Quote:Tuesday, March 29
1. Hoping to renew its deal with the Gator Bowl, the Big East told officials of the Jacksonville bowl: Kick the tires on the SEC all you want. However, the SEC is sending its first two teams to the BCS and its next two to the Capital One and Outback, and our No. 2 is a better deal than the SEC's No. 5.

<a href='http://sports.espn.go.com/ncf/news/story?page=threepointstance' target='_blank'>http://sports.espn.go.com/ncf/news/story?p...hreepointstance</a>

Unfortunately, it doesn't mention whether the Big East is going to cave and let the Gator have "unfettered" access to Notre Dame every year.

Let's hope not.

Murph, This past year the SEC #5 would have been the Florida Gators, if I'm looking at last year's standings correctly. No offense, but I'd bet the Gator Bowl would have loved a FSU/Florida matchup. Just about any SEC school would fill the Gator Bowl. Plus, who is to say that the Big East # 2 won't be playing in a BCS game?

Quote:Plus, who is to say that the Big East # 2 won't be playing in a BCS game?

Believe me, it's a problem we'd love to have, but that didn't even occur when Miami and VPI were in the league, it sure as heck won't happen now.

Hats off to the 'Big East officials' for making this point. I know that pretty much any SEC team will put more butts in seats, but when you are going so far down as #5, your bowl begins to take a prestige hit.

I don't know if that argument will be enough, I really don't want to lose the Gator.

Brick City Pirate Wrote:Murph, This past year the SEC #5 would have been the Florida Gators, if I'm looking at last year's standings correctly. No offense, but I'd bet the Gator Bowl would have loved a FSU/Florida matchup. Just about any SEC school would fill the Gator Bowl. Plus, who is to say that the Big East # 2 won't be playing in a BCS game?

And the Florida situation was a fluke situation. It's not a given that the Gator Bowl will have access to Florida or a similar school every year in the SEC. And I wouldn't go as far as to say that any SEC school would fill the Gator Bowl. If that were true then bowl attendance wouldn't be down, and that includes bowls that the SEC schools participated in. Also, don't rule out the Big East sending a #2 team to a BCS bowl or a high ranking bowl. If Louisville and Pitt play to their potential this year they both should be Top 10 or 15 squads.

The Big East spokesman must have obviously meant the Cotton Bowl, not the Outback, which is several rungs below the Cotton and Gator Bowls.

It does seem like the Liberty, in order to get the SEC involved, will have to (1) get its payout a fair amount above $2 million, and (2) that's just to get to the #5 spot, or #6 when the SEC gets 2 BCS teams. The BCS, Capital One, Cotton, and Gator Bowls (if the Gator also goes SEC) would all stand ahead of the Liberty even then.

The ACC, if the LB can get #4 or even #3, would be a better option. Or, the Big East #2 as a fallback if they guarantee enough ticket sales at the conference level. I would imagine it would be a 17-18k ticket guarantee.

Or maybe they just forgot to mention Cotton altogether and the Gator Bowl would actually be getting #6 instead of #5. Somebody correct me if I'm wrong, but both the Cotton and Outback have higher payouts than the Gator, do they not?

The Non-BCS Bowls with the biggest payouts in order are:

#1 Capital One
#2 Cotton
#3 Outback
#4 Peach
#5 Holiday
#6 Gator

The SEC sends a representative to all of the Top 4.

Gator would need to increase its total payout over $1 million to compete with the Peach Bowl.

So if the SEC were to maintain a relationship with all of these bowls, they would basically be sending SEC #6 or #7.

They only get to #5 if the SEC were to lose one of its slots in the Top 4 and then only sends one team to the BCS.

Cheers,
Neil

tufinal4 Wrote:The Big East spokesman must have obviously meant the Cotton Bowl, not the Outback, which is several rungs below the Cotton and Gator Bowls.

It does seem like the Liberty, in order to get the SEC involved, will have to (1) get its payout a fair amount above $2 million, and (2) that's just to get to the #5 spot, or #6 when the SEC gets 2 BCS teams. The BCS, Capital One, Cotton, and Gator Bowls (if the Gator also goes SEC) would all stand ahead of the Liberty even then.

The ACC, if the LB can get #4 or even #3, would be a better option. Or, the Big East #2 as a fallback if they guarantee enough ticket sales at the conference level. I would imagine it would be a 17-18k ticket guarantee.

The Outback Bowl is not several rungs below the Cotton and Gator Bowls.

Someone on another board made an interesting point. The Big 10 could send its #4 team to the Gator Bowl by dropping the Sun Bowl. Apparently, the Sun Bowl wants Big 12 vs. Pac 10 rather than Big 10 vs. Pac 10.
I could see the Gator Bowl wanting Big 10 #4 over Big East #2.
If we lose the Gator Bowl...Mike T's gotta go :bang:

Quote:Someone on another board made an interesting point. The Big 10 could send its #4 team to the Gator Bowl by dropping the Sun Bowl. Apparently, the Sun Bowl wants Big 12 vs. Pac 10 rather than Big 10 vs. Pac 10.
I could see the Gator Bowl wanting Big 10 #4 over Big East #2.
If we lose the Gator Bowl...Mike T's gotta go&nbsp; :bang:

Not necessarily. One of the reasons why the Sun Bowl is looking at the B12 over the B10 is because once you get beyond Michigan and Ohio State, the only other team that is known for traveling fans is Penn State. And they haven't been good in a while.

