(11-04-2011 08:05 PM)Lolly Popp Wrote: The problem with the Big East goes back to before its formation. In the 1970s, Penn State wanted to get the Eastern Independents together in one conference, but also wanted unfair advantages and concessions in football, which killed the deal. Pitt was coming off the 1976 national championship and was every bit the equal of the Nittany Lions. So the idea went nowhere at that time.
The second problem came when the Big East was formed. Dave Gavitt and Providence wanted to create the greatest basketball league in NCAA history, based on capturing all the big Northeast markets. Rutgers and Temple were original target schools, but both said no, because they were loyal to Joe Paterno and his plans. Those rejections completely changed the direction of the Big East.
As you know, Seton Hall and Villanova were the second choices in the New Jersey and Philadelphia markets, and the problems began. If the Big East had only included Providence, St. John's, and Georgetown as Catholic schools, it could have still worked out. UConn might have upgraded earlier. BC, Syracuse, Rutgers, and Temple would have eventually gotten Penn State and Pitt voted in.
What happened in real life was Penn State applied in 1982. Five teams voted yes and three voted no (believed by some to be Seton Hall, Villanova, and Georgetown). Problem was they needed six to get in. Then, to prevent Paterno from luring BC and Syracuse to a new conference, the Big East voted to add Pitt instead. This bit of egotistical treachery was basically the point of no return.
A new President took over at Penn State in the late 1980s and decided he wanted them in the Big Ten. At that point, the Big East opted to grab Miami for all sports, to substitute for the star power lost due to Penn State's move. Then they added Rutgers, Temple, Virginia Tech, and West Virginia as football-only members, joining the Hurricanes, BC, Syracuse, and Pitt in the gridiron hybrid.
A huge opportunity was also missed in 1994. CBS offered the football schools a contract to break away, form their own all-sports league, and expand. Instead, they compromised by adding Rutgers and West Virginia for all sports, plus Notre Dame in everything but football. Temple and Virginia Tech got screwed, although the Hokies did eventually get basketball membership, shortly before leaving.
You know the rest, with the ACC pulling off a raid in 2003, followed by the chaos of this year. So the reason the Big East is where it is, in my opinion, is because of bad decisions and half-baked compromises. Rutgers and Temple should have said yes in 1979. Penn State should have been admitted in 1982. The football schools should have taken the money from CBS and broken away in 1994.
You have several key errors in your thoughtful & thorough analysis.
1. Penn State left the old Eastern Eight with the intent of organizing an all sports league in June, 1979. So, yes, they began this effort "in the 1970's" but only in the last 6 months of the 1970's. The effort rightfully belongs in the early '80's
2. I've never heard that Temple was originally preferred over Villanova. That doesn't mean it's not true, but that's simply my response to your comment. Moreover, Jake Crouthamel doesn't mention it in his history of the Big East, which is available on line. That's significant because he does mention that an offer was originally made to Rutgers over Seton Hall but declined by Rutgers. Crouthamel indicates that Temple was considered but never indicates that they were originally targeted.
3. You make much ado about the failure of Penn State to be admitted to the conference. Why is this significant? It was a basketball conference which did not sponsor football. How would Penn State's membership have helped the development of an all sports conference? The significance of Penn State's application is that it was an admission that Paterno's dream of an all sports conference was dead & that he was at that time seeking the best alternative for his other sports.
4. The new president at Penn State was Bryce Jordan & he did not take over in the late 1980's. He began in 1983, a little over a year after Penn State was rejected by the Big East. He stated from day one that it was his intention to take Penn State to the Big Ten & he made that his mission throughout his presidency. Even if Penn State had been admitted to the Big East - then a fledgling conference in its early stages - there is no way that he would have been deterred from his goal by such an association that didn't include football & didn't include the research component (CIC) that accompanies Big Ten membership.
The significance of these dates is as follows:
A. Discussions about formation of the Big East among key Athletic Directors began in the spring of 1978, more than a year before Penn State left the Eastern 8. Paterno was a day late & a dollar short with his efforts. He had neither the vision nor the leadership skills of Gavitt. He was the wrong man for the job. by the time his efforts began, the Big East was already formed.
B. Don't forget that the Eastern 8 from its beginning in 1976 included Penn State, Pitt, West Virginia, Rutgers, UMass, & Villanova - all football schools at the time. Only GW & Duquesne from the originbal membership were not football schools. Paterno already had what he needed to start an all sports conference. All he needed was a football agreement. There was really no need to go to the Big East. At the time only 6 members were needed to form a conference. BC & Syracuse would eventually have had to come to him. He could also have targeted other independents of which there were plenty at the time. However, he had neither the vision nor the leadrship skills.
C. Big East membership was not what was needed to form an all sports conference. What was needed was an agreement among the football schools. And that is what has never been doable in the East. Penn State wanted special Texas-like treatment & once Jordan arrived on the scene, they simply wanted something else. Villanova decided they didn't want football & UMass decided they didn't want Division I-A. Syracuse, BC, & eventually Pitt decided that basketball was more important to them at the time. They were all going in different directions & they have been ever since.
I agree with your comments about 1994. Eastern Football had many opportunities like this to form an all sports conference without the Catholics over the past 30 years & they always rejected the idea. Their inability to commit to each other is precisely what has always been the core problem.
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How Did The Big East Get To This Point?
