(06-26-2021 10:47 PM)JRsec Wrote:  

(06-26-2021 10:05 PM)bill dazzle Wrote:  Let's all be very clear ...

Neither MissState nor Vanderbilt will be a "fully sufficient" champion.

And if the Commodores win it all ... I will still maintain this point.

Whoever wins will be champ and will have the trophy, rings, or whatever paraphernalia to prove it. The records will footnote an extremely worthy N.C. State Team, but I can assure you whoever wins it will have no difficulties claiming the title and hanging a banner or painting it on an outfield wall. Sometimes you have to get real Bill.

(06-26-2021 11:42 PM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(06-26-2021 10:47 PM)JRsec Wrote:  

(06-26-2021 10:05 PM)bill dazzle Wrote:  Let's all be very clear ...

Neither MissState nor Vanderbilt will be a "fully sufficient" champion.

And if the Commodores win it all ... I will still maintain this point.

Whoever wins will be champ and will have the trophy, rings, or whatever paraphernalia to prove it. The records will footnote an extremely worthy N.C. State Team, but I can assure you whoever wins it will have no difficulties claiming the title and hanging a banner or painting it on an outfield wall. Sometimes you have to get real Bill.

Yes, it might be different had NC State beaten Vanderbilt and advanced to the final before dropping out, but not now.

Whoever wins the finals series will be a fully-worthy CWS champion, no asterisks or whatever.

(06-27-2021 08:17 AM)dbackjon Wrote:  

(06-26-2021 10:05 PM)bill dazzle Wrote:  Let's all be very clear ...

Neither MissState nor Vanderbilt will be a "fully sufficient" champion.

And if the Commodores win it all ... I will still maintain this point.

Don’t be that guy. Don’t take away from the players.

Both Mississippi State and Vandy are outstanding teams. They both could win two games in a row against NC State without Covid


Don’t penalize or denigrate those two teams for the mistakes made by NC State

(06-27-2021 09:09 AM)bill dazzle Wrote:  

(06-26-2021 10:47 PM)JRsec Wrote:  

(06-26-2021 10:05 PM)bill dazzle Wrote:  Let's all be very clear ...

Neither MissState nor Vanderbilt will be a "fully sufficient" champion.

And if the Commodores win it all ... I will still maintain this point.

Whoever wins will be champ and will have the trophy, rings, or whatever paraphernalia to prove it. The records will footnote an extremely worthy N.C. State Team, but I can assure you whoever wins it will have no difficulties claiming the title and hanging a banner or painting it on an outfield wall. Sometimes you have to get real Bill.

I agree strongly, JRsec, that most folks will view either MSU or VU as national champion. I'm simply saying I will see either as "not fully" champion. I will give MissState a more "fully champion" view given it didn't get a "partially free pass" like Vandy did.

If Vanderbilt wins, I will be very excited and (as I did the previous two times) go to the campus to celebrate, buy a hat and/or T-shirt, get a commemorative sticker/pennant/photo etc. So maybe I'm being hypocritical. And perhaps I will change my mind on this.

But if Vandy wins, my gut feeling is that I will never consider the title as "whole."

(06-27-2021 09:38 AM)bullet Wrote:  And understand that NCSU was on a hot streak. They weren't even a seeded team. They were ranked 16th in the final college baseball poll, but not that high in NCAA seedings. MSU is a 7 seed and Vandy is a 4 seed. Maybe you should consider them not fully worthy because Tennessee was a 3 seed and Arkansas a 1 seed from the same conference! Texas was the top seed to make the CWS at #2 as Arkansas lost in the super regionals.

(06-26-2021 08:54 PM)OdinFrigg Wrote:  Hail State!

All SEC final.

(06-27-2021 08:17 AM)dbackjon Wrote:  Penalize and denigrate those two teams for the mistakes made by the NCAA. But above all else, abolish the NCAA.

(06-27-2021 10:12 AM)shere khan Wrote:  

(06-26-2021 08:54 PM)OdinFrigg Wrote:  Hail State!

All SEC final.

(06-26-2021 01:13 PM)shere khan Wrote:  Complete idiocy.

(06-27-2021 09:11 AM)bill dazzle Wrote:  

(06-26-2021 11:42 PM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(06-26-2021 10:47 PM)JRsec Wrote:  

(06-26-2021 10:05 PM)bill dazzle Wrote:  Let's all be very clear ...

Neither MissState nor Vanderbilt will be a "fully sufficient" champion.

And if the Commodores win it all ... I will still maintain this point.

Whoever wins will be champ and will have the trophy, rings, or whatever paraphernalia to prove it. The records will footnote an extremely worthy N.C. State Team, but I can assure you whoever wins it will have no difficulties claiming the title and hanging a banner or painting it on an outfield wall. Sometimes you have to get real Bill.

Yes, it might be different had NC State beaten Vanderbilt and advanced to the final before dropping out, but not now.

