Quote:There are already only a tiny handful of Division II football schools west of Colorado. One school in Utah and another in Texas (not west of Colorado, but bear with me) are planning FCS jumps. Meanwhile, FCS only has one Western conference, the Big Sky, and that league’s already pretty full. There are signs the WAC is interested in getting back into the football business. And if Boise were to leave the Mountain West, that conference would have serious chaos potential.

(02-24-2020 12:50 PM)IWokeUpLikeThis Wrote:  Where is Colorado Mines? There are people today who were alive when the Orediggers rubbed shoulders in the same conference as Colorado, Utah, and BYU. BYU has an interest to elevate CSM as it fills a November slot on the schedule and gets Mormons exposure into the Oredigger demographic.

(02-24-2020 12:52 PM)CitrusUCF Wrote:  David,

I like your outside the box thinking at times, but this isn't going to happen. Out of all those schools you listed, maybe 2-3 can support FCS. That's simply based on enrollment without looking further at revenue figures, which are going to be low. Enrollment and geography are just two factors, and a lot of the schools you've mentioned don't have the enrollment to support FCS or the geography that would make it feasible.

The geography matters because at this level, travel costs are very meaningful. Flying an FCS football team around the country is incredibly expensive with far less revenue potential than an FBS squad. Hawaii can barely afford to send a team to the mainland, and you're talking about a very small campus of the same system playing FCS? Central Washington and Western Washington aren't in any better shape than Eastern Washington, and there's a whole thread dedicated to their struggles. Yes, they're closer to Seattle, but they also don't have a large metro area like Spokane to draw fans from. There's no indication that they have the support necessary to move up to FCS, especially in a far-flung conference like the WAC would be. You love to talk about Colorado-Mesa, but Grand Junction is depressed with a huge meth problem...it's highly unlikely they have the finances to move up to FCS.

Anyway, the point is, if you want to talk about this, you need to go pull revenue data from the Department of Education database. Then you can compare the revenue that these D-2 schools have to what FCS schools have and look at the historical growth for schools that moved up from D-2 to FCS and control for attendance and the local economy. Then, you can come up with a list of schools where FCS is realistic. This can all be done in Excel, then you can interpret the data and post results that have a scientific basis.

(02-24-2020 12:36 PM)DavidSt Wrote:  Article About Boise State And Possible Landing Spot For Them After MWC

Quote:There are already only a tiny handful of Division II football schools west of Colorado. One school in Utah and another in Texas (not west of Colorado, but bear with me) are planning FCS jumps. Meanwhile, FCS only has one Western conference, the Big Sky, and that league’s already pretty full. There are signs the WAC is interested in getting back into the football business. And if Boise were to leave the Mountain West, that conference would have serious chaos potential.

The only schools jumping to D1 with football from D2 with Dixie State joining already are Central Washington, Western Oregon, Azusa Pacific and Simon Fraser. I could put Colorado Mesa in the same region. There are some schools out west from D2 could also join D1 with football or could add football.

Simon Fraser
Azusa Pacific
Central Washington
Western Oregon
Colorado Mesa
CSU-Peublo
New Mexico Highlands
Eastern New Mexico
West Texas A&M
Midwestern State
Kingsville
Commerce
UTPB
Angelo State
Central Oklahoma

Could restart or add football?
Western Washington
CSU-Dominguez Hills
East Bay State
Hawaii-West Oahu? They might get a waiver since there are not any other Hawaii schools with football at any levels. They could get a provisional status at D1 as not eligible for post season until they get their sports going. NCAA did that for Alaska Pacific at D1 for a time.
CSU-San Bernardino
Sonoma State
Chico State
Los Angeles State
San Francisco State

Some Big Sky schools could form a WAC FBS conference with Boise State and New Mexico State.

It depends on how the MWC/Boise State's drama go on for the next 5 years.

Utah Valley
Grand Canyon
UTRGV
Fullerton State
Long Beach State
Northridge State
UC-San Diego
and possible UC-Irvine
All could decide to pull the trigger in adding football as a sport. There are now women sports being added as emerging sports that could help the Title 9 issues.

This is just some rumors or news articles from the past. It is something that we should expect in the future on the west coast conferences for expansion concerns.
Big West
MWC
Big Sky
Summit
WAC
GNAC
Lone Star
RMAC
MIAA
All could be effected by any realignment in the future.

The New Mexico schools from D2 are just speculations, but the other schools have been mentioned to go D1. Simon Fraser wants to get a waiver already to play men's ice hockey at D1 which would help the Alaska schools. I do think the NCAA may give them a waiver for what went down with the hockey conference that the Alaska schools are in.

(02-24-2020 01:42 PM)DavidSt Wrote:  

(02-24-2020 12:52 PM)CitrusUCF Wrote:  David,

I like your outside the box thinking at times, but this isn't going to happen. Out of all those schools you listed, maybe 2-3 can support FCS. That's simply based on enrollment without looking further at revenue figures, which are going to be low. Enrollment and geography are just two factors, and a lot of the schools you've mentioned don't have the enrollment to support FCS or the geography that would make it feasible.

