(11-19-2020 10:21 AM)WalkThePlank Wrote:  

(11-19-2020 10:18 AM)gdunn Wrote:  

(11-19-2020 10:10 AM)WalkThePlank Wrote:  Voted for Trump and wish he won, but I have to say the true evidence of actually overturning the result of the election is virtually zero. He's within his Constitutional right to investigate any potential fraud, but tweeting that he was the real winner without proven results is dangerously stupid.

If there isn't enough evidence, will he ever concede? It's a dangerous path our country is headed in.

Trump's mouth by far is his worst trait. He exaggerates more than anyone person should.

That being said, if he loses but shows there is election fraud, maybe, just maybe, the American people will demand stricter regulations as it comes to votes. I hear certain people saying that throwing out votes disenfranchises voters, but fake votes disenfranchises legal voters. This could be Trump's parting gift to the country.

That's not his end game though - if that was the true message he would be talking about that instead of tweeting "I Won!"

Look, there has been a coup to undo the 2016 election, I believe this, but thinking long term...not conceding after a close loss will further divide our nation and will be his lasting legacy 20 years from now. Similar to Al Gore.

(11-19-2020 10:32 AM)Attackcoog Wrote:  

(11-19-2020 10:21 AM)WalkThePlank Wrote:  

(11-19-2020 10:18 AM)gdunn Wrote:  

(11-19-2020 10:10 AM)WalkThePlank Wrote:  Voted for Trump and wish he won, but I have to say the true evidence of actually overturning the result of the election is virtually zero. He's within his Constitutional right to investigate any potential fraud, but tweeting that he was the real winner without proven results is dangerously stupid.

If there isn't enough evidence, will he ever concede? It's a dangerous path our country is headed in.

Trump's mouth by far is his worst trait. He exaggerates more than anyone person should.

That being said, if he loses but shows there is election fraud, maybe, just maybe, the American people will demand stricter regulations as it comes to votes. I hear certain people saying that throwing out votes disenfranchises voters, but fake votes disenfranchises legal voters. This could be Trump's parting gift to the country.

That's not his end game though - if that was the true message he would be talking about that instead of tweeting "I Won!"

Look, there has been a coup to undo the 2016 election, I believe this, but thinking long term...not conceding after a close loss will further divide our nation and will be his lasting legacy 20 years from now. Similar to Al Gore.

Here is the dirty little secret about Trump. His tweets have never matched how he governs. His tweets sometimes have been strident and unpredictable. His actually governing decisions have been quite reasonable and stable. His main achievements—controlling runaway illegal immigration, changing “free” trade to “fair” trade, and bringing jobs back to America by creating a more business friendly climate (lower regulation and lower taxes) are his legacy gift to the public (along with a Covid vaccine).

There is literally nothing wrong or particularly controversial about his governance absent the tweets. Trump has tendency to think out loud via news conferences or tweets. It’s somewhat unconventional, but it’s largely the press that has deemed it a big deal. The rest of America seems to understand it really isn’t and likely re-elects him had the press not convinced them Covid was all Trumps fault.

(11-19-2020 10:10 AM)WalkThePlank Wrote:  Voted for Trump and wish he won, but I have to say the true evidence of actually overturning the result of the election is virtually zero. He's within his Constitutional right to investigate any potential fraud, but tweeting that he was the real winner without proven results is dangerously stupid.
If there isn't enough evidence, will he ever concede? It's a dangerous path our country is headed in.

(11-19-2020 11:14 AM)bullet Wrote:  Trump is impulsive. As you say, he thinks out loud. He speaks in stream of consciousness.
But as you say, his policies don't reflect that. But the traitors in the administration takes every thought and blows it out of proportion and takes it to the press.
What's become clear is there are a lot of horrible employees in DC.

(11-19-2020 12:03 PM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  

(11-19-2020 10:10 AM)WalkThePlank Wrote:  Voted for Trump and wish he won, but I have to say the true evidence of actually overturning the result of the election is virtually zero. He's within his Constitutional right to investigate any potential fraud, but tweeting that he was the real winner without proven results is dangerously stupid.
If there isn't enough evidence, will he ever concede? It's a dangerous path our country is headed in.

