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Can Obama overcome his inept energy policy?
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HuskieFan84 Offline
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Post: #21
RE: Can Obama overcome his inept energy policy?
(02-21-2012 09:35 AM)ImMoreAwesomeThanYou Wrote:  
(02-20-2012 05:02 PM)BleedsHuskieRed Wrote:  
(02-20-2012 03:45 PM)THE NC Herd Fan Wrote:  
(02-20-2012 11:29 AM)aTxTIGER Wrote:  Wouldn't a sign of his energy policy be energy production that we actually control? Aren't your points more to do with his Foreign Policy?

Energy policy

No NEW offshore oil exploration since BP accident
No to the Keystone Pipeline
No New Coal fired electric plants
Closure of 32 coal fired plants

A proactive energy policy would counter the Foreign Policy problems.

US Energy policy should be

Drill Here Drill NOW
Yes to Keystone Pipeline
Clean Coal electric plants
No closure of existing electric plants until replacement capacity is on line.
Don't forget opening dozens of new nuke plants. That is key.

How many nuclear power plants have came online in the past 5 years?

None.. its been 30+ years since construction on a new reactor began, that's why this issue is a win for Obama. Its finally happening again, under his administration, even if you believe he had nothing to do with it, it'd be extremely easy to spin it that he did. This is why I said this issue of energy policy isn't as obvious a GOP win as some might think.
02-21-2012 02:02 PM
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I'mMoreAwesomeThanYou Offline
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Post: #22
RE: Can Obama overcome his inept energy policy?
(02-21-2012 02:02 PM)HuskieFan84 Wrote:  
(02-21-2012 09:35 AM)ImMoreAwesomeThanYou Wrote:  
(02-20-2012 05:02 PM)BleedsHuskieRed Wrote:  
(02-20-2012 03:45 PM)THE NC Herd Fan Wrote:  
(02-20-2012 11:29 AM)aTxTIGER Wrote:  Wouldn't a sign of his energy policy be energy production that we actually control? Aren't your points more to do with his Foreign Policy?

Energy policy

No NEW offshore oil exploration since BP accident
No to the Keystone Pipeline
No New Coal fired electric plants
Closure of 32 coal fired plants

A proactive energy policy would counter the Foreign Policy problems.

US Energy policy should be

Drill Here Drill NOW
Yes to Keystone Pipeline
Clean Coal electric plants
No closure of existing electric plants until replacement capacity is on line.
Don't forget opening dozens of new nuke plants. That is key.

How many nuclear power plants have came online in the past 5 years?

None.. its been 30+ years since construction on a new reactor began, that's why this issue is a win for Obama. Its finally happening again, under his administration, even if you believe he had nothing to do with it, it'd be extremely easy to spin it that he did. This is why I said this issue of energy policy isn't as obvious a GOP win as some might think.

I know. That was my point. Nothing Obama has done has led this nation toward energy independence.
02-21-2012 02:05 PM
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HuskieFan84 Offline
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Post: #23
RE: Can Obama overcome his inept energy policy?
What?

Obama promotes nuclear energy.. even coming out and saying he still does after what happened in Japan. For the first time in 3 decades ground has been broken on new plants under his administration. You seem to be missing the point. It had been 30 years, until Obama took office, ground has been broken under this administration's term.

You can certainly argue Obama shouldn't get credit for it if you want, but in a 30 second commercial, going to be damn easy for him to spin it that he did help.
(This post was last modified: 02-21-2012 02:11 PM by HuskieFan84.)
02-21-2012 02:09 PM
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RobertN Offline
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Post: #24
RE: Can Obama overcome his inept energy policy?
(02-21-2012 02:05 PM)ImMoreAwesomeThanYou Wrote:  
(02-21-2012 02:02 PM)HuskieFan84 Wrote:  
(02-21-2012 09:35 AM)ImMoreAwesomeThanYou Wrote:  
(02-20-2012 05:02 PM)BleedsHuskieRed Wrote:  
(02-20-2012 03:45 PM)THE NC Herd Fan Wrote:  Energy policy

No NEW offshore oil exploration since BP accident
No to the Keystone Pipeline
No New Coal fired electric plants
Closure of 32 coal fired plants

A proactive energy policy would counter the Foreign Policy problems.

