(01-10-2020 04:46 PM)mrbig Wrote:  

(01-10-2020 04:22 PM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  

(01-10-2020 03:51 PM)mrbig Wrote:  

(01-10-2020 02:07 PM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  The bottom line is that democrats view a steady stream of illegal immigrants as a steady supply of future democrat voters. That is all.

You write a lot of smart, well-supported things. Some of them I agree with and some I don't. I think this is not smart or well-supported. I rarely hear democrats talk about increasing immigration (even I wasn't talking about that, I was talking about shifting some of the illegal immigrants to legal so that the government has a better handle on them). I have even more rarely heard democrats discuss immigration as a way to create new voters. To the extent it exists, it is so far down the list of reasons why Democrats disagree with the Trump administration on immigration issues that it is barely a bump.

You're a democrat. You wouldn't agree.
But take a look at everything democrats support in this area, and tell me that you don't see a pattern. No wall, so more get through. Catch and release, so we lose control. Sanctuary cities, so they have a place to go. Get rid of ICE, so there is no follow-up enforcement. Make them citizens ASAP. And give the vote too illegals. It's a very clear plan.

Its pretty easy to explain. Most Democrats don't support the things you ascribe to us, or at least in the way you try to ascribe them.
No wall ... because a wall wouldn't be very effective and is much more expensive than other methods that work better.
Catch and release, so we lose control ... can't find a BBC article to make us all happy, but here's a PolitiFact article noting that 23% to 28% skip hearings but the precentage that skip is much lower amongst asylum seekers (and most of the current immigration problem involves non-Mexican asylum seekers). So my point is that this policy, even if it is supported by Democrats (which is hardly an accurate characterization of the whole party) does not lead to a loss of control.
Get rid of ICE ... the Democrats supporting this do not argue that there should not be law enforcement agents at the border, just that ICE shouldn't be that agency and that it needs to be restructured.
Make them citizens ASAP ... who says this? Do you have any citations at all? Sounds like a fever dream brought on by a conservative red herring.
And give the vote too illegals ... who says this? Do you have any citations at all? Sounds like a fever dream brought on by a conservative red herring.

Wall. I've said there are more effective measures, and I would have traded the wall for other, more effective ways. So I disagree with both Trump and democrats on that issue.

As far as your other comments, what cave have you been hiding in?

Catch and release--23% to 28% is way too high for my taste, and if the rate among asylum seekers is lower, that obviously means the rate among the rest is higher. Math kinda works that way.
Get rid of ICE. You explanation may be what you believe, but that is not how it is being presented on the street.
Make them citizens ASAP. Hey I don't believe in making them citizens at all unless they came legally, or do a hitch in the military. But there are certainly those pushing to make them citizens.
Give vote to illegals. They're not talking about it, they're doing it. I just read an article about some place that was doing it today.

Despite your quibbles, you and I both know that democrats are pushing to get them into the country, get them on welfare, and get them the vote (as citizens or otherwise). That is totally consistent with my comment.

You can say whatever you want, but I'm not buying it.