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Pac-12: Is the Pac-12 through expanding?
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superdeluxe Offline
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Pac-12: Is the Pac-12 through expanding?
Somehow I missed these expansion/tv network articles:

http://www.cbssports.com/mcc/blogs/entry...2/29941030

Quote:WALNUT CREEK, Calif. -- The architect of the latest round of conference realignment says the earthshaking hasn't stopped.

Pac-12 commissioner Larry Scott told CBSSports.com that there could be more conference movement before 2020. Scott was named No. 1 Friday in CBSSports.com's college football top 100 for 2011.

"I don't see anything major on the horizon -- short term, a few years," Scott said. "I'd be surprised if in the second half of this decade, we don't see another major round."What, he was asked, would set it off?

"It could be TV deals," he said. "It could be other politics and dynamics within the NCAA. If I had to guess I would say it would be economic. That's why I believed it made sense [to expand] and continues to make sense."

Also suggests that ESPN/FOX conspired to stop the Pac-16 deal:

Quote:"They [ESPN, Fox] conspired, of course they did," to save the Big 12, Bevilacqua said. "That's a fact."

Again, with Fox/ESPN now partners in the pac-12, Not sure how much they would fight it in the future if there is another round.



Scott has asserted this thought/opinion consistantly, this is not internet message boarders/bloggers.

Article on Pac-12 Network:

http://www.cbssports.com/collegefootball...r-audience

Quote: There's no question the Pac-12 could eventually be on in millions of homes in China, Japan and other countries, and one league official confirmed that Scott has already made inquiries about having the channel distributed overseas shortly after launch.

Global network? Sold!

http://www.cbssports.com/collegefootball...c12-roost#

Larry Scott is the #1 most powerful person in CBS sports top 100:

Quote:Even with the same membership numbers as the SEC, Big 12, Big Ten and ACC, the Pac-12 might be looked back on the first real superconference. Scott calls it the league's "ubiquitous-ness." The head of Pixar, located in nearby Oakland, is a Utah grad. Scott is trying to arrange a meeting with George Lucas, a Southern California grad who might have some influence over an equally famous peer.

"Imagine the opening graphic packages of the Pac-12 Network being designed by ..."

Dramatic pause.

" ... Steven Spielberg is a [USC] trustee."
06-14-2011 10:47 AM
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CatsClaw Offline
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Post: #2
RE: Pac-12: Is the Pac-12 through expanding?
ESPN and FOX would still fight it so the Pac-12 should just let it go at this point.
06-14-2011 10:53 AM
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superdeluxe Offline
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RE: Pac-12: Is the Pac-12 through expanding?
(06-14-2011 10:53 AM)CatsClaw Wrote:  ESPN and FOX would still fight it so the Pac-12 should just let it go at this point.

ok, You should let Larry Scott know

:ncaabbs:
(This post was last modified: 06-14-2011 10:58 AM by superdeluxe.)
06-14-2011 10:57 AM
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miko33 Offline
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RE: Pac-12: Is the Pac-12 through expanding?
Surprisingly, the idea of superconferences just won't go away. I still believe that they will become a reality in the not too distant future. The question will become will independents still be around in the not too distant future. I don't believe they will.
06-14-2011 11:05 AM
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1845 Bear Offline
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RE: Pac-12: Is the Pac-12 through expanding?
Everything depends on 3 schools and what keeps them where they are:

Texas
Texas A&M
Notre Dame


If UT won't split from A&M or Tech or OU (and by extension OSU) then no marginal amount of P16 money will pull them away as they would have to ditch one to fit and they value those ties higher. As long as the Big 12 can continue to be in the financial ballpark they will likely stay. Their concern in 2010 was that a Big 12 without CU + NU/MU would not command what it has now. In a sense they underestimated their own value and envisioned a SWC-2 where low exposure + low money = bad recruits & losing. That isn't the case now.
(This post was last modified: 06-14-2011 11:08 AM by 1845 Bear.)
06-14-2011 11:06 AM
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10thMountain Offline
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RE: Pac-12: Is the Pac-12 through expanding?
And normally it wouldn't. The TV execs are over paying the B12 conference not because it is a superior product without CU/NU, but to keep it around (as well as giving Texas their own 15 mil/yr bribe to stay put) so that Fox/ESPN isn't shut out of college sports west of the Mississippi.
06-14-2011 12:02 PM
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ohio1317 Offline
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RE: Pac-12: Is the Pac-12 through expanding?
(06-14-2011 12:02 PM)10thMountain Wrote:  And normally it wouldn't. The TV execs are over paying the B12 conference not because it is a superior product without CU/NU, but to keep it around (as well as giving Texas their own 15 mil/yr bribe to stay put) so that Fox/ESPN isn't shut out of college sports west of the Mississippi.

