+1 LRTrojan

Matt is not the second coming of Alan Barksdale and should not even be mentioned alongside any of the starters on the 1996 team that gave us our last postseason appearance, especially Fisher. ****, he'd have been lucky to be riding the pine next to John Malone!

However, he is an asset to the team and deserves some respect and recognition based upon the facts. Never mind all the the spin some people try to put on it.

(11-28-2010 07:44 PM)LRTrojan Wrote:  

(11-28-2010 06:17 PM)insideualr Wrote:  If you have enough studs on the team then Matt is great, if Matt has to be one of the main guys, then you get 6 wins. That is an issue of recruiting and not having enough players to compete. Not win but compete.

I agree that Matt is a role player, but some of you guys are so prejuiced against Matt that you don't even realize what you've just said. You keep bringing up this six wins ****. Matt started a great many games on teams that you guys say make Shields a great coach. When you say "if he is one of the main guys, then you get six wins." Why don't you give him the credit for being one of the main guys that got 20 wins and 23 wins back to back.

I've never said that Matt is anything more than a very good role player. I'm not quite as high on him as Doc is, but I've never been all that high on your All-American either. He's just a good, middle level mid-major player in my opinion. I know ya'll like to get on Doc's ass, and I'm not taking up for Doc, I'm taking up for Matt, because outside of Doc, not many on here want to give him credit for much of anything. I'm only trying to see that Matt gets due credit for what he's done here.

Sure, he's not by any stretch of the imagination a great D-1 player, but I doubt that any of us on here could carry Matt's jock. I know I couldn't.

Here is the credit

He is a great shooter and with the right guys around him he could be a winner.

Here is the facts

He is a 7th or 8th man on a good mid-major team. He plays in the spots that we need a dead eye shooter.

He is a 6th man or better on a less than .500 mid-major team.

So, Reggie Theus and Steve Kerr are the same guy. One is beloved and the other bemoaned because fans only care about the record. I am sure Steve Kerr still gets a warm smile when a Bulls fan thinks about him. I am sure a Clippers fan still thinks good lord when they think about Reggie.

Maybe a better example would be Danny Ange. Celtic's fans love him and Kings fans probably remember him being a bust.

(11-28-2010 08:24 PM)insideualr Wrote:  [ Here is the credit

He is a great shooter and with the right guys around him he could be a winner.

Here is the facts

He is a 7th or 8th man on a good mid-major team. He plays in the spots that we need a dead eye shooter.

He is a 6th man or better on a less than .500 mid-major team.

So, Reggie Theus and Steve Kerr are the same guy. One is beloved and the other bemoaned because fans only care about the record. I am sure Steve Kerr still gets a warm smile when a Bulls fan thinks about him. I am sure a Clippers fan still thinks good lord when they think about Reggie.

Maybe a better example would be Danny Ange. Celtic's fans love him and Kings fans probably remember him being a bust.

You talk about facts, but you still leave out one very important fact, that he was a major player and contributed a lot to the two back to back 20 game teams. He started many of those games. "He's 7th or 8th man on a good mid-major team." Yes, right now he is the 7th or 8th player on this team, but I don't know that the verdict is in on whether it's a "good" mid-major team or not. But you leave out that he was the 5th or 6th man in many of the games on those 20 win teams.

Solo was one of the top five players on the "6 win" team. Is he due any of the blame for it not being a better team? Probably not.

Doc, I don't know if Matt has bad breath or what, or you've poisioned some of these guys against him, but they sure as hell aren't going to ever give him the credit he's due.

A guy walks on, busts his ass for free for two years, helps win a lot of games, and gets no credit. I ******* give up.

Bob,

Matt played ~29 minutes a game on a team that had Fowler, Patterson, and Edwards on it. Matt can play a bunch of productive minutes on that team. Please see Danny Ange on the Celtics.

Matt played ~25 minutes a game on the 6 win team. Please see the Kings.


Once again, everyone loves Matt but he is not a main guy. You can't build a team around him. You can build a team around Shane Edwards or Mike Smith. You can build one around Nick Zackery. You can't build a team around Patterson.

