(03-10-2012 01:09 AM)Louis Kitton Wrote:  Delaware in science and engineering has a much better reputation than Buffalo. Buffalo has the money it has because its a land grant college.

Errmmmm Buffalo is not a land grant college... The only land grant school in NYS is Cornell.

Second Delaware's Engineering School is ranked 45th by USN, Buffalo is ranked 52... Hardly "much better". When you get into specific disciplines some of UB's are better and some of UD's are better.

I would consider UD a peer to UB in just about every way except at the Graduate level. There I think UB is more research focused

Dear Friends,
I think we are getting off the point of this thread. Sure, it would be nice for possible additions to the MAC have quality academic programs, and I'm sure all of them do, but let's re-focus on the athletic part. In my opinion we need schools that will participate in all sports first, and then hopefully have the facilities that meet MAC and NCAA standards for division one.
Squabbling about whose got the best business school, or best engineering school, is not what this discussion should be about.

(03-10-2012 09:39 AM)Ken Barna Wrote:  Dear Friends,
I think we are getting off the point of this thread. Sure, it would be nice for possible additions to the MAC have quality academic programs, and I'm sure all of them do, but let's re-focus on the athletic part. In my opinion we need schools that will participate in all sports first, and then hopefully have the facilities that meet MAC and NCAA standards for division one.
Squabbling about whose got the best business school, or best engineering school, is not what this discussion should be about.

You need all three!

1) Need good academics
2) Need to be all sports
3) Need to be ready in terms of budgets and facilities (or a quick roadmap to get there)

These are in no particular and are the must haves!

The nice to haves are

1) Proximity to the rest of the MAC
2) Nice TV Market or Recruiting Territory

I know Appalachian State is looking for a All Sports conference.
I believe JMU is also.
Not sure about ODU or UD.
Believe UD would be but not so sure.

(03-10-2012 08:11 AM)GoApps70 Wrote:  

(03-09-2012 07:57 PM)Miami (Oh) Yeah ! Wrote:  Does Applachian State have plans to get rid of that ugly track around their stadium? EMU and UB need to too.

Appalachian has a $200,000,000 Capital Improvement Campaign going on right now that they announced in October or November 2011. Last I heard they had raised about $125,000,000 to this point. Probably no more than 1/3 would go toward athletic improvements. Part of it would put a third deck on the East side of the stadium and a huge end zone seating structure. Administration said would start work as soon as we join an FBS conference. They have another place in mind to put the track and these end zone seats would cover the track. Right now our stadium only has about 25,600 in seats but can put about 10,000 on a south end zone bank. App State averaged 28,060 for regular season games. If you add in play off games that dropped to something like 26,800 for this past season. They have averaged between 26,500 and 30,000 for several years. New seating would put capacity at probably around 40,000 or more.

That is exactly the kind of thing the MAC needs. Bringing in a couple of southern schools that average 40,000 to the MAC in Appalachian and Madison would take the competition up an ante.

I think Delaware would be a great addition to the MAC. However, I'm skeptical that they would accept an invitation, even if the CAA were to lose mutliple members. Let's assume that Villanova, Georgia State, JMU and ODU all leave the CAA. I think UD would be just as likely, maybe more, to work to rebuild CAA football by inviting universities such as Stony Brook and UAlbany than join the MAC. I've never gotten the impression that UD has the desire to play FBS football, unless the completely improbable happens and they're invited to join a BCS-level conference.

(03-10-2012 12:02 PM)LostInSpace Wrote:  I think Delaware would be a great addition to the MAC. However, I'm skeptical that they would accept an invitation, even if the CAA were to lose mutliple members. Let's assume that Villanova, Georgia State, JMU and ODU all leave the CAA. I think UD would be just as likely, maybe more, to work to rebuild CAA football by inviting universities such as Stony Brook and UAlbany than join the MAC. I've never gotten the impression that UD has the desire to play FBS football, unless the completely improbable happens and they're invited to join a BCS-level conference.

This.

Delaware only has 13 in-state players on scholarship at CAA level. At the MAC level they could only accept 5 of them. The program at UD has relied for years on FBS transfers.

