Coronoavirus Covid-19 thread - Printable Version +- CSNbbs (https://csnbbs.com) +-- Forum: Active Boards (/forum-769.html) +--- Forum: AACbbs (/forum-460.html) +---- Forum: Members (/forum-401.html) +----- Forum: Rice (/forum-444.html) +------ Forum: Kent Rowald Memorial Quad (/forum-660.html) +------ Thread: Coronoavirus Covid-19 thread (/thread-895134.html) Pages: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 29 30 31 32 33 34 35 36 37 38 39 40 41 42 43 44 45 46 47 48 49 50 51 52 53 54 55 56 57 58 59 60 61 62 63 64 65 66 67 68 69 70 71 72 73 74 75 76 77 78 79 80 81 82 83 84 85 86 87 88 89 90 91 92 93 94 95 96 97 98 99 100 101 102 103 104 105 106 107 108 109 110 111 112 113 114 115 116 117 118 119 120 121 122 123 124 125 126 127 128 129 130 131 132 133 134 135 136 137 138 139 140 141 142 143 144 145 146 147 148 149 150 151 152 153 154 155 156 157 158 159 160 161 162 163 164 165 166 167 168 169 170 171 172 173 174 175 176 177 178 179 180 181 182 183 184 185 186 187 188 |
RE: Coronoavirus Covid-19 thread - RiceLad15 - 03-31-2020 04:08 PM (03-31-2020 04:05 PM)mrbig Wrote:(03-31-2020 08:07 AM)Hambone10 Wrote:(03-30-2020 02:21 PM)mrbig Wrote: Again, and I'm not sure why I need to repeat this, Trump is POTUS. It is his job to keep this country safe. It is my job to be an attorney and to keep myself and my family safe. I don't have power or authority necessary to protect the country, he does. And isn't the rate and duration of hospitalization one of the most important issues we're facing? Because we have a finite number of beds we can dedicate to treating "normal" patients and the influx of COVID patients? COVID-19 creates issues outside of just hospitilizations/deaths from COVID-19, right? I wonder if we have statistics on healthcare worker cases for these types of viruses. RE: Coronoavirus Covid-19 thread - RiceLad15 - 03-31-2020 04:15 PM (03-31-2020 03:55 PM)GoodOwl Wrote:(03-31-2020 01:55 PM)Hambone10 Wrote: Hospitals should be reserved for people most likely to need the broadest range of medical services... and places that are in some way 'less' than a hospital should be reserved for people who need fewer services. It seems like you're primarily talking about pre-COVID care, is that correct? If so, I agree that hospital visits are likely not the best choice for many seeking healthcare - and that utilizing other resources like telemedicine should be the front-line response. I don't think I'd advocate for eschewing proper medical care for self-diagnosis, though. And it seems like you're getting into that realm with the comment about people not taking care of themselves. Isn't one of the goals of encouraging more preventative screenings with PCPs to cut down on eventual hospital/ER visits? RE: Coronoavirus Covid-19 thread - mrbig - 03-31-2020 04:18 PM (03-31-2020 09:19 AM)OptimisticOwl Wrote: Where do we send the flowers? I actually spoke with GoodOwl on the phone once shortly after he because an active Parliament participant and he was very nice. Many of his posts on The Quad are toxic and derogatory toward others in ways that exceed anything you, tanq, or 69/70/75 write. The are also less logical and less tethered to what I consider a realistic view of the issues, again unlike how I typically view posts by you, tanq, and 69/70/75. I haven't interacted with illiniowl as much, but that single post was, to me, pretty off the wall. If tanq can get away with his "west texas bluntness" then surely I can get away with some "alaska mountain man bluntness"? Am I still a nice young man if I am secretly a raging racist who also brings his mom dinner twice a week? RE: Coronoavirus Covid-19 thread - tanqtonic - 03-31-2020 04:20 PM (03-31-2020 04:05 PM)RiceLad15 Wrote:(03-31-2020 03:51 PM)OptimisticOwl Wrote:(03-31-2020 03:42 PM)RiceLad15 Wrote:(03-31-2020 03:38 PM)OptimisticOwl Wrote:(03-31-2020 02:40 PM)RiceLad15 Wrote: N95 masks weight 0.35 oz a piece. So 45 masks per pound. Considering the wish list for domestic use is measured in 100's of millions of units, mayber even billions of units, I dont think that one light tractor trailer load amounts to even a half-spit in an ocean. *That* is the point. When you look at those numbers, the fact that one feels the need to even try and quantify a light tractor trailer load is pretty inane. Kind of like harping on a billionaire who hands out $100 bills as tips when you think of it rationally. The fact that that a light tractor trailer load is still being discussed seems just as inane. But, sally forth on that quest, Senor Quixote. RE: Coronoavirus