Some hate on Solo for the most part because I put his name down as a savior of the program (I wanted to believe he was a true pg not a shot 1st pg) and some folks have a problem with him. I have a problem with him to if he single handily shoots us out of a game, which he has in the past. Solo last year was Reggie Theus in LA. Solo this year is Reggie Theus playing for the Hawks (Theus, Wilkins, Malone, Willis). That guy did not score as much but he was finally on a winner. Solo this year still is the guy that is going to get the ball in the last 10 seconds of the shot clock but he is playing more within the flow of things this year.

I just want them to win. I don't care who plays to get it done.

(11-28-2010 09:23 PM)insideualr Wrote:  Bob,

Matt played ~29 minutes a game on a team that had Fowler, Patterson, and Edwards on it. Matt can play a bunch of productive minutes on that team. Please see Danny Ange on the Celtics.

Matt played ~25 minutes a game on the 6 win team. Please see the Kings.

Some hate on Solo for the most part because I put his name down as a savior of the program (I wanted to believe he was a true pg not a shot 1st pg) and some folks have a problem with him. I have a problem with him to if he single handily shoots us out of a game, which he has in the past. I just want them to win. I don't care who plays to get it done.

I haven't looked it up, but I'm sure Solo played more minutes a game than Matt did. Therefore he played more minutes than Matt did on a bad team. He is yet to play on a good team here. Maybe this year we hope, but he hasn't yet.

I have no problem with Solo other than I don't think he was a team player last year. He's a pretty good solid player. I'm glad we've got him, or we would be hurting. Do I think he's an all league player? No.

I care who plays either. That's why I haven't been defending Matt's loss of PT at this point. I've just been defending his contribution to this program. Some of you guys haven't given him the respect he deserves. As far as more PT, he's got to earn that back.

(11-28-2010 09:54 PM)LRTrojan Wrote:  

(11-28-2010 09:23 PM)insideualr Wrote:  Bob,

Matt played ~29 minutes a game on a team that had Fowler, Patterson, and Edwards on it. Matt can play a bunch of productive minutes on that team. Please see Danny Ange on the Celtics.

Matt played ~25 minutes a game on the 6 win team. Please see the Kings.

Some hate on Solo for the most part because I put his name down as a savior of the program (I wanted to believe he was a true pg not a shot 1st pg) and some folks have a problem with him. I have a problem with him to if he single handily shoots us out of a game, which he has in the past. I just want them to win. I don't care who plays to get it done.

I haven't looked it up, but I'm sure Solo played more minutes a game than Matt did. Therefore he played more minutes than Matt did on a bad team. He is yet to play on a good team here. Maybe this year we hope, but he hasn't yet.

I have no problem with Solo other than I don't think he was a team player last year. He's a pretty good solid player. I'm glad we've got him, or we would be hurting. Do I think he's an all league player? No.

I care who plays either. That's why I haven't been defending Matt's loss of PT at this point. I've just been defending his contribution to this program. Some of you guys haven't given him the respect he deserves. As far as more PT, he's got to earn that back.

Matt scored the points that allowed the defense of Fowler, Patterson and Edwards to result in wins. He gets full credit as to being a piece of that. He also gets full credit (solo too) for winning 6 games the next year without Fowler, Patterson, and Edwards.

(11-28-2010 10:12 PM)insideualr Wrote:  Matt scored the points that allowed the defense of Fowler, Patterson and Edwards to result in wins. He gets full credit as to being a piece of that. He also gets full credit (solo too) for winning 6 games the next year without Fowler, Patterson, and Edwards.

True. I hope I'm done on the subject. Ya'll have worn me down. And I hope you guys cut Doc some slack. He's just proud of his adoptive kid, just like you guys would be proud of your kids. Any kid that walks on, and earns a schollie has my respect.

Thanks Doc, Thanks Bob!!!! Here's a kid that loves this program. Sad his fans have to hate on him! What message does that send to the next "Matt" that would consider coming here!!!

(11-28-2010 11:25 PM)SLK Wrote:  Thanks Doc, Thanks Bob!!!! Here's a kid that loves this program. Sad his fans have to hate on him! What message does that send to the next "Matt" that would consider coming here!!!

I have seen no one hate on Matt. As Inside said we all like the kid and appreciate what he's done for the program. Most of the discussion has been brought on by Doc arguing that Matt is a superstar who is being held down by a coach that is biased against him, players who won't pass to him, etc. We also all like Doc, but I think the backlash has been aimed a lot more at him than at Matt.

