BTW...Idaho State doesn't have sight line problems. Their seats don't have an overhang like ETSU. The reason ETSU has the sight line problems is that there wasn't enough room to make the dome bigger. Now I've been to the ETSU building a gazillion times and there is the extra feet it would take to eliminate the overhang and allow seats to go all the way to the floor like it is one one side in the basketball configuration. The other thing I thought was interesting is the different construction costs. The ETSU building was reportedly 9-million and leaked (I've heard it still does). Idaho State was under 3-million...but it was built earlier. Still in less than ten years, I doubt there was that kind of inflation!

(09-10-2012 04:05 PM)BucSinceTheSixties Wrote:  After reading that, it sounds like the only thing wrong with ETSU's dome is that it's grossly under-utilized. That 16x12 video board sounds pretty neat!

ETSU didn't have enough land to build the Hoyt so they crimped into the space they had, which resulted in the over hang and terrible sight lines.

Chattanooga model. The ETSU experiment of dumping football has been under the microscope especially at Chattanooga. You see the Mocs were having the same problems as the Bucs with attendance. The option of dumping was eliminated when the University and the City-County went in together and built Finley Stadium. A lot of private money was put into it led by Gordan Davenport who was a champion for the cause. With that place built primarily for football...it was to big to fail. That place didn't happen until a new athletic director came on board and made things happen. I don't care where you play...indoor, outdoor, outhouse...you have to have a marketing person make it a must see dynamic event that nobody wants to miss because they would be afraid they will miss something. When you have no tradition, a bad reputation...you have to change things up. Dr. Stanton would say ETSU they did all that. They did have a lot of promotions...The marching band was awesome and I'm sure that cost a bit. With all of that it still doesn't make games a happening. All that entertainment money that student fees goes too...brought in the concert that caused the seating capacity to be reduced...if the concert like that is such a draw....why don't they connect it to athletics? There ought to be an event list with the idea of how can those things make things happen for the national visibility and athletic enhancement? It's much more complicated than I just stated...ETSU needs to ask Chattanooga how Rick Hart did it. I know. I live here...and now Hart has taken his act to Southern Methodist as I recall. Sound familiar Buc fans? Didn't the Bucs lose Mike Cavan to that place after he led the Bucs to the promise land of the NCAA quarterfinals that got the program eliminated? A crowd of under 7K for a playoff game will make that happen.

(09-10-2012 04:28 PM)Mister Jennings Wrote:  BTW...Idaho State doesn't have sight line problems. Their seats don't have an overhang like ETSU. The reason ETSU has the sight line problems is that there wasn't enough room to make the dome bigger. Now I've been to the ETSU building a gazillion times and there is the extra feet it would take to eliminate the overhang and allow seats to go all the way to the floor like it is one one side in the basketball configuration. The other thing I thought was interesting is the different construction costs. The ETSU building was reportedly 9-million and leaked (I've heard it still does). Idaho State was under 3-million...but it was built earlier. Still in less than ten years, I doubt there was that kind of inflation!

The ETSU dome could have been fixed. Enough money has been spent (blown) on invisible sports teams these past nine years to more than fix the sideline sight problem, put in new carpet, and add seats on the four ends. Stanton was hell bent on killing football and the dome provided him additional ammunition. I wonder, could he have killed football as easily if ETSU had been in an outdoor stadium in 2003?

Indoor, outdoor is not the issue. Attendance is. It was embarrassing to have a playoff game with Stanton in his president's box by himself. I'm sure celebrities, corporate executives were asked to come. None did. You couldn't give tickets away. That's what got football killed...lousy attendance to the point of embarrassing. I would think every corporate executive would have come to the same conclusion.

Here's the deal. Stanton felt he pushed every button, spent every dime, won enough games to have a good attendance. When it didn't happen, he decided to stop banging his head against the wall and get rid of the embarrassment. Problem is...he thinks he left every stone unturned. I don't think so. They never thought outside the box. When I was a student, Elvis sold out three consecutive concerts at Freedom Hall in minutes. ETSU alumni built a stock car race to the point that Bristol Motor Speedway has a seating capacity of 160K. You know the story in Knoxville. Stanton is a medical doctor who became CEO of a major University. His methodology was cut the cancer out. He didn't know how to cure the patient. He didn't have the experts working on the job who knew the answers.

