Here we go again (SBC vs CUSA)

*** SMUstang ***

Last I checked the AAC already had a school located in Houston. Also, the AAC already has too many small, private universities that do not have much of a fan following-- they do not need to add another one.

(07-19-2021 03:36 PM)CliftonAve Wrote:  Last I checked the AAC already had a school located in Houston. Also, the AAC already has too many small, private universities that do not have much of a fan following-- they do not need to add another one.

The SWC also had both Houston and Rice. Seemed to work OK for them. Also D/FW had both SMU and TCU in the SWC - no problem with that. What makes the AAC different?

(07-19-2021 03:42 PM)SMUstang Wrote:  

(07-19-2021 03:36 PM)CliftonAve Wrote:  Last I checked the AAC already had a school located in Houston. Also, the AAC already has too many small, private universities that do not have much of a fan following-- they do not need to add another one.

The SWC also had both Houston and Rice. Seemed to work OK for them. Also D/FW had both SMU and TCU in the SWC - no problem with that. What makes the AAC different?

Where is the SWC today?

(07-19-2021 04:52 PM)SoCalBobcat78 Wrote:  

(07-19-2021 03:42 PM)SMUstang Wrote:  

(07-19-2021 03:36 PM)CliftonAve Wrote:  Last I checked the AAC already had a school located in Houston. Also, the AAC already has too many small, private universities that do not have much of a fan following-- they do not need to add another one.

The SWC also had both Houston and Rice. Seemed to work OK for them. Also D/FW had both SMU and TCU in the SWC - no problem with that. What makes the AAC different?

Where is the SWC today?

The demise of the SWC had nothing to do with Rice and Houston being in the same city.

(07-19-2021 05:27 PM)SMUstang Wrote:  

(07-19-2021 04:52 PM)SoCalBobcat78 Wrote:  

(07-19-2021 03:42 PM)SMUstang Wrote:  

(07-19-2021 03:36 PM)CliftonAve Wrote:  Last I checked the AAC already had a school located in Houston. Also, the AAC already has too many small, private universities that do not have much of a fan following-- they do not need to add another one.

The SWC also had both Houston and Rice. Seemed to work OK for them. Also D/FW had both SMU and TCU in the SWC - no problem with that. What makes the AAC different?

Where is the SWC today?

The demise of the SWC had nothing to do with Rice and Houston being in the same city.

You are right. "Pony Excess" had more to do with the fall of the SWC.

(07-19-2021 05:34 PM)Side.Show.Joe Wrote:  

(07-19-2021 05:27 PM)SMUstang Wrote:  

(07-19-2021 04:52 PM)SoCalBobcat78 Wrote:  

(07-19-2021 03:42 PM)SMUstang Wrote:  

(07-19-2021 03:36 PM)CliftonAve Wrote:  Last I checked the AAC already had a school located in Houston. Also, the AAC already has too many small, private universities that do not have much of a fan following-- they do not need to add another one.

The SWC also had both Houston and Rice. Seemed to work OK for them. Also D/FW had both SMU and TCU in the SWC - no problem with that. What makes the AAC different?

Where is the SWC today?

The demise of the SWC had nothing to do with Rice and Houston being in the same city.

You are right. "Pony Excess" had more to do with the fall of the SWC.

Truth is, regional conferences were deemed to be obsolete, and broader conferences were receiving larger media contracts.

*** SMUstang ***

(07-19-2021 05:27 PM)SMUstang Wrote:  

(07-19-2021 04:52 PM)SoCalBobcat78 Wrote:  

(07-19-2021 03:42 PM)SMUstang Wrote:  

(07-19-2021 03:36 PM)CliftonAve Wrote:  Last I checked the AAC already had a school located in Houston. Also, the AAC already has too many small, private universities that do not have much of a fan following-- they do not need to add another one.

The SWC also had both Houston and Rice. Seemed to work OK for them. Also D/FW had both SMU and TCU in the SWC - no problem with that. What makes the AAC different?

Where is the SWC today?

The demise of the SWC had nothing to do with Rice and Houston being in the same city.

Rice did absolutely nothing for the SWC in football or basketball. Houston and SMU could not keep themselves out of trouble. Arkansas left for the SEC. At the end of the day, Texas and Texas A&M were the dominant schools in Houston and Dallas. The Big 12 did not need Houston, Rice, SMU or TCU for the Houston and Dallas markets.

