(05-14-2012 12:30 PM)KnightChris Wrote:  

(05-14-2012 11:34 AM)SF Husky Wrote:  Unless SU AD Gross was lying, he stated that very CLEARLY. SU had no idea the other school was Pitt nor did Pitt knew SU was the other school. Gross was said they had 24 hours window or something very short to make a decision or the ACC will go to another school. I can't find the link but it was in an article right after the ACC raid. Gross was interviewed and he mentioned those points CLEARLY.

I suggest you find that link, because the scenario you described is an absurd way to conduct business, especially with a school you wish to make a long-term partner. Generally speaking, holding a gun to someone's head isn't a great way to start a relationship, nor is it good business. You identify your top target and begin negotiations. You don't willingly move down to your second (or even third) choice because of some arbitrary self-imposed deadline. That's just shooting yourself in the foot. What's next? UConn was their first choice, but took longer than 24 hours to decide?

EEEEEEEeeeeeeewwwwwwwww! I hate to have to defend SF Husky, but I read that same article on Syracusefan.com. It didnt make a lot of sense to me either but Gross basically said this. I didnt believe him then and I still dont believe that he didnt know that Pitt was also being wooed by the Acc. In that same article he mentioned that the Acc had approached SU back in the fall when the Big 10 was considering expansion and SU wouldnt negotiate with them at that time because they were waiting to see what the Big 10 was going to do.

(05-14-2012 12:34 PM)SF Husky Wrote:  

(05-14-2012 11:47 AM)cuseroc Wrote:  

(05-14-2012 11:34 AM)SF Husky Wrote:  

Quote:1) You have no facts to support contention that SYR and PITT were approached independently by ACC/ESPN, were given 24 hours to make decision, and if they declined other Big East schools would be offered.

Unless SU AD Gross was lying, he stated that very CLEARLY. SU had no idea the other school was Pitt nor did Pitt knew SU was the other school. Gross was said they had 24 hours window or something very short to make a decision or the ACC will go to another school. I can't find the link but it was in an article right after the ACC raid. Gross was interviewed and he mentioned those points CLEARLY.

Quote:2) Even if this is exactly the way it was played out, it makes little sense that Pitt and Syracuse would be stampeded into accepting. They knew that Big East stood to sign for BIGGER DOLLARS, and since they knew this, so did ALL OTHER BIG EAST FOOTBALL SCHOOLS, so they would have little to fear anyone else leaving for ACC on THAT BASIS, THE BASIS OF BIGGER DOLLARS.

So if other BE schools left, BE would still get a BIG deal? SU AD Gross also said SU was unhappy that BE did not sign that deal. Had they sign it, SU might still be in the BE.

Nahh, you cant believe anything that Darryl Gross says. Hes the AD at the school who snuck out of the BE in the middle of the night and backstabbed his other BE partners and destabilized 2 different conferences. That guy is just not trustworthy.

It still does not change the fact that SU and Pitt backstabbed rest of their partners. As a result, BE lost both WVU and TCU.

The proper thing would have been SU and Pitt contacted Marinatto within that 24 hours window and demanded conference either signed grant of rights or both would be gone. If Marinatto was not able to get Grant of Rights from rest of the schools, at least both Pitt and SU did the honorable thing and let the conference get a chance to fix the problem. They still could accept within that 24 hours even if they gave Marinatto notice.

Had the teams held together, BE would for sure got a bigger pay day than the ACC. The fact Marinatto found out about Pitt and SU via the media should tell you how much trust there was among everyone.

SU and Pitt did not use the proper channels and did it in the middle of the dark along with ACC and ESPN. They both knew by leaving they destabilized the BE and helped the ACC, but that was least of their concerns. Marinatto said multiple times people he trusted lied to his face and there is no integrity left in college sports and he is right. ACC used fear and uncertainty among BE schools and they divided and conquered.

