How much of your wages will you allow to be stolen?...What amount of your civil liberties taken away will you allow?...How much more police brutality will you tolerate?...How much more soverignty will you allow your country to give away?

At what point will you decide that it is time to take the golden gun of government away and start living your life on your own terms?

Just how much will you take?

I reject it NOW!

Fo Shizzle Wrote:How much of your wages will you allow to be stolen?...What amount of your civil liberties taken away will you allow?...How much more police brutality will you tolerate?...How much more soverignty will you allow your country to give away?

At what point will you decide that it is time to take the golden gun of government away and start living your life on your own terms?

Just how much will you take?

I reject it NOW!

How do you think we should fight the masses?? Bottom 50% of American tax payers only account for 3% of taxes collected and the politicians go after this voting block with give away entitlement programs that keep them reliant of government from cradle to grave.
Meanwhile the top 25% of Americans pay 86% of all taxes collected. It is an uphill battle for those of us in America carrying the load and for those that are more then happy to jump on our backs and enjoy the ride.

ShoreBuc Wrote:

Fo Shizzle Wrote:How much of your wages will you allow to be stolen?...What amount of your civil liberties taken away will you allow?...How much more police brutality will you tolerate?...How much more soverignty will you allow your country to give away?

At what point will you decide that it is time to take the golden gun of government away and start living your life on your own terms?

Just how much will you take?

I reject it NOW!

How do you think we should fight the masses?? Bottom 50% of American tax payers only account for 3% of taxes collected and the politicians go after this voting block with give away entitlement programs that keep them reliant of government from cradle to grave.
Meanwhile the top 25% of Americans pay 86% of all taxes collected. It is an uphill battle for those of us in America carrying the load and for those that are more then happy to jump on our backs and enjoy the ride.

This battle will have to be fought over a number of years....Lets start simple...end nation building and foreign aid...bring our assets home to defend our country and save close to a trillion a year that could be put to saving SS..rebuilding our infrastructure..ect...ect..ect.

Start marketizing functions of government...Lets start with NASA as an example of how the free market works...Think NASA could survive with advertizing and stock offerings?...Yes

End the insane war on drugs and save billions in tax revenues and also eliminate the majority of crime and the growing police state in the process...Concentrate on education and treatment of those who wish to screw up their lives instead of locking them up at OUR expense.

End welfare for workfare...then get rid of it over time.

Mandate the downsizing of the govt. each year by 5% and replace those functions with free market alternatives...and cut taxes by the same 5% yearly until the size of the govt. is so small that americans would understand that ...We really dont need it in our lives and we can survive and prosper in a voluntary society based on the principles of non agression.

Go to ...downsizedc.org...great place to start voicing your opposition to todays policies.

Fo Shizzle Wrote:

ShoreBuc Wrote:

Fo Shizzle Wrote:How much of your wages will you allow to be stolen?...What amount of your civil liberties taken away will you allow?...How much more police brutality will you tolerate?...How much more soverignty will you allow your country to give away?

At what point will you decide that it is time to take the golden gun of government away and start living your life on your own terms?

Just how much will you take?

I reject it NOW!

How do you think we should fight the masses?? Bottom 50% of American tax payers only account for 3% of taxes collected and the politicians go after this voting block with give away entitlement programs that keep them reliant of government from cradle to grave.
Meanwhile the top 25% of Americans pay 86% of all taxes collected. It is an uphill battle for those of us in America carrying the load and for those that are more then happy to jump on our backs and enjoy the ride.

This battle will have to be fought over a number of years....Lets start simple...end nation building and foreign aid...bring our assets home to defend our country and save close to a trillion a year that could be put to saving SS..rebuilding our infrastructure..ect...ect..ect.

Start marketizing functions of government...Lets start with NASA as an example of how the free market works...Think NASA could survive with advertizing and stock offerings?...Yes

End the insane war on drugs and save billions in tax revenues and also eliminate the majority of crime and the growing police state in the process...Concentrate on education and treatment of those who wish to screw up their lives instead of locking them up at OUR expense.

End welfare for workfare...then get rid of it over time.

Mandate the downsizing of the govt. each year by 5% and replace those functions with free market alternatives...and cut taxes by the same 5% yearly until the size of the govt. is so small that americans would understand that ...We really dont need it in our lives and we can survive and prosper in a voluntary society based on the principles of non agression.

Go to ...downsizedc.org...great place to start voicing your opposition to todays policies.

You have my vote for POTUS

ShoreBuc Wrote:You have my vote for POTUS

You do realize of course you just proxy voted Ron Paul?

georgia_tech_swagger Wrote:

ShoreBuc Wrote:You have my vote for POTUS

You do realize of course you just proxy voted Ron Paul?

Ron Paul is known as the KOOK of congress...He has been the anti goverment guy in congress his entire career...BUT..He is still a statist...He would be the first to admit that he has had to point the gun of government at the people in his district...You cant be involved in the government and not use force...The concepts are totally contradictory..since government IS force..(if you dont believe it...stop paying taxes and see if someone with a gun doesnt come to visit you and force you to give up your wages or surrender your property for the state)...He of course has been much more prudent in his statism than any other member of congress...but he is NOT excused from his use of force, as is ANYONE that makes governmental policy at ANY level.

