November 16, 2005
Mitch Vingle

Figuring out a bowl, Tranghese, House, Pruett

YE OLDE NOTEBOOK:

As if the Bowl Championship Series and college football’s bowl system aren’t confusing enough, along came Tuesday’s announcement over the EV1.net Houston Bowl.
Or, rather, the announcements.

The Big East and bowl brethren Notre Dame trumpeted their four-year agreement to play a Big 12 opponent in the bowl beginning in 2006.

Then came a release from Conference USA announcing it “has entered into an agreement with the EV1.net Houston Bowl to be a part of that bowl for four years, beginning with the 2006 season.’’

Inducing a “huh?’’ from those receiving both releases.

The mystery was partly solved midway through the latter release when it explained a C-USA team “is guaranteed to play in [the bowl] at least one time in the four-year period.’’

Meaning C-USA will not be a part of the bowl for as many as three years.

But here’s the kicker: Big East officials claimed C-USA could be completely shut out within the four years.

“The Houston Bowl has the option of taking a Conference USA team [over a Big East team] in one of the four years,’’ said the Big East’s John Paquette. “But it doesn’t have to take one.’’

“We’re guaranteed a spot in one of the four years,’’ countered C-USA official Russ Anderson.

A press release generated by bowl representatives said they’ve “signed an agreement with Conference USA to participate ... in one of the 2006 through 2009 seasons in the place of a Big East participant.’’

Clear as mud, right? And throughout most of Tuesday, those answering phones at the bowl weren’t able to clarify.

Finally, Shawn Bouley, assistant executive director of the Houston bowl, was reached.

“We have the option of picking a Conference USA team in place of a Big East team one of the years,’’ Bouley said. “We don’t have to, but we have the option.’’

<a href='http://wvgazette.com/section/Sports/2005111528' target='_blank'>Houston Bowl</a>

Excellent. Over the past couple of weeks its come to my attention that the offices of the MWC and CUSA don't go out of their way for the cause of honesty.

The article also states that the Liberty had a deal with the Big East but caved to political pressure when the Memphis fans threw a fit. Interesting.

I'll be watching to see how their event turns out this year.

L-yes Wrote:Excellent. Over the past couple of weeks its come to my attention that the offices of the MWC and CUSA don't go out of their way for the cause of honesty.

The article also states that the Liberty had a deal with the Big East but caved to political pressure when the Memphis fans threw a fit. Interesting.

I'll be watching to see how their event turns out this year.

You know what L-Yes, I am more satisfied with the Houston Bowl then the Liberty Bowl and I will tell you why.

1. The Liberty Bowl is falling apart and the Houston Bowl is played in a state of the art facility.

2. Houston is warmer then Memphis.

3. The payout is pretty much the same.

Maize, you are a good guy but, like MWC fans, you pull the trigger too quick. Yes, politics probably played a huge part of CUSA getting Liberty. But why fault CUSA for playing its cards...that it has been dealt. IMO, no different that, for example, BE affiliating with ND and then using that affiliation to further the purposes of both BE and ND.

Regarding your article, the BE wants to establish five bowls and establish a "Big Apple" Bowl in the new pro football stadium being built. My guess is BE fans would much rather have a nice close bowl to drive to...rather than far away Houston. So I think eventually BE will pull out of the Houston Bowl and CUSA will move in. In the meantime, Big 12 will want to keep good relations with CUSA.

FUTURE BIG EAST BOWLS
BCS
Gator/Sun
Big Apple
Charlotte
International

While there are obvious discrepancies in published reports, CUSA Commish Banowsky has been a pretty good guy for CUSA and generally understates in his speeches and statements. Maybe he made a mistake but I think you pulled the trigger on Banowsky too quick and too hard.

Clarification: With SEC replacing MWC, the Liberty Bowl expects to increase its payout from $1.4 million last year to the range of $1.8 to $2 million in the future. So the Liberty has a much higher payout and is much closer for BE fans to get to...and that is why BE wanted the Liberty.

Tallgrass Wrote:Clarification: With SEC replacing MWC, the Liberty Bowl expects to increase its payout from $1.4 million last year to the range of $1.8 to $2 million in the future. So the Liberty has a much higher payout and is much closer for BE fans to get to...and that is why BE wanted the Liberty.

My guess is the BE will ultimately be in the Liberty. Supporting what the market bears is one thing, caving to political pressure is another. The reality of the situation will set in soon enough for the L-Bowl.

Glad to see the Houston could be a BE/ND bowl all 4 years if they want it to be.

