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+---- Thread: With Wichita State likely joining the AAC in 3-4 days, what dominos will this cause? (/thread-814144.html)
With Wichita State likely joining the AAC in 3-4 days, what dominos will this cause? - shizzle787 - 04-01-2017 02:43 PM
http://www.kansas.com/sports/college/wichita-state/article142152734.html
The MVC will be down to 9. If they expand, how will the conference they raid add and so on.
RE: With Wichita State likely joining the AAC in 3-4 days, what dominos will this cause? - MissouriStateBears - 04-01-2017 03:04 PM
MVC adds Illinois-Chicago. Don't know who the Horizon goes after.
RE: With Wichita State likely joining the AAC in 3-4 days, what dominos will this cause? - BigEastHomer - 04-01-2017 03:19 PM
Too sweeeeeeeeeeeeeeet
RE: With Wichita State likely joining the AAC in 3-4 days, what dominos will this cause? - DavidSt - 04-01-2017 03:28 PM
(04-01-2017 03:04 PM)MissouriStateBears Wrote: MVC adds Illinois-Chicago. Don't know who the Horizon goes after.
I think you guys would go to the SBC. SBC's basketball > MVC once Wichita State. MVC used to be a multi-bid league when Wichita State and Creighton was there. Both gone, and they fall behind other conferences. Who should they get? I do not think any SBC schools will leave.
Central Arkansas? They are an affiliate in men's soccer.
Dallas Baptist as a full member? They are an affiliate of baseball.
Southern Illinois-Edwardsville? Men's soccer as an affiliate.
New Mexico State? They would be an outlier unless they invite West Texas A&M with them.
Bring Washburn back?
Belmont? Looks like they could be headed to Southern Conference instead.
Drury? Was a former affiliate in women's soccer.
UMKC?
North Dakota State?
South Dakota State?
IUPUI?
IUPUFW?
Milwaukee?
Green Bay?
Valparaiso?
Oral Roberts?
Omaha?
Lipscomb?
Lindenwood?
Mankato State?
RE: With Wichita State likely joining the AAC in 3-4 days, what dominos will this cause? - Stugray2 - 04-01-2017 04:08 PM
The article forgets one key point. The Kansas Board of Regents must hold a special meeting (usually by telephone conference) to approve the move. There is no such meeting on the agenda yet. So the Presidents must approve and an invite contract written up and given, at least informally to Wichita State, who then have to call a KBOR special meeting, and only after approval can they accept and have a press conference.
I would hold off on an actual official invite/acceptance date until this website shows a special meeting
http://www.kansasregents.org/about/regent_meetings_agendas_and_minutes
As for fallout, very little. The MVC will convene a search for a replacement member, and that will likely conclude a few months out. If they invite anyone, it'll probably be UIC or Valpo. If the Horizon replaces them, and they may not bother, the most obvious candidate is Robert Morris, the finalist they passed over last time in favor of Northern Kentucky. End of realignment.
Missouri valley ceases to be an Upper Mid Major, becomes the 21st conference in the Lower Mid Major category. (Only AAC, A10, WCC, MWC, and CUSA remain in the shrinking Upper Mid category). Death of the middle class.
RE: With Wichita State likely joining the AAC in 3-4 days, what dominos will this cause? - chargeradio - 04-01-2017 04:19 PM
Any chance the NEC would take NJIT should they lose Robert Morris? It may not happen until 2018 when North Alabama joins the Atlantic Sun, but it would keep the NEC and Atlantic Sun both at even numbers.
RE: With Wichita State likely joining the AAC in 3-4 days, what dominos will this cause? - bullet - 04-01-2017 05:11 PM
(04-01-2017 04:08 PM)Stugray2 Wrote: The article forgets one key point. The Kansas Board of Regents must hold a special meeting (usually by telephone conference) to approve the move. There is no such meeting on the agenda yet. So the Presidents must approve and an invite contract written up and given, at least informally to Wichita State, who then have to call a KBOR special meeting, and only after approval can they accept and have a press conference.
