Endzone2 Wrote:

niuhuskie84 Wrote:

Bourgeois_Rage Wrote:

Endzone2 Wrote:In the same category as an anti-gravity machine.

???

its not even worth trying to argue......

and btw endzone, nothing i have said contradicts any sort of religious belief. believe it or not, it is possible for logical science and religion to coexist. but then again, if youre just going to chalk up anything you dont fully understand or have knowledge on to just sort of magically happeing, i dont think we're going to get too far in this discussion. if you really believe the earth has existed for only 6000 years and was created in 6 days with new creatures coming every 24 hours, well i dont see the point in continuing this conversation. but if you're willing to admit there are people far brighter and intelligent than you and I out there in the world who have used sound science (no, not junk science) to study and draw conclusions about the world we live in, we just might get somewhere.

The more I know the Lord God and the Lord Jesus Christ, the more I am convinced that the Biblical account is very accurate. I was thinking the other day that maybe the original Earth (when God created it 6,000 or so years ago) was perfectly formed. After the fall, (after the sin of Adam and Eve) is when things started to go wrong. At that the point the Earth started to produce internal pressures and all the stuff that leads to volcanos, etc. It wasn't at all a part of the original creation. That's why science is so wrong to try and understand what happened based on what they can see with their own 2 eyes. This is why it is futile to try to understand the universe or our own history apart from what the Bible says about it. This is just a glimpse of what the Lord means when He says, "My ways are higher than your ways and my thoughts are higher than your thoughts".

Glad you cleared that one up for us
As far as the "Fall" what was that great sin of Adam and Eve that led to volcanoes and other bad stuff on this planet?? Did Adam and Eve commit murder? Genesis never mentions a marriage ceremony so I am assuming that if Adam figured out what to do with Eve while still in his ignorant bliss stage that there was some fornification going on.
But the great sin of man was disobedience?? And like any good parent God threw his kids out of the house for this, their first and only sin.

It would seem to me that to put the sin of disobedience that high on a pedestal would be awfully convenient if you were trying to create something like... I don't know, maybe...organized religion

niuhuskie84 Wrote:like i said, its not worth trying to argue.

You're right, niu.

I've argued with YECs elsewhere on the interweb, and it is always the same story. You can point them to all sorts of evidence of an old Earth/universe, and if you ignore that they you are faced with a trickster God who is trying to pull the wool over your eyes about the age of the Earth. So they are forced to discount any and all observation except the Bible. And that is the inerrant word of God.

ShoreBuc Wrote:

Endzone2 Wrote:

niuhuskie84 Wrote:

Bourgeois_Rage Wrote:

Endzone2 Wrote:In the same category as an anti-gravity machine.

???

its not even worth trying to argue......

and btw endzone, nothing i have said contradicts any sort of religious belief. believe it or not, it is possible for logical science and religion to coexist. but then again, if youre just going to chalk up anything you dont fully understand or have knowledge on to just sort of magically happeing, i dont think we're going to get too far in this discussion. if you really believe the earth has existed for only 6000 years and was created in 6 days with new creatures coming every 24 hours, well i dont see the point in continuing this conversation. but if you're willing to admit there are people far brighter and intelligent than you and I out there in the world who have used sound science (no, not junk science) to study and draw conclusions about the world we live in, we just might get somewhere.

The more I know the Lord God and the Lord Jesus Christ, the more I am convinced that the Biblical account is very accurate. I was thinking the other day that maybe the original Earth (when God created it 6,000 or so years ago) was perfectly formed. After the fall, (after the sin of Adam and Eve) is when things started to go wrong. At that the point the Earth started to produce internal pressures and all the stuff that leads to volcanos, etc. It wasn't at all a part of the original creation. That's why science is so wrong to try and understand what happened based on what they can see with their own 2 eyes. This is why it is futile to try to understand the universe or our own history apart from what the Bible says about it. This is just a glimpse of what the Lord means when He says, "My ways are higher than your ways and my thoughts are higher than your thoughts".

Glad you cleared that one up for us
As far as the "Fall" what was that great sin of Adam and Eve that led to volcanoes and other bad stuff on this planet?? Did Adam and Eve commit murder? Genesis never mentions a marriage ceremony so I am assuming that if Adam figured out what to do with Eve while still in his ignorant bliss stage that there was some fornification going on.
But the great sin of man was disobedience?? And like any good parent God threw his kids out of the house for this, their first and only sin.

It would seem to me that to put the sin of disobedience that high on a pedestal would be awfully convenient if you were trying to create something like... I don't know, maybe...organized religion

Well things did change on the Earth. Adam & Eve were living in a place of paradise weren't they? Were volcanoes, tornados, Tsunamis, hailstorms and floods a part of that? Doesn't sound like paradise to me. Something fundamentally changed.

