(07-26-2009 08:07 PM)WMD Owl Wrote:  Sen Jim Demint came up the "Waterloo" phrase. It was in the context of if Obamacare is stopped, considering the immense political capital the President has put into the effort, it will be would be as big of a defeat as Waterloo.
I think Obamacare WILL be defeated. But Obama's "Waterloo" is happening NOW.
Because of this legislation, the American People are seeing the "real" Obama. The true South Side Chicago, Community Organizer, Leftist, Big Government Tax and Spend Democrat that has been able to fool lots of people for a really long time.
People see him for what he is... and are saying... "I can't believe we voted for this ......."

I had not heard this from DeMint. I think it's a terrible mistake for any republican to talk about it in those terms. I think that puts things on a basis that democrats can go to the people and say, "The republicans are against this only because they want Barack--and America--to fail. They are being partisan and putting party over country."

Turning this into some kind of sympathy vote for Obama, who remains far more popular personally than his policies, is the one shot I think they have to pass a disastrous bill.

Fight this on the issues, not on personality. Coming across as gloating over Obama's failure is the one way I see that they could allow popular opinion to turn back in favor of a terrible idea.

(07-26-2009 09:26 PM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  

(07-26-2009 08:07 PM)WMD Owl Wrote:  Sen Jim Demint came up the "Waterloo" phrase. It was in the context of if Obamacare is stopped, considering the immense political capital the President has put into the effort, it will be would be as big of a defeat as Waterloo.
I think Obamacare WILL be defeated. But Obama's "Waterloo" is happening NOW.
Because of this legislation, the American People are seeing the "real" Obama. The true South Side Chicago, Community Organizer, Leftist, Big Government Tax and Spend Democrat that has been able to fool lots of people for a really long time.
People see him for what he is... and are saying... "I can't believe we voted for this ......."

I had not heard this from DeMint. I think it's a terrible mistake for any republican to talk about it in those terms. I think that puts things on a basis that democrats can go to the people and say, "The republicans are against this only because they want Barack--and America--to fail. They are being partisan and putting party over country."

Turning this into some kind of sympathy vote for Obama, who remains far more popular personally than his policies, is the one shot I think they have to pass a disastrous bill.

Fight this on the issues, not on personality. Coming across as gloating over Obama's failure is the one way I see that they could allow popular opinion to turn back in favor of a terrible idea.

THey have been on that comment from DeMint. Man, that state of South Carolina has got a LOT of nutcases don't they?

(07-26-2009 10:30 AM)West Is the Best Wrote:  In 6 months he has not decided on a church when previous presidents had no problem.

OH NOES!!!!!



Of all the ridiculous crap to pick on him about, this has got to be one of the most retarded criticisms.

He's not a member of a church - OH NOES!!! We're doomed!! DOOOOOOMED!

(07-26-2009 09:26 PM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  

(07-26-2009 08:07 PM)WMD Owl Wrote:  Sen Jim Demint came up the "Waterloo" phrase. It was in the context of if Obamacare is stopped, considering the immense political capital the President has put into the effort, it will be would be as big of a defeat as Waterloo.
I think Obamacare WILL be defeated. But Obama's "Waterloo" is happening NOW.
Because of this legislation, the American People are seeing the "real" Obama. The true South Side Chicago, Community Organizer, Leftist, Big Government Tax and Spend Democrat that has been able to fool lots of people for a really long time.
People see him for what he is... and are saying... "I can't believe we voted for this ......."

I had not heard this from DeMint. I think it's a terrible mistake for any republican to talk about it in those terms. I think that puts things on a basis that democrats can go to the people and say, "The republicans are against this only because they want Barack--and America--to fail. They are being partisan and putting party over country."

Turning this into some kind of sympathy vote for Obama, who remains far more popular personally than his policies, is the one shot I think they have to pass a disastrous bill.

Fight this on the issues, not on personality. Coming across as gloating over Obama's failure is the one way I see that they could allow popular opinion to turn back in favor of a terrible idea.

.... and putting an alternative plan out there in counterpoint.

It is partisanship otherwise.

Good comments Owl.

(07-27-2009 02:43 PM)Artifice Wrote:  

(07-26-2009 10:30 AM)West Is the Best Wrote:  In 6 months he has not decided on a church when previous presidents had no problem.

OH NOES!!!!!

Of all the ridiculous crap to pick on him about, this has got to be one of the most retarded criticisms.

He's not a member of a church - OH NOES!!! We're doomed!! DOOOOOOMED!

This isn't simply about him NOT being a member of some freaking church - - I could care less if he goes to church every bleeding day and every bleeding night, it isn't going to change who the man is or why he is here.

I am rather much more concerned as to Who he really is under all that bullsh't he tosses out in buckets ever bleeding day and every bleeding night.

I don't care if he ever darkens another Church Door again in his worthless life, that won't change one freaking thing for me or the millions who are hurt by this Usurper and the Billions who are going to be harmed by him one day soon.

.

How does not picking a church have anything to do with his policy making? Or any of your other criticisms?

You made religion an issue. I personally dont care what religion he is or if he even has any. You can be moral without being religious.

(07-26-2009 10:30 AM)West Is the Best Wrote:  dog for his girls.

In 6 months he has not decided on a church when previous presidents had no problem.

Yet, he wants to ram Health Care down our throats before he can conduct a proper study.
Amazing..........

Even many of his supporters have caught on to his "must act really fast" act. It is reckless and foolish. He wanted health care reform shoved down our throats before Congress goes home because he knows when they go face constituents over the summer break they will get an earful on how crazy what is happening with healthcare is. Heathcare needs reforming, but not at break neck speed that will just turn over the health decisions for Americans to the government and inflate an already bloated deficit.

(07-27-2009 03:26 PM)Artifice Wrote:  How does not picking a church have anything to do with his policy making? Or any of your other criticisms?

You made religion an issue. I personally dont care what religion he is or if he even has any. You can be moral without being religious.

I think you're missing the point. It's a question of, if he's willing to take this much time choosing a family dog and choosing a church, why is he trying to rush a bill with such wide-ranging and drastic impact like healthcare reform? He should be as interested in getting it right as he is in getting it done fast, but he certainly doesn't give that impression.