US Energy policy should be

Drill Here Drill NOW
Yes to Keystone Pipeline
Clean Coal electric plants
No closure of existing electric plants until replacement capacity is on line.
Don't forget opening dozens of new nuke plants. That is key.

How many nuclear power plants have came online in the past 5 years?

None.. its been 30+ years since construction on a new reactor began, that's why this issue is a win for Obama. Its finally happening again, under his administration, even if you believe he had nothing to do with it, it'd be extremely easy to spin it that he did. This is why I said this issue of energy policy isn't as obvious a GOP win as some might think.

I know. That was my point. Nothing Obama has done has led this nation toward energy independence.
So Obama had nothing to do with getting the government loan to the company in Georgia building the reactor?
02-21-2012 02:10 PM
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Paul M Offline
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Post: #25
RE: Can Obama overcome his inept energy policy?
So the left is against nuclear... till they can take credit for it?
02-21-2012 08:04 PM
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HuskieFan84 Offline
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Post: #26
RE: Can Obama overcome his inept energy policy?
(02-21-2012 08:04 PM)Paul M Wrote:  So the left is against nuclear... till they can take credit for it?


Obama has always been for it. Again, I'm really not sure if you guys are just uninformed, or what.. but this is not a good issue for the GOP to go after, Obama just isn't going to come out of it badly. The GOP has had plenty of chances over the last 30 years to make a move, and it didn't happen until Obama, a lefty, socialist, kenyan, muslim, communist who happens to also be pro-nuclear power was in office.

And where'd you go IMATY? Realized how blatantly wrong you were? That's gotta be a bit embarrassing, perhaps you'll read the full post before highlighting the first line of it next time.

From the Wall Street Journal.. run by Murdoch.. not exactly an Obama defender.

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424...00488.html
(This post was last modified: 02-21-2012 08:13 PM by HuskieFan84.)
02-21-2012 08:11 PM
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Paul M Offline
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Post: #27
RE: Can Obama overcome his inept energy policy?
I didn't say Obama.
02-21-2012 08:12 PM
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HuskieFan84 Offline
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Post: #28
RE: Can Obama overcome his inept energy policy?
(02-21-2012 08:12 PM)Paul M Wrote:  I didn't say Obama.

Well the discussion revolves around Obama. The thread is about Obama, the comments made by me and IMATY were about Obama. My comment was about how Obama would be able to spin it in his favor / take credit. So it would have seemed to make sense that you were referring to Obama.

That being said, it's not like there wasn't a Democratic Congress around at the time they set money aside for the loans in 2009-10. So even if you didn't mean to include Obama in the discussion, you still seem to miss the mark with your comment.
02-21-2012 08:33 PM
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Smaug Offline
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Post: #29
RE: Can Obama overcome his inept energy policy?
Interesting that the White House said today that there's not much the president can do about the price of gas.

Hmmm...the narrative 4 years ago was that Bush pretty much single-handedly ramped it up.

Second, I guess he meant besides, ANWR. the gulf and the Keystone pipeline.
02-21-2012 08:37 PM
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WoodlandsOwl Offline
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Post: #30
RE: Can Obama overcome his inept energy policy?
One thing Obama refuses to consider: Tax incentives for hydrogenation of natural gas with the end product being methanol. You mix the methanol with ethanol from corn or sugar cane and you have a perfect fuel for "Flex Fuel" vehicles.
02-21-2012 09:03 PM
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WoodlandsOwl Offline
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Post: #31
RE: Can Obama overcome his inept energy policy?
(02-21-2012 08:37 PM)Smaug Wrote:  Interesting that the White House said today that there's not much the president can do about the price of gas.

Hmmm...the narrative 4 years ago was that Bush pretty much single-handedly ramped it up.

Second, I guess he meant besides, ANWR. the gulf and the Keystone pipeline.

If Obama threatens to sick the CFTC and his "Pit Bull" Eric Holder on "oil speculators" I bet you would see the rate of crude price increase slow significantly.
02-21-2012 09:07 PM
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Owl 69/70/75 Offline
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Post: #32
RE: Can Obama overcome his inept energy policy?
I think the really interesting thing is that they are crowing over the increase in domestic production, and acting as if it's Obama's doing.