I disagree about them overpaying the Big 12. It still has Texas and Oklahoma football. That's a 1/5 of your schools who are huge national names in football. Beyond that, it has Missouri which still commands a respectable market and Texas A&M. In basketball, Kansas still delivers a lot (although basketball is small photos in the grand scene of realignment). On a school by school basis, the conference is still worth a lot and if any conference was over-payed for, I'd argue it was the PAC-10/12.
06-14-2011 12:22 PM
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Wedge Offline
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RE: Pac-12: Is the Pac-12 through expanding?
(06-14-2011 12:02 PM)10thMountain Wrote:  And normally it wouldn't. The TV execs are over paying the B12 conference not because it is a superior product without CU/NU, but to keep it around (as well as giving Texas their own 15 mil/yr bribe to stay put) so that Fox/ESPN isn't shut out of college sports west of the Mississippi.

One of the reasons that Larry Scott & Co. were so smart to encourage the Fox/ESPN partnership is that now the Pac-16 (or 18, or 20) can form and Fox and ESPN won't be locked out of it, because they're both on board with the Pac for 12 years.

(06-14-2011 11:06 AM)Sammy11 Wrote:  Everything depends on 3 schools and what keeps them where they are:

Texas
Texas A&M
Notre Dame

If UT won't split from A&M or Tech or OU (and by extension OSU) then no marginal amount of P16 money will pull them away as they would have to ditch one to fit

That's not a significant obstacle. If the Horns and Ags get together and both want to join the Pac, then there will be so much freaking money in the Pac-____ deal that the Pac could go to 16, 18, or even 20 teams if necessary to make it work.

There are easy football division splits for any of those configurations -- in a 16-team league, one division is the Pac-8 and the rest is everyone else; for 18 teams, one division is the Pac-8 plus Utah; for 20 teams, one division is the Pac-10.
06-14-2011 12:27 PM
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superdeluxe Offline
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RE: Pac-12: Is the Pac-12 through expanding?
(06-14-2011 12:27 PM)Wedge Wrote:  That's not a significant obstacle. If the Horns and Ags get together and both want to join the Pac, then there will be so much freaking money in the Pac-____ deal that the Pac could go to 16, 18, or even 20 teams if necessary to make it work.

There are easy football division splits for any of those configurations -- in a 16-team league, one division is the Pac-8 and the rest is everyone else; for 18 teams, one division is the Pac-8 plus Utah; for 20 teams, one division is the Pac-10.

True, but at the 2 divisions of 10 idea, basically that would almost be just like 2 conferences under one umbrella. Where as Pac-16, you would still have 2 cross divisional games per year, you would see a team once every four years..going to 2 10 team divisions...you would see a team once every 10 years.
06-14-2011 01:14 PM
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apex_pirate Offline
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RE: Pac-12: Is the Pac-12 through expanding?
(06-14-2011 01:14 PM)superdeluxe Wrote:  
(06-14-2011 12:27 PM)Wedge Wrote:  That's not a significant obstacle. If the Horns and Ags get together and both want to join the Pac, then there will be so much freaking money in the Pac-____ deal that the Pac could go to 16, 18, or even 20 teams if necessary to make it work.

There are easy football division splits for any of those configurations -- in a 16-team league, one division is the Pac-8 and the rest is everyone else; for 18 teams, one division is the Pac-8 plus Utah; for 20 teams, one division is the Pac-10.

True, but at the 2 divisions of 10 idea, basically that would almost be just like 2 conferences under one umbrella. Where as Pac-16, you would still have 2 cross divisional games per year, you would see a team once every four years..going to 2 10 team divisions...you would see a team once every 10 years.

If the $$$ are there then it will happen. If not...

It doesn't appear the PAC-12 is scared to try things. We shall see if that happens late in the decade.
06-14-2011 01:33 PM
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Wedge Offline
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RE: Pac-12: Is the Pac-12 through expanding?
(06-14-2011 01:14 PM)superdeluxe Wrote:  
(06-14-2011 12:27 PM)Wedge Wrote:  That's not a significant obstacle. If the Horns and Ags get together and both want to join the Pac, then there will be so much freaking money in the Pac-____ deal that the Pac could go to 16, 18, or even 20 teams if necessary to make it work.

There are easy football division splits for any of those configurations -- in a 16-team league, one division is the Pac-8 and the rest is everyone else; for 18 teams, one division is the Pac-8 plus Utah; for 20 teams, one division is the Pac-10.

True, but at the 2 divisions of 10 idea, basically that would almost be just like 2 conferences under one umbrella. Where as Pac-16, you would still have 2 cross divisional games per year, you would see a team once every four years..going to 2 10 team divisions...you would see a team once every 10 years.

