Good points, Bill.

(03-09-2026 10:01 AM)Bill Marsh Wrote:  Good points, Bill.

Yes, indeed, my good man.

(03-09-2026 11:10 AM)bill dazzle Wrote:  

(03-09-2026 10:01 AM)Bill Marsh Wrote:  Good points, Bill.

Yes, indeed, my good man.

My two cents for the Bills or is it 4 cents since there are 2 of you? How many times have we seen a coach leave a favorable situation to pursue something some view as more prestigious, only to be run out of town a few years later? Holtman could potentially be in a very desirable position at Depaul. Could he become their Mark Few? Maybe Few is an anomaly but Gonzaga being in the WCC all those years certainly didn't prevent them (and him) from being successful. He could have pursued a bigger name school or conference but did not. That decision seems to have worked out for him

(03-09-2026 05:19 PM)gosports1 Wrote:  

(03-09-2026 11:10 AM)bill dazzle Wrote:  

(03-09-2026 10:01 AM)Bill Marsh Wrote:  Good points, Bill.

Yes, indeed, my good man.

My two cents for the Bills or is it 4 cents since there are 2 of you? How many times have we seen a coach leave a favorable situation to pursue something some view as more prestigious, only to be run out of town a few years later? Holtman could potentially be in a very desirable position at Depaul. Could he become their Mark Few? Maybe Few is an anomaly but Gonzaga being in the WCC all those years certainly didn't prevent them (and him) from being successful. He could have pursued a bigger name school or conference but did not. That decision seems to have worked out for him

Thanks, gosports. That was my point, but you said it better and more succinctly than I did.

I’ll only add that Mark Few isn’t an isolated case. James Jones (Yale) and Randy Bennett (St. Mary’s) would be a couple of other examples of coaches who have found professional success and fulfillment without going to elite programs and who have become institutions over their long careers at their adopted collegiate homes.

(03-09-2026 05:19 PM)gosports1 Wrote:  

(03-09-2026 11:10 AM)bill dazzle Wrote:  

(03-09-2026 10:01 AM)Bill Marsh Wrote:  Good points, Bill.

Yes, indeed, my good man.

My two cents for the Bills or is it 4 cents since there are 2 of you? How many times have we seen a coach leave a favorable situation to pursue something some view as more prestigious, only to be run out of town a few years later? Holtman could potentially be in a very desirable position at Depaul. Could he become their Mark Few? Maybe Few is an anomaly but Gonzaga being in the WCC all those years certainly didn't prevent them (and him) from being successful. He could have pursued a bigger name school or conference but did not. That decision seems to have worked out for him

My thing is I can argue by that logic he should go to a school like VCU over staying at DePaul. Gonzaga certainly benefitted from a lack of competition within their league, making it easier for them to become the top dog. Let's say VCU were to lose Martelli Jr after this season and pursue Holtmann, offering him even a slight pay bump. Why would it be a better decision for him to stay put? VCU is more competitive within their league, still has brand recognition for scheduling purposes, has better fan support and an easier overall path to success. They've had coaches treat it like a stepping stone program, despite a decade+ long run of success. So any coach who is successful there and decides to make it their last stop would be revered by Rams fans.

I don't think Few would have had nearly the same level of success had he consistently gone up against a power conference schedule. Gonzaga became a darling of ESPN back when networks still seemed to care about the little guy and were not nearly as biased towards the power leagues, which made scheduling marquee matchups OOC easier. All he has to do was go close to .500 in the marquee OOC games then dominate an easy WCC schedule and his team was in the tournament. Once he did that for a string of consecutive seasons recruiting became much easier, and the program had the momentum to keep it going.

Holtmann has a much more difficult path to success. I think it's an apples to oranges comparison.

(03-10-2026 05:46 AM)Nameless Wrote:  

(03-09-2026 05:19 PM)gosports1 Wrote:  

(03-09-2026 11:10 AM)bill dazzle Wrote:  

(03-09-2026 10:01 AM)Bill Marsh Wrote:  Good points, Bill.

Yes, indeed, my good man.

