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King Dollar
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Machiavelli Offline
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Post: #41
RE: King Dollar
I'm arguing that the stimulus did work and I have metrics to back it up. I believe that things will continue to get better. Don't discount the role psychology has on the markets. DESPITE the constant harping from conservative ilk that the sky is falling things are improving.
05-19-2010 09:28 AM
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Machiavelli Offline
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Post: #42
RE: King Dollar
It's a contrarian opinion I know. Let's see where interest rates and gold go in the next 6-12 months.
(This post was last modified: 05-19-2010 09:30 AM by Machiavelli.)
05-19-2010 09:29 AM
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Ninerfan1 Offline
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Post: #43
RE: King Dollar
(05-19-2010 09:28 AM)Machiavelli Wrote:  I'm arguing that the stimulus did work and I have metrics to back it up.

Produce them and provide the proof of the direct correlation between the stimulus and said metrics.
05-19-2010 09:31 AM
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I45owl Offline
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Post: #44
RE: King Dollar
(05-19-2010 09:19 AM)Machiavelli Wrote:  Can we sustain our current level of borrowing? Quite simply no.

Then how does it make sense to have ultra-low interest rates that are kept artificially low by a quasi-governmental agency. Especially on the heels of a crisis that was brought on by ultra-low interest rates kept artificially low by a quasi-governmental agency?
05-19-2010 09:32 AM
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Post: #45
RE: King Dollar
(05-19-2010 09:32 AM)I45owl Wrote:  
(05-19-2010 09:19 AM)Machiavelli Wrote:  Can we sustain our current level of borrowing? Quite simply no.

Then how does it make sense to have ultra-low interest rates that are kept artificially low by a quasi-governmental agency. Especially on the heels of a crisis that was brought on by ultra-low interest rates kept artificially low by a quasi-governmental agency?

Once again he's proving why he's a school teacher. He takes his own account of making a couple grand on the stock market, and thinks everything is going great.

Tell that to the people unemployed, Mach. Tell that to the companies that are still having to lay people off, Mach. Tell that to the small businesses going under, Mach. You live in fantasy land if you think your short sell is indicative of our future market, climate, and economy.
05-19-2010 09:43 AM
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Machiavelli Offline
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Post: #46
RE: King Dollar
Unemployment-The labor markets while still very weak look to be healing. March saw the first strong gain in employment since 2007 - 162,000 jobs were added. While the number was a bit skewed by Census hiring, even if we subtract the 48,000 temporary Census jobs, the economy added 114,000 jobs in March. Manufacturing and retail again saw increases in payrolls and temporary employment continued its upward path that started last September. Clearly, the economy is recovering for its sharp downturn. Most economic indicators show improvements, and the recovery in the labor markets appears to be in more solid footing. With productivity at historical highs, an expanding workweek, companies should start hiring (even if at a slow pace) soon. So far in this recession 8.2 million jobs have been lost. One of the big uncertainties remaining is whether the private sector will be able to expand without any additional government spending, most of which is set to end by late 2010 and last year supported much of the economic recovery in the second half.

I don't know how to post the graph. But the link is here.

http://trackthestimulus.com/How_is_the_c...doing.aspx

Home Sales and Inventory

The latest reports from the National Association of Realtors (NAR) and the US Census Bureau for February 2010 showed the third month in a row of reductions in the number of home sales after a very strong showing in the previous months. The latter was in large part driven in large part by the expiration of the $8,000 first-time homebuyer tax credit which was originally due at the end of November, but which has now been extended to June 2010. The decline in February was less pronounced than what was anticipated, however it followed steep declines in December and January resulting in renewed concerns over the health of the housing market.

http://trackthestimulus.com/Housing_Mark...stics.aspx

GDP quarterly

This efforts have paid off at the macro level. The US economy grew strongly in the second half of 2009, and the most dire predicaments were adverted. Unfortunately, while businesses (especially large, well capitalized ones) have seen an improvement in their fortunes, the consumer has taken the brunt of the financial storm. With unemployment at 10% and a steep loss of wealth, consumption has suffered, and consumers are less willing to part with their cash.


Close to 3.9% of the 5.9% GDP growth in 4Q09 was the result of inventory rebalancing. Inventories had contracted so rapidly during the first two quarter that businesses needed to re-stock to be back in business. Consumer spending increased 1.7% in the fourth quarter, which accounted for only 1.2% of the growth in GDP. Once inventories are back to normal levels, if the consumer does not support the economy, the US will be back to a very slow groth scenario. Unfortunately, an over-levered consumer is expected to continue the trend seen in 2009 of saving more and spending less. Good for the economy in the long term, but not a good harbinger for the short term.

http://trackthestimulus.com/Industry_Gro...istcs.aspx
05-19-2010 09:58 AM
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Ninerfan1 Offline
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Post: #47
RE: King Dollar
LOL!!

