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I have been a hunter my whole life, but this is sick and horrible.... - usmbacker - 07-02-2018 01:21 AM
This almost made my physically ill when I just saw this article. This is not what hunting is about. This women is a very sick person.
http://www.foxnews.com/world/2018/07/01/american-hunters-images-her-black-giraffe-trophy-kill-spark-outrage.html
RE: I have been a hunter my whole life, but this is sick and horrible.... - Kaplony - 07-02-2018 01:36 AM
(07-02-2018 01:21 AM)usmbacker Wrote: This almost made my physically ill when I just saw this article. This is not what hunting is about. This women is a very sick person.
http://www.foxnews.com/world/2018/07/01/american-hunters-images-her-black-giraffe-trophy-kill-spark-outrage.html
While I have no desire to go to Africa and do a hunt like this I have to question your opinion on this. She hunted this animal in a legal and ethical manner. No different than someone who employed a guide to kill a moose, mountain goat, or big horn sheep.I have no problem with folks booking a hunt with a reputable guide and going to Africa for a hunt.
RE: I have been a hunter my whole life, but this is sick and horrible.... - TomorrowHerd - 07-02-2018 02:05 AM
The $$$$ that she paid to hunt this animal is used to probably employ 6 people/families for an entire year.
In order to keep these hunts sustainable for the future, the community practices conservation, and encourages the birth rate and protects the habitat of these animals to increase.
These hunters are told what animals they can and cannot shoot.
The 2000# of meat probably fed the community for a week or 2.
This type of hunt is actually good for the animals AND the people in the region.
I am not a hunter. I personally do not like the practice of killing an innocent animal.
I do not begrudge any one else hunting, or fishing (which I enjoy).
I do understand the necessity of hunting. Especially, here in AK where there is much subsistence hunting.
RE: I have been a hunter my whole life, but this is sick and horrible.... - WKUYG - 07-02-2018 02:52 AM
I'm not a hunter but the one thing I do understand is sometimes killing one animal might save others. This Animal had already killed 3 males that were mating and this one was too old to mate.
The money she paid helps protect the other animals from poachers and without hunts like this there would be no money to pay for that protection. I read where one company that set up hunts just like this one was in business for 40 years before Obama put a ban on these type of kills entering the USA.
18 months after that ban the company went out of business because Americans were no longer paying the 50 to 100k for these hunting trips. This company spent over 1 million a year to help keep poaching down on the 1000s of acres of land they leased.
Once they shut down with in 3 months it was reported over 300 animals were killed...poached. The animals on these hunts are chosen and for a reason and from what I've read hunts like this actually help keep the herds more healthy. Without these hunts a lot of the animals destroy the farms of some very poor people. They come in and eat everything and destroy what they dont eat. Once a animal does that its hard to keep that animal from repeating it
I'm a fisherman and even then 90% of the time its catch and release. Hell I don't even own a gun but do understand that keeping a herd thinned out and especially the weak, actually is a good thing. We people have moved onto those lands (yes even in the huge open spaces of Africa) that animals roam. So sometimes killing a few help keep them strong.
The sad thing, most of those people, saying this girl is awful and the poor animal....dont have a problem sucking a baby, from a mothers womb
RE: I have been a hunter my whole life, but this is sick and horrible.... - gdunn - 07-02-2018 06:09 AM
I'm not big on trophy hunting however, the money she spent along with the locals getting the meat, I'm not upset. If she did everything legally and this was not an endangered species, I don't see the outrage.
RE: I have been a hunter my whole life, but this is sick and horrible.... - Owl 69/70/75 - 07-02-2018 06:22 AM
This is actually one of the best ways to protect endangered species.
Provide a way to obtain market value from them, and measures will be implemented to grow their numbers.
Why are cows not extinct? Not because they have any superior self defense mechanisms or superior intelligence, but because they are worth money.
RE: I have been a hunter my whole life, but this is sick and horrible.... - thespiritof1976 - 07-02-2018 06:25 AM
(07-02-2018 01:21 AM)usmbacker Wrote: This almost made my physically ill when I just saw this article. This is not what hunting is about. This women is a very sick person.
http://www.foxnews.com/world/2018/07/01/american-hunters-images-her-black-giraffe-trophy-kill-spark-outrage.html
I agree 100%. There are some animals that should NEVER be hunted.
