As a soccer fan, these things should be mentioned.

RGV already has a fairly successful pro team at the second level. I’m not knowledgeable enough to know if lower division teams across the Rio have even larger followings. (I consider Monterrey to be a bit far south for measurement)

Mind you, I know the Portland Timbers get plenty of juice throughout Oregon. My recent road trip revealed a state with perhaps even more saturation… New Mexico United, same level as RGV Toros. Before the pandemic, United was pushing capacity at Isotopes Park and being considered to get their own stadium with help from the state.

Most American soccer fans would rather see professional development than via the college route… at least by my count. That might be debatable.

Now that doesn’t mean I’d advocate closing down men’s soccer at UTRGV. That’s the call of your community as far as I’m concerned. I would guess that you’re covered whatever happens.

who cares about soccer

(11-22-2021 10:36 PM)Pounder Wrote:  As a soccer fan, these things should be mentioned.

RGV already has a fairly successful pro team at the second level. I’m not knowledgeable enough to know if lower division teams across the Rio have even larger followings. (I consider Monterrey to be a bit far south for measurement)

Occasionally the UANL Tigres play another Mexican professional team at the Toro's HEB Park in Edinburg. I don't follow soccer much but the noise and traffic around the stadium indicate a decent turnout.

(11-22-2021 10:58 PM)edinburger Wrote:  Occasionally the UANL Tigres play another Mexican professional team at the Toro's HEB Park in Edinburg. I don't follow soccer much but the noise and traffic around the stadium indicate a decent turnout.

To be truthful Edinburger while Tigres UANL are "noisy yellow neighbors" its the 9th best team in Mexico behind America and Chivas who bring much more noise than Tigres. Hell even the Tigres neighbors Rayados are a bit more than Tigres historically. The Toros pro team draws decently at times but I can only imagine that there will be major investments in all sports thanks to football being voted on.

(11-22-2021 11:11 PM)WACfan86 Wrote:  

(11-22-2021 10:58 PM)edinburger Wrote:  Occasionally the UANL Tigres play another Mexican professional team at the Toro's HEB Park in Edinburg. I don't follow soccer much but the noise and traffic around the stadium indicate a decent turnout.

To be truthful Edinburger while Tigres UANL are "noisy yellow neighbors" its the 9th best team in Mexico behind America and Chivas who bring much more noise than Tigres. Hell even the Tigres neighbors Rayados are a bit more than Tigres historically. The Toros pro team draws decently at times but I can only imagine that there will be major investments in all sports thanks to football being voted on.

I'll defer to you. I don't know anything about Mexican pro soccer, I just walk at the municipal park nextdoor and can hear the horns and cheers. Like you say maybe it was the other team drawing the crowds.

Look and to be really honest... I think culturally the RGV will lack some identity for all sports regardless of who is running or organizing it.

For example... The local pro soccer does not draw as well because people down here near the Mexico border are accustomed to rooting for the Mexico pro team of choice. For me, I have always been Rayados fan but now they are secondary to me because I have a pro team in which I can call my own. In other families, it would like being called a traitor for switching teams that do not belong to them.

How does this apply to UTRGV.... Very simple... They are used to seeing the Longhorns and Texas A&M which are Big XII(Future SEC) and SEC. When kids of the area realize that there's a team in the Valley will be a change in culture yes... disappointing (MAYBE)... why because it is not the same level as A&M and TU. Some of the old-school fundamentals of particularly rooting for one or the other may seem as backstabbing for not choosing TU or A&M. Which I think is why UTRGV will struggle plus the people here in the region want a roster composed of kids that are local to the area which for me seems impossible because the ones that do come out they go elsewhere that is not TU or A&M.

Also I call the Longhorns TU because I cannot stand their fans.

(11-23-2021 12:05 AM)WACfan86 Wrote:  Also I call the Longhorns TU because I cannot stand their fans.

I graduated from UT Austin. But go ahead and call it TU, I never was much of a fan.