Whoever wins the finals series will be a fully-worthy CWS champion, no asterisks or whatever.

What about, in a crazy scenario, multiple MSU (or VU) players test virus positive and that club has to forfeit the series — thus yielding a "champion" that was not required to play any series finals games?

I would strongly struggle to consider that team fully worthy.

(06-27-2021 10:54 AM)CitrusUCF Wrote:  

(06-26-2021 01:13 PM)shere khan Wrote:  Complete idiocy.

So as I suspected, this turned out not to be true. Just a homer account trying to spin the story to make NC State look better. The reality is that their unvaccinated players tested positive, so then they tested everyone, as per protocol.

Bottom-line: If what the Barstool account had alleged were true, then NC State would have filed a lawsuit and sought an injunction to stop the NCAA from violating the agreed upon protocols. But those allegations were false, so NC State has taken no action nor even publicly protested the action, because the NCAA followed the rules that were set up.

(06-27-2021 11:54 AM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(06-27-2021 09:11 AM)bill dazzle Wrote:  

(06-26-2021 11:42 PM)quo vadis Wrote:  

(06-26-2021 10:47 PM)JRsec Wrote:  

(06-26-2021 10:05 PM)bill dazzle Wrote:  Let's all be very clear ...

Neither MissState nor Vanderbilt will be a "fully sufficient" champion.

And if the Commodores win it all ... I will still maintain this point.

Whoever wins will be champ and will have the trophy, rings, or whatever paraphernalia to prove it. The records will footnote an extremely worthy N.C. State Team, but I can assure you whoever wins it will have no difficulties claiming the title and hanging a banner or painting it on an outfield wall. Sometimes you have to get real Bill.

Yes, it might be different had NC State beaten Vanderbilt and advanced to the final before dropping out, but not now.

Whoever wins the finals series will be a fully-worthy CWS champion, no asterisks or whatever.

What about, in a crazy scenario, multiple MSU (or VU) players test virus positive and that club has to forfeit the series — thus yielding a "champion" that was not required to play any series finals games?

I would strongly struggle to consider that team fully worthy.

Yes, if either Vandy or MSU have to forfeit the title because of the virus in the next couple of days, that will merit an "asterisk" for the winner.

But not IMO based on what happened with NC State. We're getting a championship series, as of now at least.

(06-27-2021 09:34 AM)bullet Wrote:  

(06-27-2021 09:09 AM)bill dazzle Wrote:  

(06-26-2021 10:47 PM)JRsec Wrote:  

(06-26-2021 10:05 PM)bill dazzle Wrote:  Let's all be very clear ...

Neither MissState nor Vanderbilt will be a "fully sufficient" champion.

And if the Commodores win it all ... I will still maintain this point.

Whoever wins will be champ and will have the trophy, rings, or whatever paraphernalia to prove it. The records will footnote an extremely worthy N.C. State Team, but I can assure you whoever wins it will have no difficulties claiming the title and hanging a banner or painting it on an outfield wall. Sometimes you have to get real Bill.

I agree strongly, JRsec, that most folks will view either MSU or VU as national champion. I'm simply saying I will see either as "not fully" champion. I will give MissState a more "fully champion" view given it didn't get a "partially free pass" like Vandy did.

If Vanderbilt wins, I will be very excited and (as I did the previous two times) go to the campus to celebrate, buy a hat and/or T-shirt, get a commemorative sticker/pennant/photo etc. So maybe I'm being hypocritical. And perhaps I will change my mind on this.

But if Vandy wins, my gut feeling is that I will never consider the title as "whole."

Then root for MSU.

(06-27-2021 10:11 AM)JRsec Wrote:  

(06-27-2021 09:38 AM)bullet Wrote:  And understand that NCSU was on a hot streak. They weren't even a seeded team. They were ranked 16th in the final college baseball poll, but not that high in NCAA seedings. MSU is a 7 seed and Vandy is a 4 seed. Maybe you should consider them not fully worthy because Tennessee was a 3 seed and Arkansas a 1 seed from the same conference! Texas was the top seed to make the CWS at #2 as Arkansas lost in the super regionals.

All seedings in a year with little play outside of conference are BS. But Texas was beaten in the regular season by 4 SEC schools (Ole Miss, Miss St, A&M and Arkansas) and then defeated twice more by Miss St in the tourney. Perhaps the Horns were over seeded. Every baseball coach knows a streak is real and that having one at the right time is how you win championships. It's the nature of the game. This year's regionals were not balanced. I'd argue that Mississippi State had one of the toughest and Tennessee one of the weakest. Florida's streak came early in the season and they faded. Arkansas's game 1 blowout and a weak starting rotation past their #1 guy helped to do them in but mostly it was N.C. State's peaking at the right time.

A final between N.C. State and Mississippi State was shaping up to be epic. Both quietly had deep pens, both hit very well and both were peaking at the right time. Instead Vandy gets a do over in a way and that stinks.