Concession is more a customary thing than one that has legal significance. Concession basically cuts off his ability to challenge...

(11-19-2020 12:22 PM)CrimsonPhantom Wrote:  

(11-19-2020 12:26 PM)Redwingtom Wrote:  

(11-19-2020 12:22 PM)CrimsonPhantom Wrote:  

The guy who claimed the massacre of children at Sandy Hook was fake leading your charge.

You must be proud.

(11-19-2020 12:03 PM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  

(11-19-2020 10:10 AM)WalkThePlank Wrote:  Voted for Trump and wish he won, but I have to say the true evidence of actually overturning the result of the election is virtually zero. He's within his Constitutional right to investigate any potential fraud, but tweeting that he was the real winner without proven results is dangerously stupid.
If there isn't enough evidence, will he ever concede? It's a dangerous path our country is headed in.

Concession is more a customary thing than one that has legal significance. Concession basically cuts off his ability to challenge, and I'm not sure if he will ever do that. But once states certify the results and the electoral college meets and votes, the issue is decided and Joe Biden would have legal authority to evict him forcibly from the White House if it came to that. I hope it doesn't come to that, and I would hope Trump gets talked out of it if he even tries to go there.

As I see it, there are three issues surrounding any challenge:
1) Were there irregularities?
2) Were they sufficient to alter the result?
3) Can that be proved?

And my answers would be 1) almost certainly, 2) probably about 50-50, and 3) probably never.

At some point, probably the certification of enough electoral votes for Biden to win, and absolutely at the point the electoral college meets and votes, and ideally before either of those, republicans need to shift gears and figure out how to be an effective opposition. Obviously if they win the Georgia seats and get a senate majority, they have much stronger leverage. But if not, then I think they need to work very hard to make everything come down to 50-50 with Harris casting the deciding vote. If republicans had somebody like Schumer or Pelosi, I would feel much more confident that they could deliver that result over and over, but Milquetoast Mitch couldn't lead a sex addict to a whorehouse.

(11-19-2020 02:34 PM)UTSAMarineVet09 Wrote:  Arizona won’t certify its results until all lawsuits have been settled... it’s not over.

(11-19-2020 11:14 AM)bullet Wrote:  

(11-19-2020 10:32 AM)Attackcoog Wrote:  

(11-19-2020 10:21 AM)WalkThePlank Wrote:  

(11-19-2020 10:18 AM)gdunn Wrote:  

(11-19-2020 10:10 AM)WalkThePlank Wrote:  Voted for Trump and wish he won, but I have to say the true evidence of actually overturning the result of the election is virtually zero. He's within his Constitutional right to investigate any potential fraud, but tweeting that he was the real winner without proven results is dangerously stupid.

If there isn't enough evidence, will he ever concede? It's a dangerous path our country is headed in.

Trump's mouth by far is his worst trait. He exaggerates more than anyone person should.

That being said, if he loses but shows there is election fraud, maybe, just maybe, the American people will demand stricter regulations as it comes to votes. I hear certain people saying that throwing out votes disenfranchises voters, but fake votes disenfranchises legal voters. This could be Trump's parting gift to the country.

That's not his end game though - if that was the true message he would be talking about that instead of tweeting "I Won!"

Look, there has been a coup to undo the 2016 election, I believe this, but thinking long term...not conceding after a close loss will further divide our nation and will be his lasting legacy 20 years from now. Similar to Al Gore.

Here is the dirty little secret about Trump. His tweets have never matched how he governs. His tweets sometimes have been strident and unpredictable. His actually governing decisions have been quite reasonable and stable. His main achievements—controlling runaway illegal immigration, changing “free” trade to “fair” trade, and bringing jobs back to America by creating a more business friendly climate (lower regulation and lower taxes) are his legacy gift to the public (along with a Covid vaccine).

There is literally nothing wrong or particularly controversial about his governance absent the tweets. Trump has tendency to think out loud via news conferences or tweets. It’s somewhat unconventional, but it’s largely the press that has deemed it a big deal. The rest of America seems to understand it really isn’t and likely re-elects him had the press not convinced them Covid was all Trumps fault.

Trump is impulsive. As you say, he thinks out loud. He speaks in stream of consciousness.