My impression is that valley HS football is more competitive at a state level than valley HS basketball. So maybe running the football team on partly local talent would not be completely unrealistic?

(11-23-2021 12:29 AM)edinburger Wrote:  

(11-23-2021 12:05 AM)WACfan86 Wrote:  Also I call the Longhorns TU because I cannot stand their fans.

I graduated from UT Austin. But go ahead and call it TU, I never was much of a fan.

My impression is that valley HS football is more competitive at a state level than valley HS basketball. So maybe running the football team on partly local talent would not be completely unrealistic?

Within the last 5 years yes... much more competitive. Well a thing that does not help the RGV is the academic and if such athlete meets the requirement they are gone.

(11-23-2021 12:29 AM)edinburger Wrote:  

(11-23-2021 12:05 AM)WACfan86 Wrote:  Also I call the Longhorns TU because I cannot stand their fans.

I graduated from UT Austin. But go ahead and call it TU, I never was much of a fan.

My impression is that valley HS football is more competitive at a state level than valley HS basketball. So maybe running the football team on partly local talent would not be completely unrealistic?

From what I read the Valley is way lacking in talent compared to most regions in the state. According to the current Dave Campbells magazine the RGV produced two FBS recruits last cycle.

(11-23-2021 10:32 AM)Bobcat2013 Wrote:  

(11-23-2021 12:29 AM)edinburger Wrote:  

(11-23-2021 12:05 AM)WACfan86 Wrote:  Also I call the Longhorns TU because I cannot stand their fans.

I graduated from UT Austin. But go ahead and call it TU, I never was much of a fan.

My impression is that valley HS football is more competitive at a state level than valley HS basketball. So maybe running the football team on partly local talent would not be completely unrealistic?

From what I read the Valley is way lacking in talent compared to most regions in the state. According to the current Dave Campbells magazine the RGV produced two FBS recruits last cycle.

I was comparing to basketball. Pretty sure that two FBS recruits is way better than the number of P5 basketball recruits from the RGV.

(11-23-2021 10:32 AM)Bobcat2013 Wrote:  

(11-23-2021 12:29 AM)edinburger Wrote:  

(11-23-2021 12:05 AM)WACfan86 Wrote:  Also I call the Longhorns TU because I cannot stand their fans.

I graduated from UT Austin. But go ahead and call it TU, I never was much of a fan.

My impression is that valley HS football is more competitive at a state level than valley HS basketball. So maybe running the football team on partly local talent would not be completely unrealistic?

From what I read the Valley is way lacking in talent compared to most regions in the state. According to the current Dave Campbells magazine the RGV produced two FBS recruits last cycle.

Well there would have been 3 but he ended up tackling a referee lol

(11-23-2021 04:41 PM)Vaqueronation Wrote:  

(11-23-2021 10:32 AM)Bobcat2013 Wrote:  

(11-23-2021 12:29 AM)edinburger Wrote:  

(11-23-2021 12:05 AM)WACfan86 Wrote:  Also I call the Longhorns TU because I cannot stand their fans.

I graduated from UT Austin. But go ahead and call it TU, I never was much of a fan.

My impression is that valley HS football is more competitive at a state level than valley HS basketball. So maybe running the football team on partly local talent would not be completely unrealistic?

From what I read the Valley is way lacking in talent compared to most regions in the state. According to the current Dave Campbells magazine the RGV produced two FBS recruits last cycle.

Well there would have been 3 but he ended up tackling a referee lol

He would've done it eventually. Admittedly some refs have made decisions that made me want to tackle them but I don't condone violence to those who can't see it coming.

(11-11-2021 05:21 PM)DZ1 Wrote:  

(11-11-2021 03:45 PM)edinburger Wrote:  

(11-11-2021 03:36 PM)DZ1 Wrote:  

(11-11-2021 03:34 PM)dbackjon Wrote:  

(11-11-2021 03:28 PM)DZ1 Wrote:  Bummer! Sad day for UTRGV men's soccer and perhaps other men's sports at UTRGV.

