(10-01-2026 02:35 PM)umbluegray Wrote:  So basically we're paying Ukraine to advance the globalist agenda.

I thought trump was going to easily end that war on or before Day 1?

Once again,

Presidents do not control the price of gas and oil, unless of course the President's name is Donald Trump.

When a Democrat president is in charge, and the price of gas and oil is out of control, we, the peasants are supposed to shut up and buy electric vehicles, even if we can't afford one.

I commend the brave, dedicated, and skilled sailors for their outstanding success.

(10-01-2026 04:11 PM)BirdHawkEagle Wrote:  Once again,

Presidents do not control the price of gas and oil, unless of course the President's name is Donald Trump.

When a Democrat president is in charge, and the price of gas and oil is out of control, we, the peasants are supposed to shut up and buy electric vehicles, even if we can't afford one.

It truly is remarkable.

(10-01-2026 04:27 PM)ECUGrad07 Wrote:  

(10-01-2026 04:11 PM)BirdHawkEagle Wrote:  Once again,

Presidents do not control the price of gas and oil, unless of course the President's name is Donald Trump.

When a Democrat president is in charge, and the price of gas and oil is out of control, we, the peasants are supposed to shut up and buy electric vehicles, even if we can't afford one.

It truly is remarkable.

It's pathetic if I'm being honest.

(10-01-2026 02:43 PM)Redwingtom Wrote:  

(10-01-2026 02:28 PM)Attackcoog Wrote:  While I do believe more oil is passing through the Strait than there was a few months ago---oil prices (the truest indicator of supply and demand) continue to advance. That suggests to me that we arent yet back to the Gulf's pre-war levels of oil exports. As for diesel---high prices tend to curb demand---so my expectation is that diesel stocks rebound quicker than expected once enough crude oil is available to increase production. I do expect fuel prices to remain somewhat elevated for a while even after we return to pre-war world oil production because worldwide petroleum reserve stocks also need to be refilled--and that demand will persist until national reserves reach a safe level.

Why do you think high diesel will curb demand? How else is our trucking industry going to move product?

Because thats how supply and demand works.

How do you expect everyone to keep buying the same amount of everything when the prices of evrything rises due to increased fuel prices? The laws of supply and demand have not been repealed. What generally happens is companies sell fewer widgets at higher prices (the dollar amount of sales may be unchanged or even rise slightly—but the total number of widgets sold will decrease) and that lowers the total volume of cargo that needs to be carried. Furthermore, when prices rise, discretionary projects and purchases are often canceled or put on hold—further reducing demand. Expansion plans are tabled----vacations get cancelled or scaled down. Less demand means less product needs to be moved.

(10-01-2026 02:28 PM)Attackcoog Wrote:  While I do believe more oil is passing through the Strait than there was a few months ago---oil prices (the truest indicator of supply and demand) continue to advance. That suggests to me that we arent yet back to the Gulf's pre-war levels of oil exports. As for diesel---high prices tend to curb demand---so my expectation is that diesel stocks rebound quicker than expected once enough crude oil is available to increase production. I do expect fuel prices to remain somewhat elevated for a while even after we return to pre-war world oil production because worldwide petroleum reserve stocks also need to be refilled--and that demand will persist until national reserves reach a safe level.

Kind of have to end this war to have a chance at getting back to pre war levels. Trump's royally effed up here. One month to midterms.

Trump threatened to cut off the exports of diesel, and the G7 have capitulated and will now release diesel ( as well as oil) from their own SPR. Why is this big? Because the US refines much more diesel than we consume, so we have become exporters of diesel. We supply half of the G7's diesel requirements.

So when the world diesel markets took a hit (whether it was from russia or where ever) diesel prices here rose because of the worldwide demand. The G7 should have already begun releasing diesel and oil from their spr, but refused to do so until Trump threatened to cut off US exports of diesel.

(10-03-2026 09:54 AM)UofMstateU Wrote:  Trump threatened to cut off the exports of diesel, and the G7 have capitulated and will now release diesel ( as well as oil) from their own SPR. Why is this big? Because the US refines much more diesel than we consume, so we have become exporters of diesel. We supply half of the G7's diesel requirements.

So when the world diesel markets took a hit (whether it was from russia or where ever) diesel prices here rose because of the worldwide demand. The G7 should have already begun releasing diesel and oil from their spr, but refused to do so until Trump threatened to cut off US exports of diesel.