I don't fault the Liberty, pretty much everything is political, whether we like it or not, so any league would scratch and claw any way they know how to not lose their far and away top bowl so that it went to another league's #3 team, especially when they like to think of themselves as the same (even though it is fallacy).

Tallgrass Wrote:Maize, you are a good guy but, like MWC fans, you pull the trigger too quick. Yes, politics probably played a huge part of CUSA getting Liberty. But why fault CUSA for playing its cards...that it has been dealt. IMO, no different that, for example, BE affiliating with ND and then using that affiliation to further the purposes of both BE and ND.

Regarding your article, the BE wants to establish five bowls and establish a "Big Apple" Bowl in the new pro football stadium being built. My guess is BE fans would much rather have a nice close bowl to drive to...rather than far away Houston. So I think eventually BE will pull out of the Houston Bowl and CUSA will move in. In the meantime, Big 12 will want to keep good relations with CUSA.

FUTURE BIG EAST BOWLS
BCS
Gator/Sun
Big Apple
Charlotte
International

While there are obvious discrepancies in published reports, CUSA Commish Banowsky has been a pretty good guy for CUSA and generally understates in his speeches and statements. Maybe he made a mistake but I think you pulled the trigger on Banowsky too quick and too hard.

I think you have me confused with L-Yes. The Liberty Bowl like I said over on the C-USA made a business decision.

L-yes Wrote:

Tallgrass Wrote:Clarification:&nbsp; With SEC replacing MWC, the Liberty Bowl expects to increase its payout from $1.4 million last year to the range of $1.8 to $2 million in the future.&nbsp; So the Liberty has a much higher payout and is much closer for BE fans to get to...and that is why BE wanted the Liberty.

My guess is the BE will ultimately be in the Liberty. Supporting what the market bears is one thing, caving to political pressure is another. The reality of the situation will set in soon enough for the L-Bowl.

You'd have to give them a very good seeding to get that spot. Your teams are just too far away to make a good case. The SEC, ACC, Big 12 and CUSA are the major candidates because of geography. A Northeastern football conference is not going to do well bowl wise unless you can invent some NE bowls. It's just business.

knight_01 Wrote:

L-yes Wrote:

Tallgrass Wrote:Clarification:  With SEC replacing MWC, the Liberty Bowl expects to increase its payout from $1.4 million last year to the range of $1.8 to $2 million in the future.  So the Liberty has a much higher payout and is much closer for BE fans to get to...and that is why BE wanted the Liberty.

My guess is the BE will ultimately be in the Liberty. Supporting what the market bears is one thing, caving to political pressure is another. The reality of the situation will set in soon enough for the L-Bowl.

You'd have to give them a very good seeding to get that spot. Your teams are just too far away to make a good case. The SEC, ACC, Big 12 and CUSA are the major candidates because of geography. A Northeastern football conference is not going to do well bowl wise unless you can invent some NE bowls. It's just business.

That is why Tranghese is working on a NY Bowl.

L-Yes and Maize kill me.

The Liberty Bowl picked C-USA because it's a better fit than the Big East. They wanted C-USA vs. SEC all along. The ONLY reason they ever talked to the Big East was because they wanted the SEC and the SEC at one point said they wouldn't play against C-USA. Nowhere does that article read that they caved to pressure. They got what they wanted from the beginning. Big East was never option #1 or #2.

Maize, saying you'd take the Houston Bowl over the Liberty Bowl sure does sound like sour grapes to me. This summer y'all were practically reveling in the fact that y'all were going to "take" the Liberty Bowl from C-USA. The payouts aren't anywhere close and the Liberty Bowl payout is going up. Reliant stadium is nice, but the Liberty Bowl is undergoing renovations. It looks much different this year than it did last season. Houston is warmer, but y'all sure do talk about a bowl in NYC a whole lot and I don't think it's real warm up there in the winter.

Maize is doing what the MWC fans do. Here was an announcement of the Big East and Houston Bowls--very much a positive for the Big East. All a Big East fan had to do was post that article--and the article shouted volumes all by itself.

But Maize proceeded to trash and trivilize by calling the CUSA Commish a liar. The reader, rather than focusing on the good of the BE/Houston deal, is refocused to an apparent preturbed poster that resented that CUSA even got 1/4 of the action.

Maize, instead of using the words he used, should have simply called for a point of clarification. The writer, a known West Va fan and Marshall (and therefore CUSA) basher, may be confused. Or the bowl official may be confused. Or CUSA Commish might be confused. But to holler liar! liar! That just trivilizes and makes BE appear small. Maize, in his well deserved glory and happiness for Louisville and BE, doesn't seem to grasp what he is doing over there on the CUSA board. Or care.

