Today we traded a second round pick to Miami for Shaun Livingston and cash considerations. An hour later, we waved Shaun Livingston haha. I was kinda excited. We would have had about 5 pgs on the team, which would have meant a bigger deal was in the works involving the worst waste of a draft pick in the history of the NBA, aka Mike Conley. Heisley/Wallace will do anything to make a penny.

Forgot to add, when I say anything I mean anything except put together a winning team that people want to see.

(01-07-2009 08:03 PM)Jenkz Wrote:  Forgot to add, when I say anything I mean anything except put together a winning team that people want to see.

yea, you are probably right putting out a winning team is not something they want to do...

you do know that Heisley paid Jerry West to come here? and that during that time the Grizz were OVER the salary cap and had a top 10 or better payroll?

?

What does Jerry West have to do with Memphis right now? The Grizzlies are the furthest they have ever been under the salary cap. The team they put on the floor night after night is not built to win. Really, take away OJ Mayo, Marc Gasol, and MAYBE Rudy Gay and what do you have? NOTHING. Our lineup at the start of the 4th quarter the past two nights has been Kyle Lowry,Greg Buckner,Quinton Ross,Hakim Warrick,and Darrell Arthur. Theres a team that can do some damage right there, let me tell ya. The ONLY thing that I have seen to make me think that they were moving the franchise forward was trading for OJ Mayo. I'm sorry, I just can't believe they are trying to put a team out that can win. You have the idiots Heisley and Wallace coming on the radio saying how satisfied they are with this years team. Really? Are you satisfied with a 22 win season? You have an idiotic coach who, instead of taking atleast part of the blame for a loss, puts it all on his players. At the end of this season, fire Ivaroni, trade Conley. Find a PG in the draft and sign a FA PF. Then we will talk about this franchise moving forward.

(01-08-2009 12:04 AM)Jenkz Wrote:  Really, take away OJ Mayo, Marc Gasol, and MAYBE Rudy Gay and what do you have? NOTHING.

You're kidding right? Maybe Rudy Gay? Rudy is better than Marc Gasol. Mike Conley is going to be a very good point guard in the NBA, whether for the Grizz or someone else.

Quote:Our lineup at the start of the 4th quarter the past two nights has been Kyle Lowry,Greg Buckner,Quinton Ross,Hakim Warrick,and Darrell Arthur. Theres a team that can do some damage right there, let me tell ya.

Hakim Warrick has been averaging 20 points a game over the last ten games. Outside of OJ, he's been the most consistent scorer. I've only been watching NBA basketball for twenty or so years, but I think usually NBA coaches have the 2nd team on the floor at the start of the 4th quarter. Other than Darrell Arthur who is still growing as a player but current a screwball, the guys you mention are NBA quality players.

Would you prefer Brian Cardinal, Jason Collins, Damon Stoudamire, Casey Jacobsen, and Juan Carlos Navarro starting the fourth quarter?

Quote:The ONLY thing that I have seen to make me think that they were moving the franchise forward was trading for OJ Mayo. I'm sorry, I just can't believe they are trying to put a team out that can win. You have the idiots Heisley and Wallace coming on the radio saying how satisfied they are with this years team. Really? Are you satisfied with a 22 win season? You have an idiotic coach who, instead of taking atleast part of the blame for a loss, puts it all on his players. At the end of this season, fire Ivaroni, trade Conley. Find a PG in the draft and sign a FA PF. Then we will talk about this franchise moving forward.

If the Grizz draft another point, they are idiots (unless it's Stephon Curry with the 8th pick or something). If Mike Conley is traded, OJ Mayo better be moved to point guard. But be careful what you wish for. Mike Conley's deficiencies appear to be due to the lack of experience, confidence, and compenent coaching. That guy can pass and get the ball where it needs to be. He's fast, and he's a good size for a point guard. If he had a reliable jumper, could convert when he took it to the basketball, and played defense, he'd be headed to an all-star level. Steve Nash looked like crap his first 4 years in the league, and he was a 22 year old rookie. If Conley and OJ just can't mesh, fine, but in my eyes, the Grizz, with the current core, are an all-star qualify power forward and veteran role players away from future title contention. This team is better than the 2002-03 team, and with the right coach and free agent acquistion, that team was a playoff (losing) team.

Only reason Conley got drafted where he did was because he got hot in the NCAA tourney and came out. He can't shoot and should have been a 2nd round pick.

The Grizz need Avery Johnson to teach Conley. Fact.

Quote:You're kidding right? Maybe Rudy Gay? Rudy is better than Marc Gasol.

Not right now he isn't. Rudy is an exciting player to watch. Here recently, for whatever reason, he has been playing without that fire,without that confidence that makes him and exciting player and it's hurting the team. All Rudy needs is a confidence boost. Keep in mind, I'm talking currently, as of this moment. The way Rudy is playing, I would not pay money to go see him.

