Lame-Duck Bush wants to forge an agreement that could tie our hands in Iraq for decades to come. This agreement has to see the light of day so AMERICANS can decide whether they support it or not. A war can not stand if the public does not support it. American's feel they were hoodwinked into this fiasco to begin with and now W's Administration is trying to negotiate our continued presence without congressional approval. This isn't a monarchy. The executive branch has far outstepped it's bounds. They feel they have the legal authority to do it by the expansion of powers judicated by Gonzale's Justice Dept. This needs to see the light of day. Our major networks won't report on it. 4% of our national stories last week dealt with Iraq.

http://www.washingtonindependent.com/vie...permanence

Machiavelli Wrote:Lame-Duck Bush wants to forge an agreement that could tie our hands in Iraq for decades to come. This agreement has to see the light of day so AMERICANS can decide whether they support it or not. A war can not stand if the public does not support it. American's feel they were hoodwinked into this fiasco to begin with and now W's Administration is trying to negotiate our continued presence without congressional approval. This isn't a monarchy. The executive branch has far outstepped it's bounds. They feel they have the legal authority to do it by the expansion of powers judicated by Gonzale's Justice Dept. This needs to see the light of day. Our major networks won't report on it. 4% of our national stories last week dealt with Iraq.

http://www.washingtonindependent.com/vie...permanence

Americans decide? "So" I think that answers any questions over the importance of the American people over the "Decider".

Get on "Google Earth" and type in "Balad Airbase Iraq" and "H3 Airbase Iraq'....

The US has spent over a BILLION dollars since 2003 on each airbase to build and improve machine shops, hangars, officers clubs, swimming pools, medical facilities, weapons depots, improved runways and control towers and ON BASE HOUSING.

Congress was asked to appropriate the funds and the DoD spent it...

The Democrats cant scream about a "US long term presence" in Iraq being any sort of surprise after they were asked to appropriate funds for the supporting infrastructure...

If anyone is under the impression that this Iraq boondoggle will end in their lifetime...Please look around the world at the rest of the countries we still occupy after past conflicts...We will NEVER leave Iraq until we are driven out...Just like the Soviets were driven out of of Afganistan.

You guys must think that if we pull out of Iraq, the problem with the Muzzies will just cease to exist. Guess you guys don't remember the Iranian embassy, African embassies (2), USS Cole, Khobar Towers, WTC '93, and the destruction of towers 1, 2, and 7 in '01.

Before you bring up this bull**** about our support for Israel, well, first off, I support Israel 110% and I'm not one to bow down to the wishes of my enemy, and secondly, if Israel was the only issue, why is Russia having problems? Indonesia? Spain? Africa?

This Muzzie problem is worldwide. It's not something that's confined within any one border. You, RobertN, bash Christianity...and Christians do nothing. Try that **** in an Islamic country. ....which is what you, and liberals, will get if you don't support tackling this issue right GDamn now. This shouldn't be a "Bush" issue. It "should" be a friggin' civilized world issue.

I'm all for occupying every country on the planet from now until the end of time because occupying a country, in NO WAY, makes them hate or want to attack you, right? It certainly won't wreck our economy either.

ETSUfan1 Wrote:I'm all for occupying every country on the planet from now until the end of time because occupying a country, in NO WAY, makes them hate or want to attack you, right? It certainly won't wreck our economy either.

Yeah, Germany, Italy, Japan, Afghanistan, and even Iraq were SOOOOO much better before we "occupied" them. Yeah, talk about peaceful, and the hateful US of A, well, we just destroyed that peace, didn't we?

Tell ya what, enlist and go to Iraq or Afghanistan. Get a feel for the country. See how the people "really" feel, not what some ******* anti-American news agency wants you to think.

I don't need to enlist. Not only do I not believe in this war, but Ive got 2 friends that are in the Army and have done multiple tours who say its a hell hole, and the people will shake your hand one minute and shoot at you the next.

And before you try to call me anti-American think again. Just because I don't think a war is just, doesn't mean I hate my country. That is a VERY weak argument.

ETSUfan1 Wrote:I don't need to enlist. Not only do I not believe in this war, but Ive got 2 friends that are in the Army and have done multiple tours who say its a hell hole, and the people will shake your hand one minute and shoot at you the next.

And before you try to call me anti-American think again. Just because I don't think a war is just, doesn't mean I hate my country. That is a VERY weak argument.

I've seen your posts and you're no where near what I would call "Anti-American". As for your two friends, well, let's get into the dynamics. Are the National Guard? Reserves? Active Duty?

Sure, there are some places that what you mention occurs. I can assure you, that type of encounter is dwindling in most places.

What I am saying is let the American people know. Let Conress have the debate. This isn't a monarchy. We should have three equal branches of govt. They are overstepping their bounds. This from the lame duck no less. This should be on the front page of every newspaper.

