+- CSNbbs (https://csnbbs.com)
+-- Forum: Active Boards (/forum-769.html)
+--- Forum: Lounge (/forum-564.html)
+---- Forum: The Kyra Memorial Spin Room (/forum-540.html)
+---- Thread: Concealed Carry Reciprocity (/thread-829753.html)
Concealed Carry Reciprocity - georgia_tech_swagger - 10-11-2017 10:44 PM
Gun Owners America is now doing a full court press on it. This is the THIRD hard push mailer they've sent me, which includes one sided postcards (for fast USPS vetting) to Mitch and my Senators. And now they've had a lifetime member announce a $100k matching fund drive specifically earmarked for pushing the US Senate over the hump on national CCW reciprocity.
Where's the NRA on this?
Where's the GOP "leadership" on this?
There's a reason Ron Paul called GOA "the only no compromise gun lobby in Washington", and it's action like this instead of tepid talk that proves it.
RE: Concealed Carry Reciprocity - HeartOfDixie - 10-11-2017 10:47 PM
I am not a fan of nationwide reciprocity.
This is where many conservatives fall off the bandwagon.
RE: Concealed Carry Reciprocity - georgia_tech_swagger - 10-11-2017 10:48 PM
(10-11-2017 10:47 PM)HeartOfDixie Wrote: I am not a fan of nationwide reciprocity.
Go on. I'm listening.
RE: Concealed Carry Reciprocity - HeartOfDixie - 10-11-2017 10:51 PM
(10-11-2017 10:48 PM)georgia_tech_swagger Wrote:(10-11-2017 10:47 PM)HeartOfDixie Wrote: I am not a fan of nationwide reciprocity.
Go on. I'm listening.
I prefer for my state to make its own laws and regulations and not be forced by the Federal government to adopt those of another, even when it comes to guns which I support.
RE: Concealed Carry Reciprocity - georgia_tech_swagger - 10-11-2017 10:57 PM
(10-11-2017 10:51 PM)HeartOfDixie Wrote: I prefer for my state to make its own laws and regulations and not be forced by the Federal government to adopt those of another, even when it comes to guns which I support.
Your state already by its own choice has submitted itself to the laws and regulations of other states through voluntary reciprocity. With states that even do out of state CCW off just a background check like Utah. I can get Alabama CCW reciprocity right now through getting Utah out of state. No prints. No practical. Just a background check. And SC has, weirdly, one of the more tough CCW requirements (full prints with practical and mandatory training). Though we came about a half dozen votes shy of passing Constitutional Carry two years ago. And really it's just a matter of time before Constitutional Carry becomes the national standard. It's already well in motion.
So for me your argument doesn't carry water because Alabama has already voluntarily signed up for the loosest law on the books by having reciprocity with Utah.
RE: Concealed Carry Reciprocity - HeartOfDixie - 10-11-2017 11:01 PM
(10-11-2017 10:57 PM)georgia_tech_swagger Wrote:(10-11-2017 10:51 PM)HeartOfDixie Wrote: I prefer for my state to make its own laws and regulations and not be forced by the Federal government to adopt those of another, even when it comes to guns which I support.
Your state already by its own choice has submitted itself to the laws and regulations of other states through voluntary reciprocity. With states that even do out of state CCW off just a background check like Utah. I can get Alabama CCW reciprocity right now through getting Utah out of state. No prints. No practical. Just a background check. And SC has, weirdly, one of the more tough CCW requirements (full prints with practical and mandatory training). Though we came about a half dozen votes shy of passing Constitutional Carry two years ago. And really it's just a matter of time before Constitutional Carry becomes the national standard. It's already well in motion.
So for me your argument doesn't carry water because Alabama has already voluntarily signed up for the loosest law on the books by having reciprocity with Utah.
I’m concerned with the process, not the result.
I’m fine with Alabama voluntarily entering into reciprocity agreements.
I’m not okay with a Federal Law mandating such a result.
RE: Concealed Carry Reciprocity - geosnooker2000 - 10-11-2017 11:24 PM
(10-11-2017 11:01 PM)HeartOfDixie Wrote:(10-11-2017 10:57 PM)georgia_tech_swagger Wrote:(10-11-2017 10:51 PM)HeartOfDixie Wrote: I prefer for my state to make its own laws and regulations and not be forced by the Federal government to adopt those of another, even when it comes to guns which I support.
Your state already by its own choice has submitted itself to the laws and regulations of other states through voluntary reciprocity. With states that even do out of state CCW off just a background check like Utah. I can get Alabama CCW reciprocity right now through getting Utah out of state. No prints. No practical. Just a background check. And SC has, weirdly, one of the more tough CCW requirements (full prints with practical and mandatory training). Though we came about a half dozen votes shy of passing Constitutional Carry two years ago. And really it's just a matter of time before Constitutional Carry becomes the national standard. It's already well in motion.
So for me your argument doesn't carry water because Alabama has already voluntarily signed up for the loosest law on the books by having reciprocity with Utah.
I’m concerned with the process, not the result.
I’m fine with Alabama voluntarily entering into reciprocity agreements.
I’m not okay with a Federal Law mandating such a result.
I'm with you on this. I like gun rights being expanded, but I'm definitely a Federalist. Tennessee is sovereign. The Feds can stick it up their arse.
RE: Concealed Carry Reciprocity - rath v2.0 - 10-12-2017 06:51 AM
My knock on national reciprocity?