But as you say, his policies don't reflect that. But the traitors in the administration takes every thought and blows it out of proportion and takes it to the press.

What's become clear is there are a lot of horrible employees in DC.

(11-19-2020 10:32 AM)Attackcoog Wrote:  

(11-19-2020 10:21 AM)WalkThePlank Wrote:  

(11-19-2020 10:18 AM)gdunn Wrote:  

(11-19-2020 10:10 AM)WalkThePlank Wrote:  Voted for Trump and wish he won, but I have to say the true evidence of actually overturning the result of the election is virtually zero. He's within his Constitutional right to investigate any potential fraud, but tweeting that he was the real winner without proven results is dangerously stupid.

If there isn't enough evidence, will he ever concede? It's a dangerous path our country is headed in.

Trump's mouth by far is his worst trait. He exaggerates more than anyone person should.

That being said, if he loses but shows there is election fraud, maybe, just maybe, the American people will demand stricter regulations as it comes to votes. I hear certain people saying that throwing out votes disenfranchises voters, but fake votes disenfranchises legal voters. This could be Trump's parting gift to the country.

That's not his end game though - if that was the true message he would be talking about that instead of tweeting "I Won!"

Look, there has been a coup to undo the 2016 election, I believe this, but thinking long term...not conceding after a close loss will further divide our nation and will be his lasting legacy 20 years from now. Similar to Al Gore.

Here is the dirty little secret about Trump. His tweets have never matched how he governs. His tweets sometimes have been strident and unpredictable. His actually governing decisions have been quite reasonable and stable. His main achievements—controlling runaway illegal immigration, changing “free” trade to “fair” trade, and bringing jobs back to America by creating a more business friendly climate (lower regulation and lower taxes) are his legacy gift to the public (along with a Covid vaccine).

There is literally nothing wrong or particularly controversial about his governance absent the tweets. Trump has tendency to think out loud via news conferences or tweets. It’s somewhat unconventional, but it’s largely the press that has deemed it a big deal. The rest of America seems to understand it really isn’t and likely re-elects him had the press not convinced them Covid was all Trumps fault.

(11-19-2020 02:57 PM)U_of_Elvis Wrote:  

(11-19-2020 10:32 AM)Attackcoog Wrote:  

(11-19-2020 10:21 AM)WalkThePlank Wrote:  

(11-19-2020 10:18 AM)gdunn Wrote:  

(11-19-2020 10:10 AM)WalkThePlank Wrote:  Voted for Trump and wish he won, but I have to say the true evidence of actually overturning the result of the election is virtually zero. He's within his Constitutional right to investigate any potential fraud, but tweeting that he was the real winner without proven results is dangerously stupid.

If there isn't enough evidence, will he ever concede? It's a dangerous path our country is headed in.

Trump's mouth by far is his worst trait. He exaggerates more than anyone person should.

That being said, if he loses but shows there is election fraud, maybe, just maybe, the American people will demand stricter regulations as it comes to votes. I hear certain people saying that throwing out votes disenfranchises voters, but fake votes disenfranchises legal voters. This could be Trump's parting gift to the country.

That's not his end game though - if that was the true message he would be talking about that instead of tweeting "I Won!"

Look, there has been a coup to undo the 2016 election, I believe this, but thinking long term...not conceding after a close loss will further divide our nation and will be his lasting legacy 20 years from now. Similar to Al Gore.

Here is the dirty little secret about Trump. His tweets have never matched how he governs. His tweets sometimes have been strident and unpredictable. His actually governing decisions have been quite reasonable and stable. His main achievements—controlling runaway illegal immigration, changing “free” trade to “fair” trade, and bringing jobs back to America by creating a more business friendly climate (lower regulation and lower taxes) are his legacy gift to the public (along with a Covid vaccine).

There is literally nothing wrong or particularly controversial about his governance absent the tweets. Trump has tendency to think out loud via news conferences or tweets. It’s somewhat unconventional, but it’s largely the press that has deemed it a big deal. The rest of America seems to understand it really isn’t and likely re-elects him had the press not convinced them Covid was all Trumps fault.

