mlbUC Wrote:UC might have a losing football record overall, but they at least have owned the conference in basketball. What has ECU done outside of being terrible in football for the past 3 or 4 years (and average before that), and killed the conference RPI in basketball. I don't know why we continue to have this discussion though, it has no bearing in the future. Also, giving your side of the argument does no good either since none of us vote on future members...

We continue to have this discussion because everyone that brings it up wishes they were going to the Big East as well. They just won't admit it - rather they just keep saying UC does not belong. Well tough. We are there. I don't care how we got there - if it was because of our basketball (though it was not just that as I have shown in many other posts) then fine. The fact is we are going to be playing against schools located close to us for the most part and that will ultimately help UC in football and other sports. I still do not care about the BCS - if it helps us get some better athletes then it is a plus.

We are done with CUSA in football. I guess it really does not matter what anyone from CUSA thinks about our football team or the conference we are going to now.

I agree with mlbuc - eventually there will be a split from the FB schools and the b-ball only schools and a new conference will be formed.
There seems to be genuine hatred for UC leaving CUSA. What I can't figure out is:

A. We are constantly told the Big East is a bad football conference.

B. We are constantly told our football team stinks.

C. We are constantly told we don't belong in the Big East conference because we are not good enough.

If we and the Big East conference are so bad, then UC and the Big East appear to be a perfect match for each other.

Where to begin? Well at least L-Yes is on record that USF & Rutgers have "crap basketball". 1. Cincy in my mind was a good choice for the Big East. I don't think the Bearcats will ever be a dominant football program, but Bearcat basketball should be at the top of the conference. Cincy football will be solid, just not top 10 material. 2. Many schools are investing millions of dollars in their baseball facilities, so I think most AD's think baseball is becoming a major sport. 3. I would like to see some type of offical document that states that the Big East plans to split the way L-Yes describes. I would also like for L-Yes to comment on the great vision of the Big East if there is no plan to split. & 4. The vast majority of ECU fans are thankful about being a member of CUSA, but we understand that there are multiple advantages being a member of a BCS conference. We all know that discussing the possibility of becoming a member of a BCS conference on message boards does not alter ECU's situation, but it sure got the attention of the Big East Commissioner. Yes, I know he said ECU was not in future plans, but you have to admit that there is some power in discussing the possibility on message boards. Plus, it's all in fun!

I think it had more to do with the papers down there trying to push ECU into the Big East... not with messageboards discussing the inclusion of ECU.

College baseball consists of players who didn't get drafted out of HS. If college baseball wanted to improve they would invest the millions of dollars into wooden bats instead of their facilities.

UC just built a new stadium this year, and I went to the opening game. Ping. Ping. Ping.

College baseball is not a major sport, and I don't think it will be Tell me when college baseball in consistently on Sports Center or even covered by some sort of national media other than playoffs.

So why build nice facilities on campus for a non-major sport? Cause HS teams have a world class facility to host regional tournys for start. Some doners specify what they want their money to go to. Inflation. UC just built a nice soccar facility, do you think that's making a run at becoming a major college sport?

What's the largest stadium for college baseball? What's average attendance? I bet it doesn't compare to football or basketball.

Sorry about the myriad random points. I don't feel like organizing this any better. You get the drift. Flame away!

The only paper that has been pushing ECU to the Big East is the online paper that is referenced on another thread on this board. That writer is a joke, by the way. Now that bowl season is coming to a close, we will see what, if anything, shakes out with all conferences. By the way, I guess it's o.k. to look past all of USF's weaknesses because they have potential, but it's not o.k. for people to think ECU would make a good member because of ECU's potential? If you think narrow minded in the shortrun, you are right about ECU, but if you are wise & look at the BIG PICTURE, you will see what all ECU fans know, ECU would be an excellent member of any conference!

Rage, you lost all credibility when you said that college players are not drafted out of high school. Many of the players on the top 30-40 teams in the country were drafted out of high school. They just chose to play in college rather than the minors. ECU is starting to see more & more former players playing in the majors. ECU just built a 10 million dollar stadium so we could become even stronger in the sport.

I take that back. Who isn't drafted by baseball in a 50 round darft? if I wanted to watch sub-par baseball, I'll watch minor leagues. Thanks for addressing all my points.

Bourgeois_Rage Wrote:I take that back. Who isn't drafted by baseball in a 50 round darft? if I wanted to watch sub-par baseball, I'll watch minor leagues. Thanks for addressing all my points.

You could do that with most of the corrupt and tainted MLB players these days...

Brick City Pirate Wrote:By the way, I guess it's o.k. to look past all of USF's weaknesses because they have potential, but it's not o.k. for people to think ECU would make a good member because of ECU's potential? If you think narrow minded in the shortrun, you are right about ECU, but if you are wise & look at the BIG PICTURE, you will see what all ECU fans know, ECU would be an excellent member of any conference!

USF is in Florida, a place that the Big East wants to keep open to the other schools for recruiting. That is why they looked at USF and UCF, and ultimately chose USF. It isn't because of their history (obviously), or even so much for their future. They just wanted to make sure the Big East got TV time in Florida to help recruiting...

ECU averaged 1785 fans over 64 games last year. Here's an article that confirm what I'm posting.

Popularity Of College Game Continues To Grow

By Will Kimmey
September 1, 2004


Fans in the Louisiana bayou love nothing more than to see their college baseball teams. They proved it on April 10, 2002, when an NCAA-record crowd of 27,673 packed into the Louisiana Superdome to watch Louisiana State beat Tulane 9-5.