You obviously dont remember that WV was trying for months to leave the BE, when Luck was telling everyone how great WV was. You must have forgotten about all of the rumors about WV first being invited by the Acc and then the SEC. TCU would have bolted with or without a SU or Pitt in the BE, once a Big 12 invite came. In fact, Gross and the Pitt AD both mentioned the uncertainty coming out of WV being one of the reasons that they left the BE. Funny that you dont remember any of this when you are trying to blame SU and Pitt for WV and TCU's departure.

(05-14-2012 01:01 PM)KnightChris Wrote:  So Doc Gross said that S.U. was basically told, "you have 24 hours to accept or we're giving your spot to Rutgers (or UConn or Cincinnati),"??? Were these exact quotes or was their a chance something was lost in translation? I just don't believe the ACC would do that, and I definitely don't believe we'd be dumb enough to fall for it.

I have no idea about any of these details, but I do know I was told by multiple folks, who would be in a position to know, that the Pitt/'Cuse move to the ACC came up, and was consummated, within just a few days.

NOT that they hadn't talked before (I have no clue), but that the serious offer was made and accepted in just a matter of days. That is likely why they were able to keep it so quiet, when almost no other realignment move was anywhere near that secret.

(05-14-2012 01:01 PM)KnightChris Wrote:  

(05-14-2012 12:53 PM)cuseroc Wrote:  

(05-14-2012 12:30 PM)KnightChris Wrote:  

(05-14-2012 11:34 AM)SF Husky Wrote:  Unless SU AD Gross was lying, he stated that very CLEARLY. SU had no idea the other school was Pitt nor did Pitt knew SU was the other school. Gross was said they had 24 hours window or something very short to make a decision or the ACC will go to another school. I can't find the link but it was in an article right after the ACC raid. Gross was interviewed and he mentioned those points CLEARLY.

I suggest you find that link, because the scenario you described is an absurd way to conduct business, especially with a school you wish to make a long-term partner. Generally speaking, holding a gun to someone's head isn't a great way to start a relationship, nor is it good business. You identify your top target and begin negotiations. You don't willingly move down to your second (or even third) choice because of some arbitrary self-imposed deadline. That's just shooting yourself in the foot. What's next? UConn was their first choice, but took longer than 24 hours to decide?

EEEEEEEeeeeeeewwwwwwwww! I hate to have to defend SF Husky, but I read that same article on Syracusefan.com. It didnt make a lot of sense to me either but Gross basically said this. I didnt believe him then and I still dont believe that he didnt know that Pitt was also being wooed by the Acc. In that same article he mentioned that the Acc had approached SU back in the fall when the Big 10 was considering expansion and SU wouldnt negotiate with them at that time because they were waiting to see what the Big 10 was going to do.

So Doc Gross said that S.U. was basically told, "you have 24 hours to accept or we're giving your spot to Rutgers (or UConn or Cincinnati),"??? Were these exact quotes or was their a chance something was lost in translation? I just don't believe the ACC would do that, and I definitely don't believe we'd be dumb enough to fall for it.

No that wasnt the exact quote, but he did say something to the affect that we had to act very quickly because the Acc had other options or something to that affect. Didnt mention any other schools. But it seemed odd that the Acc would say this when they waited almost a year after SU initially put them on hold while they waited for the Big 10.
I tried to find the article but I dont have time. Its on the Syracusefan.com website in the football site from pages 89 to about 94.
I thought it was part of the daily articles that OrangeEyes puts up everyday. I believe it was either a saturday or sunday morning article.

(05-14-2012 01:01 PM)KnightChris Wrote:  

(05-14-2012 12:53 PM)cuseroc Wrote:  

(05-14-2012 12:30 PM)KnightChris Wrote:  

(05-14-2012 11:34 AM)SF Husky Wrote:  Unless SU AD Gross was lying, he stated that very CLEARLY. SU had no idea the other school was Pitt nor did Pitt knew SU was the other school. Gross was said they had 24 hours window or something very short to make a decision or the ACC will go to another school. I can't find the link but it was in an article right after the ACC raid. Gross was interviewed and he mentioned those points CLEARLY.

