(05-16-2019 06:12 AM)RiceLad15 Wrote:  

(05-15-2019 05:35 PM)georgewebb Wrote:  

(05-15-2019 03:08 PM)RiceLad15 Wrote:  I do think there is a difference between saying "I support X because they're Y" and saying "I think people are underestimating X because they're Y." So I definitely don't see Gillebrand and one who is currently playing identity politics, but rather commenting on its existence.

The most common formulation seems to be "If you don't support X, it's because he/she is Y, and therefore you are Y-ist" -- which is identity politics in condescending and divisive form.

Well, based on comments from Owl#s and OO, it seems that both have experience suggesting that this formulation does exist. So if we admit that people do act against others because they are Y, how do we go about talking about that and combatting it? Or do we not for fear that someone might feel that someone is being condescending to them?
It seems to be a rather difficult issue, rife with problems, that doesn’t lend itself to generating any productive conversations.

Exactly what formulation am I suggesting does exist?

With respect to Tanq's formulation, note specifically that he is not admitting that people do act that way because they are Y-ist, but rather stating that it is alleged any time one expresses any disagreement with X (and often alleged with absolutely zero support).

For example, if I argued against Obamacare (which I think is horrid), the counter I would receive is, "It's a republican idea (it's not, and I'm not a republican), you're just opposed because a black man proposed it." No, I'm opposed because it is a terrible idea that retains the worst part of our old system (tying health insurance to employment, which is a democrat idea) combining it with the worst of single-payer/single-provider systems (replacing the doctor-patient relationship with centralized, bureaucratic decision-making), and I have suggested a viable alternative (Bismarck, the approach used by what are generally regarded as the best health care systems in the world).