(04-22-2011 12:23 AM)LastMinuteman Wrote:  I don't know why UConn would worry about that. We're separate states. There's only so much penetration a state university can make into another state. This isn't like USF vs. UCF. But I don't think UConn's territorial-ness had anything to do with us not getting interest from the Big East, so it doesn't matter. There's plenty of other good reasons not to invite a direct-from-FCS team with an odd stadium situation.

Hope to take you up on that offer someday, Mike, and see you and the Scarlet Knights in Foxborough. I have to be honest though, I really never thought I'd see the day.

Personally I would welcome UMass into the Big East. It will help increase interest in college football at New England. I know UMass visiting us next year. I hoping for annul rival game after 2012. Welcome to big-time football.

Division-IA program can recruit up to 25 kids every year both Massachusetts and Connecticut produce about that many kids every year so the thinking is how can this region support three Division-IA programs? I don’t see it that way because Idaho have two Division-IA programs and the state produced less than five kids yearly and yet the state manage to have one program that compete at BCS level. The same can be said about West Virginia, the state doesn’t produce enough DI kids but they have a strong BCS program. All three New England programs have to go outside its region for recruits.

Because there are not enough good players in the region for any of these three programs to compete at the national level. So having UMass in our league is better than having UCF because there are a lot more great players in the state of Florida that can’t all be taken into BCS programs that we can get rather having to compete with UCF. The logic is simple you want less competition at place where there are plenty of quality kids that you have a chance to get rather than at a place that don’t have enough quality kids because you never going to get enough player anyway so you don’t need more competition at place that can help you.

I have a hard time imagining that UMASS is going to have their fans excited about a MAC schedule. I hope i'm wrong, i would love to see UMASS do well... but will they draw for a steady diet of Ball State, Kent, Akron, Western Michigan, etc? No history with any of these schools, and let's face it - not really exciting matchups. UCONN had it much better coming into the BE for FB right away.

There will be excitement immediately when they move up, the question will be if they can maintain it.

(04-22-2011 08:32 PM)SO#1 Wrote:  Because there are not enough good players in the region for any of these three programs to compete at the national level. So having UMass in our league is better than having UCF because there are a lot more great players in the state of Florida that can’t all be taken into BCS programs that we can get rather having to compete with UCF. The logic is simple you want less competition at place where there are plenty of quality kids that you have a chance to get rather than at a place that don’t have enough quality kids because you never going to get enough player anyway so you don’t need more competition at place that can help you.

So unlike other conferences that try to improve their overall quality/strength, you think Big East should always invite the weakest or those that offer the least amount of competition?

Who knows how UMass will develop. The bottomline is that the Big East is starting TV negotiations and it looks lke we wil end up with a pretty good deal that could put the league if not equal close to the ACC. Unless the league can increase that amount by adding someone then we should stay as is and see what happens in the future.

(04-23-2011 07:33 AM)KnightLight Wrote:  

(04-22-2011 08:32 PM)SO#1 Wrote:  Because there are not enough good players in the region for any of these three programs to compete at the national level. So having UMass in our league is better than having UCF because there are a lot more great players in the state of Florida that can’t all be taken into BCS programs that we can get rather having to compete with UCF. The logic is simple you want less competition at place where there are plenty of quality kids that you have a chance to get rather than at a place that don’t have enough quality kids because you never going to get enough player anyway so you don’t need more competition at place that can help you.

So unlike other conferences that try to improve their overall quality/strength, you think Big East should always invite the weakest or those that offer the least amount of competition?

A flagship university with history and tradition brings the whole state to the table. Not a university just started in1963 most likely second or third in Orlando to a flagship university and/or a more established program in the state.

(04-20-2011 10:21 AM)Frank the Tank Wrote:  BC is kind of like Miami (only nowhere near as successful) - they don't have great attendance or hardcore local fanbase intensity, but they are a pretty good national TV draw for casual fans.

Where do you get this? Outside of the Big East, I consider myself "casual", and I'll tell you, there's about 30-40 football teams I'd rather watch than Boston College.

(04-21-2011 07:42 PM)brista21 Wrote:  

(04-21-2011 03:53 PM)LastMinuteman Wrote:  It's also the fastest growing state in the northeast.

Not quite. Maryland grew by 9.0% between 2000 and 2010.

Is Maryland considered "northeast" or "mid-Atlantic"?

(04-23-2011 10:48 AM)BJUnklFkr Wrote:  

(04-21-2011 07:42 PM)brista21 Wrote:  

(04-21-2011 03:53 PM)LastMinuteman Wrote:  It's also the fastest growing state in the northeast.

