(05-25-2020 04:52 PM)RiceLad15 Wrote:  

(05-25-2020 04:23 PM)OptimisticOwl Wrote:  I thought that would bring the Wonder Twins out of the woodwork.

Lol. Good way to spend your Memorial Day I guess.

(05-25-2020 03:27 PM)Rice93 Wrote:  He is criticized for not having a filter not because "he tells it like it is" but more so because he seems to immediately express every thought that occurs to him. It's like we tell our kids sometimes, you don't need to say every word that comes into your head because doing so will get you in trouble.

(05-26-2020 10:21 AM)Hambone10 Wrote:  

(05-25-2020 03:27 PM)Rice93 Wrote:  He is criticized for not having a filter not because "he tells it like it is" but more so because he seems to immediately express every thought that occurs to him. It's like we tell our kids sometimes, you don't need to say every word that comes into your head because doing so will get you in trouble.

But the difference is, you know your kids... so you know that when they say something that 'sounds' bad, you know that's not how they mean it. That's also true of 99% of the rest of the world, almost by extension.... 99% of the world isn't 'evil'. You do that to make their lives easier... but why do we need to make Trump's life easier? It's his job to make OURS easier.

But if you didn't know someone and you wanted to... or in this case, needed to... wouldn't their lack of filter make them vastly more transparent than someone who parses every word and you never really know what they're thinking... or whether 'what they said' and 'what that means' aren't remotely the same thing?

The reason it gets Trump in trouble is that 'scandal' sells... so rather than take words at their face value or make a logical presumption about intent.. or heaven forbid, ask for clarity... the press and 'haters' simply assume whatever works for them.

And that's not remotely hyperbole. The 'he's talking about ALL immigrants' or 'he's telling people to inject disinfectant' are only a few of some so obvious, I can't believe people are 'claiming' to be this ignorant to interpret it that way sort of thing.

In terms of knowing what they intend to do.... I'd much rather have someone without a filter than someone with a filter so refined that you can't tell the difference between truth and fiction.

(05-26-2020 10:29 AM)OptimisticOwl Wrote:  Interesting that the Democrats have nominated the only wordsmith worse than Trump.

(05-26-2020 10:29 AM)OptimisticOwl Wrote:  Interesting that the Democrats have nominated the only wordsmith worse than Trump.

(05-26-2020 10:29 AM)OptimisticOwl Wrote:  Interesting that the Democrats have nominated the only wordsmith worse than Trump.

(05-26-2020 10:45 AM)RiceLad15 Wrote:  

(05-26-2020 10:29 AM)OptimisticOwl Wrote:  Interesting that the Democrats have nominated the only wordsmith worse than Trump.

Yeah, it fricken sucks. The Democratic primary resulted in one of the worst candidates being selected. But I like Biden much better than the alternative.

Ironically, people who have voted for the Trump and often defend his word salads are trying to use this against Biden...

(05-26-2020 11:02 AM)OptimisticOwl Wrote:  

(05-26-2020 10:45 AM)RiceLad15 Wrote:  

(05-26-2020 10:29 AM)OptimisticOwl Wrote:  Interesting that the Democrats have nominated the only wordsmith worse than Trump.

Yeah, it fricken sucks. The Democratic primary resulted in one of the worst candidates being selected. But I like Biden much better than the alternative.

Ironically, people who have voted for the Trump and often defend his word salads are trying to use this against Biden...

Word salads? Plagiarizing from tanq, now? How appropriate for a Biden voter.

yeah, sometimes Trump could pick better words. Like he could easily have said "SOME of them are rapists', and if he had then maybe we would not have the left claiming he said all Mexicans are rapists.

I presume you are not talking about me, since I have never yet voted for Trump in any election.

But I will vote for him. In October, in early voting. I see results I like. I see nothing from the left I like. Clear choice. If Trump had been as bad as you guys make him out to be - racist, self-serving, a Russian plant, total evil, child molester, whatever...I would not vote for him. But he did not turn out to be any of those things. Not one.

