Saw this on the Mwc board

https://www.sfchronicle.com/sports/colle...289662.php

Quote:The onus is on the four remaining Pac-12 schools to ensure that expansion targets meet certain standards in terms of brand recognition and academics. Though speculation has amplified this week that the quartet could try adding four or five Mountain West teams, a league source told The Chronicle that San Diego State is the only Mountain West school that would likely receive an invite.

(08-11-2023 01:05 PM)Glenn360 Wrote:  Saw this on the Mwc board

https://www.sfchronicle.com/sports/colle...289662.php

Quote:The onus is on the four remaining Pac-12 schools to ensure that expansion targets meet certain standards in terms of brand recognition and academics. Though speculation has amplified this week that the quartet could try adding four or five Mountain West teams, a league source told The Chronicle that San Diego State is the only Mountain West school that would likely receive an invite.

They are going to have to expand their horizons/stop being so snobby.

That would be smart. That would mean they are looking at 5 aac teams for the other division.

That would make the most money at the same time keeping the academics high.

I have to believe CSU would be on there as well. They need to just play out the '24 season or invite Rice/Tulane/SMU, and then get the MWC schools the following year. Most of these schools would have to buy their own way out I'd imagine. It would be a complete disaster if any actually joined this PAC4 I'd wager.

(08-11-2023 01:08 PM)UofMstateU Wrote:  That would be smart. That would mean they are looking at 5 aac teams for the other division.

That would make the most money at the same time keeping the academics high.

The only AAC schools that'd be considered under this criteria are SMU, Rice, and Tulane... maybe Tulsa for 8? Maybe Navy... is that bad? No, but who's paying the exit fees? And who exactly is the brand power there, aside from Navy who'd be least likely to join?

All that does is kill another conference.

(08-11-2023 01:12 PM)RUScarlets Wrote:  

(08-11-2023 01:08 PM)UofMstateU Wrote:  That would be smart. That would mean they are looking at 5 aac teams for the other division.

That would make the most money at the same time keeping the academics high.

The only AAC schools that'd be considered under this criteria are SMU, Rice, and Tulane... maybe Tulsa for 8? Maybe Navy... is that bad? No, but who's paying the exit fees? And who exactly is the brand power there, aside from Navy who'd be least likely to join?

Do they want to build a conference that guarantees a spot in the CFP and gets that money going forward plus the maximum media deal? Or do they want to build their own mini conference and fade behind the MWC and take less media money while missing out on the CFP year after year? Its their decision.

It wouldn’t shock me at all. As I’ve said elsewhere, if Stanford and Cal didn’t like the academics of the Big 12, there’s no way they’d like the academics of the MWC.

Think of adding the following:

SDSU
SMU
Rice
Tulane
USF
UConn (FB-only)
Gonzaga (non-FB)

That would put the league at 10 teams each for both football and basketball, all schools with high academic standards, and somewhat reasonable East/West pods for non-revenue sports. Even if Stanford and Cal eventually leave, this league could still backfill with the “best of the rest” from the G5. Gonzaga brings in a big brand for basketball, so this would be a league solidly in the top 6 for that sport. They also preserve their own conference bid for the CFP and NCAA Tournament, both of which have value in and of itself.

I don’t buy it. Between AFA (academics) and CSU (high budget, academically passable), there’s no way they’re passing on the state of Colorado completely.

(08-11-2023 01:15 PM)Claw Wrote:  All that does is kill another conference.

Trickle down effect leads to CUSA, which means more FCS call ups

(08-11-2023 01:17 PM)IWokeUpLikeThis Wrote:  I don’t buy it. Between AFA (academics) and CSU (high budget, academically passable), there’s no way they’re passing on the state of Colorado completely.

Agreed. They should be considering all of the military academies to build a good viewership base.

(08-11-2023 01:07 PM)PredatorUTEP Wrote:  

(08-11-2023 01:05 PM)Glenn360 Wrote:  Saw this on the Mwc board

https://www.sfchronicle.com/sports/colle...289662.php

Quote:The onus is on the four remaining Pac-12 schools to ensure that expansion targets meet certain standards in terms of brand recognition and academics. Though speculation has amplified this week that the quartet could try adding four or five Mountain West teams, a league source told The Chronicle that San Diego State is the only Mountain West school that would likely receive an invite.

They are going to have to expand their horizons/stop being so snobby.

The MWC issue may be more of a economical issue than a standards issue.

1. PAC needs 10 teams to get a deal together.
2. They need those teams by 2024.
3. Teams leaving the MWC for 2024 would pay $34M each.
4. Several MWC meet PAC needs/standards: Colorado State, UNLV, Nevada, New Mexico are all Tier One research universities. SDSU isn't but should be soon.

Ultimately, this leaves the AAC as the only option for backfills, but they also have exit fees to pay.

The PAC has to decide NOW, what they want to do and what they want to be moving forward.

(08-11-2023 01:20 PM)PredatorUTEP Wrote:  

(08-11-2023 01:17 PM)IWokeUpLikeThis Wrote:  I don’t buy it. Between AFA (academics) and CSU (high budget, academically passable), there’s no way they’re passing on the state of Colorado completely.

Agreed. They should be considering all of the military academies to build a good viewership base.

I’ve been thinking about that a lot since the football brands are solid and they have elite academic standards.

To the extent that there’s a hang-up: basketball and non-revenue sports. The service academies provide a lot as football-only members (and maybe that’s an option here), but it’s not the same for all-sports.