Rhinos, Lions, Tigers, Giraffes, Elephants, Dogs, Cats, Horses, Whales, Pandas, etc....
RE: I have been a hunter my whole life, but this is sick and horrible.... - TomorrowHerd - 07-02-2018 06:26 AM
(07-02-2018 06:22 AM)Owl 69/70/75 Wrote: This is actually one of the best ways to protect endangered species.
Provide a way to obtain market value from them, and measures will be implemented to grow their numbers.
Why are cows not extinct? Not because they have any superior self defense mechanisms or superior intelligence, but because they are worth money, and taste good.
FIFY :)
I wonder what giraffe tastes like???
RE: I have been a hunter my whole life, but this is sick and horrible.... - EigenEagle - 07-02-2018 07:24 AM
(07-02-2018 06:25 AM)thespiritof1976 Wrote:(07-02-2018 01:21 AM)usmbacker Wrote: This almost made my physically ill when I just saw this article. This is not what hunting is about. This women is a very sick person.
http://www.foxnews.com/world/2018/07/01/american-hunters-images-her-black-giraffe-trophy-kill-spark-outrage.html
I agree 100%. There are some animals that should NEVER be hunted.
Rhinos, Lions, Tigers, Giraffes, Elephants, Dogs, Cats, Horses, Whales, Pandas, etc....
I agree you shouldn't be able to hunt a threatened species or (obviously) animals that belong to someone else.
But holding different moral standards for different animals based just on how majestic or how fluffy and cute they are is BS and people have to fight that tendency.
I kind of cringe thinking about Asian cultures that eat dog but when we eat cows and pigs there's no real way to claim moral high ground there, so I don't try.
RE: I have been a hunter my whole life, but this is sick and horrible.... - thespiritof1976 - 07-02-2018 07:34 AM
(07-02-2018 07:24 AM)EigenEagle Wrote:(07-02-2018 06:25 AM)thespiritof1976 Wrote:(07-02-2018 01:21 AM)usmbacker Wrote: This almost made my physically ill when I just saw this article. This is not what hunting is about. This women is a very sick person.
http://www.foxnews.com/world/2018/07/01/american-hunters-images-her-black-giraffe-trophy-kill-spark-outrage.html
I agree 100%. There are some animals that should NEVER be hunted.
Rhinos, Lions, Tigers, Giraffes, Elephants, Dogs, Cats, Horses, Whales, Pandas, etc....
I agree you shouldn't be able to hunt a threatened species or (obviously) animals that belong to someone else.
But holding different moral standards for different animals based just on how majestic or how fluffy and cute they are is BS and people have to fight that tendency.
I kind of cringe thinking about Asian cultures that eat dog but when we eat cows and pigs there's no real way to claim moral high ground there, so I don't try.
Not all animals are equal. A dog is FAR above that of a cow or pig on the zoological ladder.
For me, a dog is a "god" while a cow or pig is an amoeba. The dog is a morally superior creature to that of the cow or other type livestock.
Anyone that eats dog should not be allowed into this country. IMO, it is a taboo that should be considered just a small step below that of cannibalism.
RE: I have been a hunter my whole life, but this is sick and horrible.... - EigenEagle - 07-02-2018 07:45 AM
(07-02-2018 07:34 AM)thespiritof1976 Wrote: Not all animals are equal. A dog is FAR above that of a cow or pig on the zoological ladder.
For me, a dog is a "god" while a cow or pig is an amoeba. The dog is a morally superior creature to that of the cow or other type livestock.
Anyone that eats dog should not be allowed into this country. IMO, it is a taboo that should be considered just a small step below that of cannibalism.
What does this mean? You know that probably every mammal that we get meat from is probably smarter than the smartest dog breeds, right? Especially the pigs.
Isn't cognition really why we say we have more rights than animals in the first place?