The next attempt, I assure you Dr. Noland will have the correct people on board to have success. ETSU has selected the right man for the job...I'm convinced. I watched his interview on line...it was clear. I can't wait for Noland to start pushing buttons after he has gathered enough information to act. I submit a hurricane is coming and Buccaneerland will never be the same. The problem right now is discouragement. Don't lose heart. It will take a few minutes for everyone to be as excited as the days of the four peat of 1989-93. Get your season tickets or you might have to watch pay per view. Every ticket will disappear causing sellouts. The stage is set. Go Bucs!

The dome sucks, it's not a viable option. Noland has made that clear. The conversation isn't even worth bringing up.
Also, Finley was built when Steve Sloan was A.D. at UT-C, and they stunk in football until he retired. The only reason UT-C didn't drop football was because they saw what happened when ETSU did. Sloan left UT-C with an APR mess that one of our own cleaned up, an attendance and on field product that was awful. They brought Rick Hart in to fix the issues, which he let Rodney Allison go. Together with Coach Huesman, Rick Hart changed an entire culture at UT-C. Attendance and wins have increased dramatically there, though they're off to a rough start this year.
A stadium can be built WHILE players are being recruited and before a game is played. Charlotte is doing this, FIU/FAU both did this. FIU actually built their stadium over the course of a few YEARS while playing in it, assembling it in sections.

bunch of us played here because the dome

Buccaneerlover... You used to be one of my favorite posters giving rational fact driven arguments. You do have a few facts sprinkled in your diatribe condemning the dome as a temporary Buc football home while a stadium is being built. It's this negative attitude that has caused ETSU to suffer attendance and image problems. I'm shocked by the president's proclamations that the dome will never be used again for a game. In TBR the only the board itself can overrule a president. On this opinion board, I suggest ETSU needs new carpet to practice on regardless of whether a game is ever played there. It doesn't do any good for anyone to be taking pot shots at the dome. You admit attendance improved at Chattanooga...but you never affirmed why. I stand by my statement that it's all about marketing and having an athletic department that knows how get a crowd to the games. Until the great day when ETSU gets it's act together and builds a stadium, get a team and start playing ASAP in the dome. It's doom maybe for sure...but it's still the fastest way to get in the game. Let's hire a coach, get a conference and play ball ASAP. We are where we are. Let's not flush another ten years for the perfect scenario to appear. Get moving now. Put a team on the field. ETSU has waited long enough. End the suffering now.

cant play in the dome. purchasing new removable turf is too expensive and Stanton/Mullins got rid of enough of the old turf to kill the chance of bringing it back in the dome.

(09-11-2012 09:00 PM)bucfan99 Wrote:  cant play in the dome. purchasing new removable turf is too expensive and Stanton/Mullins got rid of enough of the old turf to kill the chance of bringing it back in the dome.

I don't buy that, because if football is brought back, you can bet the dome will be used as an indoor practice facility. So new turf will be required.

With that said, the dome should NOT be used as the primary stadium. Why half ass things AGAIN? Do it right this time.

(09-11-2012 09:26 PM)ETSUfan1 Wrote:  the dome should NOT be used as the primary stadium. Why half ass things AGAIN? Do it right this time.

I don't see it as "half ass" at all. Rather, I see it as fiscally responsible. The most affordable way to bring football back is to sink $2,000,000(?) into carpeting rather than $50,000,000 for a new stadium. Austin Peay played for decades in a stadium built in 1946. They stuck with the stadium through their non-scholarship years, and stuck with it after re-building their program to FCS. Now, five years into FCS, they have built the football program to the point that necessitates the demolition and rebuild of the old stadium (to provide more seating, skyboxes, etc.).

http://www.foxnews.com/sports/2012/08/24...l-stadium/

That's the way to do it. Grow the program organically, and don't delay competition just to build a "perceived" perfect stadium that the program will be stuck with for a minimum of 3 decades. Besides, how do we know what kind of stadium to build without even having a team? We build an MTSU style stadium with the hopes of one day going FBS, then we'll look stupid when we only draw 5,000. If we build a 10,000 seat stadium, expandable to 15,000, that's appropriate for non-scholarship/FCS, then we'll look equally as stupid if we see Appy State/GA Southern type success when 20,000 people want tickets. Use what we already have, gauge the progress of the team, and build what we need when the time is right......i.e.= Austin Peay.

(09-11-2012 05:45 AM)Mister Jennings Wrote:  I'm shocked by the president's proclamations that the dome will never be used again for a game.

Does anyone know when he actually said that? I'd be interested to read what he said in that regard. The only online quote I can find references his dome improvements:


Noland said work has already begun on improving the Dome, specifically the roof. The building’s seating and concessions will also be improved to enhance the game day experience as part of an overall campus re-visioning effort that will kick off in a few weeks.

