(07-25-2021 09:55 AM)JRsec Wrote:  

(07-24-2021 05:02 PM)TerryD Wrote:  

(07-24-2021 07:49 AM)XLance Wrote:  

(07-23-2021 08:06 PM)TerryD Wrote:  

(07-23-2021 05:30 AM)XLance Wrote:  TerryD, this is a game changer and may be the point in time that Notre Dame climbs off of their high horse and has to mingle with the common folk.

Notre Dame is in a position to either save college football or watch it be destroyed. The question is: will they do the right thing? or will they succumb to the sin of greed?

Lol, greed? ND has left tens of millions of dollars on the table by being a football independent.

ND is not indy because of money.

"Save college football" ?? ND has no such duty nor ability.

What is the "right thing", Lance?

Something that just happens to benefit North Carolina ?? Right.....

Terry do you remember Omni?
Great Syracuse poster, he was a true realignment guru. He always claimed that the "power" in the current ACC rested with Florida State and Carolina.
If the SEC/ESPN can corral Texas and to a much lesser extent Oklahoma, then they could very well lasso in FSU and Carolina. Things are just not what they were a few months ago. If that happens, the rest of the ACC will go the way of the what will be left of the Big 12, maybe not at the same pace, but a steady decline, none the less.
Notre Dame has the power to stop that process if they act now. I get the Notre Dame's pride of being "independent". It makes the Irish unique. However, if Notre Dame holds on too long and the system collapses what good is independence?
Too much stubbornness and pride could land the Irish in the same position as a dozen other schools in a year or two, trying to climb into a life boat, and the only space available might be in the B1G.

See my post in the other thread.

If the conferences force ND to abandon independence, why not cash in the most with the Big Ten?

Why in the world would ND agree to join the ACC in football for half the money it can get in the Big Ten?

One of the main reasons ND joined the ACC was that it didn't include football. It kept ND football independent.

If ND football has to surrender to the conferences and become like everyone else, that advantage goes away.

If so, then a big reason that ND joined the ACC goes away.

In that case, why not become like everyone else (like everyone wanted, right??) and join the Big Ten to get the most filthy lucre for it?

Why not join the SEC and get even more filthy lucre, and better recruiting grounds and bring UNC, UVa, FSU and Clemson with you? As the B1G says, you are contiguos!

You said it yourself a few years ago. ND and the SEC are not a good fit.

Now, if you would go ahead and get the SEC to make that offer, I am sure that Jack Swarbrick will take that call.

(07-25-2021 02:01 PM)TerryD Wrote:  

(07-25-2021 09:55 AM)JRsec Wrote:  

(07-24-2021 05:02 PM)TerryD Wrote:  

(07-24-2021 07:49 AM)XLance Wrote:  

(07-23-2021 08:06 PM)TerryD Wrote:  Lol, greed? ND has left tens of millions of dollars on the table by being a football independent.

ND is not indy because of money.

"Save college football" ?? ND has no such duty nor ability.

What is the "right thing", Lance?

Something that just happens to benefit North Carolina ?? Right.....

Terry do you remember Omni?
Great Syracuse poster, he was a true realignment guru. He always claimed that the "power" in the current ACC rested with Florida State and Carolina.
If the SEC/ESPN can corral Texas and to a much lesser extent Oklahoma, then they could very well lasso in FSU and Carolina. Things are just not what they were a few months ago. If that happens, the rest of the ACC will go the way of the what will be left of the Big 12, maybe not at the same pace, but a steady decline, none the less.
Notre Dame has the power to stop that process if they act now. I get the Notre Dame's pride of being "independent". It makes the Irish unique. However, if Notre Dame holds on too long and the system collapses what good is independence?
Too much stubbornness and pride could land the Irish in the same position as a dozen other schools in a year or two, trying to climb into a life boat, and the only space available might be in the B1G.

See my post in the other thread.

If the conferences force ND to abandon independence, why not cash in the most with the Big Ten?

Why in the world would ND agree to join the ACC in football for half the money it can get in the Big Ten?