My two cents for the Bills or is it 4 cents since there are 2 of you? How many times have we seen a coach leave a favorable situation to pursue something some view as more prestigious, only to be run out of town a few years later? Holtman could potentially be in a very desirable position at Depaul. Could he become their Mark Few? Maybe Few is an anomaly but Gonzaga being in the WCC all those years certainly didn't prevent them (and him) from being successful. He could have pursued a bigger name school or conference but did not. That decision seems to have worked out for him

My thing is I can argue by that logic he should go to a school like VCU over staying at DePaul. Gonzaga certainly benefitted from a lack of competition within their league, making it easier for them to become the top dog. Let's say VCU were to lose Martelli Jr after this season and pursue Holtmann, offering him even a slight pay bump. Why would it be a better decision for him to stay put? VCU is more competitive within their league, still has brand recognition for scheduling purposes, has better fan support and an easier overall path to success. They've had coaches treat it like a stepping stone program, despite a decade+ long run of success. So any coach who is successful there and decides to make it their last stop would be revered by Rams fans.

I don't think Few would have had nearly the same level of success had he consistently gone up against a power conference schedule. Gonzaga became a darling of ESPN back when networks still seemed to care about the little guy and were not nearly as biased towards the power leagues, which made scheduling marquee matchups OOC easier. All he has to do was go close to .500 in the marquee OOC games then dominate an easy WCC schedule and his team was in the tournament. Once he did that for a string of consecutive seasons recruiting became much easier, and the program had the momentum to keep it going.

Holtmann has a much more difficult path to success. I think it's an apples to oranges comparison.

What has made Gonzaga special is that they experienced success once they got to the tournament. They had a Cinderella run to the Elite 8 in 1999 and followed that up with 4 more appearances in the Sweet 16 in the next decade. During this time when office pools were becoming popular, they became everyone’s favorite pick because they didn’t just get to the tournament but they won games once they got there. In the past decade or so, Few has taken them to a whole new level. They followed up a 2015 Elite 8 with an undefeated regular season and run to the championship game in 2017. There have been 3 more Elite 8s and another championship game appearance since then. The point is that Gonzaga hasn’t just gotten to the tournament, they’ve had enormous success once they got there.

Of course Holtmann would have to have success at DePaul to make it worthwhile. But I don’t see why he can’t. Build it and they will come. If DePaul starts winning fan support will be there. I don’t see how DePaul is any different than Georgetown. When the Big East was getting started, Georgetown was the Beast of the East. At that same time DePaul went to 4 Sweet 16s and a Final Four between 1979-89. They packed fans in at the Rosemont Horizon and were among the national leaders in attendance year after year. At that same time UConn was at or near the bottom of the Big East throughout the 1980s. Now roles are reversed as UConn is the best program in the league and Georgetown and DePaul battle for last place. But things can be reversed again.

Holtmann could go to VCU. But my point is that at 54 years old, it’s time for him to stop moving, to settle down and stay where he is, to stop being a basketball nomad. He’s successfully turning things around at DePaul. IMO he should continue to build on what he’s started. He can win at DePaul. The fans and the NIL money will follow as he develops a winning program.

(03-09-2026 05:19 PM)gosports1 Wrote:  

(03-09-2026 11:10 AM)bill dazzle Wrote:  

(03-09-2026 10:01 AM)Bill Marsh Wrote:  Good points, Bill.

Yes, indeed, my good man.

My two cents for the Bills or is it 4 cents since there are 2 of you? How many times have we seen a coach leave a favorable situation to pursue something some view as more prestigious, only to be run out of town a few years later? Holtman could potentially be in a very desirable position at Depaul. Could he become their Mark Few? Maybe Few is an anomaly but Gonzaga being in the WCC all those years certainly didn't prevent them (and him) from being successful. He could have pursued a bigger name school or conference but did not. That decision seems to have worked out for him

As the ladies say: "Two Bills are better than one."

Haha!

(03-10-2026 09:15 AM)Bill Marsh Wrote:  

(03-10-2026 05:46 AM)Nameless Wrote:  

(03-09-2026 05:19 PM)gosports1 Wrote:  

(03-09-2026 11:10 AM)bill dazzle Wrote:  

(03-09-2026 10:01 AM)Bill Marsh Wrote:  Good points, Bill.

Yes, indeed, my good man.