Just this week he appointed the 33 year old wife of one of his staffers (also employee of the firm he hired to challenge the vote) to a federal judgeship for life. The bar association considered her unqualified as she has only taken part in two trials (both single day trials) and was only an intern. She has never taken a case to trial as primary or co-counsel since passing the bar.

(11-19-2020 02:57 PM)U_of_Elvis Wrote:  

(11-19-2020 10:32 AM)Attackcoog Wrote:  

(11-19-2020 10:21 AM)WalkThePlank Wrote:  

(11-19-2020 10:18 AM)gdunn Wrote:  

(11-19-2020 10:10 AM)WalkThePlank Wrote:  Voted for Trump and wish he won, but I have to say the true evidence of actually overturning the result of the election is virtually zero. He's within his Constitutional right to investigate any potential fraud, but tweeting that he was the real winner without proven results is dangerously stupid.

If there isn't enough evidence, will he ever concede? It's a dangerous path our country is headed in.

Trump's mouth by far is his worst trait. He exaggerates more than anyone person should.

That being said, if he loses but shows there is election fraud, maybe, just maybe, the American people will demand stricter regulations as it comes to votes. I hear certain people saying that throwing out votes disenfranchises voters, but fake votes disenfranchises legal voters. This could be Trump's parting gift to the country.

That's not his end game though - if that was the true message he would be talking about that instead of tweeting "I Won!"

Look, there has been a coup to undo the 2016 election, I believe this, but thinking long term...not conceding after a close loss will further divide our nation and will be his lasting legacy 20 years from now. Similar to Al Gore.

Here is the dirty little secret about Trump. His tweets have never matched how he governs. His tweets sometimes have been strident and unpredictable. His actually governing decisions have been quite reasonable and stable. His main achievements—controlling runaway illegal immigration, changing “free” trade to “fair” trade, and bringing jobs back to America by creating a more business friendly climate (lower regulation and lower taxes) are his legacy gift to the public (along with a Covid vaccine).

There is literally nothing wrong or particularly controversial about his governance absent the tweets. Trump has tendency to think out loud via news conferences or tweets. It’s somewhat unconventional, but it’s largely the press that has deemed it a big deal. The rest of America seems to understand it really isn’t and likely re-elects him had the press not convinced them Covid was all Trumps fault.

Just this week he appointed the 33 year old wife of one of his staffers (also employee of the firm he hired to challenge the vote) to a federal judgeship for life. The bar association considered her unqualified as she has only taken part in two trials (both single day trials) and was only an intern. She has never taken a case to trial as primary or co-counsel since passing the bar.

(11-19-2020 12:19 PM)Redwingtom Wrote:  

(11-19-2020 12:03 PM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  

(11-19-2020 10:10 AM)WalkThePlank Wrote:  Voted for Trump and wish he won, but I have to say the true evidence of actually overturning the result of the election is virtually zero. He's within his Constitutional right to investigate any potential fraud, but tweeting that he was the real winner without proven results is dangerously stupid.
If there isn't enough evidence, will he ever concede? It's a dangerous path our country is headed in.

Concession is more a customary thing than one that has legal significance. Concession basically cuts off his ability to challenge...

How so? What legal position does a concession speech create?

(11-19-2020 03:06 PM)bullet Wrote:  

(11-19-2020 02:57 PM)U_of_Elvis Wrote:  

(11-19-2020 10:32 AM)Attackcoog Wrote:  

(11-19-2020 10:21 AM)WalkThePlank Wrote:  

(11-19-2020 10:18 AM)gdunn Wrote:  Trump's mouth by far is his worst trait. He exaggerates more than anyone person should.

That being said, if he loses but shows there is election fraud, maybe, just maybe, the American people will demand stricter regulations as it comes to votes. I hear certain people saying that throwing out votes disenfranchises voters, but fake votes disenfranchises legal voters. This could be Trump's parting gift to the country.

That's not his end game though - if that was the true message he would be talking about that instead of tweeting "I Won!"

Look, there has been a coup to undo the 2016 election, I believe this, but thinking long term...not conceding after a close loss will further divide our nation and will be his lasting legacy 20 years from now. Similar to Al Gore.