One of the main reasons ND joined the ACC was that it didn't include football. It kept ND football independent.

If ND football has to surrender to the conferences and become like everyone else, that advantage goes away.

If so, then a big reason that ND joined the ACC goes away.

In that case, why not become like everyone else (like everyone wanted, right??) and join the Big Ten to get the most filthy lucre for it?

Why not join the SEC and get even more filthy lucre, and better recruiting grounds and bring UNC, UVa, FSU and Clemson with you? As the B1G says, you are contiguos!

You said it yourself a few years ago. ND and the SEC are not a good fit.

Now, if you would go ahead and get the SEC to make that offer, I am sure that Jack Swarbrick will take that call.

I'd say "fit" is becoming rather moot wouldn't you?
Money is the only factor in play apparently.

So if Swarbrick had to toss in I'm sure Sankey would be all ears.

I can't think of a private to take Vandy's slot that would be more productive. Your basketball might be better suited to the SEC and your baseball is solid.

ND would take the SEC valuation close to 11 billion as OU and UT take us nearly to 10.

Terry normally I'd be kidding but we are already beyond old norms and I figure Southern exposure is more important to ND's future than ever. And frankly at the figures being dangled the PAC and ACC aren't as safe as many may think. All it takes in either one is a bell cow jumping the fence for what's greener and tripling media revenue is pretty danged green.

(07-25-2021 02:27 PM)JRsec Wrote:  

(07-25-2021 02:01 PM)TerryD Wrote:  

(07-25-2021 09:55 AM)JRsec Wrote:  

(07-24-2021 05:02 PM)TerryD Wrote:  

(07-24-2021 07:49 AM)XLance Wrote:  Terry do you remember Omni?
Great Syracuse poster, he was a true realignment guru. He always claimed that the "power" in the current ACC rested with Florida State and Carolina.
If the SEC/ESPN can corral Texas and to a much lesser extent Oklahoma, then they could very well lasso in FSU and Carolina. Things are just not what they were a few months ago. If that happens, the rest of the ACC will go the way of the what will be left of the Big 12, maybe not at the same pace, but a steady decline, none the less.
Notre Dame has the power to stop that process if they act now. I get the Notre Dame's pride of being "independent". It makes the Irish unique. However, if Notre Dame holds on too long and the system collapses what good is independence?
Too much stubbornness and pride could land the Irish in the same position as a dozen other schools in a year or two, trying to climb into a life boat, and the only space available might be in the B1G.

See my post in the other thread.

If the conferences force ND to abandon independence, why not cash in the most with the Big Ten?

Why in the world would ND agree to join the ACC in football for half the money it can get in the Big Ten?

One of the main reasons ND joined the ACC was that it didn't include football. It kept ND football independent.

If ND football has to surrender to the conferences and become like everyone else, that advantage goes away.

If so, then a big reason that ND joined the ACC goes away.

In that case, why not become like everyone else (like everyone wanted, right??) and join the Big Ten to get the most filthy lucre for it?

Why not join the SEC and get even more filthy lucre, and better recruiting grounds and bring UNC, UVa, FSU and Clemson with you? As the B1G says, you are contiguos!

You said it yourself a few years ago. ND and the SEC are not a good fit.

Now, if you would go ahead and get the SEC to make that offer, I am sure that Jack Swarbrick will take that call.

I'd say "fit" is becoming rather moot wouldn't you?
Money is the only factor in play apparently.

So if Swarbrick had to toss in I'm sure Sankey would be all ears.

I can't think of a private to take Vandy's slot that would be more productive. Your basketball might be better suited to the SEC and your baseball is solid.

ND would take the SEC valuation close to 11 billion as OU and UT take us nearly to 10.

Terry normally I'd be kidding but we are already beyond old norms and I figure Southern exposure is more important to ND's future than ever. And frankly at the figures being dangled the PAC and ACC aren't as safe as many may think. All it takes in either one is a bell cow jumping the fence for what's greener and tripling media revenue is pretty danged green.

At this point with the additions the SEC made it has the most reach across the country. The academics have improved and the cache is unmatched.

