(10-23-2018 05:18 AM)RiceLad15 Wrote: (10-22-2018 04:12 PM)OptimisticOwl Wrote: (10-22-2018 02:19 PM)tanqtonic Wrote: (10-22-2018 01:36 PM)RiceLad15 Wrote: You bet I don't like that idiots vote, but I have no urge to restrict who can or cannot vote based on anything outside of age.
Hoping you didn't mean to leave off 'citizenship' on your list of restrictions ('anything outside of age') to vote.
What's magic about age? Why is 18 better than 21 or 55 or 12? There are lots of 10 year olds who have a better grasp of issues than a lot of 25 year olds.
Of course, the minimum age is a feeble attempt to restrict voting to those who understand the matters to be voted on - economics, foreign affairs, etc. But when it comes to restricting the franchise to those who actually do understand, there is this loud wailing, mostly from the left.
I don't think it goes far enough, but I see no reason why natural born citizens should not take the one time test to be able to vote that naturalized citizens take. Show not only a little knowledge, but also a little desire. What's it take, 30 minutes and a rudimentary knowledge of our government not automatically conveyed by birth?
And as I said before, citizenship is not a barrier to voting in certain California communities and other places.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Right_of_f...ted_States
What’s magic about age is it can’t be discriminated against. You’re either 18 and older, or not. And 18 is only magical because we, as a society, have said it is. It’s the age you’re legally an adult and can die for the country - along with drinking beer, I think you should also be able to vote if that’s the case.
That loud wailing from the left is because history has shown us that parties in power will often use whatever means necessary to disenfranchise certain peoples if possible. I know you’re older than me, so my guess is you still remember a time when such efforts (like poll taxes) were legal. I’m not sure how anyone could want to go back to a time when having a direct say in who governs is not afforded to all voting-age citizens.
I do think it would be great if every voter was informed on civics, I just don’t believe that it will result in anything else but voter disenfranchisement.
I remember a time when the magic number was 21, not only for voting but for drinking, owning property and marrying. Back when I was young and foolish, I too thought it wrong that people could die for their country but not drink or vote. I supported the move to the magic number of 18. I am not perfect. I make mistakes. That was one. But, yes, my vote was suppressed from age 18 to age 21. I missed a Presidential election because of that voter suppression.
I remember hearing about the poll tax, but never saw one. Maybe in another state. As I remember, it was $1.00. Doesn't matter, any longer. And no doubt it was an effort by the Democrats in those states to suppress the black vote.
I used to watch Jay Leno, and he had a feature called Jaywalking, where they would stop people on the street and ask them simple questions, like "How Many States are there" and "how long is a Senator's term", or show them pictures of top newsmakers like the VP or or Senate majority leader, and it was appalling some of the answers. Even more appalling was the occupations of some of the wrong answerers - teacher(!!!), attorney, accountant. One of my favorites was the lady who thought Alaska was an island, because that is the way it is shown on weather maps.
Are these really the people we want deciding our future?
People who cannot remember who the Senator from Manitoba is? They know "that bald headed wrestler guy" is one of the six or seven, but can't think of his name?
It bugs me that votes of people like you and me are offset by the votes of the ignorant mob.
It also bugs me that naturalized citizens are better prepared to cast an informed vote than a natural born one. Why? Is it because they studied a little while and took a short, easy test? Sure that helps, but mainly it is because they CARED ENOUGH ABOUT VOTING TO DO THAT. They put in a little time and effort to vote, and because they care enough to do that, they are more likely to stay abreast of issues. They take it seriously.
There is a reason the Founding Fathers put minimum ages in the Constitution for holding high office. 25,30, 35 may not seem high to us today, but back then, people of those ages had done a lot of living and could be relied upon to have a better judgement than youths of, say, 18. Or 21, or 16, Age and wisdom are associated.
Explain to me again why the age for voting or any other thing is 18, and not 12 or 14? Is it possible that immature people are easily swayed?
Here's what I propose. Minimum age of 18. At that time or any time thereafter, take a short civics/geography/history test. like the naturalized citizens must, to activate your franchise. One time, pass, and you never have to do it again.
Fail, you can try again. Who is going to NOT take that test? People who don't give a damn about our electoral process, that's who. People who think 30 minutes of their time is worth more being used in some other way, playing pool or hanging with their friends. That is the group whose rights you are so vigorously defending. Yay, slackers, we want your opinion on foreign policy.
We have a Supreme Court (quick, how many voters can tell you how many Justices there are) and they will defend the electorate from suppression, just as they did with the poll tax. Pass the law, and it will be adjudicated by the SC. It may be rejected. I still think it is a good idea.
I come here to discuss with other educated and knowledgeable people the issues of the day. If I wanted to discuss them with people who have no idea, I would go elsewhere. wouldn't you?
I think leftists fight this because they think the majority of the uncaring will come from their base. But there will be a lot of uncaring from the other side too.