What specifically do you think Biden will do that is different from Trump that will help the nation? Talk nicer to Jim Acosta? Grant exclusive interviews to CNN (excluding Fox)?

(05-26-2020 10:46 AM)tanqtonic Wrote:  

(05-26-2020 10:29 AM)OptimisticOwl Wrote:  Interesting that the Democrats have nominated the only wordsmith worse than Trump.

Is random word salad actually in the galaxy of 'wordsmithing'?

(05-26-2020 10:28 AM)RiceLad15 Wrote:  

(05-26-2020 10:21 AM)Hambone10 Wrote:  you can't tell the difference between truth and fiction.

In the end, isn't that the case with Trump?

His lack of filter creates a situation where one isn't certain what exactly he just said and what exactly it means? You're arguing that people take him at his word exactly, as opposed to either translating it to discern what he really means or following up to ask for clarity.

I want someone that thinks before they talk, so if they are trying to tell the world that only some immigrants meet the criteria, that is explicitly stated.

(05-26-2020 01:38 PM)Hambone10 Wrote:  

(05-26-2020 10:28 AM)RiceLad15 Wrote:  

(05-26-2020 10:21 AM)Hambone10 Wrote:  you can't tell the difference between truth and fiction.

In the end, isn't that the case with Trump?

His lack of filter creates a situation where one isn't certain what exactly he just said and what exactly it means? You're arguing that people take him at his word exactly, as opposed to either translating it to discern what he really means or following up to ask for clarity.

I want someone that thinks before they talk, so if they are trying to tell the world that only some immigrants meet the criteria, that is explicitly stated.

Well, that would be a new complaint that we haven't seen.

While they've often used completely ridiculous interpretations, to this point the left has claimed to be perfectly clear about 'what he meant'. I think this is complete horse-spit... that you guys don't know what he meant. I think it pretty clear that someone talking about 'building a wall' isn't remotely speaking about people coming across through a border gate. You guys told everyone else in the last election that he meant 'I hate brown people'.... now you're not sure?

I will say this... I don't expect a 'tweet' to contain all the nuances of a hundred or thousand page bill or even a 2 page EO... so if you're trying to read a tweet and assume that you'll know from just that, then I can't help you. I do think that people today do tend to assume that 'you follow them', so that they don't have to put every detail into every conversation... and with Trump, that's certainly true.

I suspect you'd claim that Obama was quite considered in his words and 'clear'... so why didn't I get to keep my doctors that I wanted to keep? Why didn't my costs go down? Why does my insurance cost MORE to keep my daughter on my plan than to get her her own plan?

Seriously, Lad... I'm really at a loss with the left on this one. Perhaps you can provide me with an example of an 'unclear' comment. I can sure provide you with a number from Biden.

(05-26-2020 01:51 PM)RiceLad15 Wrote:  

(05-26-2020 01:38 PM)Hambone10 Wrote:  

(05-26-2020 10:28 AM)RiceLad15 Wrote:  

(05-26-2020 10:21 AM)Hambone10 Wrote:  you can't tell the difference between truth and fiction.

In the end, isn't that the case with Trump?

His lack of filter creates a situation where one isn't certain what exactly he just said and what exactly it means? You're arguing that people take him at his word exactly, as opposed to either translating it to discern what he really means or following up to ask for clarity.

I want someone that thinks before they talk, so if they are trying to tell the world that only some immigrants meet the criteria, that is explicitly stated.

Well, that would be a new complaint that we haven't seen.

While they've often used completely ridiculous interpretations, to this point the left has claimed to be perfectly clear about 'what he meant'. I think this is complete horse-spit... that you guys don't know what he meant. I think it pretty clear that someone talking about 'building a wall' isn't remotely speaking about people coming across through a border gate. You guys told everyone else in the last election that he meant 'I hate brown people'.... now you're not sure?

I will say this... I don't expect a 'tweet' to contain all the nuances of a hundred or thousand page bill or even a 2 page EO... so if you're trying to read a tweet and assume that you'll know from just that, then I can't help you. I do think that people today do tend to assume that 'you follow them', so that they don't have to put every detail into every conversation... and with Trump, that's certainly true.

