(08-16-2009 10:34 PM)homefry20 Wrote:  

(08-16-2009 10:30 PM)Sobe Wrote:  May I ask why Memphis has the best 12 year-old baseball players that have ever existed in the world?

I cant believe you havent fell off a cliff yet.

"haven't fallen"

The reason that Little League Baseball is a dying league is because it is solely geared towards recreation with its rules and limits. Kids nowadays want to be showcased at a young age and playing Little League would set them back. For instance, in Little League, there are no lead-offs (so no pick moves, throwing from teh stretch, etc.) an 85 pitch limit (i agree with this but its still a restraint), and they also have a participation rule that plays a huge role in the outcome of games.

Little League will become irrelevant sooner than later because of this. Even Dixie Youth offers more of a MLB type setting. USSSA and CABA locally and American Legion nationally have modifeid their rules to basically offer a major league set of rules to kids as yound as 9. These travelling teams get more scouts and more marquee matchups therefore the kids with talent will end up on these and Little League will slowly fade into oblivion.

Side bar: I did get to play in the Little League Southeastern Regional (St. Petersburg FL) in 1997 and it was one of the best summers of my life. I hate to see it go but theres no stopping it now.

(08-16-2009 09:40 PM)fsquid Wrote:  you seem to have it out for little league for some reason. Any specific reason why?

I don't have it out for LL. In my initial post I said I will watch. At the same time I wonder why kids with more skill and better coaches who do not play under rules that restrict player development get no national exposure. Club ball is the future, and you know it. It is what it is.

(08-16-2009 10:36 PM)Sobe Wrote:  

(08-16-2009 10:34 PM)homefry20 Wrote:  

(08-16-2009 10:30 PM)Sobe Wrote:  May I ask why Memphis has the best 12 year-old baseball players that have ever existed in the world?

I cant believe you havent fell off a cliff yet.

"haven't fallen"

You are a turd in the punch bowl of life. Go away.

(08-16-2009 10:40 PM)homefry20 Wrote:  The reason that Little League Baseball is a dying league is because it is solely geared towards recreation with its rules and limits. Kids nowadays want to be showcased at a young age and playing Little League would set them back. For instance, in Little League, there are no lead-offs (so no pick moves, throwing from teh stretch, etc.) an 85 pitch limit (i agree with this but its still a restraint), and they also have a participation rule that plays a huge role in the outcome of games.

Little League will become irrelevant sooner than later because of this. Even Dixie Youth offers more of a MLB type setting. USSSA and CABA locally and American Legion nationally have modifeid their rules to basically offer a major league set of rules to kids as yound as 9. These travelling teams get more scouts and more marquee matchups therefore the kids with talent will end up on these and Little League will slowly fade into oblivion.

Side bar: I did get to play in the Little League Southeastern Regional (St. Petersburg FL) in 1997 and it was one of the best summers of my life. I hate to see it go but theres no stopping it now.

I hate to see it go as well. But LL blew it and watered down the rules.
All these groups do is create the club alternative. Keith Hagan, anyone?

It's alive and well in Georgia, I can tell you that.

(08-16-2009 11:12 PM)Sobe Wrote:  It's alive and well in Georgia, I can tell you that.

To only have 220 posts and a reputation of -66 speaks a lot for you. If people could vote more than once then im sure it would be much worse. You are averaging roughly 1 negative rep point per 3.5 posts. Thats an awesome streak.

(08-16-2009 07:32 PM)TiggerFan Wrote:  

(08-16-2009 06:55 PM)mlb60 Wrote:  I refuse to watch it anymore. I'm tired of seeing announcers lauding the curve ball of a 14 year old pitcher. The vast majority of kids that age do not have the mature bone structure to allow them to throw curve balls without risking permanent damage to their arms. Any coach or parent that encourages this is irresponsible and for the sports announcers to act as if these are adult men only encourages that behavior.

I think these kids are 12s. Not many are throwing curves--but as a former coach if they are I agree. If you can get a kid to change speeds and stay around the plate you are doing well. At 12 the fences are brought in and base runners cannot lead off--no stealing. Pitches throw from the windup all game.
Like I said--high school soccer. It is not the highest level of baseball but is an American icon and is on TV.
There is an actual national championship tournament being planned and built to be played in Memphis with a TV contract with club teams.
LLWC champs MAY get an entry, but they won't last long.

You're right, they are 12's. I don't have any experience in LL, but I coached competitive ball (USSSA/Super Series) for a few years. I was at Huey's last night and the LLWC was on, and there was a 12 y/o kid throwing curve balls. I don't care how big he is, if he's not having to shave regularly he's probably not developed enough to throw curves.

(08-17-2009 11:36 AM)mlb60 Wrote:  

(08-16-2009 07:32 PM)TiggerFan Wrote:  

(08-16-2009 06:55 PM)mlb60 Wrote:  I refuse to watch it anymore. I'm tired of seeing announcers lauding the curve ball of a 14 year old pitcher. The vast majority of kids that age do not have the mature bone structure to allow them to throw curve balls without risking permanent damage to their arms. Any coach or parent that encourages this is irresponsible and for the sports announcers to act as if these are adult men only encourages that behavior.

