(01-30-2020 02:11 PM)DogTracks Wrote:  

(01-30-2020 01:18 PM)The Grinch Wrote:  

(01-30-2020 12:33 PM)randyfensfanclub1 Wrote:  Just tell me how you judge students with different curriculum? Is an A at Walter Payton the same as Thornton? Is the #10 student at Rantoul High = #10 at Whitney Young = #10 at Bloom = #10 at Loyola? Is math the same at all? Chemistry? Are they going to have a formula for curriculum to be reviewed or just grades? Or do we look at rankings, whether you were in band or one of 3 kids on the chess team?

It's a joke to let in whomever they want. Anyone who thought nepatism and connections were bad before this will be worse. Certain schools, program directors, teachers will be able to do even more. And NIUs academic rep is so great, they want to let MORE unqualified kids in. Might as well merge with Kishwaukee.

This to me is a panic to just increase enrollment. And of course, maybe some state and federal money.

The A at Thornton might be worth more than the A at Payton. The kid at Thornton might have earned that A while playing sport and raising his/her younger siblings while Mom works multiple jobs. Something a kid at a more "prestigious" doesn't have to contend with. The kid at Thornton may not have the resources the kid at Loyola has to prep for or be taught the test. That matters. It may force Universities to learn more about the students they admit which would potentially allow for admitting more qualified students. Not less.

Yep math is math. But maybe it takes you a minute to correctly finish the same equation that it took me three minutes to finish. However, I still correctly solved the equation. Am I unqualified because I work at a different pace than the ACT requires of me? College doesn't work like that though. I need to stay up all night to write a paper but you don't and we each get an A, it counts exactly the same.

What this likely does is allow more students from minority and poorer communities to be able to attend college. That's positive.

That's the thing- if you're a kid doing well at an under-resourced school, you're doing it despite larger forces slowing you down. A kid doing well resourced school doing well is doing it with the wind at their back.

The bottom line really is the article Stay Cool linked. The predictive value of the tests is *AT BEST* shaky, if not just plain not there. They do line up with social class status though- but NIU exists to provide access to opportunities.

About the only thing where I think tests have value is when you get someone (like me) who had middling grades and good scores- I was just underperforming for a variety of sadly normal teenage reasons.

Over a 1000 school have dropped test requirements. This isn't some ill-considered thing. The system was broken, it's up to the testing companies to re-design, improve, and show their value.

I believe SIU's policy is that the test scores must be provided if your GPA is below a certain number.