I noticed that the referendum did have a lot of additional incentives in it to entice students to vote:
Women's swimming & diving
Marching bands
addition of a spirit program

Finally, it seems to only apply to incoming students who obviously did not get to vote.
"The increase will start in Fall 2022 and affect only incoming students and students outside of UTRGV’s Guarantees Tuition ad Fees program, the University wrote in a news release."
Cleverly done.

Even though I think this is a major mistake, I do hope UTRGV succeeds.

Why do you think this will impact Men's Soccer?

Title IX

Are you suggesting that we might drop the whole team, or just that they're going to get systematically shorted on resources, facilities, and attention?

I'm a Title IX ignoramus. I can see that a women's swimming and diving team is not enough to offset an entire football team. On the other hand, there hasn't been any hint given that we were going to drop a men's sport as part of the package. Is it allowable to achieve Title IX balance by (for example) giving some men's teams less than the NCAA max on scholarships?

As I understand it, Title IX does not require that equal dollars be spent for men's and women's sports, but it does require that an equal number of athletic scholarships be offered for men and women. Since football requires quite a few scholarships, institutions are sometimes forced to make difficult choices in other men's sports. Either cut a program entirely or try to survive with a competitive disadvantage (i.e, fewer scholarship players). The other option is to add more scholarships for women athletes. Adding more scholarships for women seems to be UTRGV's preferred course of action. I applaud them for that. However, this brings additional costs to the university which sometimes cannot be absorbed leading to a difficult budgetary process where the institution reluctantly needs to cut a men's sport since it cannot afford to have so many scholarships. Soccer is often the first sport that gets placed on the chopping block. Very few mid-major schools have successful football and soccer programs. In fact, very few mid-majors offer both sports.
I am cheering for UTRGV's success, but history would suggest soccer is in danger.

I was pursuing this thread for something else, but saw this. Title IX is a three-prong test. One is actual scholarships, which is why most men’s sports have a lower max than their women counterparts. For example basketball is 13 for men, 15 for women. Baseball is 11.7 while softball is 12. However, FCS is 63 and FBS is 85. No football playing school would ever meet that criteria unless they offered 2-3 other men’s sports and 10 women’s.

The second prong is proportionality. Most football schools meet it on this level. They almost always have a higher number of women’s sports, proportionally, to men’s.

The third is progression, usually in the form of adding women’s sports. UTRGV had to add another sport to keep this one inline, as they offer an equal number of both. Yes softball would help with this and the second prong as well.

Now my question, does anyone have an idea where UTRGV football will be played? All I could find was they would play in two cities, but no actual or proposed venues were listed.

One proposed place would be HEB Park Stadium.

https://edinburgpolitics.com/2017/09/28/...ccer-fans/

That’s a good looking soccer stadium. I’m sure it would transition to football.

Based on the idea of proposed, I assume they are looking at their options as we speak?

(11-22-2021 10:45 PM)SammyH Wrote:  who cares about soccer

Me

#ListosVerdeBlack homey

(01-16-2022 05:25 PM)FoUTASportscaster Wrote:  That’s a good looking soccer stadium. I’m sure it would transition to football.

Based on the idea of proposed, I assume they are looking at their options as we speak?

I think HEB Park is a better option than Sam's Memorial in Brownsville.

(01-16-2022 06:17 PM)Outsider Wrote:  

(01-16-2022 05:25 PM)FoUTASportscaster Wrote:  That’s a good looking soccer stadium. I’m sure it would transition to football.

Based on the idea of proposed, I assume they are looking at their options as we speak?

I think HEB Park is a better option than Sam's Memorial in Brownsville.

The main proposal floating around is just what you said: HEB Park for the Edinburg games and Sam's Memorial for the Brownsville games. And you're also right that people seem to agree that HEB is better. But the university sold the games-in-two-cities promise really hard, so I think there's no going back on that, unless we try it for several years and the attendance is several times larger in Edinburg (which could happen).

