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If Brett McMurphy is correct, and I think the probability is quite high, the Pac suddenly resembles the soon to be slimmed down AAC more than any of what will be the four remaining power conferences. P4 will be the new moniker.

And if all that plays out, do we have stasis until the ACC media deal door swings open again in 2030? Seems to me it would be beneficial for UC to get a successful 6-7 year run in the Big 12 before the next upheaval.

This guys theory sounds good to me:

Quote:Josh White.
@jdubDX89
·
Aug 23
Replying to
@jlkurtz
My theory- PAC12 gets dissolved, then they finally agree on 12 team playoff w/ Power 4 conference champs all getting 1st round byes.

Doesn't the PAC 12 name have too much value to simply dissolve?

I should elaborate on that. The Big East Name was sold for a large amount of cash. I couldn't imagine the PAC name just being flushed. I don't know what happens to it, but it's hard for me to imagine a $100million+ asset simply disappearing.

(08-25-2022 09:45 AM)Z-Fly Wrote:  I should elaborate on that. The Big East Name was sold for a large amount of cash. I couldn't imagine the PAC name just being flushed. I don't know what happens to it, but it's hard for me to imagine a $100million+ asset simply disappearing.

My guess would be that the remaining schools would retain the rights to the name and keep it since there is no other entity bidding on it. If Oregon State and Washington State are left behind, they'd probably jump into the MWC and bring them all under the Pac 12 name because it is a more recognizable name.

(08-25-2022 09:40 AM)Z-Fly Wrote:  Doesn't the PAC 12 name have too much value to simply dissolve?

Probably so, whoever is left brings in a bunch of MWC teams.

(08-25-2022 09:45 AM)Z-Fly Wrote:  I should elaborate on that. The Big East Name was sold for a large amount of cash. I couldn't imagine the PAC name just being flushed. I don't know what happens to it, but it's hard for me to imagine a $100million+ asset simply disappearing.

I'm actually curious if the bulk of the MWC moves over to the PAC 12, allowing the PAC 12 to retain their name, branding, etc. My thought is every team except Washington State and Oregon State leave, then the PAC 12 adds the likes of Boise State, San Diego State, Nevada, UNLV, Fresno State, Colorado State, Air Force, and, I don't know, Utah State to make 10. Or the PAC 12 just takes everyone in the Mountain West to go to 14.

I wonder how much that complicate things as it relates to contracts for bowls and especially the College Football Playoff. Obviously the PAC 12 would be a shell of itself and certainly wouldn't deserve an automatic spot in the Rose Bowl or payouts equal to the P4 for Playoff cash but I guess that's why they have lawyers.

(08-25-2022 10:56 AM)cinbinsportsfan Wrote:  

(08-25-2022 09:45 AM)Z-Fly Wrote:  I should elaborate on that. The Big East Name was sold for a large amount of cash. I couldn't imagine the PAC name just being flushed. I don't know what happens to it, but it's hard for me to imagine a $100million+ asset simply disappearing.

I'm actually curious if the bulk of the MWC moves over to the PAC 12, allowing the PAC 12 to retain their name, branding, etc. My thought is every team except Washington State and Oregon State leave, then the PAC 12 adds the likes of Boise State, San Diego State, Nevada, UNLV, Fresno State, Colorado State, Air Force, and, I don't know, Utah State to make 10. Or the PAC 12 just takes everyone in the Mountain West to go to 14.

I wonder how much that complicate things as it relates to contracts for bowls and especially the College Football Playoff. Obviously the PAC 12 would be a shell of itself and certainly wouldn't deserve an automatic spot in the Rose Bowl or payouts equal to the P4 for Playoff cash but I guess that's why they have lawyers.

From a technical standpoint the MWC would absorb OSU/WSU and the PAC 12 name/history/branding would likely come with them. This way the departing 8 PAC schools (majority) would not pay exits fees, etc. The PAC name would be an OSU?WSU consolation prize of sorts.

(08-25-2022 02:41 PM)Helicopter Wrote:  

(08-25-2022 10:56 AM)cinbinsportsfan Wrote:  

(08-25-2022 09:45 AM)Z-Fly Wrote:  I should elaborate on that. The Big East Name was sold for a large amount of cash. I couldn't imagine the PAC name just being flushed. I don't know what happens to it, but it's hard for me to imagine a $100million+ asset simply disappearing.

