(09-29-2021 10:49 AM)eaglewraith Wrote:  So for all these complaints about Cobb, we do know that a school's AD doesn't do anything without the approval of the President right?

AD's play a major roll in them. Usually a joint decision by the AD, President and Board.

(09-29-2021 02:32 PM)AppManDG Wrote:  

(09-29-2021 10:49 AM)eaglewraith Wrote:  So for all these complaints about Cobb, we do know that a school's AD doesn't do anything without the approval of the President right?

AD's play a major roll in them. Usually a joint decision by the AD, President and Board.

So as I said, the athletic and institutional alignment of a university is not solely decided by its AD.

So why is Charlie Cobb bearing the brunt of all of this?

Because he's Charlie Cobb

(09-28-2021 07:19 PM)herdfan129 Wrote:  I'm confused. Did Ga St fans really expect to receive an AAC invite?

This guy apparently did:

Dr. Becker retired in June. He was very public about his vision to grow the athletics. To his credit, he followed through by investing much resources and showing support toward athletics during his tenure.

Hired away from the George Washington University, Dr. Blake took office somewhere in August and athletics is like 5 percent of his job. It's not implausible that he has been busy managing affairs elsewhere. It's a pretty big university operating over billion dollars in expenses. He has been public in some academic matters, but no words about athletics so far. Could be that the GSU Athletics is on an autopilot mode while Dr. Blake is delegating athletic department matters to his AD so far.

In comes Charlie with his agenda.. or so it appears.

Sorry to resurrect this one, but I wasn’t approved to post when it was active.

Just have to say that I could have totally been down with the AAC…even in its diminished form. GSU is a weird school. Being in a conference with schools like Temple, Navy and Tulane…I can see where that makes some sense. We’re in the same weird neighborhood.

I’m not going to pretend we are an elite academic university, but I feel comfortable saying that our alumni largely take more pride in our academics than our athletics. The administration seems to think similarly.

To be very clear, I’m not saying the AAC is a better conference. I think athletically that the SBC is the best G5 conference. App State, GS, UL, stAte…that’s a tough mix to top.

But I can see where the AAC peer members could make sense for GSU. If we truly bailed out on presenting our case, that’s a disappointment.

(09-29-2021 03:32 PM)eaglewraith Wrote:  

(09-29-2021 02:32 PM)AppManDG Wrote:  

(09-29-2021 10:49 AM)eaglewraith Wrote:  So for all these complaints about Cobb, we do know that a school's AD doesn't do anything without the approval of the President right?

AD's play a major roll in them. Usually a joint decision by the AD, President and Board.

So as I said, the athletic and institutional alignment of a university is not solely decided by its AD.

So why is Charlie Cobb bearing the brunt of all of this?

Something about a sweater. ;>)

(10-11-2021 01:39 AM)GSU-Blue Wrote:  Sorry to resurrect this one, but I wasn’t approved to post when it was active.

Just have to say that I could have totally been down with the AAC…even in its diminished form. GSU is a weird school. Being in a conference with schools like Temple, Navy and Tulane…I can see where that makes some sense. We’re in the same weird neighborhood.

I’m not going to pretend we are an elite academic university, but I feel comfortable saying that our alumni largely take more pride in our academics than our athletics. The administration seems to think similarly.

To be very clear, I’m not saying the AAC is a better conference. I think athletically that the SBC is the best G5 conference. App State, GS, UL, stAte…that’s a tough mix to top.

But I can see where the AAC peer members could make sense for GSU. If we truly bailed out on presenting our case, that’s a disappointment.

Tulane Navy and SMU are the only schools in either conference that are heavy on academics.

Everyone else has roughly the same undergraduate profile. Even Tulsas undergraduate profile is only slightly better than Apps for example.

This might appease some of your fans that have an outmoded sense of where GSU's academics actually stack up, but if you have an undergraduate degree from Ga St, you were a similar student to every other SBC program, and worse (on average) than some.

(10-11-2021 09:56 AM)ballantyneapp Wrote:  

(10-11-2021 01:39 AM)GSU-Blue Wrote:  Sorry to resurrect this one, but I wasn’t approved to post when it was active.

Just have to say that I could have totally been down with the AAC…even in its diminished form. GSU is a weird school. Being in a conference with schools like Temple, Navy and Tulane…I can see where that makes some sense. We’re in the same weird neighborhood.