The geography matters because at this level, travel costs are very meaningful. Flying an FCS football team around the country is incredibly expensive with far less revenue potential than an FBS squad. Hawaii can barely afford to send a team to the mainland, and you're talking about a very small campus of the same system playing FCS? Central Washington and Western Washington aren't in any better shape than Eastern Washington, and there's a whole thread dedicated to their struggles. Yes, they're closer to Seattle, but they also don't have a large metro area like Spokane to draw fans from. There's no indication that they have the support necessary to move up to FCS, especially in a far-flung conference like the WAC would be. You love to talk about Colorado-Mesa, but Grand Junction is depressed with a huge meth problem...it's highly unlikely they have the finances to move up to FCS.

Anyway, the point is, if you want to talk about this, you need to go pull revenue data from the Department of Education database. Then you can compare the revenue that these D-2 schools have to what FCS schools have and look at the historical growth for schools that moved up from D-2 to FCS and control for attendance and the local economy. Then, you can come up with a list of schools where FCS is realistic. This can all be done in Excel, then you can interpret the data and post results that have a scientific basis.

If you look at Central and Western Washington campuses, they do have high enrollment. Getting them to D1 along with Western Oregon and SFU? The Big Sky could split into 2 conferences if they wanted to. This could help ease money woes at Eastern Washington. As it is, the GNAC schools are already have football agreement with the Lone Star Conference. Having them joining the WAC, they only travel to 2 Texas schools. I think the article might be hinting of a reform west coast conferences for the FCS and a possible FBS WAC again. As it is, GNAC just lost a school as Concordia-Portland closed, and there are doubts about the other privates in the region.

(02-24-2020 01:42 PM)DavidSt Wrote:  

(02-24-2020 12:52 PM)CitrusUCF Wrote:  David,

I like your outside the box thinking at times, but this isn't going to happen. Out of all those schools you listed, maybe 2-3 can support FCS. That's simply based on enrollment without looking further at revenue figures, which are going to be low. Enrollment and geography are just two factors, and a lot of the schools you've mentioned don't have the enrollment to support FCS or the geography that would make it feasible.

The geography matters because at this level, travel costs are very meaningful. Flying an FCS football team around the country is incredibly expensive with far less revenue potential than an FBS squad. Hawaii can barely afford to send a team to the mainland, and you're talking about a very small campus of the same system playing FCS? Central Washington and Western Washington aren't in any better shape than Eastern Washington, and there's a whole thread dedicated to their struggles. Yes, they're closer to Seattle, but they also don't have a large metro area like Spokane to draw fans from. There's no indication that they have the support necessary to move up to FCS, especially in a far-flung conference like the WAC would be. You love to talk about Colorado-Mesa, but Grand Junction is depressed with a huge meth problem...it's highly unlikely they have the finances to move up to FCS.

Anyway, the point is, if you want to talk about this, you need to go pull revenue data from the Department of Education database. Then you can compare the revenue that these D-2 schools have to what FCS schools have and look at the historical growth for schools that moved up from D-2 to FCS and control for attendance and the local economy. Then, you can come up with a list of schools where FCS is realistic. This can all be done in Excel, then you can interpret the data and post results that have a scientific basis.

If you look at Central and Western Washington campuses, they do have high enrollment. Getting them to D1 along with Western Oregon and SFU? The Big Sky could split into 2 conferences if they wanted to. This could help ease money woes at Eastern Washington. As it is, the GNAC schools are already have football agreement with the Lone Star Conference. Having them joining the WAC, they only travel to 2 Texas schools. I think the article might be hinting of a reform west coast conferences for the FCS and a possible FBS WAC again. As it is, GNAC just lost a school as Concordia-Portland closed, and there are doubts about the other privates in the region.

(02-24-2020 12:54 PM)DavidSt Wrote:  

(02-24-2020 12:50 PM)IWokeUpLikeThis Wrote:  Where is Colorado Mines? There are people today who were alive when the Orediggers rubbed shoulders in the same conference as Colorado, Utah, and BYU. BYU has an interest to elevate CSM as it fills a November slot on the schedule and gets Mormons exposure into the Oredigger demographic.

They are too small to add to D1. They need to get more students to be enrolled before joining D1. Colorado Mesa is the largest football school and Metro State is the largest non-football school in the state.

(02-24-2020 12:54 PM)DavidSt Wrote:  

(02-24-2020 12:50 PM)IWokeUpLikeThis Wrote:  Where is Colorado Mines? There are people today who were alive when the Orediggers rubbed shoulders in the same conference as Colorado, Utah, and BYU. BYU has an interest to elevate CSM as it fills a November slot on the schedule and gets Mormons exposure into the Oredigger demographic.

They are too small to add to D1. They need to get more students to be enrolled before joining D1. Colorado Mesa is the largest football school and Metro State is the largest non-football school in the state.

Quote:I’ll keep this section brief, but if you’d rather go right to REALIGNMENT FANFIC, just scroll down a bit.

(02-24-2020 02:07 PM)Fighting Muskie Wrote:  David, the only place out west where I think there might be an appetite for DI FCS among the D2 ranks are among the Lonestar schools and even they don’t seem to be lining up in droves to become WAC members.

You have to factor in enrollment, finances, and demographics when looking at schools as candidates for moving up.

Public schools in CA, no matter how big, probably aren’t adding football. The Cal St’s are generally poor commuter schools and football is rapidly declining in popularity in the liberal portions of that state (as well other western states like WA and OR).