“The whole goal is when students return for the fall and we play our first men’s and women’s basketball game in the Dome, it looks different, the experience is enhanced and we’re able to attract our fans from across the region back home to campus,” he said.

(09-10-2012 09:43 PM)One Of The Last Buc Linemen Wrote:  bunch of us played here because the dome

That's an interesting point. I have heard from several players over the years that they really enjoyed playing in the dome. Many of them remarked that they felt special to have it as their home facility. I could see where a big indoor facility would be BOTH a recruiting advantage AND disadvantage. I'm quite sure if we're all so devisive as fans about dome vs. outdoors, so would be the folks who do the playing.

(09-10-2012 04:38 PM)RodShaw2 Wrote:  ETSU didn't have enough land to build the Hoyt so they crimped into the space they had, which resulted in the over hang and terrible sight lines.

I'm not sure how many acres Idaho State's Holt Arena sits on; but, the ETSU dome is about 4.5 acres. Coincidentally, though, the University of Idaho's Kibbie Dome sits on about 4.5 acres. It seats 16,000 and houses their WAC FBS football program. They're doing some dome renovations to increase capacity to 20,000. Also, they are introducing natural light (the sun, not the beer) to the arena. Maybe we should do that here?

Kibbie Dome:






copied from: http://www.c308interactive.com/uidaho.ed...ation.aspx

THE DOME RENOVATION AND EXPANSION
PROJECT WILL:

Add 3,600 seats to increase capacity to accommodate 20,000—greater capacity is projected to generate more revenue for university athletic programs.

Lower the playing field to improve sight lines and accommodate new seating—creating a more exciting and rewarding fan experience.

Update concourses, restrooms, media facilities, and lighting—meeting current building codes, a higher standard of excellence.

Add 306 club seats, 34 loge boxes and 6 suites—providing a luxurious experience for our most generous donors and alumni.

Create a 9,000 square-foot, premium level Vandal Hospitality Club Room with upscale lounge and concessions—a special venue for alumni gatherings and pre-game activities.

Create an inviting and inspiring west-end approach to the Dome with reserved VIP parking

"Daylight" the Dome by replacing the east and west walls with translucent fiberglass panels—opening the dome to natural daylight to give it a larger, open and lighter feeling.

Update fire suppression and smoke exhaust systems to current building code requirements

Idaho has maintained and updated theirs over the years. ETSU really hasn't. By the time you fix all of the issues in the dome to make it even a REMOTE POSSIBILITY to host anything above a D-2 game, you're talking atleast 15 million, and that's with some repurposing and finding ways to save on labor costs.
1. Is it even possible to lower the surface in the ETSU dome?
2. Where are all the new exits going to be built to allow for atleast 12,000 folks to come in? If you play football, putting them on the floor is now out of the question.
3. Restrooms - There aren't enough now as it is with 3K or so coming to basketball games. I'm gonna need a place to A: take a leak and B: stealthily mix up a cocktail in the stall so the Gestapo won't see me do it in the stands, and no I don't want to miss 10 minutes of game action to do it!
4. Locker facilities - The updating on that alone to do it right, and be able to recruit the type of athlete that can win at the FCS level is millions. Add in coaches offices/meeting rooms to that too.
5. Culture/stigma - We talk often about changing the culture at ETSU and the stigma attached with athletics/supporting the university. I believe the dome is a sore spot with alot of people for whatever the reason. Attempting to renovate something that people hate isn't going to bring NEW FANS, and that's what ETSU needs. They can get 5-6K for football easily, but they need 5-6K more CONSISTENTLY and trying to sell the dome to people who have a preconcieved notion of what the dome is not only is an uphill battle but a COMPLETE WASTE OF TIME. Folks are already shut off to that place.
6. Scoreboards - Nobody talks about this but the scoreboards were outdated and pieces of junk. They needed replaced and putting in state of the art boards that don't look like they belong more at John Battle vs. a Division I university is not cheap. (My beloved Trojans are 3-0 by the way, and with apologies to Swvabucsfan, Abingdon is TOAST)
7. Indoor football is antiquated and going away. The Metrodome at Mall of America Field goes boom after this season for an OUTDOOR stadium, unless Zygi springs for a convertible top. There's talk that the Falcons/Atlanta are going to either tear down/rebuild at the Georgia Dome or rebuild somewhere else in town with a retractable roof, because that's what the NFL likes.
8. With no disrespect meant to the past, a resurrection of ETSU football isn't a resurrection of what it used to be, but what it should be. The dome represents to many people a summary of poor leadership, pisspoor money management, and even more pisspoor decision making. And folks, that goes back all the way to the planning/construction of the dome. I don't believe in tearing it down because it can be used as a multi-sport practice facility, but no games.

