(07-22-2021 09:56 AM)jmu98 Wrote:  There are not going to be too many guys that are getting big time deals as a result of NIL and most kids will just be able to monetize themselves on social and maybe make a few extra bucks doing meet and greet type gigs.

[...]

What I think we will see three years from now that NIL is not even an issue anymore as it will result in a very small number of players getting really crazy deals while the rest of the folks will be able to make a few extra bucks on the side that they should have been able to do forever.

This, this, a thousand times this.

(07-22-2021 09:40 AM)Deez Nuts Wrote:  BJK you don't think it's going to get interesting? I think it's a slippery slope. I don't know toward what end, if it'll be positive or negative but I'm sure there will be both. Some college athletes gonna get rich quick though and the gap will get wider!

Not really, no. I think it's a slope that will do nothing but reinforce the current dynamics and power structure of college football. Even if it does add an element of 'pay-to-play', I'm confident it will be right in line with current team/conference clout and will change precisely nothing. Oklahoma will get exactly the same level of players they've always gotten - only now the athletes who they've profited off of for decades will finally get a little extra cash for their trouble.

And, gee, if some school like App State wants to spend a little more to get a little more, great! Pay the laborers what they're worth to your program. What a novel concept.

So could a donor now just give a player $100 for the great game they just played?

If fans want to prevent a player from leaving/transferring or going pro, can they just start a go fund me page to pay him/her to stay?

Are there limits at this point?

I honestly don't know...

We can't really discuss the P5 where many of the athletes are already set monetarily.

So in the JMU type world, a football athlete decides to come to JMU because a great athletic program, playing time, good social life, pretty women, good education, close to home. For the most part the same reasons most kids decide where they want to go to school. Now the athlete needs to consider how well he can market himself so he doesn't need to pick up a part time job for beer money. "I'll choose my #2 ODU over my #1 JMU, I won't start or get tons of PT at ODU, not much love for the Norfolk area but SB Bollard is going to pay me $10K to do TV commercials and I get a free education"

Amateur sports is no longer really amateur. It's kind the same thing that happened to the Olympic athletes over the years. The athletes are following the money, even playing for other countries.

This follow the money has been going on a long time in the power conferences but this is pretty new territory for the mid major type programs were part of the decision making is now financial. What's in it for me trumps loving your sport and school while they give me a good education.

The worst part I see in all of this; there's no putting this Jeanie back in the bottle. The NCAA isn't taking baby steps such as "To start, we'll allow your name on a shirt and you can collect x% of the sale price. Next year we'll allow you to market for school sponsors, next year you can partner with local business, the year after we'll allow shoe companies"

This monster they seem to have created is going to get really interesting.

Here, let me google that for you.

(07-22-2021 10:47 AM)Dukester Wrote:  So could a donor now just give a player $100 for the great game they just played?

No.

"What they can’t do is accept money related to athletic performance. The NCAA still prohibits pay-for-play, meaning athletes can’t be paid to compete for a specific school, receive performance-based incentives or any similar type of payment. The NCAA acknowledges that performance “may enhance a student-athlete’s NIL value,” but it cannot be the “consideration” for NIL compensation."
https://www.wboy.com/goldandbluenation/n...im-policy/

(07-22-2021 10:47 AM)Dukester Wrote:  If fans want to prevent a player from leaving/transferring or going pro, can they just start a go fund me page to pay him/her to stay?

No. That's not NIL, that's just giving someone money. If fans want to start a gofundme to pay him to endorse some spurious thing, sure, probably. This seems pretty straight forward.

(07-22-2021 10:47 AM)Dukester Wrote:  Are there limits at this point?

Within the rules? Yes. To the money? No.

(07-22-2021 10:47 AM)Dukester Wrote:  I honestly don't know...

There will be situations that one could look at and say "that wouldn't have happened without NIL."

As people have noted, young and/or dumb people do young and/or dumb stuff. An extra few grand (and certainty a $1M) means those mistakes can be multiplied. I scrapped enough money to go on some good party trips during college. I did some things that my mom wouldn't have approved of. If I had more money, I would have gone on more party trips, and I very likely done more things that I probably shouldn't have. NIL money is not the source, but its a multiplier and people will point those times out.

