There are 22 schools in the CUSA/SBC region that either are FBS or in the process of going FBS.

10 of those are in larger markets than the bottom 12. Schools are listed with their latest BCS ranking....


Big Market 10

UTSA (zero)
North Texas (92)
Rice (82)
Tulane (116)
South Alabama (zero)
UAB (106)
Middle Tennessee (113)
Georgia State (zero)
FIU (74)
Florida Atlantic (117)




Small Market 12

UTEP (94)
Texas State (zero)
Tulsa (40)
Arkansas State (35)
Louisiana Tech (37)
ULM (103)

Louisiana (63)
Southern Miss (21)
Troy (107)
WKU (76)
Marshall (60)
East Carolina (81)



Which conference has a brighter future?


I thought so.

Please tell me how El Paso, a city with 650,000 people is a small market while Mobile with less than 200,000 is a big city.

Which one can a network executive use to fudge numbers together that he can shove in front of drunken ad-buyer who doesn't know jack about football?

(04-17-2012 12:38 PM)Niner National Wrote:  Please tell me how El Paso, a city with 650,000 people is a small market while Mobile with less than 200,000 is a big city.

http://www.stationindex.com/tv/tv-markets

I should have been clearer in my post.

I label no markets small or large, only larger and smaller according to this list.

(04-17-2012 12:41 PM)CAJUNNATION Wrote:  

(04-17-2012 12:38 PM)Niner National Wrote:  Please tell me how El Paso, a city with 650,000 people is a small market while Mobile with less than 200,000 is a big city.

http://www.stationindex.com/tv/tv-markets

I should have been clearer in my post.

I label no markets small or large, only larger and smaller according to this list.

makes a little more sense, but you still have Mobile as big market, but Tulsa small market. Mobile is #60 on that list and Tulsa is #61.

It doesn't really change the point you're trying to make, but it doesn't really make sense.

Tulsa has 400k people in the city 1M metro
San Marcos is part of San Marcos/Austin/Round Rock pop 1.7M

(04-17-2012 12:30 PM)CAJUNNATION Wrote:  There are 22 schools in the CUSA/SBC region that either are FBS or in the process of going FBS.

10 of those are in larger markets than the bottom 12. Schools are listed with their latest BCS ranking....


Big Market 10

UTSA (zero)
North Texas (92)
Rice (82)
Tulane (116)
South Alabama (zero)
UAB (106)
Middle Tennessee (113)
Georgia State (zero)
FIU (74)
Florida Atlantic (117)




Small Market 12

UTEP (94)
Texas State (zero)
Tulsa (40)
Arkansas State (35)
Louisiana Tech (37)
ULM (103)

Louisiana (63)
Southern Miss (21)
Troy (107)
WKU (76)
Marshall (60)
East Carolina (81)



Which conference has a brighter future?


I thought so.

Why is there a space in between ULM and ULL? Separation?

(04-17-2012 12:45 PM)Niner National Wrote:  

(04-17-2012 12:41 PM)CAJUNNATION Wrote:  

(04-17-2012 12:38 PM)Niner National Wrote:  Please tell me how El Paso, a city with 650,000 people is a small market while Mobile with less than 200,000 is a big city.

http://www.stationindex.com/tv/tv-markets

I should have been clearer in my post.

I label no markets small or large, only larger and smaller according to this list.

makes a little more sense, but you still have Mobile as big market, but Tulsa small market. Mobile is #60 on that list and Tulsa is #61.

It doesn't really change the point you're trying to make, but it doesn't really make sense.

Note: I don't understand how markets are assigned. 1.2 million people live within 50 miles of downtown Mobile.

Gulfport-Mobile-Pensacola

You are network exec trying to sell spots to a half-drunk ad-buyer who knows nothing about football and doesn't really care.

A very good ECU team versus a very good USM team fighting for a conference championship on Saturday. (who?)

- or -

The Memphis market and the New Jersey market on Saturday!!!! Look at these little circles on the map!!! Wow!!!

Doesn't matter if USM and ECU are good....or that Memphis and Rutgers might be a steaming pile. You are selling fake numbers and somebody is buying.

I'm not sure what this is trying to prove.

I think the Big Market 10 should be forced to go down to FCS because they have no future.

(04-17-2012 01:00 PM)slappycajun Wrote:  I'm not sure what this is trying to prove.

I think he is trying to show the stupidity of the current decision-making process for conference realignment being based on questionable potential television markets.

The whole nation used to watch Oklahoma-Nebraska. People in much larger markets than Lincoln or OKC watched it in massive numbers. The reason was intense rivalry based on their familiarity with one another and geography....combined with good football.

Good football + familiarity + geography = real television interest = television dollars

Today it is:

Population of the area you happen to be in = television dollars

One of these is rational....one is not.

(04-17-2012 12:38 PM)Niner National Wrote:  Please tell me how El Paso, a city with 650,000 people is a small market while Mobile with less than 200,000 is a big city.