Houston and Rice did nothing to save the SWC despite being in the Houston market. I would love to see a revised SWC with Texas State, North Texas, UTSA, UTEP, and Rice. I just don't think that conference would be good enough to interest the networks. I don't see Rice going to the AAC. They don't add anything and the AAC needs a 12th team that can be a fairly consistent Top 25 team in football. The best home for Rice is CUSA.

Assuming that no P5 schools would jump and that geography became important, one could make a pretty solid Texas-centric conference:

Houston
SMU
Rice
UNT
UTSA
UTEP
Tulsa
LaTech
Tulane

(07-19-2021 06:09 PM)SMUstang Wrote:  

(07-19-2021 05:34 PM)Side.Show.Joe Wrote:  

(07-19-2021 05:27 PM)SMUstang Wrote:  

(07-19-2021 04:52 PM)SoCalBobcat78 Wrote:  

(07-19-2021 03:42 PM)SMUstang Wrote:  The SWC also had both Houston and Rice. Seemed to work OK for them. Also D/FW had both SMU and TCU in the SWC - no problem with that. What makes the AAC different?

Where is the SWC today?

The demise of the SWC had nothing to do with Rice and Houston being in the same city.

You are right. "Pony Excess" had more to do with the fall of the SWC.

Truth is, regional conferences were deemed to be obsolete, and broader conferences were receiving larger media contracts.

*** SMUstang ***

SMU's death penalty severely hurt the strength of the SWC. Arkansas used this as a good excuse to leave for the SEC where the conference was not centered around one state. Oklahoma beat the NCCA in court and universities were beginning to understand how to maximize profits by selling their media deals. The SWC had a deal with Raycom, which wasn't very lucrative. I've even heard that Texas turned SMU in to the NCAA for investigation, so that it would be easier to break up the much beloved SWC. Dismantling the SWC and rebuilding into the Big12 with members of the Big8 was a better option for those fortunate enough to be included.

(07-19-2021 03:36 PM)CliftonAve Wrote:  Last I checked the AAC already had a school located in Houston. Also, the AAC already has too many small, private universities that do not have much of a fan following-- they do not need to add another one.

You could be the G5 version of the ACC: too many private schools with not much fan support.

(07-19-2021 06:53 PM)Side.Show.Joe Wrote:  

(07-19-2021 06:09 PM)SMUstang Wrote:  

(07-19-2021 05:34 PM)Side.Show.Joe Wrote:  

(07-19-2021 05:27 PM)SMUstang Wrote:  

(07-19-2021 04:52 PM)SoCalBobcat78 Wrote:  Where is the SWC today?

The demise of the SWC had nothing to do with Rice and Houston being in the same city.

You are right. "Pony Excess" had more to do with the fall of the SWC.

Truth is, regional conferences were deemed to be obsolete, and broader conferences were receiving larger media contracts.

*** SMUstang ***

SMU's death penalty severely hurt the strength of the SWC. Arkansas used this as a good excuse to leave for the SEC where the conference was not centered around one state. Oklahoma beat the NCCA in court and universities were beginning to understand how to maximize profits by selling their media deals. The SWC had a deal with Raycom, which wasn't very lucrative. I've even heard that Texas turned SMU in to the NCAA for investigation, so that it would be easier to break up the much beloved SWC. Dismantling the SWC and rebuilding into the Big12 with members of the Big8 was a better option for those fortunate enough to be included.

Both the SWC and Big 8 were not going to exist as-constructed once the tv deals moved from the NCAA to the leagues. Only 8% of the nation's footprint for each was too small. Arkansas saw the writing on the wall and got out early when FSU turned down the SEC.

Baylor and Tech were fortunate to have legislative pull or else it would have been ten teams according to Tech's AD at the time.

(07-19-2021 03:42 PM)SMUstang Wrote:  

(07-19-2021 03:36 PM)CliftonAve Wrote:  Last I checked the AAC already had a school located in Houston. Also, the AAC already has too many small, private universities that do not have much of a fan following-- they do not need to add another one.

The SWC also had both Houston and Rice. Seemed to work OK for them. Also D/FW had both SMU and TCU in the SWC - no problem with that. What makes the AAC different?

Didn’t that conference collapse—leaving behind those exact 4 schools? That said, as someone else mentioned, the AAC wants to avoid any comparison to CUSA circa 2011. Additionally too many small private schools in a conference tends to limit the conference appeal to TV and bowls. The AAC knows what they want to fill that slot and right now—nobody that checks all the boxes is an option—-so the conference will probably be an 11 team league for a while.