I’m not going to pretend we are an elite academic university, but I feel comfortable saying that our alumni largely take more pride in our academics than our athletics. The administration seems to think similarly.

To be very clear, I’m not saying the AAC is a better conference. I think athletically that the SBC is the best G5 conference. App State, GS, UL, stAte…that’s a tough mix to top.

But I can see where the AAC peer members could make sense for GSU. If we truly bailed out on presenting our case, that’s a disappointment.

Tulane Navy and SMU are the only schools in either conference that are heavy on academics.

Everyone else has roughly the same undergraduate profile. Even Tulsas undergraduate profile is only slightly better than Apps for example.

This might appease some of your fans that have an outmoded sense of where GSU's academics actually stack up, but if you have an undergraduate degree from Ga St, you were a similar student to every other SBC program, and worse (on average) than some.

Again, I’m not pretending we are an elite academics university, but we tend to be academics first. And to be fair, we do have some fairly respected colleges and degrees. On a blended average, maybe that doesn’t show as much.

I’m just saying our alumni largely see academics>athletics. Aligning with some of the AAC schools, I can see where that would satisfy those alumni. And it’s perfectly fine to debate whether they are misguided or not. A case can be made both ways.

(10-11-2021 09:56 AM)ballantyneapp Wrote:  

(10-11-2021 01:39 AM)GSU-Blue Wrote:  Sorry to resurrect this one, but I wasn’t approved to post when it was active.

Just have to say that I could have totally been down with the AAC…even in its diminished form. GSU is a weird school. Being in a conference with schools like Temple, Navy and Tulane…I can see where that makes some sense. We’re in the same weird neighborhood.

I’m not going to pretend we are an elite academic university, but I feel comfortable saying that our alumni largely take more pride in our academics than our athletics. The administration seems to think similarly.

To be very clear, I’m not saying the AAC is a better conference. I think athletically that the SBC is the best G5 conference. App State, GS, UL, stAte…that’s a tough mix to top.

But I can see where the AAC peer members could make sense for GSU. If we truly bailed out on presenting our case, that’s a disappointment.

Tulane Navy and SMU are the only schools in either conference that are heavy on academics.

Everyone else has roughly the same undergraduate profile. Even Tulsas undergraduate profile is only slightly better than Apps for example.

This might appease some of your fans that have an outmoded sense of where GSU's academics actually stack up, but if you have an undergraduate degree from Ga St, you were a similar student to every other SBC program, and worse (on average) than some.

Think what you want, but those academic rankings actually matter. No, there isn't much difference in a school ranked 225 or ranked 260...but there is a big difference in schools ranked in the Top 250 and R1/R2 compared to a school unranked and listed as a regional college.

I guess our applications and GROWTH of enrollment while average entrance metrics have improved despite the regional designation…

If you’re discussing academics when it comes the G5 conference realignment I’ll show you a school that has under performed on the field.

(10-11-2021 10:15 AM)GSU-Blue Wrote:  

(10-11-2021 09:56 AM)ballantyneapp Wrote:  

(10-11-2021 01:39 AM)GSU-Blue Wrote:  Sorry to resurrect this one, but I wasn’t approved to post when it was active.

Just have to say that I could have totally been down with the AAC…even in its diminished form. GSU is a weird school. Being in a conference with schools like Temple, Navy and Tulane…I can see where that makes some sense. We’re in the same weird neighborhood.

I’m not going to pretend we are an elite academic university, but I feel comfortable saying that our alumni largely take more pride in our academics than our athletics. The administration seems to think similarly.

To be very clear, I’m not saying the AAC is a better conference. I think athletically that the SBC is the best G5 conference. App State, GS, UL, stAte…that’s a tough mix to top.

But I can see where the AAC peer members could make sense for GSU. If we truly bailed out on presenting our case, that’s a disappointment.

Tulane Navy and SMU are the only schools in either conference that are heavy on academics.

Everyone else has roughly the same undergraduate profile. Even Tulsas undergraduate profile is only slightly better than Apps for example.

This might appease some of your fans that have an outmoded sense of where GSU's academics actually stack up, but if you have an undergraduate degree from Ga St, you were a similar student to every other SBC program, and worse (on average) than some.

Again, I’m not pretending we are an elite academics university, but we tend to be academics first. And to be fair, we do have some fairly respected colleges and degrees. On a blended average, maybe that doesn’t show as much.