I would hold off on an actual official invite/acceptance date until this website shows a special meeting
http://www.kansasregents.org/about/regent_meetings_agendas_and_minutes
As for fallout, very little. The MVC will convene a search for a replacement member, and that will likely conclude a few months out. If they invite anyone, it'll probably be UIC or Valpo. If the Horizon replaces them, and they may not bother, the most obvious candidate is Robert Morris, the finalist they passed over last time in favor of Northern Kentucky. End of realignment.
Missouri valley ceases to be an Upper Mid Major, becomes the 21st conference in the Lower Mid Major category. (Only AAC, A10, WCC, MWC, and CUSA remain in the shrinking Upper Mid category). Death of the middle class.
They may not want another Chicago area school. I think their first shot is getting St. Louis to return. A10 has become a poor geographic fit for them. After that its difficult. You either add Valpo or UIC in Chicago, W. Illinois to bring in one of your football affiliates or go for someone like Detroit. Nobody has been real consistent in basketball lately. Schools like Milwaukee, Cleveland St. and Murray St. might have made sense at other times.
RE: With Wichita State likely joining the AAC in 3-4 days, what dominos will this cause? - Kittonhead - 04-01-2017 05:16 PM
(04-01-2017 03:04 PM)MissouriStateBears Wrote: MVC adds Illinois-Chicago. Don't know who the Horizon goes after.
If that's the case then Horizon probably goes for Western Illinois.
Gives the Summit room to bring in St. Cloud and Duluth.
RE: With Wichita State likely joining the AAC in 3-4 days, what dominos will this cause? - Kittonhead - 04-01-2017 05:49 PM
(04-01-2017 05:11 PM)bullet Wrote:(04-01-2017 04:08 PM)Stugray2 Wrote: The article forgets one key point. The Kansas Board of Regents must hold a special meeting (usually by telephone conference) to approve the move. There is no such meeting on the agenda yet. So the Presidents must approve and an invite contract written up and given, at least informally to Wichita State, who then have to call a KBOR special meeting, and only after approval can they accept and have a press conference.
I would hold off on an actual official invite/acceptance date until this website shows a special meeting
http://www.kansasregents.org/about/regent_meetings_agendas_and_minutes
As for fallout, very little. The MVC will convene a search for a replacement member, and that will likely conclude a few months out. If they invite anyone, it'll probably be UIC or Valpo. If the Horizon replaces them, and they may not bother, the most obvious candidate is Robert Morris, the finalist they passed over last time in favor of Northern Kentucky. End of realignment.
Missouri valley ceases to be an Upper Mid Major, becomes the 21st conference in the Lower Mid Major category. (Only AAC, A10, WCC, MWC, and CUSA remain in the shrinking Upper Mid category). Death of the middle class.
They may not want another Chicago area school. I think their first shot is getting St. Louis to return. A10 has become a poor geographic fit for them. After that its difficult. You either add Valpo or UIC in Chicago, W. Illinois to bring in one of your football affiliates or go for someone like Detroit. Nobody has been real consistent in basketball lately. Schools like Milwaukee, Cleveland St. and Murray St. might have made sense at other times.
St. Louis would be ideal for the MVC. I don't see it happening because the A10 is a private school conference with 4 publics (UMass, URI, GMU, VCU) so its a better institutional fit and stronger conference.
UMKC is a logical rival for Missouri State and a good academic school. Has 16,160 students which is typical of the Valley enrollment on the public side.
Missouri State 26,000
Illinois State 21,039
UM-Kansas City 16,160
Southern Ill. 15,987
Indiana State 13,584
Northern Iowa 11,981
UI-Chicago 29,048
UW-Milwaukee 27,813
RE: With Wichita State likely joining the AAC in 3-4 days, what dominos will this cause? - SMUfan - 04-01-2017 06:01 PM
How about adding 3? Belmont, Valpo and Murray State. Murray State would give them their 12th football school when North Dakota joins the MVFC.