I oppose the state in every way I can...from the denial of its authority to tax...to the support of its political policies..I support Ron Paul..ONLY because I feel he would be the statist that would least harm me and point the gun of government at me....That does NOT mean that I excuse his use of statism to achieve his goals.

I advocate the end of government and I embrace free and voluntary interaction among people using the principles of non agression in a totally free market society.

Fo Shizzle Wrote:

georgia_tech_swagger Wrote:

ShoreBuc Wrote:You have my vote for POTUS

You do realize of course you just proxy voted Ron Paul?

Ron Paul is known as the KOOK of congress...He has been the anti goverment guy in congress his entire career...BUT..He is still a statist...He would be the first to admit that he has had to point the gun of government at the people in his district...You cant be involved in the government and not use force...The concepts are totally contradictory..since government IS force..(if you dont believe it...stop paying taxes and see if someone with a gun doesnt come to visit you and force you to give up your wages or surrender your property for the state)...He of course has been much more prudent in his statism than any other member of congress...but he is NOT excused from his use of force, as is ANYONE that makes governmental policy at ANY level.

I oppose the state in every way I can...from the denial of its authority to tax...to the support of its political policies..I support Ron Paul..ONLY because I feel he would be the statist that would least harm me and point the gun of government at me....That does NOT mean that I excuse his use of statism to achieve his goals.

I advocate the end of government and I embrace free and voluntary interaction among people using the principles of non agression in a totally free market society.

That's the exact opposite of communism and would fail for the same fundamental reasons. The solution is in the middle, but skewed far away from communism.

Fo Shizzle Wrote:I advocate the end of government and I embrace free and voluntary interaction among people using the principles of non agression in a totally free market society.

Utopia does not exist. People are wretched and evil, and thus laws would spring up to protect the masses for this evil. Who would enforce the laws? You figure it out.

georgia_tech_swagger Wrote:

ShoreBuc Wrote:You have my vote for POTUS

You do realize of course you just proxy voted Ron Paul?

Hardly. He didn't say a damn thing about current foreign policy.

RebelKev Wrote:

georgia_tech_swagger Wrote:

ShoreBuc Wrote:You have my vote for POTUS

You do realize of course you just proxy voted Ron Paul?

Hardly. He didn't say a damn thing about current foreign policy.

Nobody running -- even those who have dropped out -- matches up with what he just agreed with .... except Ron Paul. And I'm hedging my bets that:
A) ShoreBuc falls into the majority of 70-75% of Americans who think Iraq was and is a bad idea.
B) If he's in the 25-30% minority, he doesn't consider Iraq *THE* issue overriding all others (like our impending fiscal meltdown).

Does every thread have to turn into a Ron Paul fest? The dude is an afterthought, except on internet message boards and blogs.

GrayBeard Wrote:Does every thread have to turn into a Ron Paul fest? The dude is an afterthought, except on internet message boards and blogs.

I'm so sick of the SHEEPLE in this country who think an election is a high school class president popularity contest. It's about issues, philosophy, and goals. It shouldn't matter what Faux News, CNN, O'Reilly, Hannity, Lou Dobbs, or anybody else in the media says or considers "electable". It should be about who represents what you stand for most. Of course I'm getting ahead of myself here.

Less than 40% of people in this country even vote.
Of those 40% ... I'll be VERY generous, and say that 10% of people in this country research all the candidates before voting.
Of those 40% ... (in some states) over 1/3 of those voted in the GOP primary considered the religious views of candidates VERY important in their vote.
Less than 15% of people in this country read newspapers.
Less than 3% of people in this country read books.

It's downright depressing how stupid the average American is.

Interesting side note:
Ron Paul's support overwhelming comes from the high tech and military industries. Top contributors to his campaign:

1) US Army $68,817 -- Military
2) US Navy $57,076 -- Military
3) US Air Force $52,371 -- Military
4) Google Inc $51,382 -- High Tech
5) Microsoft Corp $46,079 -- High Tech
6) US Postal Service $31,054
7) Lockheed Martin $26,754 -- Military
8) Boeing Co $24,388 -- Military
9) At&T Inc $22,398 -- High Tech
10) IBM Corp $19,177 -- High Tech
11) Verizon Communications $18,399 -- High Tech
12) Hewlett-Packard $18,014 -- High Tech
13) Apple Inc $17,314 -- High Tech
14) Intel Corp $16,751 -- High Tech
15) Northrop Grumman $16,067 -- Military
16) General Electric $15,788 -- High Tech AND Military
17) General Dynamics $15,584 -- Military
18) Cisco Systems $14,702 -- High Tech
19) US Dept of Defense $14,338 -- Military
20) Wachovia Corp $14,231

Oddly enough, both industries where morons do not remain gainfully employed for very long.

Ron Paul has 2.5 times more donations from active military than anybody else running. The next closest is Obama ... with McCain an even further distant third.