True, it wouldn't leave much room, or any room, for the cross-division matchups that would be interesting to fans.

But, money talks. If the money is there, they will do it even if it's not what old-school fans want. If they did things based only on what fans like me want to watch, we'd still be watching the Pac-8, the Big 8, and the SWC, but they're all gone now.
06-14-2011 01:44 PM
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templefootballfan Offline
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Post: #12
RE: Pac-12: Is the Pac-12 through expanding?
Tex
ND
TexA&M
NYC
have enough to start super conf
06-14-2011 03:54 PM
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superdeluxe Offline
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RE: Pac-12: Is the Pac-12 through expanding?
NYC?
06-14-2011 04:05 PM
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Cardsshark Offline
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RE: Pac-12: Is the Pac-12 through expanding?
I believe eventually UT, Oklahoma, OSU, and Texas A&M end up in the PAC. If A&M won't do it, it will be Texas Tech.

It is really the only way Texas will be able to increase their income. Right now they appear to be happy with what they have, but as soon as PAC-12 schools start to get close on revenue they will be itching to move. Utah, Colorado, Texas, Oklahoma, Texas A&M/Tech, Oklahoma State, Arizona, and Arizona State would be a VERY lucrative West Division for the PAC.
06-14-2011 05:13 PM
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hawghiggs Offline
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RE: Pac-12: Is the Pac-12 through expanding?
When the SEC contract allows for it to ask for more money again. Everything will start up once again. The real problem will be with the ACC and the Big 12,neither conference could command more money.
06-14-2011 05:32 PM
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SF Husky Offline
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RE: Pac-12: Is the Pac-12 through expanding?
(06-14-2011 05:32 PM)hawghiggs Wrote:  When the SEC contract allows for it to ask for more money again. Everything will start up once again. The real problem will be with the ACC and the Big 12,neither conference could command more money.

When the SEC get more money, it will only help drive up cost for TV rights for all other conferences as well. We all just have to wait to see how much the actual market can absorb at that time.
06-14-2011 06:05 PM
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1845 Bear Offline
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RE: Pac-12: Is the Pac-12 through expanding?
(06-14-2011 05:32 PM)hawghiggs Wrote:  When the SEC contract allows for it to ask for more money again. Everything will start up once again. The real problem will be with the ACC and the Big 12,neither conference could command more money.

That also requires the SEC to be expansion-friendly. If they can't get OU (who is 100% with UT) they have no good partner for A&M that is a slam dunk. VT can't leave and the rest of the ACC who might come are iffy adds.
06-14-2011 06:18 PM
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bluesox Offline
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RE: Pac-12: Is the Pac-12 through expanding?
If texas and usc got together to max out the $, than maybe you get:


Big 16
E
Texas
Texas A&M
Texas Tech
Oklahoma
Ok state
Kansas
Colorado
Utah

W
Arizona
Ariz state
USC
Ucla
Cal
stanford
Oregon
Washington
06-14-2011 06:21 PM
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A Far Away Frog Offline
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RE: Pac-12: Is the Pac-12 through expanding?
Quote: There's no question the Pac-12 could eventually be on in millions of homes in China, Japan and other countries, and one league official confirmed that Scott has already made inquiries about having the channel distributed overseas shortly after launch.

Let me get this straight: the Japanese, the Chinese, and other East Asians are going to be paying to watch Pac-12(16) football, basketball, baseball, and so on. I call BS on this one. The NBA might have a decent market penetration there in terms of getting large number of people to watch their games, but I highly doubt the NFL does. My experience (as a foreigner) has been that most of the folks abroad don't know squat about any college sports, and couldn't care less about it anyways. The possible exception being the NCAA basketball championship game...and that's a maybe.
06-14-2011 06:53 PM
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RE: Pac-12: Is the Pac-12 through expanding?
(06-14-2011 05:13 PM)Cardsshark Wrote:  I believe eventually UT, Oklahoma, OSU, and Texas A&M end up in the PAC. If A&M won't do it, it will be Texas Tech.

It is really the only way Texas will be able to increase their income. Right now they appear to be happy with what they have, but as soon as PAC-12 schools start to get close on revenue they will be itching to move. Utah, Colorado, Texas, Oklahoma, Texas A&M/Tech, Oklahoma State, Arizona, and Arizona State would be a VERY lucrative West Division for the PAC.

With the latest contract, the Pac-12 schools have passed the Big 12-2 schools. They are hoping to catch up by the time the Tier 1 games are renegotiated, but by that time a moderately successful PTN could be up and running and then may still keep the Pac-12 ahead of them.

Cheers,
Neil
06-14-2011 06:55 PM
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