Quote:Hakim Warrick has been averaging 20 points a game over the last ten games. Outside of OJ, he's been the most consistent scorer.

Hak is the only player on that list that I have confidence in starting the 4th quarter. My only problem with Hak is he could be averaging 30 points a game instead of 20 if he just wouldn't settle for those outside jumpers as much. As far as Quinton Ross and Greg Buckner being championship caliber role players...well.......you may have some issues. Throw in Kyle "Wildman" Lowry and the young inexperienced math deficient Darrell Arthur and that's not a unit that can get it done in crunch time. At best, they trade baskets with the opposing team, which is not what you need when you are down in the 4th. My concern here is that the Grizzlies are in all these close 4th quarter games and mount these furious comebacks but they just seem to run out of time. Maybe get the starting unit in a little earlier in the 4th.

Quote:Mike Conley is going to be a very good point guard in the NBA

To each his own I guess. Mike lived off Oden through grade school and college. If he can click with any of our players like he did with Oden, then he can be a hell of a point guard. Right now, that's not happening.

Quote:If he had a reliable jumper, could convert when he took it to the basketball, and played defense, he'd be headed to an all-star level.

Do you realize what you just said? That's alot of if's.

Quote:with the right coach

I think that may be the key to solving all of the Grizzlies problems. Ivy just isn't cutting it.

Latt, you know more about the Grizz then I do. If I recall correctly, didn't we offer Josh Smith in the off-season but since he was restricted, the Hawks had a chance to match, and did. Does that make him unrestricted this off-season? For some reason, I seem to remember him saying he wouldn't mind playing in Memphis. Who are the other PF options this year in FA? Personally, I'm hoping we don't go the Blake Griffin route. I've also heard some talk of the Grizz being interested in Joe Alexander. Anyways, I hope you understand my "frustration" with the Grizz. I love this team as much as I do any other team I support, I'm just tired of losing.

They gave away a second round pick that's protected through pick 55 in the 2012 draft. In other words. they only lose the pick if they have one of the 5 best records in the 2011-2012 season. If the Grizz are one of the 5 best teams in the league, they aren't going to be worried about a second round draft pick that probably won't earn a place on the team anyway. If Miami doesn't get the pick in that year, Miami doesn't get anything.

This was essentially a cash transaction where Miami paid Memphis to take Livingston's contract off their hands so they won't have luxury tax issues if they go after another player. Because it needed to be structured as a trade, Memphis agreed to "give up" a pick that will in all likelihood never be given up. I believe the contract will come off of Memphis's books after the season and Memphis will still have a bunch of cap space to go after a FA. That's in addition to the lottery pick they'll get.

As to Conley, he'll probably be a fine NBA player. Probably not an all-star, but a decent everyday NBA point guard. I really don't know who else anyone expected the Grizzlies to take in that draft with that pick given what was known at the time.

That said, If the Grizzlies are building around Mayo, thn Conley's future probably isn't with the Grizzlies. Mayo needs to stay at 2, but he needs to play along someone like Dereck Fisher or the Bulls/Lakers Ron Harper, a decent sized defensive minded PG that can hit open threes when he needs to.

Forgot about Boozer. Is they any chance the Grizzlies might pursue him this off-season?

(01-08-2009 02:49 PM)Jenkz Wrote:  Forgot about Boozer. Is they any chance the Grizzlies might pursue him this off-season?

I doubt it. Heisley isn't likely to go after a veteran until at least year 3 of this plan. They are building this team through the young guns and draft picks. See San Antonio, more recently Portland.

Unfortunately for the Grizz, they haven't had (much) luck in the draft. Fortunately, the T Wolves owner is an idiot and traded us Mayo.

I think Heisley is saving his chips to lock up Rudy, OJ, and Marc when their contracts expire. Everyone else is expendable. Once Rudy, OJ, and Marc are locked up; then look for The Grizzlies to make some moves for some vets to try and build a team that can contend in the playoffs. In the mean time (the next 2 years), our only hope is to get lucky in the draft.

It's not impossible, we were almost there once before.

(01-08-2009 12:28 PM)BuffaloT Wrote:  Only reason Conley got drafted where he did was because he got hot in the NCAA tourney and came out. He can't shoot and should have been a 2nd round pick.

Mike Conley would have been a 1st round pick regardless. Now had he not had the run, he probably wouldn't have been the fourth pick. A player can learn to shoot, and not too many players are as fast and quick as Mike Conley. Conley has a good head on his shoulders, is a very good to great passer, and in theory, can get to the rim at will. Conley has the tools to be an All-Star quality point guard with work. He could be a better TJ Ford.

Also, Conley has always been a winner.

I didn't support drafting Conley, but watching him play, with the right coaching and development, he could be very good.

(01-08-2009 01:53 PM)Jenkz Wrote:  Not right now he isn't. Rudy is an exciting player to watch. Here recently, for whatever reason, he has been playing without that fire,without that confidence that makes him and exciting player and it's hurting the team. All Rudy needs is a confidence boost. Keep in mind, I'm talking currently, as of this moment. The way Rudy is playing, I would not pay money to go see him.