Much to those fans’ dismay, their attendance record was broken in 2004—and three different times, no less. College baseball’s popularity rose to new heights thanks to several factors, including a national title defense by Rice’s unprecedented pitching trio, the superlative season of Long Beach State’s Jered Weaver, ESPN’s expanded postseason television coverage, and last but not least, the on-field success of the teams.

The last reason was the driving force behind the most unlikely of events to unseat the Superdome record. The Spring Baseball Classic at Atlanta’s Turner Field in May pitted Georgia against Georgia Tech and drew 28,836 fans, the second-largest crowd to ever watch a college baseball game.

“Around here, we might get that kind of attendance for a football game, but not a baseball game,

I don't think College Baseball will ever become very popular up north, just like College Hockey will never become popular down south. It is too cold for 90% of the college baseball season in Cincinnati (not to mention the Reds play 3 miles away), therefore I would not be a big supporter of it. I can see see, however, the teams in warmer weather climates being popular during the spring since people like to get outside and enjoy the weather.

mlbUC, There you go again being narrow minded. There are a lot more schools playing baseball than hockey both in the north & south. Baseball is America's past time & Hockey is Canada's past time. I think they are talking about pushing back the start of the college baseball season to help the northern schools. I'll bet that ECU averages more in baseball than USF does in basketball.

Brick City Pirate Wrote:mlbUC, There you go again being narrow minded.

Sorry that I am narrow minded... but the fact that UC baseball plays their first 9 games in Florida and North Carolina helps to support my feelings that it is just too cold in the early spring to get people interested in going to a baseball game. They play their first home game on March 4th, and my guess at the weather that day is rainy, and a high temperature in the low to mid 40's. Not exactly good for drawing fans down to Johnny Bench field (or whatever the new stadiums name is)...

That's all well and good, but HS games are drawing large attendance for big games as well. At the same time this is an article about the highest attendance figures in history. Some of these high attendance games wouldn't be enough to stay above the required average to stay in Div 1 A football (15,000). I know, not a fair comparison.

I think another thing clear in the article is that baseball is bigger in the south than it is in the north. The phenomenom is largely regional, I knew this before. Miami of Ohio has a great hockey team and I've heard the games do quite well as far as attendance goes. While it may be a major sport at Miami it is not a major sport nationally. I'd say the same goes for Baseball. It may mean something at some schools, or maybe even in all of the south, but it won't catch on nationally like football, or basketball has.

Another thing, kinda branching out here, but I would even go as far to say that Women's basketball is bigger than baseball at the college level. I only judge that based on the amount of TV play the sports get. While baseball will get the playoffs on TV, I don't think I've ever seen a regular season game on TV. Women's bb however is shown through the regular season. Which is another point; Joining the Big East will be good for UC Women's Basketball. It is a very strong conference for wbb.

At any rate here's some interesting links. I think the most interesting thing in this whole mess is that Baseball is very regional. Looking at the top attendances the south is obviously the largest baseball area. Also you can see how similar attendances are for the top women's bb teams are to baseball teams as far as individual teams go while baseball has double the amount of games. The total season attendance for baseball is strangely missing.

<a href='http://www.ncaa.org/stats/football/attendance/2003/2003footballattendance.pdf' target='_blank'>Football</a>
<a href='http://www.ncaa.org/stats/m_basketball/attendance/2004_basketball_attend.pdf' target='_blank'>Men's Basketball</a>
<a href='http://www.ncaa.org/stats/w_basketball/attendance/2003-04/2003-04_attendance.pdf' target='_blank'>Women's Basketball</a>
<a href='http://www.ncaa.org/stats/baseball/attendance/2004_attendance.pdf' target='_blank'>Baseball</a>

Quote: I'll bet that ECU averages more in baseball than USF does in basketball.

Not to burst your bubble, but:

Average Home attendance 2002-03
<a href='http://www.hoyasaxa.com/sports/bb-top14-2.htm' target='_blank'>South Florida: 4,045</a>

2004 baseball attendance:
<a href='http://www.ncaa.org/stats/baseball/attendance/2004_attendance.pdf' target='_blank'>ECU: 1,743</a>

These are the best numbers I could find.

I know Fox Sports televises college baseball, though probably regionally. I guess Notre Dame probably has the highest attendance for northern schools. The reason they do is because they go to the playoffs. I agree that college baseball has more southern appeal, while basketball & football have nationwide appeal. The point I'm trying to make is that the popularity for college baseball is on the rise. That is the reason schools are investing money for facilities. I watched the Little League World Series & I witnessed fan interest from all over the country. College baseball will never be the money maker football is, but neither is college basketball, when you compare football & basketball. Baseball has the potential to be profitable which is a rarity in college athletics. College baseball attendance & tv ratings will continue to increase whether you watch or not.

Rage,

Through 5 home basketball games this season, USF is averaging 2,155 fans.

We all know how USF can cook the books when it comes to averages.

Quote:Big East football wanted to keep a Florida footprint, that is how USF fits in.

Thing is, USF is more of a toe hold than a foot print.

Quote:They proved it on April 10, 2002, when an NCAA-record crowd of 27,673 packed into the Louisiana Superdome to watch Louisiana State beat Tulane 9-5.

Man..they drew more fans in the stands for that minor sport than Cincy averages for football. :laugh:

Brick City Pirate Wrote:Rage,

Through 5 home basketball games this season, USF is averaging 2,155 fans.

We all know how USF can cook the books when it comes to averages.

If you're going to cook the books (USF) at least make it respectable! :laugh:

The average this year is still better than your claim. Sorry, but I know that my HS women's basketball team brings in more fans per game than ECU baseball. Of course they also bring in more than the men's team. :D

Where'd you go to High School rage? My HS is the same way (Beavercreek).