I'm actually curious if the bulk of the MWC moves over to the PAC 12, allowing the PAC 12 to retain their name, branding, etc. My thought is every team except Washington State and Oregon State leave, then the PAC 12 adds the likes of Boise State, San Diego State, Nevada, UNLV, Fresno State, Colorado State, Air Force, and, I don't know, Utah State to make 10. Or the PAC 12 just takes everyone in the Mountain West to go to 14.

I wonder how much that complicate things as it relates to contracts for bowls and especially the College Football Playoff. Obviously the PAC 12 would be a shell of itself and certainly wouldn't deserve an automatic spot in the Rose Bowl or payouts equal to the P4 for Playoff cash but I guess that's why they have lawyers.

From a technical standpoint the MWC would absorb OSU/WSU and the PAC 12 name/history/branding would likely come with them. This way the departing 8 PAC schools (majority) would not pay exits fees, etc. The PAC name would be an OSU?WSU consolation prize of sorts.

Is that how it would work? I would've thought that the "PAC 12" name would be legally tied to the overarching conference administration, of which the likes of Oregon State and Washington State are simply members. But it would make sense if the name, branding, etc. would be legally tied to the individual schools, since without them there is no PAC 12, and thus they could "transition" the name to the MWC.

(08-25-2022 02:56 PM)cinbinsportsfan Wrote:  

(08-25-2022 02:41 PM)Helicopter Wrote:  

(08-25-2022 10:56 AM)cinbinsportsfan Wrote:  

(08-25-2022 09:45 AM)Z-Fly Wrote:  I should elaborate on that. The Big East Name was sold for a large amount of cash. I couldn't imagine the PAC name just being flushed. I don't know what happens to it, but it's hard for me to imagine a $100million+ asset simply disappearing.

I'm actually curious if the bulk of the MWC moves over to the PAC 12, allowing the PAC 12 to retain their name, branding, etc. My thought is every team except Washington State and Oregon State leave, then the PAC 12 adds the likes of Boise State, San Diego State, Nevada, UNLV, Fresno State, Colorado State, Air Force, and, I don't know, Utah State to make 10. Or the PAC 12 just takes everyone in the Mountain West to go to 14.

I wonder how much that complicate things as it relates to contracts for bowls and especially the College Football Playoff. Obviously the PAC 12 would be a shell of itself and certainly wouldn't deserve an automatic spot in the Rose Bowl or payouts equal to the P4 for Playoff cash but I guess that's why they have lawyers.

From a technical standpoint the MWC would absorb OSU/WSU and the PAC 12 name/history/branding would likely come with them. This way the departing 8 PAC schools (majority) would not pay exits fees, etc. The PAC name would be an OSU?WSU consolation prize of sorts.

Is that how it would work? I would've thought that the "PAC 12" name would be legally tied to the overarching conference administration, of which the likes of Oregon State and Washington State are simply members. But it would make sense if the name, branding, etc. would be legally tied to the individual schools, since without them there is no PAC 12, and thus they could "transition" the name to the MWC.

It is a copyright, an "Intellectual Property." The "rights" to the name could easily be resolved as part of the "exit arrangements," just as it happened in the Old Big East/AAC transition.

By announcing their departure already, USC and UCLA have relinquished any rights they had to the brand. If the rumors are correct, the "last" two members would have the "rights" to the PAC brand name. Part of an equitable disbandment could well be to relinquish the PAC name to the remaining members which could allow a merged PAC-MWC to use the name and brand.

Remember, when the Browns left Cleveland, Art Modell agreed, as part of the settlement, to leave the "name" with the City. (Unlike the Colts, who took the "name" with them... Or the old New Orleans Jazz, who kept the name when they moved to SLC...even after a new NBA team was awarded to New Orleans and New Orleans asked them for the name back.)

(08-25-2022 02:56 PM)cinbinsportsfan Wrote:  

(08-25-2022 02:41 PM)Helicopter Wrote:  

(08-25-2022 10:56 AM)cinbinsportsfan Wrote:  

(08-25-2022 09:45 AM)Z-Fly Wrote:  I should elaborate on that. The Big East Name was sold for a large amount of cash. I couldn't imagine the PAC name just being flushed. I don't know what happens to it, but it's hard for me to imagine a $100million+ asset simply disappearing.