I suspect you'd claim that Obama was quite considered in his words and 'clear'... so why didn't I get to keep my doctors that I wanted to keep? Why didn't my costs go down? Why does my insurance cost MORE to keep my daughter on my plan than to get her her own plan?

Seriously, Lad... I'm really at a loss with the left on this one. Perhaps you can provide me with an example of an 'unclear' comment. I can sure provide you with a number from Biden.

There's a few things at play here when we talk about Trump.

But we are focused on Trump's choice to speak off the cuff, and how that creates two parallel universes. One where people take his words literally and one where they don't. And that happens because he doesn't always think about what he's saying, what words he is using, and how it sounds. That leads to different interpretations. Do you agree with that take?

And to Obama, being more careful and measured doesn't absolve someone of making off the cuff statements that bite you in the ass, lying, misspeaking, etc. But it does limit the number of instances. The fact that you can so clearly remember these Obama claims that turned out to be false, is kind of a testament to how much more measured he was. I honestly can't list what the biggest "lie" Trump has told, because he has told so many!

Quote:We report a time course of SARS-CoV-2 RNA concentrations in primary sewage sludge during the Spring COVID-19 outbreak in a northeastern U.S. metropolitan area. SARS-CoV-2 RNA was detected in all environmental samples and, when adjusted for the time lag, the virus RNA concentrations were highly correlated with the COVID-19 epidemiological curve (R2=0.99) and local hospital admissions (R2=0.99). SARS-CoV-2 RNA concentrations were a seven-day leading indicator ahead of compiled COVID-19 testing data and led local hospital admissions data by three days. Decisions to implement or relax public health measures and restrictions require timely information on outbreak dynamics in a community.

(05-26-2020 01:51 PM)RiceLad15 Wrote:  And to Obama, being more careful and measured doesn't absolve someone of making off the cuff statements that bite you in the ass, lying, misspeaking, etc. But it does limit the number of instances. The fact that you can so clearly remember these Obama claims that turned out to be false, is kind of a testament to how much more measured he was. I honestly can't list what the biggest "lie" Trump has told, because he has told so many!

(05-26-2020 02:03 PM)tanqtonic Wrote:  

(05-26-2020 01:51 PM)RiceLad15 Wrote:  

(05-26-2020 01:38 PM)Hambone10 Wrote:  

(05-26-2020 10:28 AM)RiceLad15 Wrote:  

(05-26-2020 10:21 AM)Hambone10 Wrote:  you can't tell the difference between truth and fiction.

In the end, isn't that the case with Trump?

His lack of filter creates a situation where one isn't certain what exactly he just said and what exactly it means? You're arguing that people take him at his word exactly, as opposed to either translating it to discern what he really means or following up to ask for clarity.

I want someone that thinks before they talk, so if they are trying to tell the world that only some immigrants meet the criteria, that is explicitly stated.

Well, that would be a new complaint that we haven't seen.

While they've often used completely ridiculous interpretations, to this point the left has claimed to be perfectly clear about 'what he meant'. I think this is complete horse-spit... that you guys don't know what he meant. I think it pretty clear that someone talking about 'building a wall' isn't remotely speaking about people coming across through a border gate. You guys told everyone else in the last election that he meant 'I hate brown people'.... now you're not sure?

I will say this... I don't expect a 'tweet' to contain all the nuances of a hundred or thousand page bill or even a 2 page EO... so if you're trying to read a tweet and assume that you'll know from just that, then I can't help you. I do think that people today do tend to assume that 'you follow them', so that they don't have to put every detail into every conversation... and with Trump, that's certainly true.

I suspect you'd claim that Obama was quite considered in his words and 'clear'... so why didn't I get to keep my doctors that I wanted to keep? Why didn't my costs go down? Why does my insurance cost MORE to keep my daughter on my plan than to get her her own plan?