If you make it a federal law vs. an individual state decision you've effectively given up the high ground to the next administration that has a different view on gun rights as well as a state's ability to make all of those decisions.
It's fine how is. I have 43 or more states I can freely carry in.
RE: Concealed Carry Reciprocity - TigerBlue4Ever - 10-12-2017 08:17 AM
Yeah, I don't wish to cede my states rights to federal law. If I can't legally carry in another state then I'll do everything I can to avoid that state. While I kind of like the idea of the feds compelling a state that has no right to carry laws to allow it as a middle finger to them, I understand the inherent dangers of that.
RE: Concealed Carry Reciprocity - cb4029 - 10-12-2017 09:16 AM
You don't respect the federal government, you don't respect the flag. You guys need to bow down to the authority.
RE: Concealed Carry Reciprocity - rath v2.0 - 10-12-2017 12:09 PM
Reason I may be ok with it is that to challenge it liberals would need to make the same state's rights arguments that have been made in all of the gun rights cases. It would be priceless.
RE: Concealed Carry Reciprocity - georgia_tech_swagger - 10-12-2017 12:35 PM
I have a rather different view. This is Amendment 14 applied to Amendment 2. This is civil rights for gun rights. This is cramming the 2nd amendment down the leftist state's throats whether they like it or not. Looking at you NY, IL, and CA.
RE: Concealed Carry Reciprocity - rath v2.0 - 10-12-2017 12:42 PM
That is a question for the SCOTUS.
Keep in mind if its federal legislation, the next congress and next president may not be so hip to it and the replacement legislation may take back much more than this one gives.
Telling you, we do not want precedent established that the federal government has any say in mandating (or otherwise) concealed carry statutes to states. It opens Pandora's Box. Legislative history and intent would then be used against challenges to some future draconian anti gun measure out of DC.
RE: Concealed Carry Reciprocity - georgia_tech_swagger - 10-12-2017 12:51 PM
(10-12-2017 12:42 PM)rath v2.0 Wrote: That is a question for the SCOTUS.
Keep in mind if its federal legislation, the next congress and next president may not be so hip to it and the replacement legislation may take back much more than this one gives.
Telling you, we do not want precedent established that the federal government has any say in mandating (or otherwise) concealed carry statutes to states. It opens Pandora's Box. Legislative history and intent would then be used against challenges to some future draconian anti gun measure out of DC.
What planet are you on where you think the 2nd amendment isn't under constant assault by the leftists? Do you think simply not passing a bill will make them stop? I say pass bill after bill after bill. If they're going to undo something, give them a lot to undo. The fundamentals of CCW would require a left dominated SCOTUS to happen because now you'd have to overturn a couple of major SCOTUS decisions.
The leftists are already using the patchwork of reciprocity to arrest and harass law abiding citizens EVERY WEEK:
https://www.congress.gov/bill/115th-congress/house-bill/38
RE: Concealed Carry Reciprocity - rath v2.0 - 10-12-2017 12:56 PM
I travel a lot and carry a lot. The patchwork of laws has never worried me once. I easily check the jurisdictions I am heading to or through and 99% of the time, its almost exactly the same as my home state. Just stay away from IL, CA, New Jersey and NY. For lots of other reasons, too.
RE: Concealed Carry Reciprocity - georgia_tech_swagger - 10-12-2017 01:13 PM
(10-12-2017 12:56 PM)rath v2.0 Wrote: Just stay away from IL, CA, New Jersey and NY. For lots of other reasons, too.
I agree in general, but on the specifics of the 2nd amendment I'm tired of playing defense. I'm ready to go on offense and take this to the leftists on their home turf.
RE: Concealed Carry Reciprocity - umbluegray - 10-12-2017 01:57 PM
(10-11-2017 10:51 PM)HeartOfDixie Wrote:(10-11-2017 10:48 PM)georgia_tech_swagger Wrote:(10-11-2017 10:47 PM)HeartOfDixie Wrote: I am not a fan of nationwide reciprocity.
Go on. I'm listening.
I prefer for my state to make its own laws and regulations and not be forced by the Federal government to adopt those of another, even when it comes to guns which I support.
Should your drivers license be valid nationwide? Marriage license?
Heck, I'm of the mind that there should be no gun carry license of any type -- constitutional carry. But that's just me.
RE: Concealed Carry Reciprocity - georgia_tech_swagger - 10-12-2017 02:07 PM
(10-12-2017 01:57 PM)umbluegray Wrote: Should your drivers license be valid nationwide? Marriage license?
Heck, I'm of the mind that there should be no gun carry license of any type -- constitutional carry. But that's just me.
You have a social security card, what does it matter? You've already got government ID. And I notice not too many GOP people aside from the libertarians bothered to vote against the Real ID act, which much more tightly integrated state licenses with the feds and imposed federal mandatory guidelines that all states must abide by in issuing licenses. As a resident of SC, they won't let me board a plane in 2019 and beyond without a passport because they refuse to accept my SCDL.
So your argument doesn't hold water with me because, again, your fears are already reality.
But I do agree with you on no license straight up constitutional carry.
RE: Concealed Carry Reciprocity - GrayBeard - 10-12-2017 02:39 PM
This is an interesting topic. My current state of residence would lose it over this.
RE: Concealed Carry Reciprocity - MplsBison - 10-12-2017 04:49 PM
Let it be known, GTS is against states' rights.