Tom disagrees, and he will be back on Monday after he punches in at work to tell you that.

(10-03-2026 09:54 AM)UofMstateU Wrote:  Trump threatened to cut off the exports of diesel, and the G7 have capitulated and will now release diesel ( as well as oil) from their own SPR. Why is this big? Because the US refines much more diesel than we consume, so we have become exporters of diesel. We supply half of the G7's diesel requirements.

So when the world diesel markets took a hit (whether it was from russia or where ever) diesel prices here rose because of the worldwide demand. The G7 should have already begun releasing diesel and oil from their spr, but refused to do so until Trump threatened to cut off US exports of diesel.

wait a minute. That can’t be true. it’s only the war with Iran that is causing the issue. it is NOT reduced American refining capacity over last 5 years (something like 4 in California alone) and it is not the Ukraine war. Tom has absolutely assured me it is only Iran conflict and said my account should be revoked for not thinking like him and believing it is multifaceted issue.

WTI is overpriced currently. There is no lack of supply, and Venezuelan oil is coming in at the highest level ever.

(10-02-2026 04:32 PM)Attackcoog Wrote:  

(10-01-2026 02:43 PM)Redwingtom Wrote:  

(10-01-2026 02:28 PM)Attackcoog Wrote:  While I do believe more oil is passing through the Strait than there was a few months ago---oil prices (the truest indicator of supply and demand) continue to advance. That suggests to me that we arent yet back to the Gulf's pre-war levels of oil exports. As for diesel---high prices tend to curb demand---so my expectation is that diesel stocks rebound quicker than expected once enough crude oil is available to increase production. I do expect fuel prices to remain somewhat elevated for a while even after we return to pre-war world oil production because worldwide petroleum reserve stocks also need to be refilled--and that demand will persist until national reserves reach a safe level.

Why do you think high diesel will curb demand? How else is our trucking industry going to move product?

Because thats how supply and demand works.

How do you expect everyone to keep buying the same amount of everything when the prices of evrything rises due to increased fuel prices? The laws of supply and demand have not been repealed. What generally happens is companies sell fewer widgets at higher prices (the dollar amount of sales may be unchanged or even rise slightly—but the total number of widgets sold will decrease) and that lowers the total volume of cargo that needs to be carried. Furthermore, when prices rise, discretionary projects and purchases are often canceled or put on hold—further reducing demand. Expansion plans are tabled----vacations get cancelled or scaled down. Less demand means less product needs to be moved.

Or they move more product on trains instead of trucks. Trains are cheaper, but slower.

(10-05-2026 12:22 PM)CrimsonPhantom Wrote:  

So that's why we aren't destroying the Iranian refineries.

(10-05-2026 12:38 PM)bullet Wrote:  

(10-02-2026 04:32 PM)Attackcoog Wrote:  

(10-01-2026 02:43 PM)Redwingtom Wrote:  

(10-01-2026 02:28 PM)Attackcoog Wrote:  While I do believe more oil is passing through the Strait than there was a few months ago---oil prices (the truest indicator of supply and demand) continue to advance. That suggests to me that we arent yet back to the Gulf's pre-war levels of oil exports. As for diesel---high prices tend to curb demand---so my expectation is that diesel stocks rebound quicker than expected once enough crude oil is available to increase production. I do expect fuel prices to remain somewhat elevated for a while even after we return to pre-war world oil production because worldwide petroleum reserve stocks also need to be refilled--and that demand will persist until national reserves reach a safe level.

Why do you think high diesel will curb demand? How else is our trucking industry going to move product?

Because thats how supply and demand works.

How do you expect everyone to keep buying the same amount of everything when the prices of evrything rises due to increased fuel prices? The laws of supply and demand have not been repealed. What generally happens is companies sell fewer widgets at higher prices (the dollar amount of sales may be unchanged or even rise slightly—but the total number of widgets sold will decrease) and that lowers the total volume of cargo that needs to be carried. Furthermore, when prices rise, discretionary projects and purchases are often canceled or put on hold—further reducing demand. Expansion plans are tabled----vacations get cancelled or scaled down. Less demand means less product needs to be moved.

Or they move more product on trains instead of trucks. Trains are cheaper, but slower.

Then there's the issue of getting the goods from the train to the retail establishment.