Notice what's missing from "trackthestimulus" there mach? Any mention of how the stimulus produced said results.

The simple fact that economic indicators have improved is not proof the stimulus worked boo boo.01-wingedeagle
05-19-2010 10:06 AM
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Machiavelli Offline
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Post: #48
RE: King Dollar
Two things that I do have a problem with. We will ever see unemployment in the 4-5% range again. The jobs that we lost are not coming back. When you can pay someone to work in China for 25 cents an hour with no pee breaks. How do we compete with that? You have to put yourself into a situation where your job can not be outsourced. And if your struggling with the transition. You better learn to play the market.
(This post was last modified: 05-19-2010 10:12 AM by Machiavelli.)
05-19-2010 10:10 AM
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Post: #49
RE: King Dollar
05-19-2010 10:11 AM
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Post: #50
RE: King Dollar
(05-19-2010 10:10 AM)Machiavelli Wrote:  Two things that I do have a problem with. We will ever see unemployment in the 4-5% range again. The jobs that we lossed are not coming back.

^ ...and this is the problem I have with you liberals.
05-19-2010 10:12 AM
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SumOfAllFears Offline
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Post: #51
RE: King Dollar
It's another bubble. When it bursts you won't be able to get out fast enough. Its gambling and you know it, Vegas is as sure a bet. I don't know what your looking at but things are not getting better. The euphoria you are experiencing will be short lived. You won't be happy till you gamble it all away.

Look here Mr. King Dollar

FTTM - $4.2 Trillion Spent out of the $12.9 Trillion announced.
(This post was last modified: 05-19-2010 10:19 AM by SumOfAllFears.)
05-19-2010 10:14 AM
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Machiavelli Offline
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Post: #52
RE: King Dollar
You can find respected economists on both sides of the fence.
05-19-2010 10:14 AM
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Ninerfan1 Offline
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Post: #53
RE: King Dollar
(05-19-2010 10:12 AM)Rebel Wrote:  
(05-19-2010 10:10 AM)Machiavelli Wrote:  Two things that I do have a problem with. We will ever see unemployment in the 4-5% range again. The jobs that we lossed are not coming back.

^ ...and this is the problem I have with you liberals.

Obama and the liberal sheep like mach who eat his sh!t and beg for more are throwing that talking point around in a major way. They need to try and articulate 10% unemployment as the new norm. It's the only way they can justify the pathetic and economy killing nature of their policies.
05-19-2010 10:17 AM
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smn1256 Offline
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Post: #54
RE: King Dollar
(05-18-2010 11:00 PM)flyingswoosh Wrote:  
(05-18-2010 10:55 PM)smn1256 Wrote:  
(05-18-2010 10:14 PM)flyingswoosh Wrote:  
(05-18-2010 09:43 PM)smn1256 Wrote:  
(05-18-2010 06:32 PM)Machiavelli Wrote:  Are you better off today then you were in 2008?

No. I was laid off and had to take a job that pays about half of what I used to make and has no benefits (I'm a heart patient) On June 1, my wife will close her business of 26 years due to the decline in the construction industry. We have a house payment of almost $4k and it costs us $1k for medical insurance and we spend another $500 on medications each month (my wife and kid are both severe asthmatics)

Unless Obama's home saving program works (and it doesn't) and his healthcare plan adopts me and mine real fast we'll probably lose the house and most of the stuff in it. As it stands right now, I have to sell my cherished stereo to help make ends meet. Anyone want a good deal on a pair of MBL speakers that retailed for $27k or the amp that goes with it for $23k? I'll be lucky to get $15k for both.

Edit: Mach, I happy for you that you're doing well. And welcome back.

wait, you spent 50 grand on sound equipment?

No, the above stuff is just for the speakers and amp. Then there's the CD transport, digital-to-analog converter $8k, $7k, Pre-amp, $7k, room correction system $6200, lap top to run the room correction system $1,100, speaker cables, $3,300, various interconnects, $2,500 or so, power cables $900 each (and I have a lot), custom equipment rack $2500, AC power conditioner $2500, accoustic treatment for the room $2000, extra pair of speakers just sitting around not being used $13,500. And then there's the cost of a few thousand CD's.

The good thing about the stereo is that, unlike my wife, I can turn it off.

are all those things on top of the 50K, or included in it?