Covid-19 thread - mrbig - 03-31-2020 04:26 PM (03-31-2020 09:29 AM)tanqtonic Wrote: You did engage in ad hom name calling. In essence, you communicated that you felt him ignorant enough that you are surprised that he graduated from Rice. I'll be honest. I'm not sure what ad hominem means. I have never cared enough to look it up. I think I get the general gist. I didn't call him a name. I suggested some stuff, but didn't actually call him a name. Yes, I was doing a little tap dancing. I don't think either of them is ignorant, so that is definitely not a word I would use or intend to suggest. If I call someone a raving lunatic, that is name calling. If I call someone dumber than a lobotomized cow, that is name calling (or close to it). Incidientally, I don't think either of those is accurate and am using them as random examples, not at all directing them at anyone here. I certainly was not being respectful or nice. But you must forgive my alaskan mountain man bluntness sometimes. Not many people where I grew up so sometimes I struggle with social interaction. RE: Coronoavirus Covid-19 thread - tanqtonic - 03-31-2020 04:38 PM (03-31-2020 04:26 PM)mrbig Wrote:(03-31-2020 09:29 AM)tanqtonic Wrote: You did engage in ad hom name calling. In essence, you communicated that you felt him ignorant enough that you are surprised that he graduated from Rice. No need for any forgiveness from this quarter. As I said, I am far from being a person to cast a stone here. If you feel comfortable with your bluntness, so be it. RE: Coronoavirus Covid-19 thread - GoodOwl - 03-31-2020 04:38 PM (03-31-2020 04:15 PM)RiceLad15 Wrote:(03-31-2020 03:55 PM)GoodOwl Wrote:(03-31-2020 01:55 PM)Hambone10 Wrote: Hospitals should be reserved for people most likely to need the broadest range of medical services... and places that are in some way 'less' than a hospital should be reserved for people who need fewer services. Somewhat. For some reasons, it seems today far fewer people have been raised/taught to do some self-care first, or at least consider it. My goodne4ss, more information is available today to the average citizen and less people than ever seem capable of reading ti or using it. Many people today, it seems, don't have a clue how to take care of themselves without a doctor and an insurance card constantly at the ready, and I think that's a problem that makes things like this virus much worse, and more costly, for everybody. I worked in a pharmacy for a few years among other things growing up. The pharmacists would often point out how many people were coming in for prescriptions that seemed like overkill for what they supposedly had; that many people would get a Rx for something just because their insurance paid for it, when something OTC, or even a home-remedy would do as well or better for them; That many of them never bothered to read the insert information or warnings on the back of medicines they bought, et cetera. Maybe it was the fact that I saw so many people come in for/with so many different things, and I would listen to the pharmacist's conversations with customers and ask them questions about what the different drugs did and also would ask about and read many of the bottles and pills I was stocking out on the shelves in the OTC section...I guess a lot of folks don't know about these things nowadays, but it seems like there is a pre-disposition to just blindly run to doctors and hospitals for anything and do whatever as long as you can scan an insurance card and few seem to question or look for alternative remedies. My present concerns from this coronabug are the extreme amounts of public financing being thrown at it and the bucket list of goodies in these spending bills that will have a far more negative impact on the average American now and in the future than if we don't get every single case of coronabug exactly right by shutting everything down for several months instead of a few weeks. Inflation and economics are real, as real as this bug. Eventually, those costs have to be weighed against what we are doing and their effect on the average poor and middle-class working American needs to be taken into account. Same as with for Health Insurance, vs 'health "care"' disguised as over-bloated government-mandated insurance monstrosities like ACA, which didn't do anything to fix the alleged problem that insurance and health care cost too much; well, yeah, if you bloat up policies and take away choice from people with government mandates, what else could you expect but much higher prices and much worse