RE: I have been a hunter my whole life, but this is sick and horrible.... - Paul M - 07-02-2018 08:02 AM
Debra Messing is wrong. Ditto for Trump. This is what real conservation looks like Drump, you dipshit. Not your all's leftist touchy-feely harmful faux conservation policies that end with more animals near extinction.
RE: I have been a hunter my whole life, but this is sick and horrible.... - thespiritof1976 - 07-02-2018 08:03 AM
(07-02-2018 07:45 AM)EigenEagle Wrote:(07-02-2018 07:34 AM)thespiritof1976 Wrote: Not all animals are equal. A dog is FAR above that of a cow or pig on the zoological ladder.
For me, a dog is a "god" while a cow or pig is an amoeba. The dog is a morally superior creature to that of the cow or other type livestock.
Anyone that eats dog should not be allowed into this country. IMO, it is a taboo that should be considered just a small step below that of cannibalism.
What does this mean? You know that probably every mammal that we get meat from is probably smarter than the smartest dog breeds, right? Especially the pigs.
Isn't cognition really why we say we have more rights than animals in the first place?
When pigs can lead the blind around come back and talk. And no, one pig here and there doesn't do it for me. There is a reason the dog has been by mankind's side for millennia.
Way I see it is simple, the dog, next to the human, the cat, and a few other animals, is the most morally superior animal God or aliens or whatever created. And, IMO, I like dogs. And I don't like people who don't.
RE: I have been a hunter my whole life, but this is sick and horrible.... - Paul M - 07-02-2018 08:05 AM
(07-02-2018 08:03 AM)thespiritof1976 Wrote: When pigs can lead the blind around come back and talk.
They can.
RE: I have been a hunter my whole life, but this is sick and horrible.... - BadgerMJ - 07-02-2018 08:07 AM
I'm not a hunter or an "outdoorsman" by any stretch, but I think we tend to "Americanize" situations like this.
Personally, I wouldn't do anything like this.
BUT
She was on a LEGAL hunt. It was LEGAL to kill the animal she did. Some of these countries make $$$ allowing foreigners to go on "safari" and hunt trophy animals. It's a big portion of some regions income.
Maybe we should realize that just because we as Americans find something repulsive doesn't mean the rest of the world feels the same way.
So I ask, which is worse, killing a giraffe on a legal big game hunt or allowing people who depend on these hunts as a way of life to starve? I mean, it's not like these folks can head over to Manpower and get a variety of temp jobs......
RE: I have been a hunter my whole life, but this is sick and horrible.... - thespiritof1976 - 07-02-2018 08:07 AM
(07-02-2018 08:05 AM)Paul M Wrote:(07-02-2018 08:03 AM)thespiritof1976 Wrote: When pigs can lead the blind around come back and talk.
They can.
The scent of bacon on a plate doesn't sway me.
Dogs>every other animal
RE: I have been a hunter my whole life, but this is sick and horrible.... - thespiritof1976 - 07-02-2018 08:09 AM
(07-02-2018 08:07 AM)BadgerMJ Wrote: I'm not a hunter or an "outdoorsman" by any stretch, but I think we tend to "Americanize" situations like this.
Personally, I wouldn't do anything like this.
BUT
She was on a LEGAL hunt. It was LEGAL to kill the animal she did. Some of these countries make $$$ allowing foreigners to go on "safari" and hunt trophy animals. It's a big portion of some regions income.
Maybe we should realize that just because we as Americans find something repulsive doesn't mean the rest of the world feels the same way.
So I ask, which is worse, killing a giraffe on a legal big game hunt or allowing people who depend on these hunts as a way of life to starve? I mean, it's not like these folks can head over to Manpower and get a variety of temp jobs......
If I were in charge, I'd strip her citizenship and deport her. I'll take it one step further too, eating dog and cat should be a serious crime. Much akin to cannibalism or bestiality.
Oh, and Africa. Fertile land. No reason to starve there. The people there are too many, IMO. Need to introduce massive sex ed and family planning so the population can be managed. Or, as I prefer it, get the hell out of Africa. Missionaries included. They are part of the problem IMO.