RebelKev Wrote:You guys must think that if we pull out of Iraq, the problem with the Muzzies will just cease to exist. Guess you guys don't remember the Iranian embassy, African embassies (2), USS Cole, Khobar Towers, WTC '93, and the destruction of towers 1, 2, and 7 in '01.

Before you bring up this bull**** about our support for Israel, well, first off, I support Israel 110% and I'm not one to bow down to the wishes of my enemy, and secondly, if Israel was the only issue, why is Russia having problems? Indonesia? Spain? Africa?

This Muzzie problem is worldwide. It's not something that's confined within any one border. You, RobertN, bash Christianity...and Christians do nothing. Try that **** in an Islamic country. ....which is what you, and liberals, will get if you don't support tackling this issue right GDamn now. This shouldn't be a "Bush" issue. It "should" be a friggin' civilized world issue.

You lose all credibility by calling Islamic people "muzzie". That is a ridiculous racist slur and you should be ashamed of using such ignorant language.

He's actually harmless. The spin room isn't exactly pc. You'll get used to it. Some of the stuff Reb comes up with is actually funny. Muzzie is a new one. Don't let it drive you off. Welcome to the board.

Machiavelli Wrote:He's actually harmless. The spin room isn't exactly pc. You'll get used to it. Some of the stuff Reb comes up with is actually funny. Muzzie is a new one. Don't let it drive you off. Welcome to the board.

Who isn't harmless on an internet forum? I wouldn't expect a political board to be PC. I just find it ironic that RebelKev blasts racist statements of Rev. Wright on other threads yet uses anti-Muslim terms himself. Can't have it both ways.

Thanks for the welcome.

Muzzie?

Even I had to laugh at that one.

I can send you guys some tissue if you want it. Racist? Since when is a ******* religion a race? Spell that one out for me, Peruna. Apparently your ignorance knows now bounds. I'm sure your liberal ass is the same one that calls Christians "Fundies".

Call a Christian a "fundie", they might get pissed off or they might stick out their chest and say "Darn Right". Call a muslim a "muzzie", they'll probably call for a jihad to have you killed as you have offended them to the nth degree. Quite a striking difference..........

ETSUfan1 Wrote:I'm all for occupying every country on the planet from now until the end of time because occupying a country, in NO WAY, makes them hate or want to attack you, right? It certainly won't wreck our economy either.

This:ncaabbs:

RebelKev Wrote:I can send you guys some tissue if you want it. Racist? Since when is a ******* religion a race? Spell that one out for me, Peruna. Apparently your ignorance knows now bounds. I'm sure your liberal ass is the same one that calls Christians "Fundies".

Ooh, you got me now. I used an incorrect word. If you'd rather call me out on my poor diction in that post, that's fine. We can ignore your contradictory opinions.

And no, I don't call anyone a "fundie". Mainly because I would be insulting myself with that one.

perunapower Wrote:Ooh, you got me now. I used an incorrect word. If you'd rather call me out on my poor diction in that post, that's fine. We can ignore your contradictory opinions.

And no, I don't call anyone a "fundie". Mainly because I would be insulting myself with that one.

The premise of your response to me is that I had lost all credibility because I made a racial slur. Now, after it was pointed out that you were wrong, you’re saying it was “no big deal”? Damn, like moving goal posts, don’tcha?

From my observations, most people that throw around racism, anytime they can’t counter an opposing argument, can’t even define the term.

the question is if its a "treaty" or an "executive agreement"......

since FDR only 6% of "international agreements" have been completed as treaties(per a Wiki source).....anyway the legal and constitutional side of this is not cut and dry. Many constitutional Scholars make the argument that all matters of foreign policy are Executive in nature. See Harvard Law Prof. Michael Ramsey:

http://www.law.harvard.edu/students/orgs...online.pdf

"The Textual Basis of the Presidents Foreign Affairs Powers"...

Obama/Hillary aren't going to mention this anytime soon because they have both already made the distinction that they will not be leaving Iraq completely and are on board with this. If they politicize this it will be because they are desperate and trailing in the polls. I highly doubt either of them as CinC would do a complete withdrawal and risk completely destroying the Democrat Party from the likely aftermath it would create.


That said, were we should be withdrawing is Germany and Japan and diverting those resources to Iraq/Afghanistan. Problem is they don't want us to leave, but we need to give them some tough love for a number of reasons. For starters they can afford their own defense and if they beleive in "Globalization", "Trade" and some form of Capitalism(i.e what makes their/our nice lifestyles feasible)....then obviously someone has to 'police' the trade routes to continue to make it feasible, and its high time they bone up and work with us. That is half of the problem, the other is the obvious Islamo-fascism component which is easier to explain politicaly