GrayBeard Wrote:

Fo Shizzle Wrote:I advocate the end of government and I embrace free and voluntary interaction among people using the principles of non agression in a totally free market society.

Utopia does not exist. People are wretched and evil, and thus laws would spring up to protect the masses for this evil. Who would enforce the laws? You figure it out.

You are correct...Utopia will never totally exist but that doesnt mean that these ideas would not work.

The law would be simple...do no harm to others...A system of arbitration would handle disputes among parties...restitutution instead of jailtime...If you harm someone you would have to pay to "make them whole"...You are correct...There is no way to avoid jailtime for violent criminals...but...They would still have to pay restitution to their victims through prison labor...A system of this nature would be less expensive and more effective than our current system...With basic laws that only pertain to "harm to others"...marketized security would be able to actually serve and protect "you" instead of themselves and state.

RebelKev Wrote:

georgia_tech_swagger Wrote:

ShoreBuc Wrote:You have my vote for POTUS

You do realize of course you just proxy voted Ron Paul?

Hardly. He didn't say a damn thing about current foreign policy.

Foreign policy of non intervention, free trade and diplomacy sounds about right...Treaties with other nations would be ok...as long as they do not infringe upon our sovernity.

GrayBeard Wrote:Does every thread have to turn into a Ron Paul fest?

Only the ones that don't turn into slugfests over evolution and creationism. :)

Bourgeois_Rage Wrote:

GrayBeard Wrote:Does every thread have to turn into a Ron Paul fest?

Only the ones that don't turn into slugfests over evolution and creationism. :)

We could make it really messy and turn it into a debate on whether Ron Paul evolved from apes.

georgia_tech_swagger Wrote:

GrayBeard Wrote:Does every thread have to turn into a Ron Paul fest? The dude is an afterthought, except on internet message boards and blogs.

I'm so sick of the SHEEPLE in this country who think an election is a high school class president popularity contest. It's about issues, philosophy, and goals. It shouldn't matter what Faux News, CNN, O'Reilly, Hannity, Lou Dobbs, or anybody else in the media says or considers "electable". It should be about who represents what you stand for most. Of course I'm getting ahead of myself here.

Less than 40% of people in this country even vote.
Of those 40% ... I'll be VERY generous, and say that 10% of people in this country research all the candidates before voting.
Of those 40% ... (in some states) over 1/3 of those voted in the GOP primary considered the religious views of candidates VERY important in their vote.
Less than 15% of people in this country read newspapers.
Less than 3% of people in this country read books.

It's downright depressing how stupid the average American is.

So let me understand this. In the first part of your post, you state that "people should vote for those who represent you most". Then in the second part of the post, you make fun of the people who did just that. Just because their beliefs don't match up with yours, doesn't make them "stupid".

However, I do agree with your last statement...

blah Wrote:So let me understand this. In the first part of your post, you state that "people should vote for those who represent you most". Then in the second part of the post, you make fun of the people who did just that. Just because their beliefs don't match up with yours, doesn't make them "stupid".

However, I do agree with your last statement...

Separation of church and state. Religious views and political views should be wholly separate... and you should vote entirely based upon the second of the two.

This is not a theocracy, no matter how much Huckabee, Haggard, and Robertson want it to be.

georgia_tech_swagger Wrote:

blah Wrote:So let me understand this. In the first part of your post, you state that "people should vote for those who represent you most". Then in the second part of the post, you make fun of the people who did just that. Just because their beliefs don't match up with yours, doesn't make them "stupid".

However, I do agree with your last statement...

Separation of church and state. Religious views and political views should be wholly separate... and you should vote entirely based upon the second of the two.

This is not a theocracy, no matter how much Huckabee, Haggard, and Robertson want it to be.

I call B.S.

Voting for someone that has the same religious views as you does not equal voting for a theocracy, as much as you would like to spin it that way.

Those people did exactly what you wanted them to do (i.e. find the candidate that best represents you) and then you ridiculed them for it.

blah Wrote:I call B.S.

Voting for someone that has the same religious views as you does not equal voting for a theocracy, as much as you would like to spin it that way.

Those people did exactly what you wanted them to do (i.e. find the candidate that best represents you) and then you ridiculed them for it.

Clearly you've not talked to the typical Huckabee supporter, especially in the South. Huckabee gobbled up 4 out of 5 of the "religion matters" vote. Talking to them in the local party (since I am a committeeman) ... you get things like this:
"All gay people will burn in hell. We need to Constitutionally ban gay marriage."

"Video games are the source of violence in our schools. We need to ban all violent video games.

"We need to modify the Constitution to be in line with God's standards and laws, just like Huckabee says."

Once again -- separation of church and state. That means that religion should not in any way determine policy, and no state funding should go to religion. That also directly implies the voter should keep their religion out of their vote. I would enforce our existing separation laws much harder when it comes to campaigning.

Candidate speaks at your church? You lose tax free status.
Your pastor endorses a candidate? You lose tax free status.
Your church endorses a candidate? You lose tax free status.

I think it's worth consideration to stop having precinct polling locations at churches too.

Damn you Constitution! Getting in the way of our great "Christian nation under God".