actual care and insurance? Something just feels rotten in Denmark with the way this whole thing is playing out. Ham seems to have a better handle on the medical ground-game reality than many of us, but at some point, someone has to be brave enough to re-examine just what it is we are doing here. We just cannot shut down everything endlessly every single time this comes up--and if the Chinese are planning to release another one of these bug-bombs, what then? We can't use all our ammunition because there may be something worse coming that we will not be able to defend. RE: Coronoavirus Covid-19 thread - OptimisticOwl - 03-31-2020 04:40 PM (03-31-2020 04:18 PM)mrbig Wrote:(03-31-2020 09:19 AM)OptimisticOwl Wrote: Where do we send the flowers? Going back to that, again? You might be. I don't think anybody is pure evil or pure good. You and the other liberals tend to use racism as the dividing line between pure evil and good people. I have known lots of good people who have a touch of racism in them. Some have been prejudiced against blacks, or Asians, or Germans, or Mexican(hispanics) or jews, or whites. Some have been virulent, some mild. I once knew a black man who fell apart on learning his daughter was a lesbian. I had to talk him out of suicide. Was he pure evil? I also knew a man who used the n-word a lot. He gave generously to various charities. Was he pure evil. His best friend was Mexican (as he called him). But they had enlisted together and fought on Iwo Jima together. Jay would have given his right arm for Nacho, but you wouldn't know it at first by the language. You guys are very judgmental and rigid. This is probably the most evil racist I know of, and probably worse than all the guys carrying tiki torches. But I doubt even he is pure evil. As for GoodOwl, he is part a spectrum of people with a variety of ideas. I think some of his ideas are too much, but I think the same of you and Lad. I tend to be a bit more in agreement with him than you, if only because I cannot identify where his words and thoughts originate. I think it takes all sorts. You and Lad seem to judge on a Pass/Fail basis. Personally I have learned to be more tolerant than I used to be. The group that I really hated back then? Baptists. Lighten up, Francis. RE: Coronoavirus Covid-19 thread - Fort Bend Owl - 03-31-2020 09:21 PM https://www.texastribune.org/2020/03/31/greg-abbott-texas-executive-order-closures/ Texas officially (unofficially) joins the full state lockdown on Thursday. Except Abbott doesn't want to call it a shelter in place. During a news conference at the Texas Capitol, Abbott declined to call his latest executive order a shelter-in-place or stay-at-home order, arguing such labels leave the wrong impression and that he wants Texans to know, for example, they can still go to the grocery store. But in an interview afterward, he said "it's a fact" that the executive order nonetheless brings Texas up to speed with states that have issued orders with those labels. Oddly, Abbott did include religious services on his list of essential services. All of the churches in my area are already doing virtual services. We had someone pass out in the Catholic church 3 weeks ago and was later determined to be a positive case. But thankfully he and everyone else who helped him are fine. Here's the full list of essential services. http://tdem.texas.gov/essentialservices/ RE: Coronoavirus Covid-19 thread - At Ease - 03-31-2020 11:48 PM Quote:One minor side effect of the pandemic is that perhaps more people will learn about what drug research and clinical trials can really be like. Today’s example: we have a clinical trial of hydroxychloroquine from Wuhan that has just published on a preprint server. What’s good is that this one is blinded, randomized, and controlled (like the earlier hydroxychloroquine which one I blogged about here from Zhejiang University, so we can actually talk about it rather than just spend all our time wondering what the heck is going on. https://blogs.sciencemag.org/pipeline/archives/2020/03/31/comparing-chloroquine-trials RE: Coronoavirus Covid-19 thread - mrbig - 04-01-2020 12:54 AM (03-31-2020 03:25 PM)OptimisticOwl Wrote: So, now you are joining in the parade of putting words into mouths? Is that a legal tactic? OO, we obviously clash a lot, but I was 100% just trying to be funny and post the John Oliver bit, not trying to put words in your mouth. I apologize for it coming across that way. RE: Coronoavirus Covid-19 thread - OptimisticOwl - 04-01-2020 01:01 AM (04-01-2020 12:54 AM)mrbig