Endzone2 Wrote:Well things did change on the Earth. Adam & Eve were living in a place of paradise weren't they? Were volcanoes, tornados, Tsunamis, hailstorms and floods a part of that? Doesn't sound like paradise to me. Something fundamentally changed.

It's called human thought. One can't feel pain if it doesn't know what it is. Ignorance is bliss.
First few chapters of Genesis = metaphoric folklore of man's self-realization. Trying to make it a literal story does it injustice.

And I found a nice article by that wacko Stephen Hawking on the chances of finding intelligent life out in the cosmos:
http://www.hawking.org.uk/pdf/life.pdf
He doesn't think it will be too high either, but the simple stuff seems to have a better chance to exist.

Endzone2 Wrote:

ShoreBuc Wrote:

Endzone2 Wrote:

niuhuskie84 Wrote:

Bourgeois_Rage Wrote:

Endzone2 Wrote:In the same category as an anti-gravity machine.

???

its not even worth trying to argue......

and btw endzone, nothing i have said contradicts any sort of religious belief. believe it or not, it is possible for logical science and religion to coexist. but then again, if youre just going to chalk up anything you dont fully understand or have knowledge on to just sort of magically happeing, i dont think we're going to get too far in this discussion. if you really believe the earth has existed for only 6000 years and was created in 6 days with new creatures coming every 24 hours, well i dont see the point in continuing this conversation. but if you're willing to admit there are people far brighter and intelligent than you and I out there in the world who have used sound science (no, not junk science) to study and draw conclusions about the world we live in, we just might get somewhere.

The more I know the Lord God and the Lord Jesus Christ, the more I am convinced that the Biblical account is very accurate. I was thinking the other day that maybe the original Earth (when God created it 6,000 or so years ago) was perfectly formed. After the fall, (after the sin of Adam and Eve) is when things started to go wrong. At that the point the Earth started to produce internal pressures and all the stuff that leads to volcanos, etc. It wasn't at all a part of the original creation. That's why science is so wrong to try and understand what happened based on what they can see with their own 2 eyes. This is why it is futile to try to understand the universe or our own history apart from what the Bible says about it. This is just a glimpse of what the Lord means when He says, "My ways are higher than your ways and my thoughts are higher than your thoughts".

Glad you cleared that one up for us
As far as the "Fall" what was that great sin of Adam and Eve that led to volcanoes and other bad stuff on this planet?? Did Adam and Eve commit murder? Genesis never mentions a marriage ceremony so I am assuming that if Adam figured out what to do with Eve while still in his ignorant bliss stage that there was some fornification going on.
But the great sin of man was disobedience?? And like any good parent God threw his kids out of the house for this, their first and only sin.

It would seem to me that to put the sin of disobedience that high on a pedestal would be awfully convenient if you were trying to create something like... I don't know, maybe...organized religion

Well things did change on the Earth. Adam & Eve were living in a place of paradise weren't they? Were volcanoes, tornados, Tsunamis, hailstorms and floods a part of that? Doesn't sound like paradise to me. Something fundamentally changed.

So as a Biblical Literalist you believe that the sin of disobedience led to volcanoes, tornadoes, tsunamis, earthquakes, floods, disease etc?? I guess this is also when God added poisonous plants and animals and also the animals that could eat and kill humans to the planets creation inventory???
That is a pretty tough parent in the OT. Not only does God throw you out of the family house but then God destroys the neighborhood that he throws you in. All this over the great sin of disobedience??? No timeout or hey I told you not to eat from that tree. The first time God even spoke to Eve was in anger so maybe she just did not trust God or like God. Don't you think that God should of cut them both some slack since it was an evil talking snake that convinced them to committ the sin of disobedience in trying to aquire some knowledge.
I would think throwing the snake on its belly forever and taking away its talking priviledges would of worked or maybe even not of having that temptation for man in the Garden. But wait a minute avoiding temptation and obedience sounds like a great parable so if you take away the tree you dont have the story!!

if there is intelligent life ( I think there most certainly is but maybe not in humanoid form ) why would it come to this planet?

Endzone has been a perfect example of why if i was a sentient alien being i would not come to this planet. the inability to see ahead of ones own beliefs and the inability to think outside of some one elses interpertation pf what defines human life or life in general for that matter.

Now does bacterial life exsist in the universe yes that is probably a given, taking into account the size and age of the universe but does it qualify as life? yes.

and for the record i don't claim to be perfect want to be perfect or have the desire to be perfect. and i don't claim to have anything figured out either.