I must admit though. I got great counsiling from my wife before I made my decision...

;-)

it would be very valuable to have Coleman, but I don't know that it's critical fro next year. I would just as soon have the Williams JC from CTC and no atitude issues.

IMO the key is obivous...Devan. If we have enough warm bodies that can leap, rebound, dunk and play some D, we may be ok. With Devan, we can get the other 4 players some easy looks.

Without him, we could all require some interventions before the end of next season

I don't like being 2nd string.


I'd rather be special teams...

Let me ask you chicago, does it matter if you have depth if you are playing two games in two nights? I dont think the nba guys do that too often.

Living in Chicago...one can be assured I'm not speaking as a Piston fan.
I've selected the Pistons as they're the best team in the NBA this year...and has been one of the best for 4 years running.

The Pistons this year will play more back to back regular season games (19) than Big East teams will play conference games (16)

Why do so many of you insist on makin' me expose your lack of basis to your arguments? At least check your facts before you post.


And here are the facts. Count them yourself...


Detroit Pistons 2005-06 schedule...

Nov 2 Phi Won 108-88 1-0
Nov 4 @Bos Won 82-81 2-0
Nov 5 Tor Won 117-84 3-0
Nov 8 @Sac Won 102-88 4-0
Nov 10 @Pho Won 111-104 5-0
Nov 11 @Port Won 84-81 6-0
Nov 15 Bos Won 115-100 7-0
Nov 18 @Hou Won 78-70 8-0
Nov 19 @Dal Lost 82-119 8-1
Nov 23 Den Won 114-89 9-1
Nov 25 Wash Lost 114-120 9-2
Nov 26 @Mil Won 85-76 10-2
Nov 30 @NJ Won 93-83 11-2
Dec 2 NY Won 106-98 12-2
Dec 3 @Chi Won 92-79 13-2
Dec 9 @GS Won 106-103 14-2
Dec 11 @LAC Won 109-101 15-2
Dec 12 @Utah Lost 78-92 15-3
Dec 14 Sac Won 109-98 16-3
Dec 16 Chi Won 110-82 17-3
Dec 17 @Char Won 103-78 18-3
Dec 19 @Mem Won 106-104 19-3
Dec 20 Port
Dec 23 GS
Dec 25 SA
Dec 27 Tor
Dec 29 Mia
Dec 31 @Cle
Jan 3 Orl
Jan 6 Sea
Jan 7 Utah
Jan 10 @NO
Jan 12 @SA
Jan 14 Char
Jan 16 Bos
Jan 18 @Atl
Jan 19 @NY
Jan 22 Hou
Jan 24 @Min
Jan 25 Mil
Jan 27 Mem
Jan 29 LAL
Jan 31 @NJ
Feb 1 Min
Feb 3 @Phi
Feb 4 @IND
Feb 7 @Atl
Feb 8 LAC
Feb 10 @Orl
Feb 12 @Mia
Feb 14 NJ
Feb 21 Atl
Feb 23 IND
Feb 24 @Chi
Feb 26 Cle
Feb 27 @Cle
Mar 1 @Den
Mar 3 @Sea
Mar 4 @LAL
Mar 8 Chi
Mar 11 @Wash
Mar 12 Char
Mar 15 @Tor
Mar 17 @NY
Mar 18 @Char
Mar 20 Atl
Mar 22 Mia
Mar 24 @IND
Mar 26 NJ
Mar 28 Dal
Mar 29 @Phi
Mar 31 Mil
Apr 2 Pho
Apr 4 NO
Apr 6 @Mia
Apr 7 @Orl
Apr 9 IND
Apr 12 Cle
Apr 14 @Tor
Apr 16 NY
Apr 17 @Mil
Apr 19 Wash

And here's some more facts for you.


Rip Hamilton has averaged 37 mpg this year...39 mpg last year
Chauncy Billups has averaged 35 mpg this year...and 36 last
T Prince...37 mpg this year...37 mpg last
R Wallace...34 mpg this year...34 last
B Wallace...36 mpg this year...and 36 mpg last

They EACH played 107 total games last year.

And those minutes per game listed were all regular season. Over the 25 post season games...every starter but Rasheed (36 mpg) avereaged 40+ minutes. Hamilton averaged a whopping 43+ minutes per game.


Gee...after 82 games (a score of them back to back)...you'd think they'd be to tired to increase their minutes to MORE than a 40 minute college hoops game...and challenge for an NBA title.

And what did we ask our boys to do last year? Play 33 minutes in one game?

Maybe that's the problem. Jihad only played 33 minutes. If he had played the 38 minutes Rhondo did...maybe he wouldn't have bricked those three pointers at crunch time.


doh!!!

Cincy lost to UK last year partly cause we were over matched at the 5 position. But mostly...cause we didn't have a POINT GUARD that could take the pressure off them...or hit the big shot.


It had nothing to do with playing time...

As for later this week. Cincy doesn't have a 5 man rotation like the Pistons essentially do...we have a 9 man rotation.

Playing time will not be an excuse in these games either. Unless its cause of fouls.



I thought we had put this discussion to rest...

chcgobearcat Wrote:As for later this week. Cincy doesn't have a 5 man rotation like the Pistons essentially do...we have a 9 man rotation.

Playing time will not be an excuse in these games either. Unless its cause of fouls.



I thought we had put this discussion to rest...

OK, how many times did they play back to back games and cover?

Prolly about as many times as the bookies adjusted the spread for those back to back games...

So a question for you.

Who do they adjust the spread for in this case...Cincy or LSU?

chcgobearcat Wrote:So a question for you.

Who do they adjust the spread for in this case...Cincy or LSU?