Two things:
1. Remember back in 2008, when democrats were criticizing "drill baby drill" by saying it wouldn't have any effect for 10 years? Well, if that's true, then whatever is going on today must obviously be the result of what happened 10 years ago, and that wasn't Obama. Of course, it's actually a lie, as I pointed out then. Even the Department of Energy report that supposedly said 10 years didn't; it actually said 5 years if you read the report. Of course, that's exactly what the industry has said all along. So if that's right, we are looking at the results of decisions made 5 years ago. Who was president then? Not Obama.

2. If Obama wants to take credit, then Obama needs to point out what specifically he did to deserve credit. What did he do to help the energy sector produce more domestically? Answer is simple: He didn't. If you disagree, then please explain what he has done. And don't say green energy, because the green energy we are promoting--solar, wind, electric cars--have virtually no effect on oil.

Two other points in passing:
a. Funny how democrats have been opposing more drilling, but now that production is up they want to claim credit. A bit dishonest.
b. I have replicated the process used to prepare the graphs showing how we are producing more than 50% domestically, starting from raw data and getting to the reported results. You can do it, but you have to go through a few mental gymnastics and do some fairly strange classification of certain activity to get there. For example, there's something called "refinery gains" that amounts to about a million barrels a day. What happens is that crude oil is not a specific compound, but rather a bunch of different things--gasoline, diesel, fuel oil, etc.--all flowing together in one stream; different types of crude have different amounts of the various components. The refining process is not a chemical process but rather a physical process of separating the various component products into separate streams. When you do that, the total volume of all the components once separated exceeds the volume when they were all flowing together in one stream. That is "refinery gain" and the statistics being reported count that as domestic "production."
(This post was last modified: 02-21-2012 10:18 PM by Owl 69/70/75.)
02-21-2012 10:18 PM
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smn1256 Offline
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Post: #33
RE: Can Obama overcome his inept energy policy?
Guys, you're still forgetting Obama wants high energy prices.
02-21-2012 10:31 PM
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Owl 69/70/75 Offline
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Post: #34
RE: Can Obama overcome his inept energy policy?
(02-21-2012 09:07 PM)WMD Owl Wrote:  
(02-21-2012 08:37 PM)Smaug Wrote:  Interesting that the White House said today that there's not much the president can do about the price of gas.
Hmmm...the narrative 4 years ago was that Bush pretty much single-handedly ramped it up.
Second, I guess he meant besides, ANWR. the gulf and the Keystone pipeline.
If Obama threatens to sick the CFTC and his "Pit Bull" Eric Holder on "oil speculators" I bet you would see the rate of crude price increase slow significantly.

I'll bet what you see is all the crude oil trading moving offshore, where the long arm of Eric Holder can't get to them. The Dubai Energy Exchange?

What people don't understand is how speculation affects prices. It drives them up when they are low and down when they are high. Which ought to be what we want.

Let's say I can buy oil and store it on a tanker at anchor in the approaches to Singapore (where there are a whole lot of tankers at anchor doing precisely this) for $1 per barrel per month. Let's say I believe the price of a barrel of crude will be $160/bbl in February 2017. That's 60 months, or $60 in storage charges, from now. So I'll buy oil at something close to $100 today. If I'm on the market buying oil now, that drives the price up somewhat. If I'm right about the 2017 price, I come out okay. But what I'm really hoping for is a spike between now and then. If that happens, I sell what's on the tanker. That drives the price down and attenuates the price spike.
02-21-2012 10:42 PM
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Owl 69/70/75 Offline
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Post: #35
RE: Can Obama overcome his inept energy policy?
(02-21-2012 09:03 PM)WMD Owl Wrote:  One thing Obama refuses to consider: Tax incentives for hydrogenation of natural gas with the end product being methanol. You mix the methanol with ethanol from corn or sugar cane and you have a perfect fuel for "Flex Fuel" vehicles.

Three are any number of things that can be done. Unfortunately, we aren't doing any of them.
02-21-2012 10:43 PM
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THE NC Herd Fan Offline
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Post: #36
RE: Can Obama overcome his inept energy policy?
Interesting article about Obama's inept energy policy.