This is one of the most extraordinary things I've ever seen written on a message board.

Rudy Gay is an All-Star quality player. He can score at will, inside, outside, and in the middle. He's athletic. Rudy Gay is better than Pau Gasol. Pau Gasol is better than Marc Gasol.

Marc Gasol will be one of the ten best center in the NBA, but that's more of slam on the quality of centers in the NBA. Gasol has alot of work to do, but he'll never be as good as Rudy Gay. NEVER.

Quote:Hak is the only player on that list that I have confidence in starting the 4th quarter. My only problem with Hak is he could be averaging 30 points a game instead of 20 if he just wouldn't settle for those outside jumpers as much. As far as Quinton Ross and Greg Buckner being championship caliber role players...well.......you may have some issues. Throw in Kyle "Wildman" Lowry and the young inexperienced math deficient Darrell Arthur and that's not a unit that can get it done in crunch time. At best, they trade baskets with the opposing team, which is not what you need when you are down in the 4th. My concern here is that the Grizzlies are in all these close 4th quarter games and mount these furious comebacks but they just seem to run out of time. Maybe get the starting unit in a little earlier in the 4th.

Hakim Warrick is not a 30 points a game guy. Warrick scores against the 2nd units of the other team. Against the 1st unit guys, he doesn't score and doesn't defend. Warrick is a quality bench guy, but is a borderline starter quality player at best.

As bad as you think those players are, they are light years ahead of the 2nd unit last year.

Quote:To each his own I guess. Mike lived off Oden through grade school and college. If he can click with any of our players like he did with Oden, then he can be a hell of a point guard. Right now, that's not happening.

Oddly enough, Oden doesn't look like the world beater he did playing with Mike Conley. Sometimes you have a symboynic relationship that benefits both. You give Conley an inside scoring power forward to pick-and-roll with, and Marc Gasol consistantly scoring inside when he gets a Conley pass, Conley becomes a ten assist a game guy. Conley is a much better passer than Lowry. What would John Stockton have been had he not had Karl Malone to pass to? What would Karl Malone have been had he not had John Stockton getting him the ball?

Quote:Do you realize what you just said? That's alot of if's.

All are things that can be developed. Conley's shot has improved this season. Conley misses easy lay-ups, and that could be fixed if someone works with him on his mechanics. Conley should be a natural at defense with his speed.

Quote:I think that may be the key to solving all of the Grizzlies problems. Ivy just isn't cutting it.

It's the biggest problem. A young team losing is natural. But not to have a coach who is developing the players and forging roles is unforgivable.

(01-08-2009 02:34 PM)Jenkz Wrote:  Latt, you know more about the Grizz then I do. If I recall correctly, didn't we offer Josh Smith in the off-season but since he was restricted, the Hawks had a chance to match, and did. Does that make him unrestricted this off-season? For some reason, I seem to remember him saying he wouldn't mind playing in Memphis. Who are the other PF options this year in FA?

Smith received a 5 year offer from the Grizz for about $60 million, and the Hawks matched. He will not be a free agent until 2013.

Carlos Boozer IMO is not a good option. Injury prone and too expensive. Best hope is for Utah to max him out.

Paul Millsap, who backs Boozer up, would be my choice. He's a restricted free agent this off-season (when Boozer and Mekmet Okur could opt-out be become unrestricted free agents) and is a double double guy. He might not be a 1st option guy, but he might be the Horace Grant type to play power forward for us. He might have to be overpaid though so Utah doesn't match.

If Utah is smart, they'll let Boozer go and keep Millsap. But if all three are free agents, unless they make other moves, they cannot afford all three and re-sign Ronnie Brewer next year.

Quote:Personally, I'm hoping we don't go the Blake Griffin route. I've also heard some talk of the Grizz being interested in Joe Alexander. Anyways, I hope you understand my "frustration" with the Grizz. I love this team as much as I do any other team I support, I'm just tired of losing.

What's wrong with Blake Griffin?

I don't know if I'd want Joe Alexander. He's a small forward. You have a small forward!

Losing is annoying, but we have the best young core in Grizz history. Better than 2002 and better than 1999 (Shareef-Abdur Rahim, Mike Bibby, Bryant Reeves, & Mike Dickerson).

Blake Griffin is a player. He would be a great get for the Grizz.

I'm just not that high on Griffin. As for the Marc Gasol > Rudy Gay thing, Never did I say Gasol > Gay period. I was talking about recently. You even quoted the last part of the sentence where I said that.

Rudy lookin good tonight. Back to back 20 point games is what he needed. Lookin like he may go for 40 tonight haha. This is exactly what he needs. His confidence will be way up after tonights game.

http://www.commercialappeal.com/news/200...ius-miles/

Grizz sign D-Miles to a 10 day contract! Let the screwing of Portland begin!