As JMU85 pointed out, the relationships in a locker room will be multiplied. The $1M QB throws his third INT in a game, I'm certain a teammate is going to point it out that they ain't worth $hit. But guess what, that $1M QB was already on the front cover of the game program, they were already the one already doing the interview, they were already the one that fans sought out for autographs. The jealousy type dynamic won't start with NIL, it will just be multiplied.

Athletes with money will continue to get bad advice and suffer financially from it, now there will just be more cases of it and it will start earlier. Again nothing new, just multiplied.

On the flip side, thousands of athletes will finally get a piece of the billion dollar industry that was built with the support of unpaid labor.

So as far as I see it, this isn't flipping a switch as it seems like some may think it is. IMHO, its more of adjusting the dimmer on the light and I'm all for it.

(07-22-2021 10:01 AM)Dukester Wrote:  

(07-22-2021 09:10 AM)AssyrianDuke Wrote:  Athletes have folks that are helping guide their decision making while building their "brand." If something could limit their potential exposure I don't think they are going to take it. The kids aren't as dumb as we think they are, especially not when they have help figuring it out.

And I will say, there will be many that make mistakes not due to being dumb, but young, naive, and misguided. Probably peer pressure will lead to a lot of interesting events/situations. Students/friends/even family - "Come up - hook this up for us, you have NIL"

Might be a lot more drug suspensions as well.

Many players will likely listen less to the coaches direction.

https://www.thestate.com/sports/college/...36203.html

How much did they get for this?

I'm not sure I follow why there will be more drug suspensions, but I don't think that's your main point so I'll leave it for now. My point is that NIL isn't the end of all things. Again, it helps to have a solid support system around you; not just for NIL purposes, but for most things in life, and not everyone has that unfortunately. That said, yeah mistakes will be made, hangers on will hang on, etc. and it isn't just a problem with NCAA athletes.

One of the Cowboys OL's (I think Tyron Smith) had his family show up at training camp asking him to pay their bills, and the team had to step in and take action (thankfully, they were very supportive of him as well). A hockey player had his own parents steal millions from him to the point he had to file for bankruptcy. I am sure we have all seen the 30 for 30 titled "Broke" where a bunch of athletes spend and lose their money. It doesn't mean we should stop paying pro athletes, or that pro athletes should never enter into marketing/promotional deals.

If the NCAA wasn't so impotent, they could have seen this coming and changed their rules to accommodate the situation. They didn't. Instead they sat on the sidelines and watched as state after state wrote and passed their own bills, superseding the NCAA's supposed authority. They desperately hoped Congress would do something to help them, which shows just how out of touch the NCAA is with reality by expecting Congress to do something quickly. They could have organized this and played a leading role in putting these laws together. Instead, they did nothing and got caught with their pants down.

(07-22-2021 10:47 AM)Dukester Wrote:  So could a donor now just give a player $100 for the great game they just played?

If fans want to prevent a player from leaving/transferring or going pro, can they just start a go fund me page to pay him/her to stay?

Are there limits at this point?

I honestly don't know...

No you can't just pay a player for playing a game or for him to stay another year and that is not what this is about. It is all about the player having some control to make money on their name, etc. which allows them to have a youtube page that can be monetized, they can do an autograph signing, or a meet and greet with fans and get paid. As this all shakes out most guys will quickly realized that they are not going to make huge money and maybe they can make a few bucks on the side. The ironic thing about all of this is that some of the most successful guys in NIL are going to make their money in ways that are not related to football.

I understand that their are a lot of crazy boosters out there and they are the ones that you have to watch out for in all of this. The large advertisers are really not going to dip their toes too far into these waters.

But - Charlie Obaugh can give a player a car and money to promote his dealership?

You might not be able to just give $ for performance, or to an athlete, but it seems like you could be creative to get around that. Take care of my lawn. Work in my office etc. Promote me or my business.

Plus I thought when this was first announced I heard that this might just be the start. That what is allowed now was due to a certain case, but there are additional areas that may be freed up in the future for athletes.

(07-22-2021 12:09 PM)Dukester Wrote:  But - Charlie Obaugh can give a player a car and money to promote his dealership?