(07-25-2021 02:37 PM)domer1978 Wrote:  

(07-25-2021 02:27 PM)JRsec Wrote:  

(07-25-2021 02:01 PM)TerryD Wrote:  

(07-25-2021 09:55 AM)JRsec Wrote:  

(07-24-2021 05:02 PM)TerryD Wrote:  See my post in the other thread.

If the conferences force ND to abandon independence, why not cash in the most with the Big Ten?

Why in the world would ND agree to join the ACC in football for half the money it can get in the Big Ten?

One of the main reasons ND joined the ACC was that it didn't include football. It kept ND football independent.

If ND football has to surrender to the conferences and become like everyone else, that advantage goes away.

If so, then a big reason that ND joined the ACC goes away.

In that case, why not become like everyone else (like everyone wanted, right??) and join the Big Ten to get the most filthy lucre for it?

Why not join the SEC and get even more filthy lucre, and better recruiting grounds and bring UNC, UVa, FSU and Clemson with you? As the B1G says, you are contiguos!

You said it yourself a few years ago. ND and the SEC are not a good fit.

Now, if you would go ahead and get the SEC to make that offer, I am sure that Jack Swarbrick will take that call.

I'd say "fit" is becoming rather moot wouldn't you?
Money is the only factor in play apparently.

So if Swarbrick had to toss in I'm sure Sankey would be all ears.

I can't think of a private to take Vandy's slot that would be more productive. Your basketball might be better suited to the SEC and your baseball is solid.

ND would take the SEC valuation close to 11 billion as OU and UT take us nearly to 10.

Terry normally I'd be kidding but we are already beyond old norms and I figure Southern exposure is more important to ND's future than ever. And frankly at the figures being dangled the PAC and ACC aren't as safe as many may think. All it takes in either one is a bell cow jumping the fence for what's greener and tripling media revenue is pretty danged green.

At this point with the additions the SEC made it has the most reach across the country. The academics have improved and the cache is unmatched.

Just based on what is going to be paid out now N.D. would raise the 75 million to between 77-78 million per school. We aren't getting paid now on just what is added, but on brand synergy. This is how networks sculpt a league.

(07-25-2021 02:27 PM)JRsec Wrote:  

(07-25-2021 02:01 PM)TerryD Wrote:  

(07-25-2021 09:55 AM)JRsec Wrote:  

(07-24-2021 05:02 PM)TerryD Wrote:  

(07-24-2021 07:49 AM)XLance Wrote:  Terry do you remember Omni?
Great Syracuse poster, he was a true realignment guru. He always claimed that the "power" in the current ACC rested with Florida State and Carolina.
If the SEC/ESPN can corral Texas and to a much lesser extent Oklahoma, then they could very well lasso in FSU and Carolina. Things are just not what they were a few months ago. If that happens, the rest of the ACC will go the way of the what will be left of the Big 12, maybe not at the same pace, but a steady decline, none the less.
Notre Dame has the power to stop that process if they act now. I get the Notre Dame's pride of being "independent". It makes the Irish unique. However, if Notre Dame holds on too long and the system collapses what good is independence?
Too much stubbornness and pride could land the Irish in the same position as a dozen other schools in a year or two, trying to climb into a life boat, and the only space available might be in the B1G.

See my post in the other thread.

If the conferences force ND to abandon independence, why not cash in the most with the Big Ten?

Why in the world would ND agree to join the ACC in football for half the money it can get in the Big Ten?

One of the main reasons ND joined the ACC was that it didn't include football. It kept ND football independent.

If ND football has to surrender to the conferences and become like everyone else, that advantage goes away.

If so, then a big reason that ND joined the ACC goes away.

In that case, why not become like everyone else (like everyone wanted, right??) and join the Big Ten to get the most filthy lucre for it?

Why not join the SEC and get even more filthy lucre, and better recruiting grounds and bring UNC, UVa, FSU and Clemson with you? As the B1G says, you are contiguos!

You said it yourself a few years ago. ND and the SEC are not a good fit.

