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Cincinnati is a sleeping giant. - Helicopter - 04-21-2021 03:14 PM

I was perusing UNC message boards to get their take on Wes Miller and one comment stuck out to me:

"Cincinnati is a sleeping giant"

Then I watched Wes' press conference and he basically had the same reaction. This board is way way way too self deprecating (loathing). Near the end of Mick's tenure he had this attitude that there was a ceiling at UC. Maybe it was losing Kemba Walker to Calhoun in the 25th hour and getting waxed by him in the tourney a few years later that broke him. Maybe it was Nevada -- who knows? What I do know is Cincinnati had "something" ~20 years ago that most fans remember. We can absolutely get back there and we don't need a high profile conference, we did it in CUSA, Zags are doing it now in WCC. A couple of things right off the bat:

1. Our UA deal is dead. No one is getting high $ apparel deals anymore. Go get Meach, Wes Miller, Roy Williams, whoever it takes and get the Jumpman brand back on the Unis.
2. Load up the Shoe. Show recruits, current players, students what 12,012 screaming basketball junkies looks like in a $87 million arena. We win 85% of our games at home. No reason we can't keep doing that.
3. Blow up social media. I'm not saying you have to stalk 17 year olds (cringe) but look at the football recruiting buzz. We need that for bball.

I'm eternally optimistic when it comes to UC basketball. The fact it has endured academic sanctions, conference realignment, administrative incompetence, and frankly a hostile national media, means it's special. It will be special again. We just have to shake the Cincinnati sports mentality and believe it.


Cincinnati is a sleeping giant. - RealDeal - 04-21-2021 07:46 PM

All they need to do is look down the hall and see what Luke Fickell built. And not being P5 is less of an obstacle than it is in football. Dream big, don't apologize and create a culture and sell everyone who will listen why they need to be a part of it.

Sent from my SM-T720 using Tapatalk


RE: Cincinnati is a sleeping giant. - Bear Catlett - 04-21-2021 08:13 PM

We were clearly the best team in in the country in 2000 until that Cincinnati thing kicked on us.

No reason why that can't be done again.


RE: Cincinnati is a sleeping giant. - Captain Bearcat - 04-21-2021 11:50 PM

Cincinnati basketball is a brand name for its style of play. How many other programs have that?

Any coach in the country knows that a game against Cincinnati means you're in for a physical game, and you'll get challenged every single play. Any recruit in the country knows that being a Bearcat means you're expected to be a tough SOB.

That's a huge advantage in recruiting. Miller doesn't even have to say anything about the expectation - recruits already know it. The branding is already there.

The only other program I can think of with a unique style that transcends coaches is Butler. And the Butler Way (teamwork and selflessness) is tougher to sell to teenagers than being a BAMF.


RE: Cincinnati is a sleeping giant. - doss2 - 04-22-2021 04:14 AM

(04-21-2021 11:50 PM)Captain Bearcat Wrote:  Cincinnati basketball is a brand name for its style of play. How many other programs have that?

Any coach in the country knows that a game against Cincinnati means you're in for a physical game, and you'll get challenged every single play. Any recruit in the country knows that being a Bearcat means you're expected to be a tough SOB.

That's a huge advantage in recruiting. Miller doesn't even have to say anything about the expectation - recruits already know it. The branding is already there.

The only other program I can think of with a unique style that transcends coaches is Butler. And the Butler Way (teamwork and selflessness) is tougher to sell to teenagers than being a BAMF.

Used to have a tough image. Now the image is, if the coach makes us practice too hard, our players quit.


RE: Cincinnati is a sleeping giant. - rath v2.0 - 04-22-2021 04:50 AM

And fans who have been complaining for 16 years keep complaining.


RE: Cincinnati is a sleeping giant. - Edgebrookjeff - 04-22-2021 06:22 AM

I like the the fan that finds something to ***** about even though the team is killing it. Cincinnati is full of those fans in particular.


RE: Cincinnati is a sleeping giant. - OKIcat - 04-22-2021 09:24 AM

(04-21-2021 03:14 PM)Helicopter Wrote:  I was perusing UNC message boards to get their take on Wes Miller and one comment stuck out to me:

"Cincinnati is a sleeping giant"

Then I watched Wes' press conference and he basically had the same reaction. This board is way way way too self deprecating (loathing). Near the end of Mick's tenure he had this attitude that there was a ceiling at UC. Maybe it was losing Kemba Walker to Calhoun in the 25th hour and getting waxed by him in the tourney a few years later that broke him. Maybe it was Nevada -- who knows? What I do know is Cincinnati had "something" ~20 years ago that most fans remember. We can absolutely get back there and we don't need a high profile conference, we did it in CUSA, Zags are doing it now in WCC. A couple of things right off the bat:

1. Our UA deal is dead. No one is getting high $ apparel deals anymore. Go get Meach, Wes Miller, Roy Williams, whoever it takes and get the Jumpman brand back on the Unis.
2. Load up the Shoe. Show recruits, current players, students what 12,012 screaming basketball junkies looks like in a $87 million arena. We win 85% of our games at home. No reason we can't keep doing that.
3. Blow up social media. I'm not saying you have to stalk 17 year olds (cringe) but look at the football recruiting buzz. We need that for bball.