I suggest you find that link, because the scenario you described is an absurd way to conduct business, especially with a school you wish to make a long-term partner. Generally speaking, holding a gun to someone's head isn't a great way to start a relationship, nor is it good business. You identify your top target and begin negotiations. You don't willingly move down to your second (or even third) choice because of some arbitrary self-imposed deadline. That's just shooting yourself in the foot. What's next? UConn was their first choice, but took longer than 24 hours to decide?

EEEEEEEeeeeeeewwwwwwwww! I hate to have to defend SF Husky, but I read that same article on Syracusefan.com. It didnt make a lot of sense to me either but Gross basically said this. I didnt believe him then and I still dont believe that he didnt know that Pitt was also being wooed by the Acc. In that same article he mentioned that the Acc had approached SU back in the fall when the Big 10 was considering expansion and SU wouldnt negotiate with them at that time because they were waiting to see what the Big 10 was going to do.

So Doc Gross said that S.U. was basically told, "you have 24 hours to accept or we're giving your spot to Rutgers (or UConn or Cincinnati),"??? Were these exact quotes or was their a chance something was lost in translation? I just don't believe the ACC would do that, and I definitely don't believe we'd be dumb enough to fall for it.

That's pretty much how it went down. SU had no idea the other school was Pitt nor did Pitt knew it was SU their partner. ACC gave them very short notice to accept and if they didn't, ACC would move on to invite another school. Of course, ACC did not name any of the schools because that just isn't how ACC does things. They do in the backroom and in the dark, pretty much the same way they did back in 2003 when they took BCU and Miami. They used fear, uncertainty and distrust among BE schools against them and it worked.

(05-14-2012 01:11 PM)TripleA Wrote:  

(05-14-2012 01:01 PM)KnightChris Wrote:  So Doc Gross said that S.U. was basically told, "you have 24 hours to accept or we're giving your spot to Rutgers (or UConn or Cincinnati),"??? Were these exact quotes or was their a chance something was lost in translation? I just don't believe the ACC would do that, and I definitely don't believe we'd be dumb enough to fall for it.

I have no idea about any of these details, but I do know I was told by multiple folks, who would be in a position to know, that the Pitt/'Cuse move to the ACC came up, and was consummated, within just a few days.

NOT that they hadn't talked before (I have no clue), but that the serious offer was made and accepted in just a matter of days. That is likely why they were able to keep it so quiet, when almost no other realignment move was anywhere near that secret.

The invite was exposed by the media not even a week after the Acc increase their fees to leave.

(05-14-2012 01:15 PM)SF Husky Wrote:  That's pretty much how it went down. SU had no idea the other school was Pitt nor did Pitt knew it was SU their partner.

Believe past reports (yahoo and nj.com), plus comments from ND Athletic Director and ACC "sources" shows that was most likely not the case.

It was pretty well known to those involved that reviewed the information from ESPN about "value" of new teams and who would be their top choice.

To think Pitt & Syracuse Chancellors had no idea who they were joining with is foolish.

(05-14-2012 01:15 PM)cuseroc Wrote:  

(05-14-2012 01:11 PM)TripleA Wrote:  

(05-14-2012 01:01 PM)KnightChris Wrote:  So Doc Gross said that S.U. was basically told, "you have 24 hours to accept or we're giving your spot to Rutgers (or UConn or Cincinnati),"??? Were these exact quotes or was their a chance something was lost in translation? I just don't believe the ACC would do that, and I definitely don't believe we'd be dumb enough to fall for it.

I have no idea about any of these details, but I do know I was told by multiple folks, who would be in a position to know, that the Pitt/'Cuse move to the ACC came up, and was consummated, within just a few days.

NOT that they hadn't talked before (I have no clue), but that the serious offer was made and accepted in just a matter of days. That is likely why they were able to keep it so quiet, when almost no other realignment move was anywhere near that secret.

The invite was exposed by the media not even a week after the Acc increase their fees to leave.

Which means what in terms of timing? As I said, I wasn't following that particular issue.