Still, Wisconsin and Iowa, the teams most likely to finish as B10 #4 would probably draw better or at least equal TV ratings.

What won't happen with the B10 is giving the Gator any access to ND, which means the ACC would have to acquiesce to the Gator on this point or the Gator doesn't get ND.

Now the ACC might do so, just to spite the BE, but that access would be like the Cotton Bowl access to ND is, one-time and one-time only over a four year period. Still, considering how desperately the ACC needs to make $$$ to show expansion was worth it, I highly doubt this scenario.

Personally, I think the BE should do whatever is necessary to secure our #2 to the Outback (if they are even remotely interested). If not, target the Liberty and give up on the Gator altogether. The conference just doesn't need the bad press the Gator gives us each and every year.

Cheers,
Neil

ACC Bowls
#1) BCS - $12,963,000
#2) Peach - $2,200,000
<span style='color:red'>#3) Gator - $1,600,000</span>
#4) Champs Sports - $850,000
#5) MPC computers - $750,000
#6) Continental Tires - $750,000

Big 12 Bowls
#1) BCS - $12,963,000
<span style='color:blue'>#2) Cotton - $3,000,000</span>
<span style='color:blue'>#3) Holiday - $2,000,000</span>
#4) Alamo - $1,550,000
#5) Independence - $1,200,000
#6) Houston – $1,100,000
#7) Champs Sports - $850,000
#8) Forth Worth - $750,000

Big 10 Bowls
#1) BCS - $12,963,000
<span style='color:blue'>#2) Capital One - $5,187,000</span>
<span style='color:blue'>#3) Outback - $2,750,000</span>
#4) Alamo - $1,550,000
#5) Sun - $1,500,000
#6) Music City - $780,000
#7) Motor City - $750,000

SEC Bowls
#1) BCS - $12,963,000
<span style='color:blue'>#2) Capital One - $5,187,000</span>
<span style='color:blue'>#3) Cotton - $3,000,000</span>
<span style='color:blue'>#4) Outback - $2,750,000</span>
<span style='color:blue'>#5) Peach - $2,200,000</span>
#6) Independence - $1,200,000
#7) Houston – $1,100,000
#8) Motor City - $750,000

Pac-10 Bowls
#1) BCS - $12,963,000
<span style='color:blue'>#2) Holiday - $2,000,000</span>
#3) Sun - $1,500,000
#4) Las Vegas - $750,000
#5) Insight - $750,000
#6) Emerald - $750,000

Same conference
#1) BCS - $11,780,000
#2) BCS - $6,000,000

missed Independence bowl in SEC

omnicarrier Wrote:

Quote:Someone on another board made an interesting point. The Big 10 could send its #4 team to the Gator Bowl by dropping the Sun Bowl. Apparently, the Sun Bowl wants Big 12 vs. Pac 10 rather than Big 10 vs. Pac 10.
I could see the Gator Bowl wanting Big 10 #4 over Big East #2.
If we lose the Gator Bowl...Mike T's gotta go &nbsp; :bang:

Not necessarily. One of the reasons why the Sun Bowl is looking at the B12 over the B10 is because once you get beyond Michigan and Ohio State, the only other team that is known for traveling fans is Penn State. And they haven't been good in a while.

Still, Wisconsin and Iowa, the teams most likely to finish as B10 #4 would probably draw better or at least equal TV ratings.

What won't happen with the B10 is giving the Gator any access to ND, which means the ACC would have to acquiesce to the Gator on this point or the Gator doesn't get ND.

Now the ACC might do so, just to spite the BE, but that access would be like the Cotton Bowl access to ND is, one-time and one-time only over a four year period. Still, considering how desperately the ACC needs to make $$$ to show expansion was worth it, I highly doubt this scenario.

Personally, I think the BE should do whatever is necessary to secure our #2 to the Outback (if they are even remotely interested). If not, target the Liberty and give up on the Gator altogether. The conference just doesn't need the bad press the Gator gives us each and every year.

Cheers,
Neil

You don't have very good knowledge of the Big 10. Actually, Wisconsin is probably the school that travels best. The fans are insane. They actually had to set up tents outside the Rose Bowl with big screen tvs because of the thousands (some reports were of 20-40,000 fans) of the extra Wisconsin fans that travelled to the game, but could not get tickets. Wisconsin regularly gets selected to go to a better bowl game simply because its fans travel so well. Iowa is very similar, although the school and the state are smaller. Iowa has been selected ahead of other Big 10 schools just because it travels so well. Michigan and Ohio State, while travelling very well, clearly don't have the reputation of UW and UI. Suprisingly, Northwestern also travels well and had a fine showing in the Rose Bowl. Illinois and Indiana do travel well for basketball, so if their football teams ever come around, they also would probably do well. Minnesota, although the largest school in the country, doesn't have much of a reputation. Michigan State and Purdue travel, but not in hoards, like UW and Iowa.