You might not be able to just give $ for performance, or to an athlete, but it seems like you could be creative to get around that. Take care of my lawn. Work in my office etc. Promote me or my business.

Plus I thought when this was first announced I heard that this might just be the start. That what is allowed now was due to a certain case, but there are additional areas that may be freed up in the future for athletes.

Right we can all give money to the car dealership to pay sponsorships for players. There is a way around anything. Pandora's box is opened and much like the early days (golden age) of the internet with Napster and other file sharing apps allowing you to pirate any song or movie ever made...until some controls are put into place it will be wild west for a bit.

(07-22-2021 10:47 AM)Dukester Wrote:  So could a donor now just give a player $100 for the great game they just played?

If fans want to prevent a player from leaving/transferring or going pro, can they just start a go fund me page to pay him/her to stay?

Are there limits at this point?

I honestly don't know...

I can't give an athlete $100 but I can go buy 10 shirts with his name on it.

No go fund me but a donor could buy a corvette put it in the garage for a year or two so it's there when the kid graduates. The kid could borrow the car while he's still in school.

There was a basketball player that worked a summer job for a painting contractor that happen to be a long time donor, connected to the who's who in the donor circle. Guess how much that kid got paid by the hour and how muck overtime he worked (this was 20 yrs ago)

NIL not just for college athletes.

https://www.espn.com/high-school/story/_...tball-star

(07-22-2021 12:23 PM)RamDawg Wrote:  

(07-22-2021 10:47 AM)Dukester Wrote:  So could a donor now just give a player $100 for the great game they just played?

If fans want to prevent a player from leaving/transferring or going pro, can they just start a go fund me page to pay him/her to stay?

Are there limits at this point?

I honestly don't know...

I can't give an athlete $100 but I can go buy 10 shirts with his name on it.

No go fund me but a donor could buy a corvette put it in the garage for a year or two so it's there when the kid graduates. The kid could borrow the car while he's still in school.

There was a basketball player that worked a summer job for a painting contractor that happen to be a long time donor, connected to the who's who in the donor circle. Guess how much that kid got paid by the hour and how muck overtime he worked (this was 20 yrs ago)

This sounds like how UCLA funded that basketball dynasty years ago.

(07-22-2021 12:23 PM)RamDawg Wrote:  There was a basketball player that worked a summer job for a painting contractor that happen to be a long time donor, connected to the who's who in the donor circle. Guess how much that kid got paid by the hour and how muck overtime he worked (this was 20 yrs ago)

WAIT. Are you trying to tell me. That student athletes have found ways around NCAA regulations. For DECADES?!?

Whatever you do, don't tell Dukester.

(07-22-2021 12:27 PM)JMU Wrote:  NIL not just for college athletes.

https://www.espn.com/high-school/story/_...tball-star

I think you will see firms like Big League Advance start investing in HS and College kids. Big League Advance invests in young Baseball talent that they study and believe to have a great amount of Major League potential. They pay these players six figures in return for 10% of all their future contracts. Tatis Jr. is a client and on their roughly 300k investment they will received 3.5M from his new contract. If a player does not pan out they do not ask for any money back. That is a risk Big League Advance takes. They may not be able to pay the athlete but maybe offer Marketing Services or Financial Advice in exchange of a percentage of future earnings.

(07-22-2021 09:29 AM)Dukester Wrote:  

(07-22-2021 09:10 AM)AssyrianDuke Wrote:  Athletes have folks that are helping guide their decision making while building their "brand." If something could limit their potential exposure I don't think they are going to take it. The kids aren't as dumb as we think they are, especially not when they have help figuring it out.

I'm sorry - but as in any segment of the population - there are plenty of dumb and naive athletes. There will also be many new folks that actually guild their decisions in the wrong direction.

Redskins top draft pick two years ago.

- On draft night rents bowling center, charges people to come to his draft party
- Keeps practice to a minimum - no extra time is spent to improve his game.
- in Middle of covid (when players were supposed to be in lockdown) had strippers come to his home and girlfriend takes pictures and puts them on 'net. Gets in trouble.
- Later in same season rents out a room with Strippers for birthday, and again GF puts pictures on the 'net.