I think these kids are 12s. Not many are throwing curves--but as a former coach if they are I agree. If you can get a kid to change speeds and stay around the plate you are doing well. At 12 the fences are brought in and base runners cannot lead off--no stealing. Pitches throw from the windup all game.
Like I said--high school soccer. It is not the highest level of baseball but is an American icon and is on TV.
There is an actual national championship tournament being planned and built to be played in Memphis with a TV contract with club teams.
LLWC champs MAY get an entry, but they won't last long.

You're right, they are 12's. I don't have any experience in LL, but I coached competitive ball (USSSA/Super Series) for a few years. I was at Huey's last night and the LLWC was on, and there was a 12 y/o kid throwing curve balls. I don't care how big he is, if he's not having to shave regularly he's probably not developed enough to throw curves.

I umpired a few games for the Super Series one year and there was this kid (10yr) that had the best knuckleball Ive ever seen. He also threw a circle change that was pretty good as well. His father sat behind the plate and we struck up a conversation and I told him how well his son was pitching and how I liked that he didnt throw a curve. His father told me that he actually explained to his son what kind of damage can be done to a developing arm putting that much strain on it. He said he would teach him to throw whatever offspeed pitch he wanted besides a curve/slider and his son wanted the knuckler and the changeup. He mixed them well for a 10 yr old as well.

Basically, there are plenty of alternate pitches out there for a kid to have until hes reached adulthood and this is a great example.

to me the LLWS isnt really competitve baseball. There is no leading off and there are no kids in the stretch. I think its funny when the commentators see a kid throwing a fastball and are trying to compare it to a MLB fastball. And for the Georgia guy who loves the LLWS go get the winner of that thing and go play a 12 yr old EAST COBB team in georgia and see how that goes. You have some good ball players as a whole but i would say from the talent that ive watched i would bet that 60% of those kids never play high school baseball. And i would have to agree that alot of the teams playing at First Tennessee whether theyre from here or not would absolutely demolish the teams in the LLWS.

And for the person who reference Keith Hagan, were you dogging him or applauding him bec he just recently passed away and was an icon in this city for youth baseball so i would hope it wasnt the first option.

(08-17-2009 11:47 AM)homefry20 Wrote:  

(08-17-2009 11:36 AM)mlb60 Wrote:  

(08-16-2009 07:32 PM)TiggerFan Wrote:  

(08-16-2009 06:55 PM)mlb60 Wrote:  I refuse to watch it anymore. I'm tired of seeing announcers lauding the curve ball of a 14 year old pitcher. The vast majority of kids that age do not have the mature bone structure to allow them to throw curve balls without risking permanent damage to their arms. Any coach or parent that encourages this is irresponsible and for the sports announcers to act as if these are adult men only encourages that behavior.

I think these kids are 12s. Not many are throwing curves--but as a former coach if they are I agree. If you can get a kid to change speeds and stay around the plate you are doing well. At 12 the fences are brought in and base runners cannot lead off--no stealing. Pitches throw from the windup all game.
Like I said--high school soccer. It is not the highest level of baseball but is an American icon and is on TV.
There is an actual national championship tournament being planned and built to be played in Memphis with a TV contract with club teams.
LLWC champs MAY get an entry, but they won't last long.

You're right, they are 12's. I don't have any experience in LL, but I coached competitive ball (USSSA/Super Series) for a few years. I was at Huey's last night and the LLWC was on, and there was a 12 y/o kid throwing curve balls. I don't care how big he is, if he's not having to shave regularly he's probably not developed enough to throw curves.

I umpired a few games for the Super Series one year and there was this kid (10yr) that had the best knuckleball Ive ever seen. He also threw a circle change that was pretty good as well. His father sat behind the plate and we struck up a conversation and I told him how well his son was pitching and how I liked that he didnt throw a curve. His father told me that he actually explained to his son what kind of damage can be done to a developing arm putting that much strain on it. He said he would teach him to throw whatever offspeed pitch he wanted besides a curve/slider and his son wanted the knuckler and the changeup. He mixed them well for a 10 yr old as well.

Basically, there are plenty of alternate pitches out there for a kid to have until hes reached adulthood and this is a great example.

We always taught a four seam and two seam fastball and a changeup. We emphasized control and hitting spots. I'd say that most of the coaches in this area do the same thing. We had one kid who could throw a pretty good knuckleball.

(08-17-2009 12:23 PM)biglewlew20 Wrote:  to me the LLWS isnt really competitve baseball. There is no leading off and there are no kids in the stretch. I think its funny when the commentators see a kid throwing a fastball and are trying to compare it to a MLB fastball. And for the Georgia guy who loves the LLWS go get the winner of that thing and go play a 12 yr old EAST COBB team in georgia and see how that goes. You have some good ball players as a whole but i would say from the talent that ive watched i would bet that 60% of those kids never play high school baseball. And i would have to agree that alot of the teams playing at First Tennessee whether theyre from here or not would absolutely demolish the teams in the LLWS.

And for the person who reference Keith Hagan, were you dogging him or applauding him bec he just recently passed away and was an icon in this city for youth baseball so i would hope it wasnt the first option.

It was me. I played against Keith Hagan teams. All anybody has to to do is see his teams play and there is nothing but respect.
East Cobb used to come up this way every now and then when I was coaching a lower-level competitive team. They no-hit us. If I recall correctly, they advanced as the 1 seed, we advanced as the 4 seed.
They no-hit us again with another pitcher. J.D. Drew came out of Cobb, as I remember.