I'm actually curious if the bulk of the MWC moves over to the PAC 12, allowing the PAC 12 to retain their name, branding, etc. My thought is every team except Washington State and Oregon State leave, then the PAC 12 adds the likes of Boise State, San Diego State, Nevada, UNLV, Fresno State, Colorado State, Air Force, and, I don't know, Utah State to make 10. Or the PAC 12 just takes everyone in the Mountain West to go to 14.

I wonder how much that complicate things as it relates to contracts for bowls and especially the College Football Playoff. Obviously the PAC 12 would be a shell of itself and certainly wouldn't deserve an automatic spot in the Rose Bowl or payouts equal to the P4 for Playoff cash but I guess that's why they have lawyers.

From a technical standpoint the MWC would absorb OSU/WSU and the PAC 12 name/history/branding would likely come with them. This way the departing 8 PAC schools (majority) would not pay exits fees, etc. The PAC name would be an OSU?WSU consolation prize of sorts.

Is that how it would work? I would've thought that the "PAC 12" name would be legally tied to the overarching conference administration, of which the likes of Oregon State and Washington State are simply members. But it would make sense if the name, branding, etc. would be legally tied to the individual schools, since without them there is no PAC 12, and thus they could "transition" the name to the MWC.

It's just property. I'm assuming it would work the same way the Big East / AAC split happened. The Catholic schools left the Big East and bought the Big East name/brand. Which was worthwhile because "The Jesuit League" didn't have the same panache.

(08-25-2022 10:56 AM)cinbinsportsfan Wrote:  I wonder how much that complicate things as it relates to contracts for bowls and especially the College Football Playoff. Obviously the PAC 12 would be a shell of itself and certainly wouldn't deserve an automatic spot in the Rose Bowl or payouts equal to the P4 for Playoff cash but I guess that's why they have lawyers.

Interesting question about the Rose Bowl - in the past, it has been an obstacle to the BCS and the CFP. Without a strong Pac12, it loses a lot of leverage. In an expanded playoff world - you could imagine the six NY6 bowls rotating to be the quarter and semi final games??

(08-27-2022 12:00 PM)bearcat_df Wrote:  

(08-25-2022 10:56 AM)cinbinsportsfan Wrote:  I wonder how much that complicate things as it relates to contracts for bowls and especially the College Football Playoff. Obviously the PAC 12 would be a shell of itself and certainly wouldn't deserve an automatic spot in the Rose Bowl or payouts equal to the P4 for Playoff cash but I guess that's why they have lawyers.

Interesting question about the Rose Bowl - in the past, it has been an obstacle to the BCS and the CFP. Without a strong Pac12, it loses a lot of leverage. In an expanded playoff world - you could imagine the six NY6 bowls rotating to be the quarter and semi final games??

Rose Bowl will end up likely being Big Ten Big 12 matchup (assuming the PAC gets gutted). Regarding playoff games/National Championship SOFI Stadium LA would get those. The National Championship is at SOFI this season.

Forde Yard Dash: What a best-of-the-rest conference could look like

Quote:Cincinnati (31). Current conference: American. Conference in 2023: Big 12.

Ohio is football country, and Cincinnati is a football city. (The drawback: It’s an Ohio State and Bengals football city as much as or more than a Bearcats football city.) Football momentum is strong. It’s a recruitable area, athletically and academically. The school’s all-sports and academic profiles are not great, though.

(09-07-2022 08:48 AM)Cat-Man Wrote:  Forde Yard Dash: What a best-of-the-rest conference could look like

Quote:Cincinnati (31). Current conference: American. Conference in 2023: Big 12.

Ohio is football country, and Cincinnati is a football city. (The drawback: It’s an Ohio State and Bengals football city as much as or more than a Bearcats football city.) Football momentum is strong. It’s a recruitable area, athletically and academically. The school’s all-sports and academic profiles are not great, though.

I didn't see him list his home-town Louisville Cardinals. Are they in his P2?

(09-07-2022 08:48 AM)Cat-Man Wrote:  Forde Yard Dash: What a best-of-the-rest conference could look like

Quote:Cincinnati (31). Current conference: American. Conference in 2023: Big 12.

