(10-31-2018 04:23 PM)RiceLad15 Wrote:  

(10-31-2018 03:40 PM)tanqtonic Wrote:  

(10-31-2018 02:34 PM)RiceLad15 Wrote:  

(10-31-2018 02:21 PM)OptimisticOwl Wrote:  

(10-31-2018 02:19 PM)RiceLad15 Wrote:  Who is advocating that abuse? Who is saying that people should lie on their asylum application in order to gain entry to the US?

Anybody who wants them to successfully enter the US.

Head in the sand.

We know there are activists with the caravan.

A few things to unpack here.

First, how do we know there are activists in the caravan? I'll admit I have not read much about the caravan so I really have no idea how we know what sort of support structure there is.

Second, anyone who wants these migrants to successfully enter the US does not necessarily mean they want these migrants to abuse the current asylum system. They could believe that we should expand the asylum process. They could believe that we should increase our non-asylum legal immigration process in a way that allows them to enter legally, and so on. I haven't seen express advocacy the abuse of the current system, but again, like I said, I'm not super well versed on the caravan thing.

It sounds like you could provide me a lot of relevant articles/reports that support your claims though. Could you send them my way?

Lad.... seriously think of doing some CASA work or something. I find it interesting that the loudest voices in stating that the system isnt being gamed are the people with zero real world experience in it.

To your second point: if you go down and volunteer you will actually meet people who state just that. It happened with other policies 20 years ago. When DACA came down the pike and Flores was decided, you saw a several hundred percent increase in kids being carted along. I guess that was just 'chance', right?

You go to any left-wing based 'immigrant' group, the current buzzword is 'claim amnesty, --- just like the DACA surge 7 years ago. There are hundreds of groups both in the United States and elsewhere that are wholly committed to loosening of our borders in every aspect.

Less than 5 weeks ago at a pro-bono clinic, one of the lobby speakers was fing coaching the assembled people to get word back to the audience home and 'schooling' (literally) the audience on *how* precisely to answer the questions after the claim of asylum.

I mean, good god, what sort of bubble do you live in?

The caravan is just the end result of all this. And the Flores decision. And the decision that illini posted.

I'm not suggesting that people aren't trying to game the system - if you think I have, I'd like you to point out that post.

What I'm trying to understand is if those attempts are actually successful. If the normal year results in around 50% of all affirmative cases are rejected, I would imagine that a number of those are from people who are trying to game the system. It would be very informative to know how many of those who are trying to game the system get through - it sounds like it would be on the order of 100s, based on the statistics I presented earlier.

Your second point doesn't touch on what OO originally stated - what politicians are advocating for immigrants to abuse the system? I've seen them advocate for changing the system, but not lying to get through it. I should have been clearer that I was referring to politicians as OO said. I don't doubt that there are activists who don't care about the current law and are coaching people to work the system as you say. I just haven't seen politicians publicly say those things.

You ask what bubble I live in - I'm living in a bubble that is very skeptical of the claims that get y'all on the right riled up. I don't doubt that there are people gaming the system or attempting to help those do it (as I just stated). I'm just testing to see if the bubble y'all live in has thought through all of these talking points and figured out what the issues really are and what the magnitude of the issue really is.

For example, I didn't realize that we only approve asylum applications for less than 30,000 asylum seekers each year - that is approximately less than 0.01% of our population. Based on the uproar over asylum seekers on the southern border, I had assumed the acceptance rate/percent was much, much higher.

The uproar isnt over the 'number of approved asylum seekers'. You utterly miss the point.

The point is that the 'scoop' is that *once* you get caught, insto presto you guarantee a stay in this country -- 90 per cent of the time. You do that you are practically guaranteed not to be put on the 6am bus to Oaxaca.

Odds are, the scoop says, that if caught you say the 'magic words'. No 6am bus. On top of that the big fight now is even holding illegal immigrants. So on top of the 'instant in', the authorities are now under immense pressure to release them. Essentially on recognizance.

Your statistic of 'only 30,000 granted' is an utterly meaningless statistic when you put your logic cap on. I dont care if the 'number granted' is 30 per cent, or 3 per cent, or .00003 per cent. Who cares. What does matter is that it disables the quich turnaround trip to Ensenada that used to be the norm, and puts out the ability to be part of the 'catch and release' that the progressives seem to want to make the norm.

It is a clear path and a clear way to game the system to both avoid the insta-deport express, *and* clears the way to actually being released on recognizance.

Your statistic about some small number actually granted has absolutely zero to do with the actual issue.