Here is the dirty little secret about Trump. His tweets have never matched how he governs. His tweets sometimes have been strident and unpredictable. His actually governing decisions have been quite reasonable and stable. His main achievements—controlling runaway illegal immigration, changing “free” trade to “fair” trade, and bringing jobs back to America by creating a more business friendly climate (lower regulation and lower taxes) are his legacy gift to the public (along with a Covid vaccine).

There is literally nothing wrong or particularly controversial about his governance absent the tweets. Trump has tendency to think out loud via news conferences or tweets. It’s somewhat unconventional, but it’s largely the press that has deemed it a big deal. The rest of America seems to understand it really isn’t and likely re-elects him had the press not convinced them Covid was all Trumps fault.

Just this week he appointed the 33 year old wife of one of his staffers (also employee of the firm he hired to challenge the vote) to a federal judgeship for life. The bar association considered her unqualified as she has only taken part in two trials (both single day trials) and was only an intern. She has never taken a case to trial as primary or co-counsel since passing the bar.

He can't do that without senate approval.

The bar association is a liberal cesspool. They claimed one guy who was perfectly qualified was unqualified. One of his political opponents wrote the claim that he was unqualified.

And I notice you didn't include a link.

(11-19-2020 03:25 PM)Attackcoog Wrote:  

(11-19-2020 12:19 PM)Redwingtom Wrote:  

(11-19-2020 12:03 PM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  

(11-19-2020 10:10 AM)WalkThePlank Wrote:  Voted for Trump and wish he won, but I have to say the true evidence of actually overturning the result of the election is virtually zero. He's within his Constitutional right to investigate any potential fraud, but tweeting that he was the real winner without proven results is dangerously stupid.
If there isn't enough evidence, will he ever concede? It's a dangerous path our country is headed in.

Concession is more a customary thing than one that has legal significance. Concession basically cuts off his ability to challenge...

How so? What legal position does a concession speech create?

Agreement among both parties as to who won. Its hard to unring that bell.

(11-19-2020 02:57 PM)U_of_Elvis Wrote:  

(11-19-2020 10:32 AM)Attackcoog Wrote:  

(11-19-2020 10:21 AM)WalkThePlank Wrote:  

(11-19-2020 10:18 AM)gdunn Wrote:  

(11-19-2020 10:10 AM)WalkThePlank Wrote:  Voted for Trump and wish he won, but I have to say the true evidence of actually overturning the result of the election is virtually zero. He's within his Constitutional right to investigate any potential fraud, but tweeting that he was the real winner without proven results is dangerously stupid.

If there isn't enough evidence, will he ever concede? It's a dangerous path our country is headed in.

Trump's mouth by far is his worst trait. He exaggerates more than anyone person should.

That being said, if he loses but shows there is election fraud, maybe, just maybe, the American people will demand stricter regulations as it comes to votes. I hear certain people saying that throwing out votes disenfranchises voters, but fake votes disenfranchises legal voters. This could be Trump's parting gift to the country.

That's not his end game though - if that was the true message he would be talking about that instead of tweeting "I Won!"

Look, there has been a coup to undo the 2016 election, I believe this, but thinking long term...not conceding after a close loss will further divide our nation and will be his lasting legacy 20 years from now. Similar to Al Gore.

Here is the dirty little secret about Trump. His tweets have never matched how he governs. His tweets sometimes have been strident and unpredictable. His actually governing decisions have been quite reasonable and stable. His main achievements—controlling runaway illegal immigration, changing “free” trade to “fair” trade, and bringing jobs back to America by creating a more business friendly climate (lower regulation and lower taxes) are his legacy gift to the public (along with a Covid vaccine).

There is literally nothing wrong or particularly controversial about his governance absent the tweets. Trump has tendency to think out loud via news conferences or tweets. It’s somewhat unconventional, but it’s largely the press that has deemed it a big deal. The rest of America seems to understand it really isn’t and likely re-elects him had the press not convinced them Covid was all Trumps fault.

Just this week he appointed the 33 year old wife of one of his staffers (also employee of the firm he hired to challenge the vote) to a federal judgeship for life. The bar association considered her unqualified as she has only taken part in two trials (both single day trials) and was only an intern. She has never taken a case to trial as primary or co-counsel since passing the bar.