Seriously, Lad... I'm really at a loss with the left on this one. Perhaps you can provide me with an example of an 'unclear' comment. I can sure provide you with a number from Biden.

There's a few things at play here when we talk about Trump.

But we are focused on Trump's choice to speak off the cuff, and how that creates two parallel universes. One where people take his words literally and one where they don't. And that happens because he doesn't always think about what he's saying, what words he is using, and how it sounds. That leads to different interpretations. Do you agree with that take?

And to Obama, being more careful and measured doesn't absolve someone of making off the cuff statements that bite you in the ass, lying, misspeaking, etc. But it does limit the number of instances. The fact that you can so clearly remember these Obama claims that turned out to be false, is kind of a testament to how much more measured he was. I honestly can't list what the biggest "lie" Trump has told, because he has told so many!

And Ambassador Stevens is worm-food because some dude made a movie making fun of Mohammed according to his administration.

I would absolutely state the the number of inaccuracies emanating from Trump surpass that from Obama.

Obama's all seem specifically predicated to move a political football.

I am sure I can dig up a **** ton on the Iran Cash Express, amongst many more topics.

And by the way lad, I cant square the circle with your first comment. You seem to indict Trump for 'talking loosely' and how dare he allow someone to roll additional meaning into his words.

Yet I cant begin to assemble the **** ton of instances where you undeniably state that a 'loose talk' is unequivocally racist (or something -ist).

You do a good job of assembling a 'heads I win, tails you lose argument' in that sense. In one instance you berate the looseness, then in others you pounce on such loose talk as 'undeniabl' something or another' --- that 'something or another' taking whatever the favorite -ist seems to be from the talking points that day.

Bravo.

Quote: When Mexico sends its people, they’re not sending their best. They’re sending people that have lots of problems, and they’re bringing those problems with us. They’re bringing drugs, they’re bringing crime, they’re rapists. And some, I assume, are good people.

(05-26-2020 11:48 PM)At Ease Wrote:  

Quote: In the spring of 2017, the Trump team formally stripped OSHA's airborne infectious disease rule from the regulatory agenda. NPR could find no indication the new administration had specific policy concerns about the infectious disease rules.

Instead, the decision appeared to be part of a wider effort to cut regulations and bureaucratic oversight.

"Earlier this year we set a target of adding zero new regulatory costs onto the American economy," Trump said in December 2017. "As a result, the never-ending growth of red tape in America has come to a sudden, screeching and beautiful halt."

(05-27-2020 06:16 AM)RiceLad15 Wrote:  

(05-26-2020 11:48 PM)At Ease Wrote:  

Something, something, doers not planners, no specifics in the plan, something, something.

Quote: In the spring of 2017, the Trump team formally stripped OSHA's airborne infectious disease rule from the regulatory agenda. NPR could find no indication the new administration had specific policy concerns about the infectious disease rules.
Instead, the decision appeared to be part of a wider effort to cut regulations and bureaucratic oversight.
"Earlier this year we set a target of adding zero new regulatory costs onto the American economy," Trump said in December 2017. "As a result, the never-ending growth of red tape in America has come to a sudden, screeching and beautiful halt."

(05-27-2020 07:26 AM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote:  

(05-27-2020 06:16 AM)RiceLad15 Wrote:  

(05-26-2020 11:48 PM)At Ease Wrote:  

Something, something, doers not planners, no specifics in the plan, something, something.

Quote: In the spring of 2017, the Trump team formally stripped OSHA's airborne infectious disease rule from the regulatory agenda. NPR could find no indication the new administration had specific policy concerns about the infectious disease rules.
Instead, the decision appeared to be part of a wider effort to cut regulations and bureaucratic oversight.
"Earlier this year we set a target of adding zero new regulatory costs onto the American economy," Trump said in December 2017. "As a result, the never-ending growth of red tape in America has come to a sudden, screeching and beautiful halt."

The argument that you appear to be trying to make rests upon two assumptions, 1) the the regulations would have been effective, and 2) that they would have been implemented in time to make a difference in this crisis. I an unwilling to concede either assumption.