The Virginia schools have a strong in-state talent base to work with which is exactly why ODU has become so good so fast.

NO to Delaware, small instate talent base and would only canabalize the talent the MAC already gets out of PA (which would not be bad for NIU since the Huskies don't recruit East). ODU & JMU sit in a state that has grown by 1M population in the last decade and has a hoard of talent in multiple sports that the MAC would tap into once they are full conference members.

And to you nitwits that think the size of an undergrad student body makes no difference to what a program can draw; then let's invite Villanova and their tiny student body. They can replace Temple in Philly, not.

When a program achieves success in a higher level conference, the alumni who were at the program prior to them having football or while they played at a lower level get energized and reconnected to their school. Inviting programs with larger alumni bases helps them draw and makes the MAC look like it's moving up instead of stagnant

I am not in favor of eastward expansion.....first let's see if UMASS even hangs around.

(03-11-2012 12:04 PM)exCincy Kid Wrote:  I am not in favor of eastward expansion.....first let's see if UMASS even hangs around.

Yep. IF UMass were interested in long-term membership in the MAC, for all sports, then we could talk eastward expansion.

Until that happens, not worth talking about.

(03-11-2012 12:12 PM)huskiebob Wrote:  

(03-11-2012 12:04 PM)exCincy Kid Wrote:  I am not in favor of eastward expansion.....first let's see if UMASS even hangs around.

Yep. IF UMass were interested in long-term membership in the MAC, for all sports, then we could talk eastward expansion.

Until that happens, not worth talking about.

+1
At this time the only reason to add 1 to 3 teams out East (like JUM/OD/UD) is if it were to convince UMASS to join in all sports.

There is no need to replace Temple. Work out a deal to send UMass over to the Alliance/Merger in 2013.

In the future, make a rule that only all-sports members can join the MAC, or they can look other places.

Forgive my obvious school pimping, but I think a football-only agreement could be mutually beneficial for us all. The MAC provides the path to FBS that a few of our schools really want...and the established conference invitation we need. The 3 CAA schools provide new markets, large, excited fan bases, and increased exposure for the MAC brand. Sometimes it's good to shake things up a little to generate excitement and change the status quo.

I think this could be a stable, long-term arrangement. Our schools really like the CAA and our BB rivalries. If we could play FB in th MAC, I don't think we would ever look elsewhere. You guys play good FB, aren't half a continent away (especially the eastern division), and have similar profiles to our's. If UMASS ever bales...App State could be easily added (or VCU if they begin FB as expected).

With all the craziness in college sports these days, I think it's smart to think big picture and a little outside the box.

Again...sorry for the pimping. You should take it as a complement.

(03-11-2012 04:56 PM)Maryland Monarch Wrote:  Forgive my obvious school pimping, but I think a football-only agreement could be mutually beneficial for us all. The MAC provides the path to FBS that a few of our schools really want...and the established conference invitation we need. The 3 CAA schools provide new markets, large, excited fan bases, and increased exposure for the MAC brand. Sometimes it's good to shake things up a little to generate excitement and change the status quo.

I think this could be a stable, long-term arrangement. Our schools really like the CAA and our BB rivalries. If we could play FB in th MAC, I don't think we would ever look elsewhere. You guys play good FB, aren't half a continent away (especially the eastern division), and have similar profiles to our's. If UMASS ever bales...App State could be easily added (or VCU if they begin FB as expected).

With all the craziness in college sports these days, I think it's smart to think big picture and a little outside the box.

Again...sorry for the pimping. You should take it as a complement.

I think most appreciate the discussion Maryland Monarch, but just know that football-only is a real hard sell around here and for good reason.

(03-11-2012 04:56 PM)Maryland Monarch Wrote:  Forgive my obvious school pimping, but I think a football-only agreement could be mutually beneficial for us all. The MAC provides the path to FBS that a few of our schools really want...and the established conference invitation we need. The 3 CAA schools provide new markets, large, excited fan bases, and increased exposure for the MAC brand. Sometimes it's good to shake things up a little to generate excitement and change the status quo.

Its conceivable the A-10 could invite Old Dominion as a replacement for Temple and then ODU could assume Temple's football only arrangement in the MAC.