Add the speakers and amp to the above.
05-19-2010 10:30 AM
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smn1256 Offline
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Post: #55
RE: King Dollar
(05-18-2010 11:13 PM)I45owl Wrote:  
(05-18-2010 10:55 PM)smn1256 Wrote:  The good thing about the stereo is that, unlike my wife, I can turn it off.

To clarify, you're saying your wife doesn't know how to turn the stereo off, right?

No, I can't turn her off.
05-19-2010 10:31 AM
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smn1256 Offline
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Post: #56
RE: King Dollar
(05-19-2010 04:02 AM)Raider_ATO Wrote:  
(05-19-2010 01:55 AM)wild bill Wrote:  50 GRAND for an amp and speakers WTF...For once I agree with Robert. That's why your broke, live within your means and be prepared for the worst. I graduated school, have a good paying job, and I still drive the same POS 92 junker Buick Park Ave with 250,000 miles that my parents gave me after the engine/tranny in my truck blew up while I was in school back in 06. That alone has saved me 20+ grand over the last 4 years.

I'm not going to fault the guy for making an investment in something that he is obviously passionate about. He wasn't complaining about having to give them up, just saying that he had to sell 'em to make ends meet.

He could afford it before, now he can't. It's no different than purchasing season tickets to FB games. Many can't justify donating $X0,000 just for the right to purchase $50/game/seat tickets, but people do it (probably an investment many on here would make if they could). And I'm sure many have sold their PSLs or tickets because of what has happened over the past 2+ years.

His quality of life has dropped, which answers Mach's question.

Thanks dude
05-19-2010 10:32 AM
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smn1256 Offline
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Post: #57
RE: King Dollar
(05-19-2010 01:43 AM)RobertN Wrote:  
(05-18-2010 09:43 PM)smn1256 Wrote:  
(05-18-2010 06:32 PM)Machiavelli Wrote:  Are you better off today then you were in 2008?

No. I was laid off and had to take a job that pays about half of what I used to make and has no benefits (I'm a heart patient) On June 1, my wife will close her business of 26 years due to the decline in the construction industry. We have a house payment of almost $4k and it costs us $1k for medical insurance and we spend another $500 on medications each month (my wife and kid are both severe asthmatics)

Unless Obama's home saving program works (and it doesn't) and his healthcare plan adopts me and mine real fast we'll probably lose the house and most of the stuff in it. As it stands right now, I have to sell my cherished stereo to help make ends meet. Anyone want a good deal on a pair of MBL speakers that retailed for $27k or the amp that goes with it for $23k? I'll be lucky to get $15k for both.

Edit: Mach, I happy for you that you're doing well. And welcome back.
Not trying to be an ******* here but are you serious? $27,000 for speakers? $4,000/month for a house? Good lord.

Stick with your government issued project apartment and ghetto blaster.
05-19-2010 10:34 AM
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smn1256 Offline
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Post: #58
RE: King Dollar
(05-19-2010 07:10 AM)Rebel Wrote:  
(05-18-2010 10:55 PM)smn1256 Wrote:  No, the above stuff is just for the speakers and amp. Then there's the CD transport, digital-to-analog converter $8k, $7k, Pre-amp, $7k, room correction system $6200, lap top to run the room correction system $1,100, speaker cables, $3,300, various interconnects, $2,500 or so, power cables $900 each (and I have a lot), custom equipment rack $2500, AC power conditioner $2500, accoustic treatment for the room $2000, extra pair of speakers just sitting around not being used $13,500. And then there's the cost of a few thousand CD's.

The good thing about the stereo is that, unlike my wife, I can turn it off.

What the hell do you have, the highest-end Martin Logan's?

I'm happy with my Bose 3-2-1. My co-worker has some ML's that cost about 2K per piece. I thought that was crazy.

Over the years I've had 4 different pairs of Martin Logans: the Sequel II's, SL3's, Monoliths, and Requests. The best ones, at least in the rooms I've used them, were the Sequel II's which were the cheapest of all of them.

Right now, I have the MBL 111E speakers and 9008A amp which I just noticed have gone up in price.
05-19-2010 10:39 AM
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fsquid Offline
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Post: #59
RE: King Dollar
I'm a Benjamin Graham disciple, so I guess I don't have the highs that Mach does, but my lows aren't as bad either.
05-19-2010 10:43 AM
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Ninerfan1 Offline
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Post: #60
RE: King Dollar
Yep, that stimulus worked. 01-wingedeagle

Mortgage delinquencies and forclosures at all time high

Keep in mind, this is what the stimulus "working" looks like.
05-19-2010 10:57 AM
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