(09-13-2012 09:48 AM)Buccaneerlover Wrote:  Idaho has maintained and updated theirs over the years. ETSU really hasn't. By the time you fix all of the issues in the dome to make it even a REMOTE POSSIBILITY to host anything above a D-2 game, you're talking atleast 15 million, and that's with some repurposing and finding ways to save on labor costs.
1. Is it even possible to lower the surface in the ETSU dome?
2. Where are all the new exits going to be built to allow for atleast 12,000 folks to come in? If you play football, putting them on the floor is now out of the question.
3. Restrooms - There aren't enough now as it is with 3K or so coming to basketball games. I'm gonna need a place to A: take a leak and B: stealthily mix up a cocktail in the stall so the Gestapo won't see me do it in the stands, and no I don't want to miss 10 minutes of game action to do it!
4. Locker facilities - The updating on that alone to do it right, and be able to recruit the type of athlete that can win at the FCS level is millions. Add in coaches offices/meeting rooms to that too.
5. Culture/stigma - We talk often about changing the culture at ETSU and the stigma attached with athletics/supporting the university. I believe the dome is a sore spot with alot of people for whatever the reason. Attempting to renovate something that people hate isn't going to bring NEW FANS, and that's what ETSU needs. They can get 5-6K for football easily, but they need 5-6K more CONSISTENTLY and trying to sell the dome to people who have a preconcieved notion of what the dome is not only is an uphill battle but a COMPLETE WASTE OF TIME. Folks are already shut off to that place.
6. Scoreboards - Nobody talks about this but the scoreboards were outdated and pieces of junk. They needed replaced and putting in state of the art boards that don't look like they belong more at John Battle vs. a Division I university is not cheap. (My beloved Trojans are 3-0 by the way, and with apologies to Swvabucsfan, Abingdon is TOAST)
7. Indoor football is antiquated and going away. The Metrodome at Mall of America Field goes boom after this season for an OUTDOOR stadium, unless Zygi springs for a convertible top. There's talk that the Falcons/Atlanta are going to either tear down/rebuild at the Georgia Dome or rebuild somewhere else in town with a retractable roof, because that's what the NFL likes.
8. With no disrespect meant to the past, a resurrection of ETSU football isn't a resurrection of what it used to be, but what it should be. The dome represents to many people a summary of poor leadership, pisspoor money management, and even more pisspoor decision making. And folks, that goes back all the way to the planning/construction of the dome. I don't believe in tearing it down because it can be used as a multi-sport practice facility, but no games.

How cool will it be for ETSU to have a practice facility with 12-thousand seats? The school could have an NFL day with plenty of elbow room for all the scouts! Regardless, ETSU needs to fix the capacity problem if for graduation alone. Having two graduations on the same day is not good. So many decisions to make because of all the bad decisions that have already been made.

(09-13-2012 02:52 PM)Mister Jennings Wrote:  ... Regardless, ETSU needs to fix the capacity problem if for graduation alone. Having two graduations on the same day is not good....

The alternatnative to two graduations is a single loooong ceremony. I don't know that would better. I know everything would have to be done only once, but it would take close to an extra hour for all the grads to cross the stage. Some colleges just pronounce that degrees are awarded en mass. ETSU could do that and a single ceremony would be even shorter, but I imagine most of us like everyone having his or her moment. If all the names continue to be called (which I hope), I'm not sure one ceremony is better than two. I dunno.

Is not the entire driving force for the new Convocation Center so that the University can graduate every one in one occasion?

(09-13-2012 07:14 PM)bucfan81 Wrote:  Is not the entire driving force for the new Convocation Center so that the University can graduate every one in one occasion?

Yep, I recall that being said. Specifically, I remember President Noland saying it can be difficult to get graduation speakers when they have to commit to two ceremonies. I just feel for the last few graduates who will cross the stage after a whole bunch of the audience (and fellow grads) have already left. This is another example where it's not an easy decision, pros and cons both ways.

(09-13-2012 09:48 AM)Buccaneerlover Wrote:  7. Indoor football is antiquated and going away.

2011 CFL:

Home, sweet, Dome for Leos


A few of the B.C. Lions check out the new jumbo screen in BC Place Stadium during their first practice in the building on Friday.