His action may have cost him a long career and potentially over $50,000,000.

When these players, get money like they have never scene at the age of 18 -23. You're going to see a lot of interesting stuff....

There's going to be a lot of stuff over the next few years........

I agree. We should enjoy the comedy.

(07-22-2021 01:00 PM)JMU85 Wrote:  

(07-22-2021 12:27 PM)JMU Wrote:  NIL not just for college athletes.

https://www.espn.com/high-school/story/_...tball-star

I think you will see firms like Big League Advance start investing in HS and College kids. Big League Advance invests in young Baseball talent that they study and believe to have a great amount of Major League potential. They pay these players six figures in return for 10% of all their future contracts. Tatis Jr. is a client and on their roughly 300k investment they will received 3.5M from his new contract. If a player does not pan out they do not ask for any money back. That is a risk Big League Advance takes. They may not be able to pay the athlete but maybe offer Marketing Services or Financial Advice in exchange of a percentage of future earnings.

Once again this is very different than what NIL is really about. Big League advance is not about NIL it is about pure athletic talent. Sure those lines will blur a bit for the elite of the elite and there will be some players who really cash in on this, but most will make a few extra bucks. You have heard a few stories over the last few weeks of deals, but generally there has been nothing crazy. The fact is that most of these guys are just not that marketable from a purely athletic perspective. Many will be marketable because of social media skills, etc. but most will not kill it just because they are a football/basketball player.

(07-22-2021 10:00 PM)jmu98 Wrote:  

(07-22-2021 01:00 PM)JMU85 Wrote:  

(07-22-2021 12:27 PM)JMU Wrote:  NIL not just for college athletes.

https://www.espn.com/high-school/story/_...tball-star

I think you will see firms like Big League Advance start investing in HS and College kids. Big League Advance invests in young Baseball talent that they study and believe to have a great amount of Major League potential. They pay these players six figures in return for 10% of all their future contracts. Tatis Jr. is a client and on their roughly 300k investment they will received 3.5M from his new contract. If a player does not pan out they do not ask for any money back. That is a risk Big League Advance takes. They may not be able to pay the athlete but maybe offer Marketing Services or Financial Advice in exchange of a percentage of future earnings.

Once again this is very different than what NIL is really about. Big League advance is not about NIL it is about pure athletic talent. Sure those lines will blur a bit for the elite of the elite and there will be some players who really cash in on this, but most will make a few extra bucks. You have heard a few stories over the last few weeks of deals, but generally there has been nothing crazy. The fact is that most of these guys are just not that marketable from a purely athletic perspective. Many will be marketable because of social media skills, etc. but most will not kill it just because they are a football/basketball player.

I never BLA was in the NIL market. I said that I can see things opening up to firms that are similar to the BLA model . If you don't think firms like this are not licking their chops then you are living under a rock.

Sent from my LM-V405 using Tapatalk

How long do you think it will take before wealthy William Mary and Richmond Boosters get involved and start throwing around money using NIL to help their their schools become competitive again in football?

I could see a booster who owns a business offer $3,000 a year to existing players to promote the booster’s business through the players’ social media accounts. The strategy may not be of the same scale as top tier FBS programs such as the Miami gym owner paying the entire Hurricanes football roster $6,000 a year but impressive enough to attract top tier FCS players.

I wonder if academic standards will fall for "student-athletes" because they are no longer student-athletes, but, rather, professional athletes. I think so. After all, who cares about their grades, these are professionals. Why should they even be required to go to class?

The whole development is very sad in my opinion. How many millions will be thrown at five-star kids to pretend to be college students?

(07-26-2021 06:49 AM)Purple Wrote:  I wonder if academic standards will fall for "student-athletes" because they are no longer student-athletes, but, rather, professional athletes. I think so. After all, who cares about their grades, these are professionals. Why should they even be required to go to class?

The whole development is very sad in my opinion. How many millions will be thrown at five-star kids to pretend to be college students?

Are you implying that college students outside of the sports realm that make money off their name, image, and likeness streaming on twitch or producing videos on YouTube are also professionals?

Where has this pearl clutching been for all this time that they've been allowed to do this?