Not quite. Maryland grew by 9.0% between 2000 and 2010.

Is Maryland considered "northeast" or "mid-Atlantic"?

You are in the Northeast anytime you are within the Boston to DC cooridor. Maryland is right in that cooridor.

If the Big Ten ever went in the direction of 14, adding Missouri and Maryland, I wonder what the chances then would be of BC trying to move back to the Big East?

Maryland is mid-Atlantic. It's not considered part of the northeast corridor, which goes from Philly to Boston, since it is south of the Mason-Dixon line...

(04-22-2011 02:25 PM)JHG722 Wrote:  

(04-20-2011 06:22 AM)MichaelSavage Wrote:  Someone is going to have to explain to me the logic of expecting to draw even respectably in Gillette Stadium--which is 100 miles from the campus in Amherst--playing opponents such as Bowling Green, Temple, and Northern Illinois.

UMass is set up for failure.

Of all the teams in the MAC you mention us? We actually had a very heated rivalry with UMass for years. This will hopefully rekindle it. But seriously, mentioning us instead of EMU, or Kent State is laughable.

So 16K will show up to see UMass play Temple instead of the normal 15K that will show up to see EMU or Kent. Congratulations.

(04-23-2011 10:48 AM)BJUnklFkr Wrote:  

(04-21-2011 07:42 PM)brista21 Wrote:  

(04-21-2011 03:53 PM)LastMinuteman Wrote:  It's also the fastest growing state in the northeast.

Not quite. Maryland grew by 9.0% between 2000 and 2010.

Is Maryland considered "northeast" or "mid-Atlantic"?

Both. The most encompassing definition of Mid-Atlantic is NY, NJ, PA, DE, MD, DC, WV and VA. The most narrow definition is DE, MD, DC, WV and VA. Northeast to me could be any state that is part of the New England region or has a part of its state in the Northeast Corridor megalopolis. So by that measure one could include WV and VA in the Northeast, if the Northeast is made up of New England and the Mid-Atlantic. Another way to define the Northeast would be the original (pre-Illinois/Ohio/Indiana) EZ-Pass states which again would include VA and WV. However culturally no one would mistake WV or VA outside the DC suburbs for the Northeast. Another way to do it would be the major cities having robust mass transit systems. Pittsburgh, Baltimore, Washington (including VA & MD suburbs/exurbs), New York (including Hudson County/Jersey City and Newark), Philly (including Trenton-Camden corridor), Buffalo, and Boston all have robust or fairly robust transit systems. Even a few of the smaller cities like Harrisburg and Syracuse have fairly robust multi-modal transit systems. Based on all that I wouldn't put VA or WV in the northeast but I'd definitely put Maryland, the District and Delaware (which colonially speaking was a middle colony not a Southern one) in the Northeast.

(04-23-2011 10:45 AM)BJUnklFkr Wrote:  

(04-20-2011 10:21 AM)Frank the Tank Wrote:  BC is kind of like Miami (only nowhere near as successful) - they don't have great attendance or hardcore local fanbase intensity, but they are a pretty good national TV draw for casual fans.

Where do you get this? Outside of the Big East, I consider myself "casual", and I'll tell you, there's about 30-40 football teams I'd rather watch than Boston College.

Since when did BC have some kind of "National" following...last I check they are not Michigan, Penn State or Miami in regards to "National" following of programs that have fallen a little.

(04-22-2011 11:47 PM)wvucrazed Wrote:  I have a hard time imagining that UMASS is going to have their fans excited about a MAC schedule. I hope i'm wrong, i would love to see UMASS do well... but will they draw for a steady diet of Ball State, Kent, Akron, Western Michigan, etc? No history with any of these schools, and let's face it - not really exciting matchups. UCONN had it much better coming into the BE for FB right away.

There will be excitement immediately when they move up, the question will be if they can maintain it.

It's not going to happen over night, but the MAC is better for UMass then where they currently are. They could start to develop rivalry with Temple, Then start to bring in OOC games against schools like UConn, Syracuse, BC Army etc and grow interest. If they can show they can be competitive against teams like that then the fans should respond. We shall see

(04-23-2011 01:32 PM)gosports1 Wrote:  It's not going to happen over night, but the MAC is better for UMass then where they currently are. They could start to develop rivalry with Temple, Then start to bring in OOC games against schools like UConn, Syracuse, BC Army etc and grow interest. If they can show they can be competitive against teams like that then the fans should respond. We shall see

They definitely need regional teams like Rutgers, Penn State, Pitt, Syracuse, Army, Navy, Maryland, WVU and especially UConn and BC on the sched. Long term their obvious goal is Big East membership and if they're growing the fanbase and performing on the field we should welcome them with open arms. Right now New England doesn't produce much FBS talent but I think long-term that could change with 3 FBS programs and the very successful Patriots franchise.