I think those two got picked mainly for capacity. If we're more realistic about attendance there are plenty of other options; Sam's is a HS stadium anyway so no harm in looking at others. I just don't see any new stadiums being built unless a billionaire has a whim. Elon Musk is buying property and driving up prices in B'Ville but shows no interest in sports, much less FCS startups.

(01-17-2022 05:42 PM)edinburger Wrote:  

(01-16-2022 06:17 PM)Outsider Wrote:  

(01-16-2022 05:25 PM)FoUTASportscaster Wrote:  That’s a good looking soccer stadium. I’m sure it would transition to football.

Based on the idea of proposed, I assume they are looking at their options as we speak?

I think HEB Park is a better option than Sam's Memorial in Brownsville.

The main proposal floating around is just what you said: HEB Park for the Edinburg games and Sam's Memorial for the Brownsville games. And you're also right that people seem to agree that HEB is better. But the university sold the games-in-two-cities promise really hard, so I think there's no going back on that, unless we try it for several years and the attendance is several times larger in Edinburg (which could happen).

I think those two got picked mainly for capacity. If we're more realistic about attendance there are plenty of other options; Sam's is a HS stadium anyway so no harm in looking at others. I just don't see any new stadiums being built unless a billionaire has a whim. Elon Musk is buying property and driving up prices in B'Ville but shows no interest in sports, much less FCS startups.

The idea to split home games between two cities seems strange. There is no real homefield. The UTRGV fanbase may truly be that spread-out, but doesn't that keep the fanbase split and prevent them from coming together? The HS football stadium isn't necessarily the issue. ACU had to do it for decades before finally getting the donor base to build Wildcat Stadium back on campus. HEB is the nicer stadium in my opinion, but I would think that UTRGV would want to build a fanbase that is united, rather than split, either way. I am sure there will be some fans that go to both.

(01-17-2022 07:58 PM)Outsider Wrote:  

(01-17-2022 05:42 PM)edinburger Wrote:  

(01-16-2022 06:17 PM)Outsider Wrote:  

(01-16-2022 05:25 PM)FoUTASportscaster Wrote:  That’s a good looking soccer stadium. I’m sure it would transition to football.

Based on the idea of proposed, I assume they are looking at their options as we speak?

I think HEB Park is a better option than Sam's Memorial in Brownsville.

The main proposal floating around is just what you said: HEB Park for the Edinburg games and Sam's Memorial for the Brownsville games. And you're also right that people seem to agree that HEB is better. But the university sold the games-in-two-cities promise really hard, so I think there's no going back on that, unless we try it for several years and the attendance is several times larger in Edinburg (which could happen).

I think those two got picked mainly for capacity. If we're more realistic about attendance there are plenty of other options; Sam's is a HS stadium anyway so no harm in looking at others. I just don't see any new stadiums being built unless a billionaire has a whim. Elon Musk is buying property and driving up prices in B'Ville but shows no interest in sports, much less FCS startups.

The idea to split home games between two cities seems strange. There is no real homefield. The UTRGV fanbase may truly be that spread-out, but doesn't that keep the fanbase split and prevent them from coming together? The HS football stadium isn't necessarily the issue. ACU had to do it for decades before finally getting the donor base to build Wildcat Stadium back on campus. HEB is the nicer stadium in my opinion, but I would think that UTRGV would want to build a fanbase that is united, rather than split, either way. I am sure there will be some fans that go to both.

You're right but it's one of many issues caused by the "merger". It boils down to two facts: (a) the students and locals in Brownsville always suspect they are being treated as 2nd class, but their votes were needed for the referendum, and (b) the two cities are represented by different legislators, and keeping them happy is necessary to even have money and approval for football, much less salaries, classrooms, etc.

I sympathize a little bit with the Brownsville guys. (Not enough to agree with this wacky plan, but a little.) They had their own sports teams, D2 but some of them were very good, especially volleyball. They lost all that in the merger when the state said UTRGV would inherit the UTPA D1 programs and conference membership.