Quote: You don't have very good knowledge of the Big 10. Actually, Wisconsin is probably the school that travels best. The fans are insane. They actually had to set up tents outside the Rose Bowl with big screen tvs because of the thousands (some reports were of 20-40,000 fans) of the extra Wisconsin fans that travelled to the game, but could not get tickets. Wisconsin regularly gets selected to go to a better bowl game simply because its fans travel so well. Iowa is very similar, although the school and the state are smaller. Iowa has been selected ahead of other Big 10 schools just because it travels so well. Michigan and Ohio State, while travelling very well, clearly don't have the reputation of UW and UI. Suprisingly, Northwestern also travels well and had a fine showing in the Rose Bowl. Illinois and Indiana do travel well for basketball, so if their football teams ever come around, they also would probably do well. Minnesota, although the largest school in the country, doesn't have much of a reputation. Michigan State and Purdue travel, but not in hoards, like UW and Iowa.

You don't judge 'traveling' fans by how many they send to a BCS Bowl (particularly the 'Granddaddy of the All').

You judge them by how they 'travel' to the non-BCS bowls.

In this case Wisconsin's record is far from sterling. The only crowd they have had above 50,000 fans is the Outback and since they face an SEC opponent in that game, you know which conference is sending more fans.

Not that Wisconsin's numbers are 'bad' but it isn't as impressive as OSU and Michigan and really isn't much more than SU's especially when you consider the huge alumni base they have to draw from, which a small private school does not.

Northwestern's numbers are virtually non-existant.

Cheers,
Neil

You mean like the 24,000 tickets that Badger fans bought from the school for the Hall of Fame Bowl a few years ago plus the additional 6,000 tickets bought from travel agencies? 30,000 tickets for a minor bowl game isn't bad.

Quote: You mean like the 24,000 tickets that Badger fans bought from the school for the Hall of Fame Bowl a few years ago plus the additional 6,000 tickets bought from travel agencies? 30,000 tickets for a minor bowl game isn't bad.

That was a decade ago (1995) and it was their second consecutive Bowl game after not having been to a bowl in over a decade.

Their Copper (now Insight Bowl) numbers in the 1996 game were not much better than what SU and Pitt have sent to Insight games. And SU and Pitt don't have 'traveling' reputations.

In addition, Wisconsin sent a formal written apology to the Kickoff Classic people at the beginning of the following season (1997) when they couldn't manage to come close to selling 10,000 tickets for the game against SU in the Meadowlands.

Again, the Badgers are good, but they are certainly far from great.

Cheers,
Neil

And to re-inforce the above:

HO-HUM: TAMPA BOWL LOSES LUSTER WITH UW FANS
Wisconsin State Journal; 12/25/2004; Todd Finkelmeyer

Wisconsin State Journal

12-25-2004

HO-HUM: TAMPA BOWL LOSES LUSTER WITH UW FANS
Byline: Todd Finkelmeyer
Edition: ALL
Section: SPORTS
Column: HIT AND RUN
Type: Column

A couple items to ponder while dashing through the snow, in a one- horse open sleigh:

Is the University of Wisconsin - with its large fan base, solid recent football tradition and entertaining marching band - still one of the nation's top bowl draws?

Ten years ago, many in the red-sweater crowd were eagerly anticipating the Badgers' first trip to Tampa, Fla., for the UW's bowl matchup with Duke

Back then, the game was known as the Hall of Fame Bowl, and an estimated 30,000 Badgers fans were in Florida to enjoy some fun in the sun just one year after Wisconsin's first Rose Bowl triumph. Of those Badger backers, 24,000 bought their tickets directly through the UW - then a record number sold by any school participating in a Tampa bowl game.

Duke, in fact, was so worried about the large contingent of Badgers fans that this reporter remembers attending a Blue Devils practice in the week leading up to the game, and watching coach Fred Goldsmith's squad run its offense while every Duke backup stood on the sidelines and yelled as loud as they could to simulate crowd noise.

As for this year's Outback Bowl in Tampa?

According to associate athletic director Steve Malchow, the UW is "closing in on" 10,000 tickets sold - a total that includes tickets used by the team's traveling party - for the 16th-ranked Badgers' (9- 2) game next Saturday against No. 8 Georgia (9-2).

And although Georgia has sold more than 15,000 tickets, Outback Bowl president and CEO Jim McVay said seats for the game still remain. The Outback Bowl has sold out the previous four seasons at 65,000-seat Raymond James Stadium.

To be certain, ticket directors at many schools would be doing backflips if they could sell 10,000 bowl tickets.

In addition, some Badger fans no doubt bought their tickets directly through the Outback Bowl.

That said, it is fair to say times have changed for many Badger backers - spoiled by three Rose Bowl wins since Jan. 1 of 1994.

How else can one explain that the UW has sold fewer tickets for its lasts three bowl games combined - the 2002 Alamo (6,000), 2003 Music City (7,000) and 2005 Outback (10,000) - than it sold for the 1995 Hall of Fame Bowl (24,000)?

Cheers,
Neil