I'm eternally optimistic when it comes to UC basketball. The fact it has endured academic sanctions, conference realignment, administrative incompetence, and frankly a hostile national media, means it's special. It will be special again. We just have to shake the Cincinnati sports mentality and believe it.

Interesting post and I agree with most of your assertions here. I think UC was a sleeping giant when Huggins arrived and returned Cincinnati to the Final Four in three short years. I think UC was a sleeping giant when Brian Kelly stepped in and took football to where it had never been before with back-to-back BCS games in the Orange and Sugar.

I think UC was a sleeping giant after Tuberville's tenure--maybe a self-induced coma is a better description. And Fickell revived the patient for a NY6 Peach in four years. If finding fault anywhere it was UC's inability to upgrade facilities fast enough to entice the ACC to take a more serious look when when the Big East imploded and Louisville had shiny new toys for football, basketball, baseball and more.

We disagree on point one. UA still owes UC millions of dollars if I understand the deal and an aspiring G5 can't afford to walk away from that kind of money. Watching college basketball this year, I wasn't impressed with the Jumpman uniforms at all. The fabric and cut appeared identical to the more widely used Nike gear and using Final Four Houston as an example, to me there was nothing particularly unique or distinctive about their gear in any way. Honest question, how does it help our basketball program to gain that small, branded logo patch on a jersey and walk away from millions of dollars from UC's next suitor--be it Adidas or Nike again or an emergent brand willing to invest in Bearcat sports given our track record of substantial licensed merchandise sales and high potential to migrate to a power conference in the coming years?


RE: Cincinnati is a sleeping giant. - Helicopter - 04-22-2021 09:30 AM

(04-22-2021 09:24 AM)OKIcat Wrote:  
(04-21-2021 03:14 PM)Helicopter Wrote:  I was perusing UNC message boards to get their take on Wes Miller and one comment stuck out to me:

"Cincinnati is a sleeping giant"

Then I watched Wes' press conference and he basically had the same reaction. This board is way way way too self deprecating (loathing). Near the end of Mick's tenure he had this attitude that there was a ceiling at UC. Maybe it was losing Kemba Walker to Calhoun in the 25th hour and getting waxed by him in the tourney a few years later that broke him. Maybe it was Nevada -- who knows? What I do know is Cincinnati had "something" ~20 years ago that most fans remember. We can absolutely get back there and we don't need a high profile conference, we did it in CUSA, Zags are doing it now in WCC. A couple of things right off the bat:

1. Our UA deal is dead. No one is getting high $ apparel deals anymore. Go get Meach, Wes Miller, Roy Williams, whoever it takes and get the Jumpman brand back on the Unis.
2. Load up the Shoe. Show recruits, current players, students what 12,012 screaming basketball junkies looks like in a $87 million arena. We win 85% of our games at home. No reason we can't keep doing that.
3. Blow up social media. I'm not saying you have to stalk 17 year olds (cringe) but look at the football recruiting buzz. We need that for bball.

I'm eternally optimistic when it comes to UC basketball. The fact it has endured academic sanctions, conference realignment, administrative incompetence, and frankly a hostile national media, means it's special. It will be special again. We just have to shake the Cincinnati sports mentality and believe it.

Interesting post and I agree with most of your assertions here. I think UC was a sleeping giant when Huggins arrived and returned Cincinnati to the Final Four in three short years. I think UC was a sleeping giant when Brian Kelly stepped in and took football to where it had never been before with back-to-back BCS games in the Orange and Sugar.

I think UC was a sleeping giant after Tuberville's tenure--maybe a self-induced coma is a better description. And Fickell revived the patient for a NY6 Peach in four years. If finding fault anywhere it was UC's inability to upgrade facilities fast enough to entice the ACC to take a more serious look when when the Big East imploded and Louisville had shiny new toys for football, basketball, baseball and more.

We disagree on point one. UA still owes UC millions of dollars if I understand the deal and an aspiring G5 can't afford to walk away from that kind of money. Watching college basketball this year, I wasn't impressed with the Jumpman uniforms at all. The fabric and cut appeared identical to the more widely used Nike gear and using Final Four Houston as an example, to me there was nothing particularly unique or distinctive about their gear in any way. Honest question, how does it help our basketball program to gain that small, branded logo patch on a jersey and walk away from millions of dollars from UC's next suitor--be it Adidas or Nike again or an emergent brand willing to invest in Bearcat sports given our track record of substantial licensed merchandise sales and high potential to migrate to a power conference in the coming years?

I hadn't gotten the details of the UA divorce. It was explained to me they payout a portion of the deal upfront because they are breaching the contract (renegotiated based on this) and then its apparel only for the remainder of the original deal (2-3 years remaining).

Meach's podcast discussed this in some depth and he all but said discussions are going on to line up a new apparel deal which wouldn't effect the partial $ coming our way from UA. The other consensus I am hearing (in podcasts, message boards, etc.) is the traditional apparel deal of getting free stuff AND a payout is going away. There just isn't any competition between Nike and the other brands. Interesting to say the least.

I think the apparel (specifically Jordan brand) helps us in 3 ways:
1. Attracts recruits interest
2. Attracts fan interest
3. Limits the advantages other schools have in terms of AAU affiliations and "steering" recruits