Now, if you would go ahead and get the SEC to make that offer, I am sure that Jack Swarbrick will take that call.

I'd say "fit" is becoming rather moot wouldn't you?
Money is the only factor in play apparently.

So if Swarbrick had to toss in I'm sure Sankey would be all ears.

I can't think of a private to take Vandy's slot that would be more productive. Your basketball might be better suited to the SEC and your baseball is solid.

ND would take the SEC valuation close to 11 billion as OU and UT take us nearly to 10.

Terry normally I'd be kidding but we are already beyond old norms and I figure Southern exposure is more important to ND's future than ever. And frankly at the figures being dangled the PAC and ACC aren't as safe as many may think. All it takes in either one is a bell cow jumping the fence for what's greener and tripling media revenue is pretty danged green.

I say that "fit" is dead as well. I just wanted to see if you agreed.

We live in interesting times.

(07-25-2021 03:59 PM)TerryD Wrote:  

(07-25-2021 02:27 PM)JRsec Wrote:  

(07-25-2021 02:01 PM)TerryD Wrote:  

(07-25-2021 09:55 AM)JRsec Wrote:  

(07-24-2021 05:02 PM)TerryD Wrote:  See my post in the other thread.

If the conferences force ND to abandon independence, why not cash in the most with the Big Ten?

Why in the world would ND agree to join the ACC in football for half the money it can get in the Big Ten?

One of the main reasons ND joined the ACC was that it didn't include football. It kept ND football independent.

If ND football has to surrender to the conferences and become like everyone else, that advantage goes away.

If so, then a big reason that ND joined the ACC goes away.

In that case, why not become like everyone else (like everyone wanted, right??) and join the Big Ten to get the most filthy lucre for it?

Why not join the SEC and get even more filthy lucre, and better recruiting grounds and bring UNC, UVa, FSU and Clemson with you? As the B1G says, you are contiguos!

You said it yourself a few years ago. ND and the SEC are not a good fit.

Now, if you would go ahead and get the SEC to make that offer, I am sure that Jack Swarbrick will take that call.

I'd say "fit" is becoming rather moot wouldn't you?
Money is the only factor in play apparently.

So if Swarbrick had to toss in I'm sure Sankey would be all ears.

I can't think of a private to take Vandy's slot that would be more productive. Your basketball might be better suited to the SEC and your baseball is solid.

ND would take the SEC valuation close to 11 billion as OU and UT take us nearly to 10.

Terry normally I'd be kidding but we are already beyond old norms and I figure Southern exposure is more important to ND's future than ever. And frankly at the figures being dangled the PAC and ACC aren't as safe as many may think. All it takes in either one is a bell cow jumping the fence for what's greener and tripling media revenue is pretty danged green.

I say that "fit" is dead as well. I just wanted to see if you agreed.

We live in interesting times.

And a curse indeed it is. If it comes to it ESPN can work out the minutia. I'm sure they would salivate over potential match ups. I figure the one chomping at the bit for a chance is FSU.

I found it ironic in a bad way that OU and UT were announced the same day as Coach Bowden's cancer. My brother used to fly him around some and loved the guy. Tommy was in a Sunday School class for awhile with us and is genuine and sharp. Don't know what gene pool Terry came out of 'cause he's different.

The irony was that sometime late '90 or early '91 as years run together now, the SEC hatched a Kramer plan to jump from 10 to 16 in a strategic strike. Texas, Texas A&M, Arkansas, Clemson, and Florida State were approached and as usual Texas had then what our people called a silent partner, Oklahoma. As it will wind up everyone the SEC sought except Clemson and FSU will be members. Odd that the announcement for UT and OU came on the same day. Prayers for Coach Bowden a true gentleman and heckuva competitor and coach.

I always liked Roy Kramer. Always struck me as the quintessential southern gentleman. The kind of guy that could tell you what he thought but do it in a respectful way. I always appreciated doing business with people like that.

(07-25-2021 04:33 PM)CardinalJim Wrote:  I always liked Roy Kramer. Always struck me as the quintessential southern gentleman. The kind of guy that could tell you what he thought but do it in a respectful way. I always appreciated doing business with people like that.