My two cents for the Bills or is it 4 cents since there are 2 of you? How many times have we seen a coach leave a favorable situation to pursue something some view as more prestigious, only to be run out of town a few years later? Holtman could potentially be in a very desirable position at Depaul. Could he become their Mark Few? Maybe Few is an anomaly but Gonzaga being in the WCC all those years certainly didn't prevent them (and him) from being successful. He could have pursued a bigger name school or conference but did not. That decision seems to have worked out for him

My thing is I can argue by that logic he should go to a school like VCU over staying at DePaul. Gonzaga certainly benefitted from a lack of competition within their league, making it easier for them to become the top dog. Let's say VCU were to lose Martelli Jr after this season and pursue Holtmann, offering him even a slight pay bump. Why would it be a better decision for him to stay put? VCU is more competitive within their league, still has brand recognition for scheduling purposes, has better fan support and an easier overall path to success. They've had coaches treat it like a stepping stone program, despite a decade+ long run of success. So any coach who is successful there and decides to make it their last stop would be revered by Rams fans.

I don't think Few would have had nearly the same level of success had he consistently gone up against a power conference schedule. Gonzaga became a darling of ESPN back when networks still seemed to care about the little guy and were not nearly as biased towards the power leagues, which made scheduling marquee matchups OOC easier. All he has to do was go close to .500 in the marquee OOC games then dominate an easy WCC schedule and his team was in the tournament. Once he did that for a string of consecutive seasons recruiting became much easier, and the program had the momentum to keep it going.

Holtmann has a much more difficult path to success. I think it's an apples to oranges comparison.

What has made Gonzaga special is that they experienced success once they got to the tournament. They had a Cinderella run to the Elite 8 in 1999 and followed that up with 4 more appearances in the Sweet 16 in the next decade. During this time when office pools were becoming popular, they became everyone’s favorite pick because they didn’t just get to the tournament but they won games once they got there. In the past decade or so, Few has taken them to a whole new level. They followed up a 2015 Elite 8 with an undefeated regular season and run to the championship game in 2017. There have been 3 more Elite 8s and another championship game appearance since then. The point is that Gonzaga hasn’t just gotten to the tournament, they’ve had enormous success once they got there.

Of course Holtmann would have to have success at DePaul to make it worthwhile. But I don’t see why he can’t. Build it and they will come. If DePaul starts winning fan support will be there. I don’t see how DePaul is any different than Georgetown. When the Big East was getting started, Georgetown was the Beast of the East. At that same time DePaul went to 4 Sweet 16s and a Final Four between 1979-89. They packed fans in at the Rosemont Horizon and were among the national leaders in attendance year after year. At that same time UConn was at or near the bottom of the Big East throughout the 1980s. Now roles are reversed as UConn is the best program in the league and Georgetown and DePaul battle for last place. But things can be reversed again.

Holtmann could go to VCU. But my point is that at 54 years old, it’s time for him to stop moving, to settle down and stay where he is, to stop being a basketball nomad. He’s successfully turning things around at DePaul. IMO he should continue to build on what he’s started. He can win at DePaul. The fans and the NIL money will follow as he develops a winning program.

I do understand part of Gonzaga's overall success has included success in the tournament. But again, the path to a higher seed is made easier by their schedule. Win 3/6 marquee games, lose a game to St Mary's in conference play or the conference tourney and you're looking at a 4 loss season. The narrative surrounding them at that point becomes something along the lines of, "they only lost 4 games all season and beat 3 good teams" thus leading to a higher seed. The higher seed obviously makes tournament runs easier.

The difference between DePaul and Georgetown is Georgetown still put out elite teams in the 2000s. I graduated high school in 2011 and I believe my sophomore year they were a 1 seed. What has DePaul done since that stretch you mentioned? Success has been largely non-existent for the program over the course of the past 4 decades. It's much easier to climb out of a hole when people under 40 remember the success the program once had.

UConn has been a good to elite program since the early 90s, with the only bad stretch coming under Ollie, who still won a championship there. Furthermore, the entire athletic department benefits from being "the only game in town." In other words, they don't have the Bears, Bulls, Cubs and White Sox to compete with for attention. Chicago is for all intents and purposes a pro sports town the way Boston is. It is much easier to drum up fan interest and NIL support for a college in Storrs than Chicago. My point being I don't think it's fair to compare programs and imply that anyone can do it. It will be substantially harder to build that program up than it would be at almost any other school in the league. There is a reason they have struggled since they joined.

Personally, I don't think 54 is old for a coach. Hurley isn't much younger and nobody considers him to be an old coach. Coaches routinely coach into their mid 60s to early 70s. If he were to leave this season or next, he could easily have a 10-15 year run at another program.

Again, I say all this not because I want him to go but because I think he has to at least listen to offers if a better opportunity comes along.