(06-27-2021 12:16 PM)bill dazzle Wrote:  

(06-27-2021 10:11 AM)JRsec Wrote:  

(06-27-2021 09:38 AM)bullet Wrote:  And understand that NCSU was on a hot streak. They weren't even a seeded team. They were ranked 16th in the final college baseball poll, but not that high in NCAA seedings. MSU is a 7 seed and Vandy is a 4 seed. Maybe you should consider them not fully worthy because Tennessee was a 3 seed and Arkansas a 1 seed from the same conference! Texas was the top seed to make the CWS at #2 as Arkansas lost in the super regionals.

All seedings in a year with little play outside of conference are BS. But Texas was beaten in the regular season by 4 SEC schools (Ole Miss, Miss St, A&M and Arkansas) and then defeated twice more by Miss St in the tourney. Perhaps the Horns were over seeded. Every baseball coach knows a streak is real and that having one at the right time is how you win championships. It's the nature of the game. This year's regionals were not balanced. I'd argue that Mississippi State had one of the toughest and Tennessee one of the weakest. Florida's streak came early in the season and they faded. Arkansas's game 1 blowout and a weak starting rotation past their #1 guy helped to do them in but mostly it was N.C. State's peaking at the right time.

A final between N.C. State and Mississippi State was shaping up to be epic. Both quietly had deep pens, both hit very well and both were peaking at the right time. Instead Vandy gets a do over in a way and that stinks.

Yep. I strongly feel NCST would have beaten Vandy with a full lineup this past Friday. Then we would have seen the Pack vs. the Dogs.

(06-26-2021 10:26 AM)dbackjon Wrote:  The vaccine greatly illuminates your chances of getting Covid and greatly reduces your chances of spreading it but it’s not 100%. No drug or treatment is

The fact remains you can’t play Russian roulette with peoples lives in this manner

(06-27-2021 10:13 AM)georgia_tech_swagger Wrote:  

(06-27-2021 08:17 AM)dbackjon Wrote:  Penalize and denigrate those two teams for the mistakes made by the NCAA. But above all else, abolish the NCAA.

Accuracy++;

(06-27-2021 02:37 PM)OdinFrigg Wrote:  

(06-27-2021 12:16 PM)bill dazzle Wrote:  

(06-27-2021 10:11 AM)JRsec Wrote:  

(06-27-2021 09:38 AM)bullet Wrote:  And understand that NCSU was on a hot streak. They weren't even a seeded team. They were ranked 16th in the final college baseball poll, but not that high in NCAA seedings. MSU is a 7 seed and Vandy is a 4 seed. Maybe you should consider them not fully worthy because Tennessee was a 3 seed and Arkansas a 1 seed from the same conference! Texas was the top seed to make the CWS at #2 as Arkansas lost in the super regionals.

All seedings in a year with little play outside of conference are BS. But Texas was beaten in the regular season by 4 SEC schools (Ole Miss, Miss St, A&M and Arkansas) and then defeated twice more by Miss St in the tourney. Perhaps the Horns were over seeded. Every baseball coach knows a streak is real and that having one at the right time is how you win championships. It's the nature of the game. This year's regionals were not balanced. I'd argue that Mississippi State had one of the toughest and Tennessee one of the weakest. Florida's streak came early in the season and they faded. Arkansas's game 1 blowout and a weak starting rotation past their #1 guy helped to do them in but mostly it was N.C. State's peaking at the right time.

A final between N.C. State and Mississippi State was shaping up to be epic. Both quietly had deep pens, both hit very well and both were peaking at the right time. Instead Vandy gets a do over in a way and that stinks.

Yep. I strongly feel NCST would have beaten Vandy with a full lineup this past Friday. Then we would have seen the Pack vs. the Dogs.

Bill, your "what if" logic is rather perplexing. Both Mississippi State and Vanderbilt beat some excellent teams along the way. Texas has an awesome team for example. MSU & Vandy navigated the established system successfully. Suggesting MSU & Vandy are incomplete victors has no basis given the highly structured format with rules and procedures that had no deviation.

NC State got excluded due to multiple players testing positive for COVID. That is unfortunate for the Wolfpack, but the protocol for dealing with such a situation was pre-established. The tournament officials tried to accommodate NCSU up to an hour before the game that was already delayed. Because Vandy got an auto-advancement due to a game cancellation is reasonable methodology. There was no other option. Off-the-field events, i.e. injuries, illnesses, etc. happen with all sports and impacts.

If ranked #1s and #2s lost, they lost. They don't get second and third chances. Those that prevailed on the field of play are to be congratulated and not inappropriately labeled with some negative asterisks. That won't happen for the record books in this case other than noting one game was cancelled due to a ruling NC State, not Vanderbilt, could not participate. With Miss. State it is 'next-up' in a no bumps (outside W-L) sequence.