RE: With Wichita State likely joining the AAC in 3-4 days, what dominos will this cause? - LostInSpace - 04-01-2017 06:13 PM
(04-01-2017 05:11 PM)bullet Wrote:(04-01-2017 04:08 PM)Stugray2 Wrote: The article forgets one key point. The Kansas Board of Regents must hold a special meeting (usually by telephone conference) to approve the move. There is no such meeting on the agenda yet. So the Presidents must approve and an invite contract written up and given, at least informally to Wichita State, who then have to call a KBOR special meeting, and only after approval can they accept and have a press conference.
I would hold off on an actual official invite/acceptance date until this website shows a special meeting
http://www.kansasregents.org/about/regent_meetings_agendas_and_minutes
As for fallout, very little. The MVC will convene a search for a replacement member, and that will likely conclude a few months out. If they invite anyone, it'll probably be UIC or Valpo. If the Horizon replaces them, and they may not bother, the most obvious candidate is Robert Morris, the finalist they passed over last time in favor of Northern Kentucky. End of realignment.
Missouri valley ceases to be an Upper Mid Major, becomes the 21st conference in the Lower Mid Major category. (Only AAC, A10, WCC, MWC, and CUSA remain in the shrinking Upper Mid category). Death of the middle class.
They may not want another Chicago area school. I think their first shot is getting St. Louis to return. A10 has become a poor geographic fit for them. After that its difficult. You either add Valpo or UIC in Chicago, W. Illinois to bring in one of your football affiliates or go for someone like Detroit. Nobody has been real consistent in basketball lately. Schools like Milwaukee, Cleveland St. and Murray St. might have made sense at other times.
There is zero chance of SLU going to the MVC. They turned down the MVC in favor of the A10 when the MVC was a multi-bid conference with WSU and Creighton in it and with their head coach (Majerus) lobbying for the MVC as well. The only geographic change for them has been one less Ohio school and SLU wants to be in an East Coast conference for student recruitment purposes. When Temple, Xavier and Butler left the other A10 presidents informed Dayton and SLU that they would not consider adding any new members from the Midwest and neither SLU or Dayton objected.
As for the MVC, Valpo is probably the best choice among a bunch of weak candidates. I'm not sure that Valpo gains much going from one bid conference to another.
RE: With Wichita State likely joining the AAC in 3-4 days, what dominos will this cause? - Kittonhead - 04-01-2017 06:17 PM
Since its obvious the MVC has been in decline since Creighton left and now Wichita it could be time to shake things up to move to 12 teams.
UW-Milwaukee
UI-Chicago
UM-Kansas City
That would really make things interesting and rejuvenate the MVC.
Horizon could unite Western Ill and Eastern Ill to regain an Illinois presence. Basically a peer of the Summit League in strength moving forward.
RE: With Wichita State likely joining the AAC in 3-4 days, what dominos will this cause? - Kittonhead - 04-01-2017 06:40 PM
(04-01-2017 06:13 PM)LostInSpace Wrote:(04-01-2017 05:11 PM)bullet Wrote:(04-01-2017 04:08 PM)Stugray2 Wrote: The article forgets one key point. The Kansas Board of Regents must hold a special meeting (usually by telephone conference) to approve the move. There is no such meeting on the agenda yet. So the Presidents must approve and an invite contract written up and given, at least informally to Wichita State, who then have to call a KBOR special meeting, and only after approval can they accept and have a press conference.
I would hold off on an actual official invite/acceptance date until this website shows a special meeting
http://www.kansasregents.org/about/regent_meetings_agendas_and_minutes
As for fallout, very little. The MVC will convene a search for a replacement member, and that will likely conclude a few months out. If they invite anyone, it'll probably be UIC or Valpo. If the Horizon replaces them, and they may not bother, the most obvious candidate is Robert Morris, the finalist they passed over last time in favor of Northern Kentucky. End of realignment.
Missouri valley ceases to be an Upper Mid Major, becomes the 21st conference in the Lower Mid Major category. (Only AAC, A10, WCC, MWC, and CUSA remain in the shrinking Upper Mid category). Death of the middle class.
