(09-20-2020 03:50 PM)jedclampett Wrote:  

(09-18-2020 02:16 PM)WhoseHouse? Wrote:  

(09-18-2020 01:44 PM)TexanMark Wrote:  Is UCLA still a Blueblood or just an elite team?

I'm kinda torn...they have great history but haven't done much lately and they draw crap at Pauley Pavilion.

Personally I think only Kentucky, UNC, Duke, Kansas are clear cut blue bloods (and in that order). However, if people are going to consider Indiana a blue blood then UCLA gets in easily. Since Indiana's last title run in '87, UCLA has more FF's, S16'S, tournament appearances, and conference championships.

The one thing that separates Duke, Kansas, UNC, and Kentucky from UCLA is that the first four schools on this short list have had more success in recent decades.

Perhaps it would clarify things to divide all the blueblood schools (the all-time greatest BB schools, most outstanding achievements, regardless of recent performance) into two groups:

I. Currently top tier bluebloods, or "The (current) Elite" (UNC, Kansas, Duke, Kentucky, ...)

II. Formerly elite bluebloods, or "The Legends" (UCLA, Indiana, etc....)

That way, people can still consider UCLA and Indiana full-fledged BB blueblood schools of the "Legends" type, as being on the same plane of all-time achievement with the UNCs and Dukes, even though they're not among the current elite.

Yes but if we're looking at the composite UCLA is still tops in championships, T-2 in Final Fours, and 4th in NCAAT appearances. That places them above at least one blue blood in every significant metric of tourney success. Because of that I can't equate them with Indiana or drop them out of the T-5. After looking more thoroughly at the data here's how I see it.

Blue Bloods
1. Kentucky (2nd in championships, T-2 in Final Fours, Most NCAAT appearances)
2. UNC (3rd in championships, 1st in Final Fours, 2nd Most NCAAT appearances)
3. UCLA (1st in championships, T-2 in Final Fours, 4th in NCAAT appearances)
4. Duke (T-4 in championships, 4th in Final Fours, 5th in NCAAT appearances)
5. Kansas (T-7 in championships, 5th in Final Fours, 3rd in NCAAT appearances)

Tier 2
6. Indiana (T-4 in championships, T-8 in Final Fours, 7th in NCAAT appearances)
7. Louisville (T-9 in championships, T-8 in Final Fours, 7th in NCAAT appearances)
8. Villanova (T-7 in championships, T-15 in Final Fours, 9th in NCAAT appearances)
9. UConn (6th in championships, T-15 in Final Fours, T-17 in NCAAT appearances)
10. Michigan St. (T-9 in championships, 7th in Final Fours, T-12 in NCAAT appearances)

After that I see a 3rd tier consisting of Arizona, Michigan, Syracuse, NCST, Cincinnati, Georgetown, Oklahoma St, Arkansas, Ohio St, Marquette (Not necessarily in that order). Everyone in that group has a title (post 1940), 3+ Final Fours, 25+ NCAAT appearances. The only other school that checks all of those boxes and hasn't already been listed is Utah and given that title came in 1946 and that 20 is a more rounded than 21, I have no problem excluding them from tier 3.