I sat with the Kramers and earlier with Harvey Schiller at more than a couple of games and liked both very much. I never met Slive and haven't met Sankey, but people I know and trust thought very highly of the Slives and feel the same about Sankey.

His first two years I felt that a couple of situations between member schools got a bit heated and he should have stepped in earlier, but he has found his stride and is truly doing an outstanding job both in moves and in playing Smokey the Bear.

(07-25-2021 01:32 PM)Lou_C Wrote:  It occurred to me last night that the ACC does have one play here. It's actually a pretty good one. JR, excuse me posting this again, repeating from the other thread.

So..what if the ACC offered Texas, Baylor and TT. And released FSU from the GOR to take Texas' place in the SEC?

Here's the genius of this...all the ACC has to do is float this out there so that the Texas legislature is on the spot. Every politician in Texas that is loyal to A&M, Baylor, or TT would have to line up behind this idea over Texas going to the SEC. Make no mistake, Texas politicians aren't going to be able, or interested, in really forcing TX to stay in the Big 12. They might make some noise, but they'll eventually be able to say "what alternative is there really?".

Well, now they've got an alternative, and it's going to be real hard to acquiesce to Texas to the SEC, when there's a deal on the table that save Baylor, TT, AND mollifies Texas A&M.

ND could sweeten the deal with a sixth ACC game, to be an annual game against Texas.

The ACC Network with full carriage in Texas would be a huge windfall for ESPN...after all, the SECN is already on there. Especially with an extra (half) ND game...they could siginificantly pay up.

If the ACC floats this offer out there, they could actually have some impact on how this goes.

If I was a Dude, I'd float out that I was actually hearing this and try to will it into existence. Maybe there's a Dude of College Station that can run with this "inside information" and try to get Texas politicians all riled up.

I don’t know if the average value of UT, TTU, and BYU is better than the value of FSU. Does FSU really want to get out of this conference? I don’t see any possible exit...

(07-25-2021 01:32 PM)Lou_C Wrote:  It occurred to me last night that the ACC does have one play here. It's actually a pretty good one. JR, excuse me posting this again, repeating from the other thread.

So..what if the ACC offered Texas, Baylor and TT. And released FSU from the GOR to take Texas' place in the SEC?

Here's the genius of this...all the ACC has to do is float this out there so that the Texas legislature is on the spot. Every politician in Texas that is loyal to A&M, Baylor, or TT would have to line up behind this idea over Texas going to the SEC. Make no mistake, Texas politicians aren't going to be able, or interested, in really forcing TX to stay in the Big 12. They might make some noise, but they'll eventually be able to say "what alternative is there really?".

Well, now they've got an alternative, and it's going to be real hard to acquiesce to Texas to the SEC, when there's a deal on the table that save Baylor, TT, AND mollifies Texas A&M.

ND could sweeten the deal with a sixth ACC game, to be an annual game against Texas.

The ACC Network with full carriage in Texas would be a huge windfall for ESPN...after all, the SECN is already on there. Especially with an extra (half) ND game...they could siginificantly pay up.

If the ACC floats this offer out there, they could actually have some impact on how this goes.

If I was a Dude, I'd float out that I was actually hearing this and try to will it into existence. Maybe there's a Dude of College Station that can run with this "inside information" and try to get Texas politicians all riled up.

I like the idea of getting the Texas politicians involved and offering the Texas schools but don't like letting FSU get out of the granting of rights. Why would the ACC let FSU get away. Who cares about appeasing the SEC? Its every conference for himself and the SEC will have to outsmart the other conferences. What about getting things really muddled up by offering Oklahoma and Oklahoma State as well, to get the Oklahoma politicians involved. That would really screw things up for Texas and Oklahoma and their quest for conference domination. If i were Texas Tech, Baylor, TCU and Oklahoma State, i would be calling up the state politicians and getting them involved, especially if the ACC came with an offer for all of them.

