(02-15-2012 12:51 PM)THUNDERGround Wrote:  Hey guys... Yes, I'm a Herd fan, but I still regard the MAC as a good, stable conference. I miss the rivalries with UT, Miami, and Ohio. We had some really good games.

If you wind up losing X or Y, what are your thoughts on Youngstown State? I hear they're going to try to make the jump to FBS. It's a perfect geographic fit and the football isn't bad. Or would that infringe on the other Ohio schools too much???

Way too much Ohio. The conference doesn't need more FB only, and YSU brings little in other sports.

(02-15-2012 12:51 PM)THUNDERGround Wrote:  Hey guys... Yes, I'm a Herd fan, but I still regard the MAC as a good, stable conference. I miss the rivalries with UT, Miami, and Ohio. We had some really good games.

If you wind up losing X or Y, what are your thoughts on Youngstown State? I hear they're going to try to make the jump to FBS. It's a perfect geographic fit and the football isn't bad. Or would that infringe on the other Ohio schools too much???

Unless we lose *most* of the Ohio school than OH needs to be off the map.

My bias is go after east coast big institutions CAA schools with good hoops or Maybe Stony Brook.

But on the other end mayne Iowa, Missouri, or Illinois schools.

Okay, yeah, I can see that. I didn't know where YSU was in terms of other sports. Apparently at the bottom.

Is the MAC trying to bring in current FBS schools (Mid-Tenn. / WKU) or would a good FCS program looking to move up (Old Dominion / JMU / Southern Illinois / App St.) and in a good market an attractive candidate? I was just curious to see if the MAC was trying to keep its geographical footprint intact.

(02-15-2012 01:20 PM)THUNDERGround Wrote:  Okay, yeah, I can see that. I didn't know where YSU was in terms of other sports. Apparently at the bottom.

Is the MAC trying to bring in current FBS schools (Mid-Tenn. / WKU) or would a good FCS program looking to move up (Old Dominion / JMU / Southern Illinois / App St.) and in a good market an attractive candidate? I was just curious to see if the MAC was trying to keep its geographical footprint intact.

Footprint intact? The MAC isn't trying to change anything. We're the only one's discussing expansion. The MAC has a stable 12. For better or worse.

I'm about the only one suggesting the MAC split.

(02-15-2012 01:20 PM)THUNDERGround Wrote:  Okay, yeah, I can see that. I didn't know where YSU was in terms of other sports. Apparently at the bottom.

Is the MAC trying to bring in current FBS schools (Mid-Tenn. / WKU) or would a good FCS program looking to move up (Old Dominion / JMU / Southern Illinois / App St.) and in a good market an attractive candidate? I was just curious to see if the MAC was trying to keep its geographical footprint intact.

Honestly after the addition of UMass I don't think the MAC is looking intently at any changes.

If we lose one of our Fball only schools than *maybe* we try to pull another but if we lose both I suspect the focus will be on improving the current 12 that remain.

The MAC benefits from a common footprint and a mostly common institutional profile (helps that 9 of our schools are split between just two state university systems).

The MAC, if they add, will keep it as close to the current footprint as they can while at the same time stretching into a new Market. That is unless something great comes along.

If Temple stays I can see reaching into VA / Deleware / NYC (stonybrook). On the west some of the other Illinois universities have been mentioned.

The problem with the alliance, and I am not trying to disparage any members here, is that you all have *nothing* in common.

As the conference starts to mature and the happy go lucky love phase ends it could get ugly. The politics of a 20 team conference with that footprint, that variance in institutional profiles (and priorities) is going to make Congress look like a group hug.

No, I agree...That's a fair point. I'd say the schools we have the most in common with is Southern Miss and ECU (small market/small town). Everyone else is either in a large metro area or west of the Mississippi or both.

And I think 24 teams in 4 pods (or whatever) is too big. Eighteen is plenty as there is currently an abundance of travel. If UTEP goes west and we add two in the "east" with zero crossovers our travel costs stay relatively the same.