They may not want another Chicago area school. I think their first shot is getting St. Louis to return. A10 has become a poor geographic fit for them. After that its difficult. You either add Valpo or UIC in Chicago, W. Illinois to bring in one of your football affiliates or go for someone like Detroit. Nobody has been real consistent in basketball lately. Schools like Milwaukee, Cleveland St. and Murray St. might have made sense at other times.
There is zero chance of SLU going to the MVC. They turned down the MVC in favor of the A10 when the MVC was a multi-bid conference with WSU and Creighton in it and with their head coach (Majerus) lobbying for the MVC as well. The only geographic change for them has been one less Ohio school and SLU wants to be in an East Coast conference for student recruitment purposes. When Temple, Xavier and Butler left the other A10 presidents informed Dayton and SLU that they would not consider adding any new members from the Midwest and neither SLU or Dayton objected.
As for the MVC, Valpo is probably the best choice among a bunch of weak candidates. I'm not sure that Valpo gains much going from one bid conference to another.
That is kind of a problem. MVC, Horizon and the Summit are all solid, lean Midwestern conferences.
12) Missouri Valley Conference (RPI 0.5031)-10 teams
17) Horizon League (RPI 0.4882)-10 teams
18) Summit League (RPI 0.4851)-9 teams (10 with NDSU)
If you take Wichita out of the MVC the 3 leagues are basically the same.
It make take an MVC move to 12 where the resulting conference would be far stronger than the Horizon or Summit League.
The traditional assumption where MVC>Horizon>Summit may not ring true anymore, IMO.
UMKC moved from the Summit to the WAC. They are the only Midwest mid major school playing outside of their geographic region. I'm pretty sure they would move to the MVC though.
RE: With Wichita State likely joining the AAC in 3-4 days, what dominos will this cause? - MJG - 04-01-2017 06:54 PM
What are the travel partner pairings in the MVC ?
Sometimes twelve makes more sense for travel reasons especially if they partner up.
RE: With Wichita State likely joining the AAC in 3-4 days, what dominos will this cause? - SMUfan - 04-01-2017 07:03 PM
Is Belmont-Nashville too far out of the foot print?
RE: With Wichita State likely joining the AAC in 3-4 days, what dominos will this cause? - DavidSt - 04-01-2017 07:29 PM
(04-01-2017 07:03 PM)SMUfan Wrote: Is Belmont-Nashville too far out of the foot print?
Belmont could be on their way to the Southern Conference. Southern could go back to a multi-bid if Belmont and College of Charleston go there.
We have to think that a replacement for Wichita State is a public school. Which public schools have had success basketball recently? North Dakota State and South Dakota State might be ones to look at. If they go to 12? Take the 2 Dakota schools and Valparaiso to get the basketball RPI back up. That would be 6 publics and 6 privates.
RE: With Wichita State likely joining the AAC in 3-4 days, what dominos will this cause? - The Cutter of Bish - 04-01-2017 07:42 PM
It's a pain having St. Louis in the A10. They weren't good until they knew there was a chance they could go above the conference, and once that went away for a bit, back into the garbage pile they went. The A10 wins whenever you have good teams in it, and for a bit there, Majerus had that program rocking, but I can't stand them being in the conference.
Like Fordham, I wish they'd just suck it up and go back to something more aligned to their location and overall program operations. Fordham is a Patriot League school, and St. Louis is a MVC one. Good luck trying to convince them that when they collect off the back of the others who prop up their conference. And it's a shame, really...MVC and Patsy both would stand to gain with both those programs respectively. I think moving SLU to MVC might help it retain that multi-bid status.
Regardless, if Wichita does leave soon, the replacement will likely validate their reasons to do so. If this conference goes back to that Valpo-UIC-UMKC well instead of something that actually makes the conference better, I hope the Shockers thrive in their future home. It's a shame. MVC should have known better once it lost Creighton to protect its assets rather than doing something that only looks good because it got them a major city school. Wichita will walk, and...really, UIC?
Were that the case...maybe it finally motivates Mo State and/or Illinois State to move on, too.
RE: With Wichita State likely joining the AAC in 3-4 days, what dominos will this cause? - Hokie Mark - 04-01-2017 07:47 PM
I hope the get Ooey Pooey. Just like the name. UIPUI. Whatever.