Once again, Stanford and Cal don’t look at their non-revenue sports as merely Title IX compliance niceties. They legitimately seek to produce Olympians in their Olympic sports, so they still need to compete against top level competition.

(08-11-2023 01:15 PM)Claw Wrote:  All that does is kill another conference.

Not the PAC-4’s problem

(08-11-2023 01:15 PM)Claw Wrote:  All that does is kill another conference.

One could call it a consolidating move, yes.

(08-11-2023 01:17 PM)Frank the Tank Wrote:  It wouldn’t shock me at all. As I’ve said elsewhere, if Stanford and Cal didn’t like the academics of the Big 12, there’s no way they’d like the academics of the MWC.

Think of adding the following:

SDSU
SMU
Rice
Tulane
USF
UConn (FB-only)
Gonzaga (non-FB)

No network is paying for this nonsense... UConn FB only? If this is Luck's thinking, they are all screwed. I can't believe they are still in this mentality. In fact, they probably aren't, and just hired Luck to tell them what they want to hear before listening to more pragmatic offers. It's dead. I too thought they'd get B1G invites as well, perhaps at permanent partial shares, but the fact they didn't really tells you all you need to know. We were some of the few posters here overrating Stanford/Cal's prospects.

I believe there is a path to a national Magnolia League of sorts, but we are years away from that. We haven't gone hard enough in the semi-professional direction for the pendulum to swing hard enough in the other direction that such a league becomes possible again.

(08-11-2023 01:27 PM)Frank the Tank Wrote:  

(08-11-2023 01:20 PM)PredatorUTEP Wrote:  

(08-11-2023 01:17 PM)IWokeUpLikeThis Wrote:  I don’t buy it. Between AFA (academics) and CSU (high budget, academically passable), there’s no way they’re passing on the state of Colorado completely.

Agreed. They should be considering all of the military academies to build a good viewership base.

I’ve been thinking about that a lot since the football brands are solid and they have elite academic standards.

To the extent that there’s a hang-up: basketball and non-revenue sports. The service academies provide a lot as football-only members (and maybe that’s an option here), but it’s not the same for all-sports.

Once again, Stanford and Cal don’t look at their non-revenue sports as merely Title IX compliance niceties. They legitimately seek to produce Olympians in their Olympic sports, so they still need to compete against top level competition.

A lot of those Stanford sports already are in (or will be forced to join) other leagues. The Pac12--as a league---simply doesnt sponsor as many sports as Stanford has.

PAC 4 will have all the schools saying no to join. Not with California and Stanford eying Big 10.

Adding schools like Rice, Texas State, Tulsa, ECU, Temple, Charlotte etc, would make their conference terrible and be maybe the 8th best conference. PAC 4 don't have the power to even grab G5 schools now. They have been neutered to a point that they have to either merged with the MWC or with the AAC. Just tell Stanford and California ask the AAC for the invite and let Washington State and Oregon State that the PAC to merge with the MWC and take all the credits, and make the PAC Mountain as the new rebrand.

(08-11-2023 01:17 PM)Frank the Tank Wrote:  It wouldn’t shock me at all. As I’ve said elsewhere, if Stanford and Cal didn’t like the academics of the Big 12, there’s no way they’d like the academics of the MWC.

Think of adding the following:

SDSU
SMU
Rice
Tulane
USF
UConn (FB-only)
Gonzaga (non-FB)

That would put the league at 10 teams each for both football and basketball, all schools with high academic standards, and somewhat reasonable East/West pods for non-revenue sports. Even if Stanford and Cal eventually leave, this league could still backfill with the “best of the rest” from the G5. Gonzaga brings in a big brand for basketball, so this would be a league solidly in the top 6 for that sport. They also preserve their own conference bid for the CFP and NCAA Tournament, both of which have value in and of itself.

The league has cred, yet is small enough that it could combine productively later with another (nACC, say).

(08-11-2023 01:26 PM)Sicembear11 Wrote:  

(08-11-2023 01:07 PM)PredatorUTEP Wrote:  

(08-11-2023 01:05 PM)Glenn360 Wrote:  Saw this on the Mwc board

https://www.sfchronicle.com/sports/colle...289662.php

Quote:The onus is on the four remaining Pac-12 schools to ensure that expansion targets meet certain standards in terms of brand recognition and academics. Though speculation has amplified this week that the quartet could try adding four or five Mountain West teams, a league source told The Chronicle that San Diego State is the only Mountain West school that would likely receive an invite.

They are going to have to expand their horizons/stop being so snobby.

The MWC issue may be more of a economical issue than a standards issue.

1. PAC needs 10 teams to get a deal together.
2. They need those teams by 2024.
3. Teams leaving the MWC for 2024 would pay $34M each.
4. Several MWC meet PAC needs/standards: Colorado State, UNLV, Nevada, New Mexico are all Tier One research universities. SDSU isn't but should be soon.

Ultimately, this leaves the AAC as the only option for backfills, but they also have exit fees to pay.

The PAC has to decide NOW, what they want to do and what they want to be moving forward.

Exit fees for the MWC decrease significantly if they wait until 2025 atleast. I do agree, I think they use the AAC to atleast get to 8 teams to survive, and then bring in some others they find attractive in 2025. The PAC needs to build a good relationship with a media company outside of espn and fox (turner?) And then see if Apple will be interested in some of its catalog.

2024: SDSU, SMU, Rice, Tulane
2025: Tulsa? CSU? AFA?