(05-14-2012 01:18 PM)KnightLight Wrote:  

(05-14-2012 01:15 PM)SF Husky Wrote:  That's pretty much how it went down. SU had no idea the other school was Pitt nor did Pitt knew it was SU their partner.

Believe past reports (yahoo and nj.com), plus comments from ND Athletic Director and ACC "sources" shows that was most likely not the case.

It was pretty well known to those involved that reviewed the information from ESPN about "value" of new teams and who would be their top choice.

To think Pitt & Syracuse Chancellors had no idea who they were joining with is foolish.

Actually, they had no idea. SU and UCONN were the original top 2 choices for the ACC until BC and their gang intervened. UCONN was blackballed by BCU and Flipper was gloating about that. The timeline was clearly spelled out in Boston Globe's BCU AD Flipper interview. They took Pitt because no one objected to Pitt in the ACC and the fact B12 was asking about Pitt back then. BCU AD said they did not B12 to come to the east so their invited Pitt.

SU AD said they had no idea the other school is Pitt. ACC kept everyone in the dark and everything secretive.

(05-14-2012 01:19 PM)TripleA Wrote:  

(05-14-2012 01:15 PM)cuseroc Wrote:  

(05-14-2012 01:11 PM)TripleA Wrote:  

(05-14-2012 01:01 PM)KnightChris Wrote:  So Doc Gross said that S.U. was basically told, "you have 24 hours to accept or we're giving your spot to Rutgers (or UConn or Cincinnati),"??? Were these exact quotes or was their a chance something was lost in translation? I just don't believe the ACC would do that, and I definitely don't believe we'd be dumb enough to fall for it.

I have no idea about any of these details, but I do know I was told by multiple folks, who would be in a position to know, that the Pitt/'Cuse move to the ACC came up, and was consummated, within just a few days.

NOT that they hadn't talked before (I have no clue), but that the serious offer was made and accepted in just a matter of days. That is likely why they were able to keep it so quiet, when almost no other realignment move was anywhere near that secret.

The invite was exposed by the media not even a week after the Acc increase their fees to leave.

Which means what in terms of timing? As I said, I wasn't following that particular issue.

That Pitt and SU had to have some sort of assurances about the stability of the Acc at the time, since it was rumored that VT and FSU were being wooed by the SEC, then it was Duke and someone being wooed by the Big 10 etc...

(05-14-2012 01:22 PM)SF Husky Wrote:  

(05-14-2012 01:18 PM)KnightLight Wrote:  

(05-14-2012 01:15 PM)SF Husky Wrote:  That's pretty much how it went down. SU had no idea the other school was Pitt nor did Pitt knew it was SU their partner.

Believe past reports (yahoo and nj.com), plus comments from ND Athletic Director and ACC "sources" shows that was most likely not the case.

It was pretty well known to those involved that reviewed the information from ESPN about "value" of new teams and who would be their top choice.

To think Pitt & Syracuse Chancellors had no idea who they were joining with is foolish.

Actually, they had no idea. SU and UCONN were the original top 2 choices for the ACC until BC and their gang intervened. UCONN was blackballed by BCU and Flipper was gloating about that. The timeline was clearly spelled out in Boston Globe's BCU AD Flipper interview. They took Pitt because no one objected to Pitt in the ACC and the fact B12 was asking about Pitt back then. BCU AD said they did not B12 to come to the east so their invited Pitt.

SU AD said they had no idea the other school is Pitt. ACC kept everyone in the dark and everything secretive.

This I cant substantiate, and I believe to be a rumor created by Husky fans. I have read nothing to collaborate this, other then BC AD saying he had some influence regarding not targeting Uconn, when the Acc presidents were trying to figure out which schools to target

(05-14-2012 01:22 PM)SF Husky Wrote:  

(05-14-2012 01:18 PM)KnightLight Wrote:  

(05-14-2012 01:15 PM)SF Husky Wrote:  That's pretty much how it went down. SU had no idea the other school was Pitt nor did Pitt knew it was SU their partner.