Wrote:(03-31-2020 03:25 PM)OptimisticOwl Wrote: So, now you are joining in the parade of putting words into mouths? Is that a legal tactic? Yes, this message board medium does not convey humor well. I am sure I could have caught it if we were face to face (but 6 feet apart) You sometime ago asked for more humor here, and I have tried, but clearly once in a while the efforts will fall flat. We are good. RE: Coronoavirus Covid-19 thread - mrbig - 04-01-2020 01:01 AM (03-31-2020 10:18 AM)tanqtonic Wrote: 3 days ago he leveled the DPA hammer on GM for ventilators. Seems that the left leaning people on this board arent really up on the current status of the use of the DPA. Forgive me, I am busy trying to keep 3 kids in line with online schooling while doing extra chores and "teleworking". Some of the minutia fall through the cracks. I still don't understand why he didn't "invoke" it to either use it as a "talking point" or as a "hammer" 20-30 days earlier. People who didn't need to catch Covid-19 have caught it due to inadequate PPE supplies. His decision to not use this tool earlier is, along with a lot of other factors, responsible for some people catching Covid-19. Same with his decision not to invoke the DPA earlier to increase respirator production. The tidal wave has been coming and plenty of experts were pointing to it and telling him that he had the power to get the country to high ground. He took us up to the porch. Better than standing on the beach, but not as good as the 2nd floor. RE: Coronoavirus Covid-19 thread - mrbig - 04-01-2020 01:13 AM (03-31-2020 11:19 AM)Hambone10 Wrote: On the other hand, the two of you have made if a point to offer criticism and worse, credit to others... without one single scintilla of factual evidence to support that they would have done better.... and when people point this out to you, you act as if the comparisons to those others would have existed independently of your blind support for them and criticism of others? How on god's green earth are we supposed to offer a scintilla of factual evidence about a hypothetical like "what would Clinton/Biden do?"? To quote a great philosopher, "Christ on a cracker". Honestly, for purposes of hypothesizing how Clinton or Biden might respond to Covid-19, I consider both a hypothetical Hillary Clinton presidency and a prospective Biden presidency as essentially another term of the Obama presidency. I don't think either of them would have markedly different responses to what he might have done. I think all 3 listen to scientists and experts more than Trump so I think they would have almost everything that Trump did at an earlier date, but without disbanding the NSC staff, cutting the CDC budgets in the same way, and with less inaccurate information disseminated. I think the same is true of most mainstream democratic politicians as well as many non-Trump Republicans. To put it another way, if Dewine or Romney or Kasich was president, I feel like their response to Covid-19 would have been pretty similar to Obama, Clinton, or Biden. For the most part, it is just about listening to the experts. All that said, I have less than zero interest in discussing hypothetical Clinton or Biden responses. It doesn't get us anywhere and neither side can prove or disprove anything. Why waste the time or words? 69/70/75 gave Trump a B+ and I gave him an F. I'm happy to hear how others would grade him. I think Lad gave him some kind of C, I'm just too lazy to look it up... RE: Coronoavirus Covid-19 thread - mrbig - 04-01-2020 01:16 AM Evening graphs. Not really anything good to say for the USA. I'm still waiting for someone to explain why Trump gets a passing grade when the USA had a 1-month head start to respond based on China's response and yet we somehow end up as the worst in the world for total cases and trending in very horrifying directions on total deaths. I guess it was cultural differences and had nothing to do with Trump. RE: Coronoavirus Covid-19 thread - mrbig - 04-01-2020 01:38 AM (03-31-2020 03:51 PM)OptimisticOwl Wrote: edit: Turns out it was Big in post #1676 who would have hoarded our supplies and not shared with a country having a crisis. Not really what I was saying. My point was at the time the PPE supplies were being given to China, many experts seemed to believe that we had a large active outbreak and just didn't know it yet because of the lack of testing. So I was saying that we should keep the supplies to treat our own outbreak rather than sending supplies elsewhere to treat someone else's outbreak. If