Matt is a good player, he is not producing right now, but it is early. Other players are producing, so that is taking away from his chances. Steve is giving him chances and will continue to, he just needs to produce. Will he play 30 minutes a game at the end of the year, no one knows. He has proven himself in the past, but what you shot in the past 3 years doesn't carry over to the current season. Hopefully Matt will produce highly

(11-28-2010 11:49 PM)littlerockbred Wrote:  Matt is a good player, he is not producing right now, but it is early. Other players are producing, so that is taking away from his chances. Steve is giving him chances and will continue to, he just needs to produce. Will he play 30 minutes a game at the end of the year, no one knows. He has proven himself in the past, but what you shot in the past 3 years doesn't carry over to the current season. Hopefully Matt will produce highly

That is a good point that really hasn't been mentioned. It doesn't really matter what Matt did or didn't do in the past. His playing time this year will depend on how he plays in 2010-2011.

(11-28-2010 11:25 PM)SLK Wrote:  Thanks Doc, Thanks Bob!!!! Here's a kid that loves this program. Sad his fans have to hate on him! What message does that send to the next "Matt" that would consider coming here!!!

We do not hate Matt and do not tell or play it that way it you know or talk to Matt. We love to root for Matt. Jerry tends to read more into his ups and downs than the rest of us.

We all love Jerry too. He keeps the board moving.

Well I lied. I'm going to say just one more thing(I hope)on this subject. No, I don't believe anyone on this board hates Matt or any other Trojan, especially mjs and insider. They are two of our best fans, and they spend too much time and money supporting a basketball program that is obviously stagnant, with no signs of wanting to improve. I certainly believe that they don't hate Matt, but I don't think they believe he is D-1 material. They may be right, but how many other true D-1 players have we had here in recent years, when a kid like Matt can come in here, play ahead of a bunch of the recruited kids, and make the kind of showing he's made. That speaks volumes about what Matt has accomplished, and the recruiting capabilities of our coach doesn't it?

Thanks Matt for all you've done as a Trojan, and what you will continue to do the remainder of this season. You are a winner.

(11-29-2010 08:11 AM)insideualr Wrote:  

(11-28-2010 11:25 PM)SLK Wrote:  Thanks Doc, Thanks Bob!!!! Here's a kid that loves this program. Sad his fans have to hate on him! What message does that send to the next "Matt" that would consider coming here!!!

We do not hate Matt and do not tell or play it that way it you know or talk to Matt. We love to root for Matt. Jerry tends to read more into his ups and downs than the rest of us.

We all love Jerry too. He keeps the board moving.

I know everyone loves Matt. We just disagree about his capabilities.
That's what a message board should be about. Differences of opinions.
I don't take it personally when my friends disagree with me. If they didn't care about the program, they wouldn't be on this message board and, as LRTrojan says, spend thousands of dollars supporting the program and attending the games.

The only thing I would like to make clear is that I never said Matt should be all conference. I only think he should be starting and playing 20-30 minute a game. And as far as that's concerned, I don't think we have an all conference player on our roster at this time. In the next couple of years, maybe Chucky and/orWill Neighbour or some other of our recruits. But right now I don't see anyone who fits my description of an all conference player this season. But there's a lot of time left for someone to step up and light it up. Maybe Alex or Solo. And wouldn't it be funny if it was Matt. Now that would be something wouldn't it? I'd have some pretty good bragging rights for awhile. But not counting on it.

(11-29-2010 10:11 AM)LRTrojan Wrote:  Well I lied. I'm going to say just one more thing(I hope)on this subject. No, I don't believe anyone on this board hates Matt or any other Trojan, especially mjs and insider. They are two of our best fans, and they spend too much time and money supporting a basketball program that is obviously stagnant, with no signs of wanting to improve. I certainly believe that they don't hate Matt, but I don't think they believe he is D-1 material. They may be right, but how many other true D-1 players have we had here in recent years, when a kid like Matt can come in here, play ahead of a bunch of the recruited kids, and make the kind of showing he's made. That speaks volumes about what Matt has accomplished, and the recruiting capabilities of our coach doesn't it?