Believe past reports (yahoo and nj.com), plus comments from ND Athletic Director and ACC "sources" shows that was most likely not the case.

It was pretty well known to those involved that reviewed the information from ESPN about "value" of new teams and who would be their top choice.

To think Pitt & Syracuse Chancellors had no idea who they were joining with is foolish.

Actually, they had no idea.

SU AD said they had no idea the other school is Pitt. ACC kept everyone in the dark and everything secretive.

WE can agree to disagree....as not even local HS would ever agree to a conf membership without knowing who their conference mates were to be....let alone a Univ that deals with contracts with Billions of $$$.

Heck, even the NY Times had an article on Pitt and Syracuse possible joining the ACC "two days" prior to their invite:

Syracuse and Pitt in Talks With A.C.C.
By PETE THAMEL
Published: September 16, 2011
http://www.nytimes.com/2011/09/17/sports...ref=sports

Yeah...everyone KNEW but the Syracuse and Pitt Chancellors.....

(05-14-2012 01:24 PM)cuseroc Wrote:  

(05-14-2012 01:22 PM)SF Husky Wrote:  

(05-14-2012 01:18 PM)KnightLight Wrote:  

(05-14-2012 01:15 PM)SF Husky Wrote:  That's pretty much how it went down. SU had no idea the other school was Pitt nor did Pitt knew it was SU their partner.

Believe past reports (yahoo and nj.com), plus comments from ND Athletic Director and ACC "sources" shows that was most likely not the case.

It was pretty well known to those involved that reviewed the information from ESPN about "value" of new teams and who would be their top choice.

To think Pitt & Syracuse Chancellors had no idea who they were joining with is foolish.

Actually, they had no idea. SU and UCONN were the original top 2 choices for the ACC until BC and their gang intervened. UCONN was blackballed by BCU and Flipper was gloating about that. The timeline was clearly spelled out in Boston Globe's BCU AD Flipper interview. They took Pitt because no one objected to Pitt in the ACC and the fact B12 was asking about Pitt back then. BCU AD said they did not B12 to come to the east so their invited Pitt.

SU AD said they had no idea the other school is Pitt. ACC kept everyone in the dark and everything secretive.

This I cant substantiate, and I believe to be a rumor created by Husky fans. I have read nothing to collaborate this, other then BC AD saying he had some influence regarding not targeting Uconn, when the Acc presidents were trying to figure out which schools to target

That certainly was not something Husky fans made up. I hate to bring this up yet again but here it is:

http://www.bostonglobe.com/sports/2011/1...story.html

Quote:Enough was enough, and a master plan was devised to bring ACC basketball back to the top. The only real target was the Big East, for geographical and competitive reasons.

The first target was Syracuse, which had been on the original ACC expansion list eight years ago. The Orangemen, like BC, were disappointed when they didn’t make the final cut, passed over for Virginia Tech and Miami.

Under coach Jim Boeheim, Syracuse was clearly one of the elite basketball teams in the country and would boost the ACC’s stature in that sport.

The second target was Connecticut, which was part of the Northeast footprint the ACC wanted, and was coming off the daily double of a BCS bid in football and a championship in men’s basketball (the third for Jim Calhoun).

In addition, the women’s basketball program under Geno Auriemma had established itself as the most dominant in the sport over the past 15 years.

As for whether Pitt and SU screwed over the BE and remaining schools, here is the video interview of Tom Jurich right after the raid. His reaction said it all. He also did not understand what value Pitt brought along.

http://www.courier-journal.com/VideoNetw...e-Big-East

(05-13-2012 12:40 PM)BadWillHunting Wrote:  

(05-13-2012 12:13 PM)BJUnklFkr Wrote:  Maybe Haggard had his filter turned off the first time, but that doesn't mean what he originally said wasn't really the way he felt.

Merle Haggard works at Florida State?

Man, I'm getting old...

Reverend Ted Haggard -- now free from sin and preaching to a fabulous new congregation -- coming to the Doak on any given Saturday.