Sent from my HTC Desire 626 using CSNbbs mobile app
RE: With Wichita State likely joining the AAC in 3-4 days, what dominos will this cause? - SMUfan - 04-01-2017 07:55 PM
(04-01-2017 07:29 PM)DavidSt Wrote:(04-01-2017 07:03 PM)SMUfan Wrote: Is Belmont-Nashville too far out of the foot print?
Belmont could be on their way to the Southern Conference. Southern could go back to a multi-bid if Belmont and College of Charleston go there.
We have to think that a replacement for Wichita State is a public school. Which public schools have had success basketball recently? North Dakota State and South Dakota State might be ones to look at. If they go to 12? Take the 2 Dakota schools and Valparaiso to get the basketball RPI back up. That would be 6 publics and 6 privates.
Give me one article on Belmont to the Southern Conference.
RE: With Wichita State likely joining the AAC in 3-4 days, what dominos will this cause? - bullet - 04-01-2017 08:02 PM
(04-01-2017 06:40 PM)Kittonhead Wrote:(04-01-2017 06:13 PM)LostInSpace Wrote:(04-01-2017 05:11 PM)bullet Wrote:(04-01-2017 04:08 PM)Stugray2 Wrote: The article forgets one key point. The Kansas Board of Regents must hold a special meeting (usually by telephone conference) to approve the move. There is no such meeting on the agenda yet. So the Presidents must approve and an invite contract written up and given, at least informally to Wichita State, who then have to call a KBOR special meeting, and only after approval can they accept and have a press conference.
I would hold off on an actual official invite/acceptance date until this website shows a special meeting
http://www.kansasregents.org/about/regent_meetings_agendas_and_minutes
As for fallout, very little. The MVC will convene a search for a replacement member, and that will likely conclude a few months out. If they invite anyone, it'll probably be UIC or Valpo. If the Horizon replaces them, and they may not bother, the most obvious candidate is Robert Morris, the finalist they passed over last time in favor of Northern Kentucky. End of realignment.
Missouri valley ceases to be an Upper Mid Major, becomes the 21st conference in the Lower Mid Major category. (Only AAC, A10, WCC, MWC, and CUSA remain in the shrinking Upper Mid category). Death of the middle class.
They may not want another Chicago area school. I think their first shot is getting St. Louis to return. A10 has become a poor geographic fit for them. After that its difficult. You either add Valpo or UIC in Chicago, W. Illinois to bring in one of your football affiliates or go for someone like Detroit. Nobody has been real consistent in basketball lately. Schools like Milwaukee, Cleveland St. and Murray St. might have made sense at other times.
There is zero chance of SLU going to the MVC. They turned down the MVC in favor of the A10 when the MVC was a multi-bid conference with WSU and Creighton in it and with their head coach (Majerus) lobbying for the MVC as well. The only geographic change for them has been one less Ohio school and SLU wants to be in an East Coast conference for student recruitment purposes. When Temple, Xavier and Butler left the other A10 presidents informed Dayton and SLU that they would not consider adding any new members from the Midwest and neither SLU or Dayton objected.
As for the MVC, Valpo is probably the best choice among a bunch of weak candidates. I'm not sure that Valpo gains much going from one bid conference to another.
That is kind of a problem. MVC, Horizon and the Summit are all solid, lean Midwestern conferences.
12) Missouri Valley Conference (RPI 0.5031)-10 teams
17) Horizon League (RPI 0.4882)-10 teams
18) Summit League (RPI 0.4851)-9 teams (10 with NDSU)
If you take Wichita out of the MVC the 3 leagues are basically the same.
It make take an MVC move to 12 where the resulting conference would be far stronger than the Horizon or Summit League.
The traditional assumption where MVC>Horizon>Summit may not ring true anymore, IMO.
UMKC moved from the Summit to the WAC. They are the only Midwest mid major school playing outside of their geographic region. I'm pretty sure they would move to the MVC though.
Its a down year. The MVC schools have a lot more tradition and vastly more fan support.