(07-25-2021 11:37 PM)tj_2009 Wrote:  

(07-25-2021 01:32 PM)Lou_C Wrote:  It occurred to me last night that the ACC does have one play here. It's actually a pretty good one. JR, excuse me posting this again, repeating from the other thread.

So..what if the ACC offered Texas, Baylor and TT. And released FSU from the GOR to take Texas' place in the SEC?

Here's the genius of this...all the ACC has to do is float this out there so that the Texas legislature is on the spot. Every politician in Texas that is loyal to A&M, Baylor, or TT would have to line up behind this idea over Texas going to the SEC. Make no mistake, Texas politicians aren't going to be able, or interested, in really forcing TX to stay in the Big 12. They might make some noise, but they'll eventually be able to say "what alternative is there really?".

Well, now they've got an alternative, and it's going to be real hard to acquiesce to Texas to the SEC, when there's a deal on the table that save Baylor, TT, AND mollifies Texas A&M.

ND could sweeten the deal with a sixth ACC game, to be an annual game against Texas.

The ACC Network with full carriage in Texas would be a huge windfall for ESPN...after all, the SECN is already on there. Especially with an extra (half) ND game...they could siginificantly pay up.

If the ACC floats this offer out there, they could actually have some impact on how this goes.

If I was a Dude, I'd float out that I was actually hearing this and try to will it into existence. Maybe there's a Dude of College Station that can run with this "inside information" and try to get Texas politicians all riled up.

I like the idea of getting the Texas politicians involved and offering the Texas schools but don't like letting FSU get out of the granting of rights. Why would the ACC let FSU get away. Who cares about appeasing the SEC? Its every conference for himself and the SEC will have to outsmart the other conferences. What about getting things really muddled up by offering Oklahoma and Oklahoma State as well, to get the Oklahoma politicians involved. That would really screw things up for Texas and Oklahoma and their quest for conference domination. If i were Texas Tech, Baylor, TCU and Oklahoma State, i would be calling up the state politicians and getting them involved, especially if the ACC came with an offer for all of them.

I've been thinking that the ACC should go to 20 with Texas, Oklahoma, OSU, TCU, Kansas, and either WVU or Cincinnati for a few years. As usual, the leadership is a dollar short and a day late. Actually millions of dollars short.

Oklahoma State president rips Oklahoma about leaving for the SEC

https://www.espn.com/college-sports/stor...-statement

From her standpoint, she should be working the state politicians hard and see whether they will block Oklahoma from leaving the Big XII. I don't know whether she will but these schools should be fighting for their future not rolling over and accepting their fate without a fight. From a strategy standpoint Texas Tech, TCU and Baylor should be doing the same by lobbying the Texas politicians. I suspect they are probably also calling the other conferences Pac 12, ACC and B1G to see whether they will throw them a lifeline. The other conferences could in collusion with the Oklahoma politicians and Texas politicians block the SEC from taking Texas and Oklahoma if they provide a home for all of these schools from Oklahoma and Texas including Oklahoma and Texas. This might be a bit of hassle though so maybe it is better to live with the SEC becoming all powerful and domineering.

(07-27-2021 12:00 AM)tj_2009 Wrote:  Oklahoma State president rips Oklahoma about leaving for the SEC

https://www.espn.com/college-sports/stor...-statement

From her standpoint, she should be working the state politicians hard and see whether they will block Oklahoma from leaving the Big XII. I don't know whether she will but these schools should be fighting for their future not rolling over and accepting their fate without a fight. From a strategy standpoint Texas Tech, TCU and Baylor should be doing the same by lobbying the Texas politicians. I suspect they are probably also calling the other conferences Pac 12, ACC and B1G to see whether they will throw them a lifeline. The other conferences could in collusion with the Oklahoma politicians and Texas politicians block the SEC from taking Texas and Oklahoma if they provide a home for all of these schools from Oklahoma and Texas including Oklahoma and Texas. This might be a bit of hassle though so maybe it is better to live with the SEC becoming all powerful and domineering.

A little life lesson. Oklahoma and Texas have law schools and almost all state house members are lawyers who graduated from Texas and Oklahoma.