An A-10 with Charlotte, Old Dominion, Richmond, George Washington would have a decent regional presence for the Monarchs.

(03-11-2012 05:45 PM)Miami (Oh) Yeah ! Wrote:  

(03-11-2012 04:56 PM)Maryland Monarch Wrote:  Forgive my obvious school pimping, but I think a football-only agreement could be mutually beneficial for us all. The MAC provides the path to FBS that a few of our schools really want...and the established conference invitation we need. The 3 CAA schools provide new markets, large, excited fan bases, and increased exposure for the MAC brand. Sometimes it's good to shake things up a little to generate excitement and change the status quo.

I think this could be a stable, long-term arrangement. Our schools really like the CAA and our BB rivalries. If we could play FB in th MAC, I don't think we would ever look elsewhere. You guys play good FB, aren't half a continent away (especially the eastern division), and have similar profiles to our's. If UMASS ever bales...App State could be easily added (or VCU if they begin FB as expected).

With all the craziness in college sports these days, I think it's smart to think big picture and a little outside the box.

Again...sorry for the pimping. You should take it as a complement.

I think most appreciate the discussion Maryland Monarch, but just know that football-only is a real hard sell around here and for good reason.

Football only is no-go, all sports, long term MAC intentions only.

The only exception would be a hefty $10 million exit fee with a 2 year heads up. We've apparently got waterfront property (if you're FCS). Why not rent it out once in a while if the price is right?

(03-11-2012 04:56 PM)Maryland Monarch Wrote:  Forgive my obvious school pimping, but I think a football-only agreement could be mutually beneficial for us all. The MAC provides the path to FBS that a few of our schools really want...and the established conference invitation we need. The 3 CAA schools provide new markets, large, excited fan bases, and increased exposure for the MAC brand. Sometimes it's good to shake things up a little to generate excitement and change the status quo.

I think this could be a stable, long-term arrangement. Our schools really like the CAA and our BB rivalries. If we could play FB in th MAC, I don't think we would ever look elsewhere. You guys play good FB, aren't half a continent away (especially the eastern division), and have similar profiles to our's. If UMASS ever bales...App State could be easily added (or VCU if they begin FB as expected).

With all the craziness in college sports these days, I think it's smart to think big picture and a little outside the box.

Again...sorry for the pimping. You should take it as a complement.

How does investing at three programs that would jump on 'the alliance' or conference USA in a second benefit us? at all?

You don't need to pimp your school. We like you, you're hot stuff. But just because you're good does not mean the MAC should be your doormat until you can get into some other conference.

Temple, for all their faults, did not want CUSA or the alliance. They wanted the Big East (I suspect most MAC schools would likely leave for the BE). But all these CAA schools who sneer at the MAC for years and then decide 'hey can we sleep on youcouch'...

I don't think Old Dominion has sneered at anyone for years...JMU maybe, but not us. We just started FB 3 years ago, so we had no vested interest in it one way or the other. As for our designs on the Alliance, I think that is over-stated. I know a lot of our fans aren't thrilled about the 3rd Continental Congress...or whatever they're calling the Alliance these days. Too much travel...too much uncertainty.

(03-12-2012 11:28 AM)Maryland Monarch Wrote:  I don't think Old Dominion has sneered at anyone for years...JMU maybe, but not us. We just started FB 3 years ago, so we had no vested interest in it one way or the other. As for our designs on the Alliance, I think that is over-stated. I know a lot of our fans aren't thrilled about the 3rd Continental Congress...or whatever they're calling the Alliance these days. Too much travel...too much uncertainty.

Over here were calling it the "Left Behind Conference"...

But if ODU fans don't want to be full MAC members I'd rather not have them in the conference. Unless there is a tangible statement showing they can really put a boost in our TV contract it's not worth taking in another mouth to feed.

It's not a slight. Like I said you don't need to 'pimp' yourselves we all respect ODU here. As a full member with another regional team (full member) to keep them from being on an island most MAC fans would be happy.

Point is I am happy with UB in the MAC. Would I want a big 6 conference to invite us? Sure, but there is no chance I would ant the LBC or even CUSA if it survives.