Quote:Why aren't Democrats making the case that the spike in prices is a good thing? Isn't this basically our energy policy these days? How we "win the future"? If high energy prices were to damage President Barack Obama's re-election prospects, it would be ironic, considering the left has been telling us to set aside our "dependency" -- or, as our most recent Republican president put it, "addiction" -- for a long time.


Obama is a hypocrite plain and simple he got what he wanted and he won't admit it to voters.

Quote:In 2008, Steven Chu, Obama's (and, sadly, our own) future secretary of energy lamented, "Somehow we have to figure out how to boost the price of gasoline to the levels in Europe." The president, when asked whether he thought $4-a-gallon gas prices were good for the American economy, said, "I think that I would have preferred a gradual adjustment."

How gradual? Like, what, four years? Or is it eight?

So why does Obama feel the need to make excuses for the price he wanted.

Aren't high gas prices what democrats want?
02-22-2012 06:34 PM
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I'mMoreAwesomeThanYou Offline
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Post: #37
RE: Can Obama overcome his inept energy policy?
(02-21-2012 08:11 PM)HuskieFan84 Wrote:  
(02-21-2012 08:04 PM)Paul M Wrote:  So the left is against nuclear... till they can take credit for it?


Obama has always been for it. Again, I'm really not sure if you guys are just uninformed, or what.. but this is not a good issue for the GOP to go after, Obama just isn't going to come out of it badly. The GOP has had plenty of chances over the last 30 years to make a move, and it didn't happen until Obama, a lefty, socialist, kenyan, muslim, communist who happens to also be pro-nuclear power was in office.

And where'd you go IMATY? Realized how blatantly wrong you were? That's gotta be a bit embarrassing, perhaps you'll read the full post before highlighting the first line of it next time.

From the Wall Street Journal.. run by Murdoch.. not exactly an Obama defender.

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424...00488.html

LOL...I just read this. I didn't go anywhere. I'm not embarrassed because Obama has done more to deny this country energy independence than any president in US history. His administration is involved in ONE loan for a nuclear plant and you think that qualifies as a success. Too funny.
02-22-2012 07:08 PM
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THE NC Herd Fan Offline
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Post: #38
RE: Can Obama overcome his inept energy policy?
Quote:“Somehow,” Chu said, “we have to figure out how to boost the price of gasoline to the levels in Europe.”

While this position may be slightly unfair to the President (Mr. Chu was not yet in the Administration at the time he made the remarks, so any link between it and administration policy is tenuous), the quote devastatingly reveals just how tone-deaf and myopic white-collar, progressive intellectualism can be. The delusion that jacking up energy prices is part of a “good government” agenda is one of the pieces of insanity that keeps the blue intelligentsia from consolidating its position as a natural governing class.

Oxymoron... "Progressive Intellectualism" 05-stirthepot

Rising gas prices all part of Obama's plan
02-23-2012 08:47 PM
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boss man Offline
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Post: #39
RE: Can Obama overcome his inept energy policy?
Of course COTUS wants those gas prices to escalate; higher and quicker. He just can't openly say that in this re-election year. But I am sure he is chestbumping Chu as well as his Sierra Club activist buddies behind closed doors.

Meanwhile, his Predator-faced skank wife takes yet another vacation to Colorado on the taxpayer dime. I wonder what the carbon footprint is for her jetting out west?
02-25-2012 12:18 AM
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WoodlandsOwl Offline
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Post: #40
RE: Can Obama overcome his inept energy policy?
(02-25-2012 12:18 AM)boss man Wrote:  Of course COTUS wants those gas prices to escalate; higher and quicker. He just can't openly say that in this re-election year. But I am sure he is chestbumping Chu as well as his Sierra Club activist buddies behind closed doors.

Meanwhile, his Predator-faced skank wife takes yet another vacation to Colorado on the taxpayer dime. I wonder what the carbon footprint is for her jetting out west?

The US Economy historically has stalled as soon as Gasoline hits $3.75 a gallon. Its there today.

Lets watch 1Q 2012 Economic Growth hit about .5% and if fuel prices keep going up, 2Q will be negative. This Dimwit keeps talking about Algae and Biofuels to placate his tree hugger friends.

You could temporarily suspend the EPA Fuel Blend requirements and just go to one Blend nationwide and that would knock off 20 cents a gallon.
02-25-2012 09:16 AM
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