RE: I have been a hunter my whole life, but this is sick and horrible.... - EigenEagle - 07-02-2018 08:09 AM
(07-02-2018 08:03 AM)thespiritof1976 Wrote:(07-02-2018 07:45 AM)EigenEagle Wrote:(07-02-2018 07:34 AM)thespiritof1976 Wrote: Not all animals are equal. A dog is FAR above that of a cow or pig on the zoological ladder.
For me, a dog is a "god" while a cow or pig is an amoeba. The dog is a morally superior creature to that of the cow or other type livestock.
Anyone that eats dog should not be allowed into this country. IMO, it is a taboo that should be considered just a small step below that of cannibalism.
What does this mean? You know that probably every mammal that we get meat from is probably smarter than the smartest dog breeds, right? Especially the pigs.
Isn't cognition really why we say we have more rights than animals in the first place?
When pigs can lead the blind around come back and talk.
Pigs could easily do that from a cognitive standpoint. The issue is that they are bigger and more costly and more difficult to care for. And does that mean you'd be okay with eating chiuaua's and other small dog breeds no one would ever use as service dogs? And what about cats? Whoever heard of a service cat or a drug-sniffing cat?
RE: I have been a hunter my whole life, but this is sick and horrible.... - thespiritof1976 - 07-02-2018 08:12 AM
(07-02-2018 08:09 AM)EigenEagle Wrote:(07-02-2018 08:03 AM)thespiritof1976 Wrote:(07-02-2018 07:45 AM)EigenEagle Wrote:(07-02-2018 07:34 AM)thespiritof1976 Wrote: Not all animals are equal. A dog is FAR above that of a cow or pig on the zoological ladder.
For me, a dog is a "god" while a cow or pig is an amoeba. The dog is a morally superior creature to that of the cow or other type livestock.
Anyone that eats dog should not be allowed into this country. IMO, it is a taboo that should be considered just a small step below that of cannibalism.
What does this mean? You know that probably every mammal that we get meat from is probably smarter than the smartest dog breeds, right? Especially the pigs.
Isn't cognition really why we say we have more rights than animals in the first place?
When pigs can lead the blind around come back and talk.
Pigs could easily do that from a cognitive standpoint. The issue is that they are bigger and more costly and more difficult to care for. And does that mean you'd be okay with eating chiuaua's and other small dog breeds no one would ever use as service dogs? And what about cats? Whoever heard of a service cat or a drug-sniffing cat?
Quit trying to move the goal posts. You lost this one.
RE: I have been a hunter my whole life, but this is sick and horrible.... - BadgerMJ - 07-02-2018 08:12 AM
(07-02-2018 07:34 AM)thespiritof1976 Wrote:(07-02-2018 07:24 AM)EigenEagle Wrote:(07-02-2018 06:25 AM)thespiritof1976 Wrote:(07-02-2018 01:21 AM)usmbacker Wrote: This almost made my physically ill when I just saw this article. This is not what hunting is about. This women is a very sick person.
http://www.foxnews.com/world/2018/07/01/american-hunters-images-her-black-giraffe-trophy-kill-spark-outrage.html
I agree 100%. There are some animals that should NEVER be hunted.
Rhinos, Lions, Tigers, Giraffes, Elephants, Dogs, Cats, Horses, Whales, Pandas, etc....
I agree you shouldn't be able to hunt a threatened species or (obviously) animals that belong to someone else.
But holding different moral standards for different animals based just on how majestic or how fluffy and cute they are is BS and people have to fight that tendency.
I kind of cringe thinking about Asian cultures that eat dog but when we eat cows and pigs there's no real way to claim moral high ground there, so I don't try.
Not all animals are equal. A dog is FAR above that of a cow or pig on the zoological ladder.
For me, a dog is a "god" while a cow or pig is an amoeba. The dog is a morally superior creature to that of the cow or other type livestock.
Anyone that eats dog should not be allowed into this country. IMO, it is a taboo that should be considered just a small step below that of cannibalism.
You're right, not all animals are equal, but that doesn't mean we should force our "equality scale" on other cultures.
We consider dogs to be man's best friend. Other countries don't. If they come HERE, they should do as we do, but when they're on their OWN country, they should be allowed to do as THEY see fit and believe.