we weren't having an outbreak, by all means, donate the supplies to help out. I'm a lefty after all! RE: Coronoavirus Covid-19 thread - mrbig - 04-01-2020 01:40 AM (03-31-2020 03:55 PM)GoodOwl Wrote:(03-31-2020 01:55 PM)Hambone10 Wrote: Hospitals should be reserved for people most likely to need the broadest range of medical services... and places that are in some way 'less' than a hospital should be reserved for people who need fewer services. My wife was on call last weekend (she covers 2 hospitals). I don't think she had to venture to the ER (just labor & delivery and surgery). But from the people she spoke to, apparently this is actually happening as they were getting many fewer ER visits from people who didn't really need them (but a lot of Covid-19 visits). RE: Coronoavirus Covid-19 thread - OptimisticOwl - 04-01-2020 01:56 AM Big, I get the impression you are one of these guys who gives all the credit or all the blame to the QB. Although perhaps Trump better fits the role of Coach or Athletic Director, or in the pros, General Manager. Any way you look at it, you want to blame one guy for the team performance. I am not even sure the performance was bad. Continuing the football analogy, you seem to want to say Rice did poorly because Furman did better. I don’t know on what basis to rate Trump, or the CDC. I don’t have the experience with huge companies or government. But I think the response was not abjectly terrible, which would be an F. I think it was reasonably within the bounds of what we could expect in this country, regardless,of leader. So a B sounds reasonable to me. I guess the implication of an F is that anybody would have been better. I don’t come close to believing that. Would somebody else have been better. Maybe. Hard to believe he would be the best out 7 billion, so probably. Maybe Petraeus. Maybe Chris Christie. Maybe Fauci. Maybe Joe the Plumber. But They were not in office. We had no alternative that had been tested. The only alternative would have been Hillary, who had no experience in handling any sort of crisis. She was groomed and nominated to be one thing only, the First Woman POTUS. So, IMO, if you compare only to Hillary, he gets an A. If you compare him to the whole world, he gets a B. If we compare him to you, Big, he gets an F, since you would have done all the right things at the earliest possible moment, quickly discerning which experts to listen to and which to ignore. Compared to me, he gets an A++++++. I would have been vacationing in Hawaii. I think this assigning of blame/credit is as useless as the comparing of Trump/Hillary. But it seems to be important to you and all Democrats to be certain he is the goat, or scapegoat. Must be an election thing. If the primary goal is to defeat Trump and replace him with anybody, then he cannot be allowed to be credited with anything. So we start with the idea he is bad, and so whatever he did was bad, and then we can fill in the reasons for that as we go along, like he sent 17 tons of gear to China. Sorry to have rambled. Wizened old coots shouldn’t indulge in energy drinks, I guess. RE: Coronoavirus Covid-19 thread - mrbig - 04-01-2020 02:07 AM (03-31-2020 04:40 PM)OptimisticOwl Wrote: Going back to that, again? Apparently I am way funnier in my own head than in yours. Just trying to crack some jokes, this time poking fun at our previous exchange about racism. So ... lighten up, Francis? I again don't know what that means, but it seems to fit the circumstances. Another joke! As for GoodOwl, I might need to retract my earlier comment. He had a couple solid posts today, free of his usual vindictive. A welcome addition to his lexicon, as far as I am concerned. RE: Coronoavirus Covid-19 thread - mrbig - 04-01-2020 02:19 AM (04-01-2020 01:56 AM)OptimisticOwl Wrote: Big, I get the impression you are one of these guys who gives all the credit or all the blame to the QB. I think this is a fair assessment of how I assess POTUS, governors, and mayors. They are the QB, the head coach, the general manager, and the owner all wrapped into one spot. Of course, there are certain areas where they are constrained by Congress. But generally, if something falls through the cracks in the executive branch, I think POTUS is the one who needs to answer. After all, he/she is the only one who is elected. It was either POTUS's responsibility to see the problem and fix it or to hire the kind of people who would ferret out the problem and fix it. I guess that is the slings and arrows of being the most powerful person on the planet. |