Ohio is football country, and Cincinnati is a football city. (The drawback: It’s an Ohio State and Bengals football city as much as or more than a Bearcats football city.) Football momentum is strong. It’s a recruitable area, athletically and academically. The school’s all-sports and academic profiles are not great, though.

No matter what strides we make elsewhere in the university, even getting CCC designation, until we stop choosing quantity over quality in our freshman classes that is going to be the perception (fairly or unfairly) around the country.

(08-25-2022 09:40 AM)Z-Fly Wrote:  Doesn't the PAC 12 name have too much value to simply dissolve?

Of course, the PAC 12 name has too much value to simply vanish. It's as durable as Packard, Pontiac, Plymouth, Nash, Mercury, Studebaker, Oldsmobile, DeSoto, Hudson, et al.

Nothing ever changes. Things stay the same forever. Stasis. Just ask the guys who ran Sears, the Amazon of its day.

(09-07-2022 08:54 AM)Bearcat 1985 Wrote:  

(09-07-2022 08:48 AM)Cat-Man Wrote:  Forde Yard Dash: What a best-of-the-rest conference could look like

Quote:Cincinnati (31). Current conference: American. Conference in 2023: Big 12.

Ohio is football country, and Cincinnati is a football city. (The drawback: It’s an Ohio State and Bengals football city as much as or more than a Bearcats football city.) Football momentum is strong. It’s a recruitable area, athletically and academically. The school’s all-sports and academic profiles are not great, though.

No matter what strides we make elsewhere in the university, even getting CCC designation, until we stop choosing quantity over quality in our freshman classes that is going to be the perception (fairly or unfairly) around the country.

Why are the national reports so wrong?

1. Cincinnati is not an Ohio State city, Bengals yes, but Ohio State isn’t a factor here. There are pockets of Buckeyes fans but those tend to alums or those in the northern suburban and rural towns on the way to Dayton and Columbus. Cincinnati is Reds, Bengals, and Bearcats with a side of FCC and Xavier. UK in Northern Kentucky is a factor. UC is the number college football and college basketball team in the city period.

2. Academics are actually good, not great but not poor. Research, Endowment, graduate and professional programs, and specific colleges like CCM, Engineering, and DAAP rate well. The problem will always be that A&S, Education, and Business don’t stand out. They have good programs but overall the undergraduate profile is solid but doesn’t really help UC’s standing. Academics are probably a plus unless UC is looking for a Big Ten invite.

(09-07-2022 09:41 AM)UCBearcatlawjd2 Wrote:  

(09-07-2022 08:54 AM)Bearcat 1985 Wrote:  

(09-07-2022 08:48 AM)Cat-Man Wrote:  Forde Yard Dash: What a best-of-the-rest conference could look like

Quote:Cincinnati (31). Current conference: American. Conference in 2023: Big 12.

Ohio is football country, and Cincinnati is a football city. (The drawback: It’s an Ohio State and Bengals football city as much as or more than a Bearcats football city.) Football momentum is strong. It’s a recruitable area, athletically and academically. The school’s all-sports and academic profiles are not great, though.

No matter what strides we make elsewhere in the university, even getting CCC designation, until we stop choosing quantity over quality in our freshman classes that is going to be the perception (fairly or unfairly) around the country.

Why are the national reports so wrong?

1. Cincinnati is not an Ohio State city, Bengals yes, but Ohio State isn’t a factor here. There are pockets of Buckeyes fans but those tend to alums or those in the northern suburban and rural towns on the way to Dayton and Columbus. Cincinnati is Reds, Bengals, and Bearcats with a side of FCC and Xavier. UK in Northern Kentucky is a factor. UC is the number college football and college basketball team in the city period.

2. Academics are actually good, not great but not poor. Research, Endowment, graduate and professional programs, and specific colleges like CCM, Engineering, and DAAP rate well. The problem will always be that A&S, Education, and Business don’t stand out. They have good programs but overall the undergraduate profile is solid but doesn’t really help UC’s standing. Academics are probably a plus unless UC is looking for a Big Ten invite.

I think Forde probably still has a little bit of unconscious bias based on his time in Louisville.