I’m just saying our alumni largely see academics>athletics. Aligning with some of the AAC schools, I can see where that would satisfy those alumni. And it’s perfectly fine to debate whether they are misguided or not. A case can be made both ways.

sorry, this is just such a specious argument. All of our universities have respected college and degrees. If your fanbase ostensibly values academics over athletics, you should be advocating to significantly reduce athletics or drop them altogether., not double the cost to the university, which is almost entirely borne by the students. The only schools that have actually value academics over athletics are the ivies et al, and maybe Rice.

For everyone else athletics is a business.

(10-11-2021 10:23 AM)herdfan129 Wrote:  

(10-11-2021 09:56 AM)ballantyneapp Wrote:  

(10-11-2021 01:39 AM)GSU-Blue Wrote:  Sorry to resurrect this one, but I wasn’t approved to post when it was active.

Just have to say that I could have totally been down with the AAC…even in its diminished form. GSU is a weird school. Being in a conference with schools like Temple, Navy and Tulane…I can see where that makes some sense. We’re in the same weird neighborhood.

I’m not going to pretend we are an elite academic university, but I feel comfortable saying that our alumni largely take more pride in our academics than our athletics. The administration seems to think similarly.

To be very clear, I’m not saying the AAC is a better conference. I think athletically that the SBC is the best G5 conference. App State, GS, UL, stAte…that’s a tough mix to top.

But I can see where the AAC peer members could make sense for GSU. If we truly bailed out on presenting our case, that’s a disappointment.

Tulane Navy and SMU are the only schools in either conference that are heavy on academics.

Everyone else has roughly the same undergraduate profile. Even Tulsas undergraduate profile is only slightly better than Apps for example.

This might appease some of your fans that have an outmoded sense of where GSU's academics actually stack up, but if you have an undergraduate degree from Ga St, you were a similar student to every other SBC program, and worse (on average) than some.

Think what you want, but those academic rankings actually matter. No, there isn't much difference in a school ranked 225 or ranked 260...but there is a big difference in schools ranked in the Top 250 and R1/R2 compared to a school unranked and listed as a regional college.

sorry you are conflating academic mission with academics. They only matter if you are a career academic.

Whats the actual difference between an undergraduate student at Marshall vs App? Only that the top quartile of Marshall students would even have a shot at being accepted into App.

and, for the record, even though our academic profiles are vastly different, i'm openly campaigning for Marshall and App to be in the same ATHLETIC conference.

(10-11-2021 10:37 AM)ballantyneapp Wrote:  

(10-11-2021 10:23 AM)herdfan129 Wrote:  

(10-11-2021 09:56 AM)ballantyneapp Wrote:  

(10-11-2021 01:39 AM)GSU-Blue Wrote:  Sorry to resurrect this one, but I wasn’t approved to post when it was active.

Just have to say that I could have totally been down with the AAC…even in its diminished form. GSU is a weird school. Being in a conference with schools like Temple, Navy and Tulane…I can see where that makes some sense. We’re in the same weird neighborhood.

I’m not going to pretend we are an elite academic university, but I feel comfortable saying that our alumni largely take more pride in our academics than our athletics. The administration seems to think similarly.

To be very clear, I’m not saying the AAC is a better conference. I think athletically that the SBC is the best G5 conference. App State, GS, UL, stAte…that’s a tough mix to top.

But I can see where the AAC peer members could make sense for GSU. If we truly bailed out on presenting our case, that’s a disappointment.

Tulane Navy and SMU are the only schools in either conference that are heavy on academics.

Everyone else has roughly the same undergraduate profile. Even Tulsas undergraduate profile is only slightly better than Apps for example.

This might appease some of your fans that have an outmoded sense of where GSU's academics actually stack up, but if you have an undergraduate degree from Ga St, you were a similar student to every other SBC program, and worse (on average) than some.

Think what you want, but those academic rankings actually matter. No, there isn't much difference in a school ranked 225 or ranked 260...but there is a big difference in schools ranked in the Top 250 and R1/R2 compared to a school unranked and listed as a regional college.

sorry you are conflating academic mission with academics. They only matter if you are a career academic.

