Its a catch 22, highly ambitious, type A personality people usually make for the best coaches. The problem with that is that such people are bound to leave for the next big thing exactly because of what makes them great coaches.

That's the risk you take when you hire that kind of coach. Yeah they can do a lot of winning for you but they can also bolt at a moments notice.

WHat about his responsibity to his family? How much is money is enough? The way the economy has been lately who knows. Butler is paying him to do a job and he is doing it well but they don't own him. In the example above he is making 350,000 and someone offers him 1.5 million he would be a complete fool not to leave. He could go there and make more in 4 years then 16 at Butler. He is the hot item right now, what happens if Butler falls back to earth next year? Butler has gotten thier money's worth, time to ante up and pay him what he is worth or step aside and let him move on if that is his wish.
Sorry Mister you seem to have some very fanciful ideals but not at reality based at all.

(04-06-2010 10:05 AM)Mister Jennings Wrote:  When a coach recruits...the player asks...are you going to guide me during my four years here? If he says yes...he is bound by his word.

This is a flawed arguement.

First of all, NO coach can answer that question. Nor will one ever say "yes" to it.

One cannot see into the future. You're saying that if a coach was fired or retired or died or took a leave to take care of his sick mother Matilda or got sick of coaching and wanted to change careers, he'd be lying to the kid.

Let's look at the circumstances regarding ETSU football and basketball coaches. What was Paul Hamilton supposed to tell people as he was recruiting in his final years? I mean even before the decision to drop football was made- I'm saying if in December of 2002 and Paul Hamilton is recruiting me with ONE YEAR LEFT ON HIS CONTRACT- what is he supposed to say to me?

The best would be "well, I sure hope so."

Often Murry Bartow has had to recruit with less than four years on his contract. We've discussed this at length. What is he supposed to tell recruits (hence why I think a college coach should always have four years on his contract to work with) at these times?

What about a recruit from Florida who might go to ETSU not because of Bartow but Wagers? Then Wagers is contacted by Appalachian State and asked to be their head coach for double the money he's making.

He would be greedy if he wanted career advancement? That's what you're telling me?

Why would the recruit be so shallow that he couldn't be happy for one's career advancement.

I'm not saying that greed is never a factor when a coach leaves. I am also saying that it isn't always cut and dry, and that to say that Wagers would be "greedy" or not a man of his word if he were to get such an opportunity is ridiculous and the height of cynicism.

For all we know, the coach and player may wind up hating each other before it's all through as well. Now does he owe it to this player to stay?

Another thing, I'm getting a little sick of hearing this romantic ideals you speak of with Stevens.

Practice at 6:30 a.m.? John Cheney used to hold 5:30 a.m. practices routinely so as not to interfere with a class schedule. This is done A LOT in college athletics.

Athletic dorms are becoming less and less common in college as well. I was of the mindset they'd been done away with, in fact, but I could be wrong about that.

And Tennessee plays on an 89-year-old field. Maybe that's why Kiffin left- the one he's at now is only 87.

Tennessee plays on a 89 year old field in a stadium that they just last year spent 200 million to renovate..

A coach at a school like Butler needs to take a big job offer when he gets the chance... Ed DeChellis said recruiting is 90 percent luck.. and a mid major like Butler might never have another group like they have now.

McKillop had a once in a lifetime team at Davidson when he had Curry, and they probably will never have another chance at the final 4.. if he wanted to move up, he should have done it then..

DeChellis had a couple of great years and got the chance to move to his dream job.. if he had not had those recruits and had not made the NCAA tourney a couple of times, Penn State would not have called..So he was smart to go take the big bucks when he had the opportunity..Same thing with Les Robinson..

If IU gets their program going and Butler goes down hill over the next 3 or 4 years, don't think Butler will hesitate to put their young coach on the road.. We are seeing coaches fired with 19 wins.. So I would tell any coach to take the money and run!

(04-07-2010 04:21 PM)PittsburghBucs Wrote:  Another thing, I'm getting a little sick of hearing this romantic ideals you speak of with Stevens.

Practice at 6:30 a.m.? John Cheney used to hold 5:30 a.m. practices routinely so as not to interfere with a class schedule. This is done A LOT in college athletics.

Athletic dorms are becoming less and less common in college as well. I was of the mindset they'd been done away with, in fact, but I could be wrong about that.

And Tennessee plays on an 89-year-old field. Maybe that's why Kiffin left- the one he's at now is only 87.

It's the Butler Way. BTW--I love to make you sick. In an attempt to make you feel better though...I have a picture of hockey being played in JC on Market Street.

I'm sure those guys playing hockey is the only culturally relevant exercise anyone has ever done in Johnson City.