I think it is all going to work itself out in the future. There will be atleast one season where ND will make a BCS Bowl along with the Big East champion which means the Big East will need atleast 3 more bowl eligible teams to fill the Gator/Sun Bowl-Tire Bowl and Houston Bowl. The Big East will probably fall short one year to fill the Houston Bowl and a C-USA team will move in. If the Big East/ND does have enough teams to fill it every year then the Houston Bowl will probably opt for a C-USA team from the state of Texas that is Bowl eligible (UTEP,RICE,SMU,HOUSTON,ETC...) one of those four years. Just my opinion......

The MWC, more then C-USA, have a way of bending, stretching and even out-right lying. Remember, right before the new BCS deal was signed that the MWC sent out a press release saying that that Big East's BCS bid wasn't secure even though it was a bald-faced lie? Bottomline, the Houston Bowl is a secure Big East Bowl. Now we have a BCS Bowl, Sun Bowl, Tire Bowl, Gator Bowl and Houston Bowl to sell recruits. The Big East is just fine! :D

Ice98 Wrote:I think it is all going to work itself out in the future. There will be atleast one season where ND will make a BCS Bowl along with the Big East champion which means the Big East will need atleast 3 more bowl eligible teams to fill the Gator/Sun Bowl-Tire Bowl and Houston Bowl. The Big East will probably fall short one year to fill the Houston Bowl and a C-USA team will move in. If the Big East/ND does have enough teams to fill it every year then the Houston Bowl will probably opt for a C-USA team from the state of Texas that is Bowl eligible (UTEP,RICE,SMU,HOUSTON,ETC...) one of those four years. Just my opinion......

The Big East is having a down year and STILL meeting the requirements to send a team to Houst most likely (if the agreement were in place today it would either be Rutgers or South Florida assuming they become bowl-eligible).

3601 Wrote:L-Yes and Maize kill me.

The Liberty Bowl picked C-USA because it's a better fit than the Big East. They wanted C-USA vs. SEC all along. The ONLY reason they ever talked to the Big East was because they wanted the SEC and the SEC at one point said they wouldn't play against C-USA. Nowhere does that article read that they caved to pressure. They got what they wanted from the beginning. Big East was never option #1 or #2.

Maize, saying you'd take the Houston Bowl over the Liberty Bowl sure does sound like sour grapes to me. This summer y'all were practically reveling in the fact that y'all were going to "take" the Liberty Bowl from C-USA. The payouts aren't anywhere close and the Liberty Bowl payout is going up. Reliant stadium is nice, but the Liberty Bowl is undergoing renovations. It looks much different this year than it did last season. Houston is warmer, but y'all sure do talk about a bowl in NYC a whole lot and I don't think it's real warm up there in the winter.

So you're ripping the Big East because they didn't get the Liberty Bowl as their 3rd or 4th bowl and that C-USA "beat them out" and the Liberty Bowl is C-USA's best bowl? That's what C-USA fans in this thread are laughing about "HAHA, we got the Liberty Bowl as our #1 bowl, you couldn't even get them as your 3rd or 4th place bowl, SCOREBOARD!" So the Big East just replaced them with another bowl that C-USA seriously considered as their #1 bowl, and they will, AT BEST be the Big East's #2 bowl on certain years, but more then likely the 3rd or 4th place bowl depending on what the Tire Bowl does each year? Think about that.

I like having a bowl in Houston. It's a good place to be in the winter. I went to see Pitt play Texas in the Bluebonnet Bowl in 1987 and it was a good atmosphere. That was back in the old Astrodome. Naturally, it was a sell-out. If Texas or A&M are in the game, it's a guaranteed sell-out.

Most of the B12 South teams would draw well. I don't know how the B12 North teams will do.

Jim

3601 Wrote:The Liberty Bowl picked C-USA because it's a better fit than the Big East. They wanted C-USA vs. SEC all along. The ONLY reason they ever talked to the Big East was because they wanted the SEC and the SEC at one point said they wouldn't play against C-USA. Nowhere does that article read that they caved to pressure. They got what they wanted from the beginning. Big East was never option #1 or #2.

Maize, saying you'd take the Houston Bowl over the Liberty Bowl sure does sound like sour grapes to me. This summer y'all were practically reveling in the fact that y'all were going to "take" the Liberty Bowl from C-USA. The payouts aren't anywhere close and the Liberty Bowl payout is going up. Reliant stadium is nice, but the Liberty Bowl is undergoing renovations. It looks much different this year than it did last season. Houston is warmer, but y'all sure do talk about a bowl in NYC a whole lot and I don't think it's real warm up there in the winter.