That list he is using has Mobile and Pensacola combined.
And, I suppose, all the stuff in between.

If it also includes the populations of Pace and Milton (towns touching Pensacola) and Prichard, that is a legitimate sh*tload of people.

Edit: I checked that list and it goes all the way to Ft. Walton Beach. Yeah. That is a LOT of people.

I don't know if it is fair to include Pensacola in the Mobile market when talking about football.
Pensacola is excited about the program and the local paper gives the Jaguars pretty good football coverage, but I don't know anybody except for other alumni like me that travel to the games.

(04-17-2012 01:14 PM)Dedsquirrl Wrote:  

(04-17-2012 12:38 PM)Niner National Wrote:  Please tell me how El Paso, a city with 650,000 people is a small market while Mobile with less than 200,000 is a big city.

That list he is using has Mobile and Pensacola combined.
And, I suppose, all the stuff in between.

If it also includes the populations of Pace and Milton (towns touching Pensacola) and Prichard, that is a legitimate sh*tload of people.

Edit: I checked that list and it goes all the way to Ft. Walton Beach. Yeah. That is a LOT of people.

I don't know if it is fair to include Pensacola in the Mobile market when talking about football.
Pensacola is excited about the program and the local paper gives the Jaguars pretty good football coverage, but I don't know anybody except for other alumni like me that travel to the games.

And THAT is the point of the exercise. Even (especially?) if you're located in a major city, at the non-AQ level, you're going to draw your alumni base, and that's about it.

And those alumni better give a crap about football.

A random guy in the Atlanta suburbs isn't going to wake up one Saturday and say "gee I saw a billboard about Georgia State the other day, I think I'll head over to the Dome/tune in to CSS!" If they were 10-2 on a regular basis, THEN that might happen, but for the forseeable future, that's not particularly realistic.

So when it really comes down to it, what makes people tune in or come out to a game? Is it a winning product, or is it 6 million people within an hour drive?

(04-17-2012 01:08 PM)ark30inf Wrote:  

(04-17-2012 01:00 PM)slappycajun Wrote:  I'm not sure what this is trying to prove.

I think he is trying to show the stupidity of the current decision-making process for conference realignment being based on questionable potential television markets.

The whole nation used to watch Oklahoma-Nebraska. People in much larger markets than Lincoln or OKC watched it in massive numbers. The reason was intense rivalry based on their familiarity with one another and geography....combined with good football.

Good football + familiarity + geography = real television interest = television dollars

Today it is:

Population of the area you happen to be in = television dollars

One of these is rational....one is not.

Oklahoma, first season: 1895
Nebraska, first season: 1890

Good football + century old programs + first to start up in state = real television interest = television dollars.

So let me turn this question around.

Oklahoma, Nebraska, small town programs, have been playing since the late 19th century. stAte & cajuns, small town program by your definition, has been playing since 1911 and 1901. That is a lot of years to get familiar with the programs, right? A 6 to 21 year difference between the 4 programs.

Good football + familiarity + geography = real television interest = television dollars

Why is stAte or cajuns not as successful as Oklahoma & Nebraska if small college towns always means better quality football & more fans?

Uninvite us forthwith

(04-17-2012 01:31 PM)panama Wrote:  Uninvite us forthwith

I never said that.

This is just one of those issues that you're going to be on one side or the other, and you'll never change your mind.

Small market teams with good programs think on-the-field play should matter most.

Big market teams with poor/average programs think market size should matter most.

Right now, the guys in the suits agree with the second group of people. For the prior 100 years, they agreed with the first group.

Everything is about Georgia State to these Southern trolls. I can't wait to watch them implode! Go back to your small market town of 28,000 plus and tell somebody who gives a sh!t.

(04-17-2012 01:37 PM)Klak Wrote:  

(04-17-2012 01:31 PM)panama Wrote:  Uninvite us forthwith

I never said that.

This is just one of those issues that you're going to be on one side or the other, and you'll never change your mind.

Small market teams with good programs think on-the-field play should matter most.

Big market teams with poor/average programs think market size should matter most.

Right now, the guys in the suits agree with the second group of people. For the prior 100 years, they agreed with the first group.

Its BOTH. The problem is while I can fire a coach and fix football I cannot make 1M people move to a small town.

(04-17-2012 12:38 PM)Niner National Wrote:  Please tell me how El Paso, a city with 650,000 people is a small market while Mobile with less than 200,000 is a big city.

El Paso Area Market pop.= 800, 647.
(includes Las Cruces, NM; Juarez, Mex and El Paso)

Mobile Area Market pop.= 894,467.
(includes Pensacola, FL; Mobile, Pascagoula, MS and Biloxi)

No doubt, El Paso's AMP is comparable to Mobile/Pensacola. Remember, Juarez and surrounding area is included in El Paso's.