Also, rail is normally only cheaper when travel is greater than 500 miles. And it looks like around 55% of the value of goods (74% of the weight) travels less than 250 miles from from their origin (producer or distribution center) to the retail establishment per the Bureau of Transportation. While only 17% of the value (6% of the weight) travel more than 1,000 miles.

(10-05-2026 12:22 PM)CrimsonPhantom Wrote:  

Complete ******* fiction.

Why do you keep listening to this lying moron?!?

Quote:The Strait of Hormuz, through which an average of 20 million barrels per day (mb/d) of crude oil and oil products were shipped in 2025, is one of the world's most critical oil transit chokepoints.

https://www.iea.org/about/oil-security-a...-of-hormuz

Quote:Oil and products through Hormuz: 13.1 million barrels a day in the latest week, just under 80% of the 17.1 mb/d pre-war level (CNN (Kpler data), 29 Sep)

https://hormuz.now/

Why do you blindly believe what the Democrats tell you, Tom?

(10-05-2026 01:42 PM)Redwingtom Wrote:  

(10-05-2026 12:22 PM)CrimsonPhantom Wrote:  

Complete ******* fiction.

Why do you keep listening to this lying moron?!?

Quote:The Strait of Hormuz, through which an average of 20 million barrels per day (mb/d) of crude oil and oil products were shipped in 2025, is one of the world's most critical oil transit chokepoints.

https://www.iea.org/about/oil-security-a...-of-hormuz

Quote:Oil and products through Hormuz: 13.1 million barrels a day in the latest week, just under 80% of the 17.1 mb/d pre-war level (CNN (Kpler data), 29 Sep)

https://hormuz.now/

I'm not a fan of this war at all but how do we know this information on hormuz.now is trustworthy? I've never heard of this site. Wild how you had it at the ready apparently. I'm trying my best to call it right down the middle so enlighten me please.

(10-01-2026 02:44 PM)Redwingtom Wrote:  

(10-01-2026 02:35 PM)umbluegray Wrote:  So basically we're paying Ukraine to advance the globalist agenda.

I thought trump was going to easily end that war on or before Day 1?

kinetic activity ended april 7 ...
a fragile ceasefire ever since ...
the iran war is over ...
get it through your thick head ...

FOR ALL INTENTS & PURPOSES

(10-05-2026 02:18 PM)b2b Wrote:  

(10-05-2026 01:42 PM)Redwingtom Wrote:  

(10-05-2026 12:22 PM)CrimsonPhantom Wrote:  

Complete ******* fiction.

Why do you keep listening to this lying moron?!?

Quote:The Strait of Hormuz, through which an average of 20 million barrels per day (mb/d) of crude oil and oil products were shipped in 2025, is one of the world's most critical oil transit chokepoints.

https://www.iea.org/about/oil-security-a...-of-hormuz

Quote:Oil and products through Hormuz: 13.1 million barrels a day in the latest week, just under 80% of the 17.1 mb/d pre-war level (CNN (Kpler data), 29 Sep)

https://hormuz.now/

I'm not a fan of this war at all but how do we know this information on hormuz.now is trustworthy? I've never heard of this site. Wild how you had it at the ready apparently. I'm trying my best to call it right down the middle so enlighten me please.

Thanks for questioning me on this. I did a bit more digging. No, that site is not any official authority and there are several sites doing the same thing. They basically track ship movements via their locators, but there can be delays and mistakes.

That being said, the 13.1 figure is based on Kpler data which is often sited as a good source. But even they're being questioned as well. Mainly because they then said that...

Quote:The seven-day moving average for crude exports from the region was 18.3 million barrels per day on September 30, provisional data from Kpler showed, with volumes topping pre-war levels on 14 days in September.

https://www.reuters.com/business/energy/...026-10-05/

So this would make trump's claim somewhat more accurate...but again, this is subjective. It also has the following caveat:

Quote:That included Gulf oil ​sent Hormuz, via the Red Sea, and from terminals and ship-to-ship transfers in the Gulf of Oman.

So this wouldn't just be strait traffic, but would also include oil piped to the Red Sea.

But even then, these numbers seem to be iffy when you consider the Houthi attacks on the pipeline as well as other recent ship attacks.

So who knows what to really believe?!?

Bottom line, we're still in for a long period of high gas and diesel prices, likely to last a ways into 2027.

Apologies for any confusion.