I would have liked to have had the Liberty Bowl. Of course, I was a proponent of adding Memphis to the BE. With Memphis in the BE, I believe we would have gotten that bowl. I think it's a case of the bowl chairman wanting the 2 conferences that contained Memphis and Tennessee. I think that was a valid viewpoint.

I'm happy with the Houston Bowl even though I would have liked both even better.

New York City is, in my opinion, one of the few Northern cities that can rise above the disadvantage of cold weather during bowl season. NYC is just one of those places people might see as a vacation destination. Naturally, if they get a bowl, I sure would prefer a domed stadium. It would be nice if they could get a BE/B10 matchup for that locale.

Jim

Tallgrass Wrote:Maize is doing what the MWC fans do. Here was an announcement of the Big East and Houston Bowls--very much a positive for the Big East. All a Big East fan had to do was post that article--and the article shouted volumes all by itself.

But Maize proceeded to trash and trivilize by calling the CUSA Commish a liar. The reader, rather than focusing on the good of the BE/Houston deal, is refocused to an apparent preturbed poster that resented that CUSA even got 1/4 of the action.

Maize, instead of using the words he used, should have simply called for a point of clarification. The writer, a known West Va fan and Marshall (and therefore CUSA) basher, may be confused. Or the bowl official may be confused. Or CUSA Commish might be confused. But to holler liar! liar! That just trivilizes and makes BE appear small. Maize, in his well deserved glory and happiness for Louisville and BE, doesn't seem to grasp what he is doing over there on the CUSA board. Or care.

He and the MWC have been not been telling the truth. This is from the Houston paper.

Nov. 15, 2005, 1:32AM

Houston Bowl has chance to land big fish
Starting in '06, deal could bring Notre Dame to city if Irish miss BCS
By JOSEPH DUARTE
Copyright 2005 Houston Chronicle

The EV1.net Houston Bowl has reached a four-year agreement with the Big East Conference, Conference USA and Notre Dame to pair a team against the Big 12, officials said Monday.

The agreement covers the 2006-09 seasons.

The game will match the No. 5 or No. 6 selection from the Big 12 against either the Big East's No. 2 or No. 3 team or Notre Dame. C-USA would provide a representative in the event the Big 12 did not have enough bowl-eligible teams.

"We didn't want to rush into anything. We've been working on this for some time," Houston Bowl chairman Shea Guinn said. "This was something we wanted to do right."

The Houston Bowl is about to end a three-year tie-in with the Southeastern Conference, which is unlikely to produce an opponent for the Big 12 for the third consecutive year.

The inclusion of Notre Dame will give the Houston Bowl an opportunity for a marquee team in the years the Irish are not eligible for the BCS.

"At the end of the day, we wanted some assurances of the type of teams that were going to be there," Guinn said.

By adding C-USA to the mix, the Houston Bowl will have the opportunity to feature a regional team with the conference's new realignment including UTEP, Houston, SMU and Rice. The bowl will keep a payout of about $1.2 million.

The game has been affiliated with the Big 12 since its inception in 2000, when it was known as the galleryfurniture.com Bowl.

<a href='http://www.chron.com/cs/CDA/ssistory.mpl/sports/fb/fbc/3461321' target='_blank'>Where is the guaranteed C-USA Slot</a>

In the C-USA Press Release they stated that they were guaranteed a slot in the bowl game. Guess what, you have two media outlets-(One in Houston and the other in West Virginia) reporting that is not the case.

Tallgrass Wrote:Maize is doing what the MWC fans do. Here was an announcement of the Big East and Houston Bowls--very much a positive for the Big East. All a Big East fan had to do was post that article--and the article shouted volumes all by itself.

But Maize proceeded to trash and trivilize by calling the CUSA Commish a liar. The reader, rather than focusing on the good of the BE/Houston deal, is refocused to an apparent preturbed poster that resented that CUSA even got 1/4 of the action.

Maize, instead of using the words he used, should have simply called for a point of clarification. The writer, a known West Va fan and Marshall (and therefore CUSA) basher, may be confused. Or the bowl official may be confused. Or CUSA Commish might be confused. But to holler liar! liar! That just trivilizes and makes BE appear small. Maize, in his well deserved glory and happiness for Louisville and BE, doesn't seem to grasp what he is doing over there on the CUSA board. Or care.

He did lie.