Thanks Matt for all you've done as a Trojan, and what you will continue to do the remainder of this season. You are a winner.

Bingo and +1

We should be able to recruit over the top of Matt and have not been able to do it. We may have this year but I still think he will get 15 to 20 minutes.

(11-29-2010 11:27 AM)insideualr Wrote:  

(11-29-2010 10:11 AM)LRTrojan Wrote:  Well I lied. I'm going to say just one more thing(I hope)on this subject. No, I don't believe anyone on this board hates Matt or any other Trojan, especially mjs and insider. They are two of our best fans, and they spend too much time and money supporting a basketball program that is obviously stagnant, with no signs of wanting to improve. I certainly believe that they don't hate Matt, but I don't think they believe he is D-1 material. They may be right, but how many other true D-1 players have we had here in recent years, when a kid like Matt can come in here, play ahead of a bunch of the recruited kids, and make the kind of showing he's made. That speaks volumes about what Matt has accomplished, and the recruiting capabilities of our coach doesn't it?

Thanks Matt for all you've done as a Trojan, and what you will continue to do the remainder of this season. You are a winner.

Bingo and +1

We should be able to recruit over the top of Matt and have not been able to do it. We may have this year but I still think he will get 15 to 20 minutes.

I think we've said about all that can be said. Can you just delete this entire post now and send it to that great bitching garbage dump in the sky!

(11-29-2010 03:57 PM)outsideualr Wrote:  

(11-29-2010 11:27 AM)insideualr Wrote:  

(11-29-2010 10:11 AM)LRTrojan Wrote:  Well I lied. I'm going to say just one more thing(I hope)on this subject. No, I don't believe anyone on this board hates Matt or any other Trojan, especially mjs and insider. They are two of our best fans, and they spend too much time and money supporting a basketball program that is obviously stagnant, with no signs of wanting to improve. I certainly believe that they don't hate Matt, but I don't think they believe he is D-1 material. They may be right, but how many other true D-1 players have we had here in recent years, when a kid like Matt can come in here, play ahead of a bunch of the recruited kids, and make the kind of showing he's made. That speaks volumes about what Matt has accomplished, and the recruiting capabilities of our coach doesn't it?

Thanks Matt for all you've done as a Trojan, and what you will continue to do the remainder of this season. You are a winner.

Bingo and +1

We should be able to recruit over the top of Matt and have not been able to do it. We may have this year but I still think he will get 15 to 20 minutes.

I think we've said about all that can be said. Can you just delete this entire post now and send it to that great bitching garbage dump in the sky!

Intentional or not, you did start one of the longest topic threads in our board's history.

(11-29-2010 04:31 PM)mjs Wrote:  

(11-29-2010 03:57 PM)outsideualr Wrote:  

(11-29-2010 11:27 AM)insideualr Wrote:  

(11-29-2010 10:11 AM)LRTrojan Wrote:  Well I lied. I'm going to say just one more thing(I hope)on this subject. No, I don't believe anyone on this board hates Matt or any other Trojan, especially mjs and insider. They are two of our best fans, and they spend too much time and money supporting a basketball program that is obviously stagnant, with no signs of wanting to improve. I certainly believe that they don't hate Matt, but I don't think they believe he is D-1 material. They may be right, but how many other true D-1 players have we had here in recent years, when a kid like Matt can come in here, play ahead of a bunch of the recruited kids, and make the kind of showing he's made. That speaks volumes about what Matt has accomplished, and the recruiting capabilities of our coach doesn't it?

Thanks Matt for all you've done as a Trojan, and what you will continue to do the remainder of this season. You are a winner.

Bingo and +1

We should be able to recruit over the top of Matt and have not been able to do it. We may have this year but I still think he will get 15 to 20 minutes.

I think we've said about all that can be said. Can you just delete this entire post now and send it to that great bitching garbage dump in the sky!

Intentional or not, you did start one of the longest topic threads in our board's history.

Keeping the board hopping is a dirty job, but someone has to do it!

The subject starts with Chucky but is all about Matt. Bait and switch!

(11-29-2010 04:31 PM)mjs Wrote:  Intentional or not, you did start one of the longest topic threads in our board's history.

Don't worry, he'll brang on Matt again and start a new one.