I was just messing with you. I wanted to see if you actually had those stats hidden away somewhere. THEN, I would be impressed.

chcgobearcat Wrote:Cincy lost to UK last year partly cause we were over matched at the 5 position. But mostly...cause we didn't have a POINT GUARD that could take the pressure off them...or hit the big shot.


It had nothing to do with playing time...

You must have been watching some other game. UK rotated wave after wave of subs. UC hung with UK for most of the game but no interior depth had Max and Hicks out of gas in the end and they totally wore us down. You could see the legs going for the UC guys when the outside shots starting all coming up short.

I don't know what other game you think I watched...but I already posted the minutes of both teams starting five. And except for their frosh Morris (who played 25 minutes)...UK's starters averaged more minutes than Cincy's starters did.


Those are the facts. Maybe those waves you saw were a bad TV tube...

Once again...here's the minutes from the starters...


Hicks....34 minutes
White...34
Max...33
N Williams..33
Jihad....34


UK

Azubuike...31
Hayse....29
Morris....25
Rondo...38
Sparks..33


UK's guards played more minutes than Cincy's (Williams and Jihad). And Azubuike played as many minutes as Max. Azubuike was UK's leading scorer with 19 and Rhondo was 2nd with 16


Here's the bench minutes for everyone gettin more than 3 minutes of PT on either team


Kirkland...22 minutes
Bright......10 minutes


Ravi Moss....11 minutes
S. Thomas...13 minutes
Alleyne........9 minutes


Those 3 UK bench players played one more cumulative minute than Cincy's two. And here's what they contributed to UK...

Moss........Zero Points...Zero Rebounds
Thomas...Zero Points...Zero Rebounds
Alleyne....Two Points...Zero Rebounds


Both teams starters played essentially equivalent minutes. UK's were just more productive.

Cincy lost to a better team. NOT because they were tired.

Any other conclusion is simply a homering defense mechanism to try to explain away the loss...

Back to the issue of Coleman. The situation facing us next year is much worse than what Huggins had to deal with his first year. Banks, Robinson, and Starks were blue chip recruits coming out of high school and were solid college players. Huggins had no depth but he had a solid nucleus to work with. In fact, I believe Huggins performance his first two years is highly overrated. Next year we are facing something worse than 1982-83 which was 3-25. We are in the Big East now and there will be no hiding this fiasco from the national media like when we were in the Metro. Unless a coach is named very soon (Kennedy) there will be NO opportunity to bring in any players in the spring. Will Z even allow JUCO transfers to be signed? We are looking at playing next year with at most four true scholarship players and perhaps only one (McGowan). Am I missing something here or is this the end of days for UC B-ball?

chcgobearcat Wrote:Once again...here's the minutes from the starters...


Hicks....34 minutes
White...34
Max...33
N Williams..33
Jihad....34


UK

Azubuike...31
Hayse....29
Morris....25
Rondo...38
Sparks..33


UK's guards played more minutes than Cincy's (Williams and Jihad). And Azubuike played as many minutes as Max Azubuike was UK's leading scorer with 19 and Rhondo was 2nd with 16


Here's the bench minutes for everyone gettin more than 3 minutes of PT on either team


Kirkland...22 minutes
Bright......10 minutes


Ravi Moss....11 minutes
S. Thomas...13 minutes
Alleyne........9 minutes


Those 3 UK bench players played one more cumulative minute than Cincy's two. And here's what they contributed to UK...

Moss........Zero Points...Zero Rebounds
Thomas...Zero Points...Zero Rebounds
Alleyne....Two Points...Zero Rebounds


Both teams starters played essentially equivalent minutes. UK's were just more productive.

Cincy lost to a better team. NOT because they were tired.

Any other conclusion is simply a homering defense mechanism to try to explain away the loss...

I never said UC was the better team. UK had more talent and was a better team but UK also had more depth and also wore UC down. Just the 9 minutes they were able to throw Alleyne at Max along with Morris's minutes against Max wore him down. Maybe our guys were not in as good of shape as UK. All I know is what I saw: UK wore us down. It didn't help that our buddy Armein as well as Jihad continued to force bad shots down the stretch.

cmhcat...sad to say...I think you're spot on.

chcgobearcat Wrote:Once again...here's the minutes from the starters...


Hicks....34 minutes
White...34
Max...33
N Williams..33
Jihad....34


UK

Azubuike...31
Hayse....29
Morris....25
Rondo...38
Sparks..33


UK's guards played more minutes than Cincy's (Williams and Jihad). And Azubuike played as many minutes as Max. Azubuike was UK's leading scorer with 19 and Rhondo was 2nd with 16


Here's the bench minutes for everyone gettin more than 3 minutes of PT on either team


Kirkland...22 minutes
Bright......10 minutes


Ravi Moss....11 minutes
S. Thomas...13 minutes
Alleyne........9 minutes


Those 3 UK bench players played one more cumulative minute than Cincy's two. And here's what they contributed to UK...

Moss........Zero Points...Zero Rebounds
Thomas...Zero Points...Zero Rebounds
Alleyne....Two Points...Zero Rebounds


Both teams starters played essentially equivalent minutes. UK's were just more productive.

Cincy lost to a better team. NOT because they were tired.

Any other conclusion is simply a homering defense mechanism to try to explain away the loss...

One other thing to consider is that when you have guys 6'5" and basically 6'6" in Hicks and Max trying to guard 7 footers and 6'11 guys with mass, that wears on you. Hicks playing 34 minutes against guys who have more size wears the smaller guy out. It takes more effort for the smaller guy imo.

You can make that conclusion if you like murph. But Cincy lost when they quit going inside to score the last 5 minutes...and Williams and mostly Jihad bricked everything they shot up (mostly behind the arc).


And THAT had nothing to do with tired legs...as I said...UKs guards played more minutes than Cincy's.


If Cincy had shooters...the were in position to win that game...