The jury is still out on this one for me. I'm excited about the better programs in the MWC, but on the other hand, big whoop if we have to win the title every year to get a chance to play one. Overall, I think it will be better for the conference(s), but as to how much, well, that remains to be seen. They've kept a pretty tight lid on it.

This thing is about TV and markets.

I do miss the close-knit conference that the MAC is. Easy jaunts to Oxford, Athens, Kent, etc...

(02-15-2012 01:42 PM)THUNDERGround Wrote:  No, I agree...That's a fair point. I'd say the schools we have the most in common with is Southern Miss and ECU (small market/small town). Everyone else is either in a large metro area or west of the Mississippi or both.

And I think 24 teams in 4 pods (or whatever) is too big. Eighteen is plenty as there is currently an abundance of travel. If UTEP goes west and we add two in the "east" with zero crossovers our travel costs stay relatively the same.

The jury is still out on this one for me. I'm excited about the better programs in the MWC, but on the other hand, big whoop if we have to win the title every year to get a chance to play one. Overall, I think it will be better for the conference(s), but as to how much, well, that remains to be seen. They've kept a pretty tight lid on it.

This thing is about TV and markets.

I do miss the close-knit conference that the MAC is. Easy jaunts to Oxford, Athens, Kent, etc...

I think the best solution, for both conferences would have been a Molotov–Ribbentrop pact to divide up the WAC and then shuffle that large mass into two functional conferences. Maybe add Appy Georgia state or some sun belt to give an eastern front.

Could have put together two decent 12 team conferences with a nice scheduling agreement. But I doubt the WAC would have been any more enthusiastic about an MRP than Poland was.

(02-15-2012 01:54 PM)Bull_In_Exile Wrote:  Could have put together two decent 12 team conferences with a nice scheduling agreement. But I doubt the WAC would have been any more enthusiastic about an MRP than Poland was.

The WAC would be fine, it's the residual MWC that is most unhappy at this point.

I think that refusal to accept their current situation is going to be their downfall.

Only major change that would help is a big exodus from the Big 12, and then that conference looking west.

Yeah, I think the WAC is in trouble. As is stands now, they're losing 3, maybe 4, and I think you have to have 8 to be a conference, don't you? I'd day they'll add some FCS teams and hope for the best. I can't see all of the WAC being absorbed by the MWC.

(02-15-2012 02:43 PM)THUNDERGround Wrote:  Yeah, I think the WAC is in trouble. As is stands now, they're losing 3, maybe 4, and I think you have to have 8 to be a conference, don't you? I'd day they'll add some FCS teams and hope for the best. I can't see all of the WAC being absorbed by the MWC.

Not just that but so many members need to be conference mates over a given period of time to maintain an NCAA bid.

(02-15-2012 02:43 PM)THUNDERGround Wrote:  Yeah, I think the WAC is in trouble. As is stands now, they're losing 3, maybe 4, and I think you have to have 8 to be a conference, don't you? I'd day they'll add some FCS teams and hope for the best. I can't see all of the WAC being absorbed by the MWC.

And that's the MWC memebers' mistake.

(02-15-2012 02:45 PM)Bull_In_Exile Wrote:  

(02-15-2012 02:43 PM)THUNDERGround Wrote:  Yeah, I think the WAC is in trouble. As is stands now, they're losing 3, maybe 4, and I think you have to have 8 to be a conference, don't you? I'd day they'll add some FCS teams and hope for the best. I can't see all of the WAC being absorbed by the MWC.

Not just that but so many members need to be conference mates over a given period of time to maintain an NCAA bid.

Actually the MWC is closer to the brink of extinction because you need 7 members who have been in a conference consecutively for 2 seasons for the basketball autobid.