Regardless, I'm sure there are nicer venues than what Butler has, but arenas and ballparks come in all shapes and sizes and have different appeals. I can definitely see where someone could recruit saying "Hey, ever see 'Hoosiers?' Best basketball film in the world and it was filmed right here! This is the heart of basketball and you can play here every day!"

What about the Palestra? Is that a handicap for the Big Five?

Brad Stevens just signed a 12 year deal

http://www.cbssports.com/collegebasketba...ines;other

(04-06-2010 09:16 AM)Mister Jennings Wrote:  I say greed because at makes $350,000 a year plus bonuses you have plenty to live on. He will get a nice raise...he already makes more than the school president.

Off alot on what he made according to the article. I know that includes other stuff besides money but still.

Quote:Team spokesman Jim McGrath declined to say how much the deal was worth, though Stevens had a total compensation package of $750,000 last season. Athletic director Barry Collier acknowledged Tuesday that Stevens was in line for a pay raise.

You know, by the time this thing is over Murry Bartow might be the one heading to Oregon.

Everybody else they wanted just got extensions from their current schools.

As far as athletic dorms, Pitt you're right. It's against NCAA rules to have over 50% athletes in any campus residence facility. No one has athletic dorms anymore. That rule has been around for years.

Butler Hoops Team Under Investigation- AP

INDIANAPOLIS--Butler's run in the NCAA Men's Basketball National Championship Game may be tarnished after reports surfaced today that all 13 players on the roster are being given good educations in an effort to help them find good jobs after they leave the school. "It's important to remember that right now these are only allegations -- allegations that we are looking into," said NCAA president James Isch.

"But, obviously, if true, this would be very disappointing. The NCAA has certain expectations and standards. It's not fair for players at one school to be given good educations while athletes at other member schools receive basic, remedial instruction that is worth essentially nothing." According to documents seized from the school's registrar's office, Butler players have received an education worth $38,616 per year totaling more than $150,000 over a four-year career.

Compare that to players at a school like Kentucky, where tuition is set at $4,051 -- but with an actual value far below that."We don't want to say too much until these reports are confirmed," said Kentucky head basketball coach John Calipari. "But we're talking about almost $140,000 difference in education per player -- and that's even if my players stayed four years or graduated, which many of them do not. Then these Butler players are reportedly stepping into good jobs after graduation while my kids, if they don't make the NBA, have absolutely no job prospects or life skills. It's far from a balanced playing field. They are buying the best players by giving them a high-priced education."

In addition to the allegations that they were given an expensive education, many Butler players have been spotted around campus holding books, studying and engaging in interesting conversations. Others have been seen with people who are known to not be tutors. Butler point guard and Kentucky native Ronald Nored, who is reportedly a secondary education major, denied allegations that the Bulldog program is cheating.

"The discourse on this matter is fatuous and inane," he said, implicating the program further.

Is John Calipari turning in other programs? Why is he commenting on Butler? Coach Cal corals hordes of high school All-Americans and he's talking about Butler.

Maybe Calipari is correct...it's just a little sleazy being a tattle tale when you budget is the best in all of college basketball.

No matter...just let ETSU play the Cats in Rupp in 2011. We owe them one... at least a competitive game.

I don't know whether to laugh or cry.

(04-21-2010 09:23 PM)ETSUfan1 Wrote:  I don't know whether to laugh or cry.

Both

DO YOU SEE WHERE EVERYTHING I HAVE SAID ABOUT THE SPORTS MEDIA IN THIS AREA IS TRUE??????

No, not from the last part of this thread (and not that I have a high opinion of the sports media here).........unless you're stretching by commenting on the (apparent) failure of some hereon to recognize satire when they see it (of which you've very recently been guilty, too, you know).

Please, enlighten us. And may we kiss your ring if we grovel sufficiently?

Wait a sec.

You're trying to say that I don't get satire?

YOU?

If that's not the pot calling the kettle black . . . .

But I think we do have an example of what I've been talking about for 10 years about the local media.

Mister has identified himself as a sportswriter. Now, he hasn't come on here and given us his fair prose to look at and praise the way I have, because I know my work is good.

In fact, people have come on here and gone out of their way to praise it. One editor HIRED ME off what I wrote here.

Regardless, Mister is the epitome of the sort of sports media we have traditionally had around here- more homers than journalists and certainly not all that bright.

(04-22-2010 03:46 PM)PittsburghBucs Wrote:  Wait a sec.

You're trying to say that I don't get satire?

YOU?

If that's not the pot calling the kettle black . . . .

Duh......yeah......
Just yesterday you missed my satire about Rush not still being around.....

And I did not know "Mister" had identified himself as a sportswriter.
But to the extent he apparently missed the BLATANT satire in that piece I posted, then.........well.......nod, nod, wink, wink.......say no more......