(04-23-2011 11:57 AM)MichaelSavage Wrote:  

(04-22-2011 02:25 PM)JHG722 Wrote:  

(04-20-2011 06:22 AM)MichaelSavage Wrote:  Someone is going to have to explain to me the logic of expecting to draw even respectably in Gillette Stadium--which is 100 miles from the campus in Amherst--playing opponents such as Bowling Green, Temple, and Northern Illinois.

UMass is set up for failure.

Of all the teams in the MAC you mention us? We actually had a very heated rivalry with UMass for years. This will hopefully rekindle it. But seriously, mentioning us instead of EMU, or Kent State is laughable.

So 16K will show up to see UMass play Temple instead of the normal 15K that will show up to see EMU or Kent. Congratulations.

IYO

Boston College doesn't have a national following, I mean what in the hell? And the Big East isn't waiting on UMass, in fact someone mentioned in the Boston Globe that Bob Kraft, the New England Patriots owner, pushed for UMass in the Big East and they said no to them. I think UMass would have been a very interesting pick, but things happen. The Big East is not waiting around for UMass and adding them wasn't going to improve our TV deal though they would have been an ideal fit geographically.

(04-22-2011 07:50 PM)mikeinsec127 Wrote:  

(04-22-2011 02:25 PM)JHG722 Wrote:  

(04-20-2011 06:22 AM)MichaelSavage Wrote:  Someone is going to have to explain to me the logic of expecting to draw even respectably in Gillette Stadium--which is 100 miles from the campus in Amherst--playing opponents such as Bowling Green, Temple, and Northern Illinois.

UMass is set up for failure.

Of all the teams in the MAC you mention us? We actually had a very heated rivalry with UMass for years. This will hopefully rekindle it. But seriously, mentioning us instead of EMU, or Kent State is laughable.

I was already thinking about that. I expect the UMass/Temple game to become an instant rivalry. Considering that you both play each other in every other sport in the A-10, this should heat up right away. The logo on the field won't matter.

i would tend to agree that umass temple would be a rivalry game, umass is pretty good they hung with michigan last year..

the population of mass isn't to far away from michigans 10 million, so i would think they could find good fb players..another thing in umass favor is the states population is about twice that of conn, so that would also help in finding players. the fact that all their home games are at gillette also weighs in to their chances of success.

i could see a scenario of them being in the mac a few years and then a move into a bcs conference.

I think a big part of the reason that New England isn't a better region for football recruiting is that our college football scene doesn't get kids excited about football. Boston College isn't a great fan experience because there's nowhere to tailgate unless you're a big donor, plus it's an expensive, private religious school. UConn is a better experience, but they're a relative newcomer and they can't get a game against BC due to the bad blood over the lawsuit, so people from elsewhere in New England haven't had a good reason to travel down to UConn and see what they've got. UMass will obviously be an even bigger newcomer and won't have the advantage of BCS affiliation, but if we can just get some games going between these teams, especially at an affordable, accessible place outside the urban sprawl like Gillette Stadium, and have people traveling between and seeing the various college campuses, I think that's going to have an impact on the next generation of players.

The athleticism is up here. Look at basketball. The example of UConn is obvious, and the great 90s era UMass teams were all New England kids. Look at college hockey and the dominance by the Boston teams. Look at the New England players throughout the rosters of the top lacrosse programs in the country. We don't get the same value from the winter sports as we would from football though. We can't tour each others' campuses or tailgate for basketball or hockey, it's too frickin' cold up here. We really screwed up on football, between the Ivies grabbing all the early football prestige and taking it away with them to their sandbox, and Penn State and the conference formation clusterf*ck. It's time to start turning that around, and create an environment that our youth football players can get invested in. Kraft took a little shot at BC during the UMass press conference, saying that "the one thing we're missing as a sports region is big-time college football." BC fans were like, "WTF?", but what he's talking about is all the other things that go into making college football great, not just belonging to a BCS conference and making it to bowl games. Boston College has been a serviceable regional rep, but we've been missing all the trimmings that other regions get to enjoy.

What Kraft meant to say is only big-time college football play in a BCS game. You are not going to see BC in a BCS game any time soon.

If UMass can average between 30k and 40k annually in Boston with MAC schedule, the Big East can’t turn them again in the next TV contract sometime in 202X unless we go all-sports. The same goes with Temple.