Whats the actual difference between an undergraduate student at Marshall vs App? Only that the top quartile of Marshall students would even have a shot at being accepted into App.

https://www.usnews.com/best-colleges/app...6/applying

“ Appalachian State University admissions is selective with an acceptance rate of 80% and an early acceptance rate of 82%. Half the applicants admitted to Appalachian State have an SAT score between 1070 and 1240 or an ACT score of 22 and 27.”

Average ACT at Marshall 19-25….

This is now the 7th level of realignment hell, discussing academics.

(10-11-2021 10:46 AM)Saint3333 Wrote:  Average ACT at Marshall 19-25….

This is now the 7th level of realignment hell, discussing academics.

Well you're posting in a Gast realignment thread so.....

(10-11-2021 10:37 AM)ballantyneapp Wrote:  

(10-11-2021 10:23 AM)herdfan129 Wrote:  

(10-11-2021 09:56 AM)ballantyneapp Wrote:  

(10-11-2021 01:39 AM)GSU-Blue Wrote:  Sorry to resurrect this one, but I wasn’t approved to post when it was active.

Just have to say that I could have totally been down with the AAC…even in its diminished form. GSU is a weird school. Being in a conference with schools like Temple, Navy and Tulane…I can see where that makes some sense. We’re in the same weird neighborhood.

I’m not going to pretend we are an elite academic university, but I feel comfortable saying that our alumni largely take more pride in our academics than our athletics. The administration seems to think similarly.

To be very clear, I’m not saying the AAC is a better conference. I think athletically that the SBC is the best G5 conference. App State, GS, UL, stAte…that’s a tough mix to top.

But I can see where the AAC peer members could make sense for GSU. If we truly bailed out on presenting our case, that’s a disappointment.

Tulane Navy and SMU are the only schools in either conference that are heavy on academics.

Everyone else has roughly the same undergraduate profile. Even Tulsas undergraduate profile is only slightly better than Apps for example.

This might appease some of your fans that have an outmoded sense of where GSU's academics actually stack up, but if you have an undergraduate degree from Ga St, you were a similar student to every other SBC program, and worse (on average) than some.

Think what you want, but those academic rankings actually matter. No, there isn't much difference in a school ranked 225 or ranked 260...but there is a big difference in schools ranked in the Top 250 and R1/R2 compared to a school unranked and listed as a regional college.

sorry you are conflating academic mission with academics. They only matter if you are a career academic.

Whats the actual difference between an undergraduate student at Marshall vs App? Only that the top quartile of Marshall students would even have a shot at being accepted into App.

and, for the record, even though our academic profiles are vastly different, i'm openly campaigning for Marshall and App to be in the same ATHLETIC conference.

I personally agree with you that academic talk is dumb when discussing an athletic conference, but it doesn't matter what I think. It's been proven time and time again that these things do matter to University Presidents aka the decision makers.

(10-11-2021 10:46 AM)Saint3333 Wrote:  Average ACT at Marshall 19-25….

This is now the 7th level of realignment hell, discussing academics.

Marshall is an R2 on pace to be R1 in three years. UNSWR ranking of around 275. Nothing special but much better than an unranked regional college. Just saying.

Ga St is an R1, so yes, I'm sure academics do matter at Ga St. It's one of the many reasons why Ga St has a better shot at the AAC than App. It's also why Ga St might consider CUSA if it comes down to it, so they can be associated with other national research institutions as opposed to regional colleges. Nothing wrong with either designation, but it does speak to the overall mission of the University.

(10-11-2021 10:57 AM)herdfan129 Wrote:  

(10-11-2021 10:46 AM)Saint3333 Wrote:  Average ACT at Marshall 19-25….

This is now the 7th level of realignment hell, discussing academics.

Marshall is an R2 on pace to be R1 in three years. UNSWR ranking of around 275. Nothing special but much better than an unranked regional college. Just saying.

Ga St is an R1, so yes, I'm sure academics do matter at Ga St. It's one of the many reasons why Ga St has a better shot at the AAC than App. It's also why Ga St might consider CUSA if it comes down to it, so they can be associated with other national research institutions as opposed to regional colleges. Nothing wrong with either designation, but it does speak to the overall mission of the University.

We are not sliding sideways to CUSA. lol

Looking at the past and current frontrunner targets, essentially, the AAC is looking for RESEARCH classified universities. Just say that. That doesn't mean they have better academics at all. That's a specification of the type of university. Little to nothing to do with how great academically it is. That alone will impact certain rankings and how universities are classified on certain sources.