1. Air Force (1998)
2. Colorado State (1998)
3. New Mexico (1998)
4. UNLV (1998)
5. San Diego State (1998, leaving 2013)
6. TCU (2005, leaving 2012)
7. Boise (2011, leaving 2012)
8. Fresno State (2012)
9. Nevada (2012)
10. Hawaii (2012, FB only)

In 2012 the MWC will only have 4 member that have been in the conference consecutively for 2 seasons. They will only have 7 all-sport members, less than the required 8 to maintain FBS status.

(02-15-2012 01:20 PM)THUNDERGround Wrote:  Is the MAC trying to bring in current FBS schools (Mid-Tenn. / WKU) or would a good FCS program looking to move up (Old Dominion / JMU / Southern Illinois / App St.) and in a good market an attractive candidate? I was just curious to see if the MAC was trying to keep its geographical footprint intact.

Depending the vantage point of the MAC school making a selection there is a wide variety of support for different candidates.

Ideally, the MAC would like to expand its footprint to nearby schools that can be within easy bus distance to save on travel costs. All the potential additions however only are within driving distance of a few schools.

Northern Illinois (Northern Iowa, Illinois State)
Miami (Western Ky, Middle Tennessee)
Ohio (Appalachian State, James Madison)
Buffalo (Albany, Stony Brook)

Out of all those different directions to strike out in the MAC is probably best served with Appalachian State and James Madison. They already draw 25,000 and have competed at the very top levels of FCS. The facilities are in place for a MAC upgrade today.

Old Dominion and Charlotte are more in the CUSA mold market wise and I don't think the MAC will want to go that direction.

(02-11-2012 04:44 PM)BarnardHall211 Wrote:  even their mods are obnoxious.

I know enough about ECU fans to know they would not go to a conference where football is just something to go see because you don't have something else to do. 50,000 ECU fans in the stadium leads the league in attendance. Getting smaller is not their game plan.

(02-16-2012 03:58 PM)BkGold Wrote:  

(02-11-2012 04:44 PM)BarnardHall211 Wrote:  even their mods are obnoxious.

I know enough about ECU fans to know they would not go to a conference where football is just something to go see because you don't have something else to do. 50,000 ECU fans in the stadium leads the league in attendance. Getting smaller is not their game plan.

LOL I think oyu got that backwards son.. The reason attendance is better in the CUSA cities is because college football is the only game in town... Really on a Saturday in Hattiesburg what else is there to do?

Now the Bulls are competing against the Bills, the Sabers, two other NCAA Division 1 (hoops) colleges....

WAC is probably going to fold and Karl Benson knew it so he got the heck out of there while he could.

(02-17-2012 12:33 AM)epasnoopy Wrote:  WAC is probably going to fold and Karl Benson knew it so he got the heck out of there while he could.

Its hard to tell if the WAC will make it or not.

I guess if the WAC can retain Idaho, SJSU, Utah State, New Mexico State they'll have a western core to recruit in Montana, Montana State, Portland State, Sacramento State. Then you've got some regional basketball only schools like Denver, Seattle and Boise State to help for travel.

With the death of the AQ's its getting to the point that almost any FCS scholarship program would accept a conference invite if they could get one to the WAC or the SBC just to get on the gravy train of FBS postseason revenue.

The same goes for the MAC. Its not even that MAC has to offer something by itself as a football or basketball conference anymore, the simple fact that a school like James Madison would be able to participate in FBS revenue sharing is reason enough for them to join.

Since 2006 the eight remaining C-USA teams are 8-4 against the MAC, just a thought.

Also, I think Temple to C-USA is a stupid idea with no real merit.

(02-20-2012 04:37 PM)LR Eagle Wrote:  Since 2006 the eight remaining C-USA teams are 8-4 against the MAC, just a thought.

Also, I think Temple to C-USA is a stupid idea with no real merit.

Since 2006 Buffalo is 2-0 against CUSA teams

It's an interesting stat but our schools don't play enough to really tell..

since 2011 Frankenstein Conf. schools are 0-3 vs the MAC.