(07-18-2021 04:55 PM)DFW HOYA Wrote:  

(07-18-2021 08:02 AM)SMUstang Wrote:  If Rice increases it’s athletic budgets and hires some serious coaching staffs, and upgrades their facilities, particularly basketball, they may be acceptable to the AAC. They have a lot of work to do and I don’t think it will happen any time soon.

Short of a teardown, Autry Court isn't going anywhere. It's bigger than the Tulane gym, though that doesn't say much. A basketball training facility would help.

Re: spending, a lot of this is perception. Per EADA reporting:

Football budget ($M):
SMU: 21.1
Rice: 13.7
Tulsa: 13.2
Tulane 11.8

Men's basketball budget ($M):
SMU: 7.3
Tulsa: 5.0
Tulane 3.7
Rice: 3.2

Total budget ($M):
SMU: 68.8
Rice: 42.0
Tulsa: 38.0
Tulane 31.8

Those numbers are lies. Tulane announces that all Men's Head Coaches make $1.1m COMBINED in the EADA document. This is laughable as Fritz makes WAY past that BY HIMSELF - and we have a baseball coach and basketball coach on decent money as well.

As a private school, Tulane is NOTORIOUS for hiding expenses.

Our actual basketball expenses sit just shy of $5M/year.

(07-19-2021 11:27 PM)oliveandblue Wrote:  Those numbers are lies. Tulane announces that all Men's Head Coaches make $1.1m COMBINED in the EADA document. This is laughable as Fritz makes WAY past that BY HIMSELF - and we have a baseball coach and basketball coach on decent money as well.

As a private school, Tulane is NOTORIOUS for hiding expenses.

Not saying that Tulane in particular does this, but one way to lowball coach payments is to report base salary and exclude reporting of bonuses, even when bonuses are for things like hitting targets that the coach hits as a matter of routine.

(07-19-2021 11:12 PM)Attackcoog Wrote:  

(07-19-2021 03:42 PM)SMUstang Wrote:  

(07-19-2021 03:36 PM)CliftonAve Wrote:  Last I checked the AAC already had a school located in Houston. Also, the AAC already has too many small, private universities that do not have much of a fan following-- they do not need to add another one.

The SWC also had both Houston and Rice. Seemed to work OK for them. Also D/FW had both SMU and TCU in the SWC - no problem with that. What makes the AAC different?

Didn’t that conference collapse—leaving behind those exact 4 schools?That said, as someone else mentioned, the AAC wants to avoid any comparison to CUSA circa 2011. Additionally too many small private schools in a conference tends to limit the conference appeal to TV and bowls. The AAC knows what they want to fill that slot and right now—nobody that checks all the boxes is an option—-so the conference will probably be an 11 team league for a while.

Schools added to the AAC since 2011 include SMU, Houston, Memphis in 2013, Tulane, East Carolina, and Tulsa in 2014. That being said, Rice is where they should be given their athletic budget.

*** SMUstang ***

(07-19-2021 07:54 PM)1845 Bear Wrote:  

(07-19-2021 06:53 PM)Side.Show.Joe Wrote:  

(07-19-2021 06:09 PM)SMUstang Wrote:  

(07-19-2021 05:34 PM)Side.Show.Joe Wrote:  

(07-19-2021 05:27 PM)SMUstang Wrote:  The demise of the SWC had nothing to do with Rice and Houston being in the same city.

You are right. "Pony Excess" had more to do with the fall of the SWC.

Truth is, regional conferences were deemed to be obsolete, and broader conferences were receiving larger media contracts.

*** SMUstang ***

SMU's death penalty severely hurt the strength of the SWC. Arkansas used this as a good excuse to leave for the SEC where the conference was not centered around one state. Oklahoma beat the NCCA in court and universities were beginning to understand how to maximize profits by selling their media deals. The SWC had a deal with Raycom, which wasn't very lucrative. I've even heard that Texas turned SMU in to the NCAA for investigation, so that it would be easier to break up the much beloved SWC. Dismantling the SWC and rebuilding into the Big12 with members of the Big8 was a better option for those fortunate enough to be included.

Both the SWC and Big 8 were not going to exist as-constructed once the tv deals moved from the NCAA to the leagues. Only 8% of the nation's footprint for each was too small. Arkansas saw the writing on the wall and got out early when FSU turned down the SEC.

Baylor and Tech were fortunate to have legislative pull or else it would have been ten teams according to Tech's AD at the time.

Good and honest post about the demise of the Southwest Conference.

*** SMUstang ***

(07-20-2021 08:32 AM)SMUstang Wrote:  Schools added to the AAC since 2011 include SMU, Houston, Memphis in 2013, Tulane, East Carolina, and Tulsa in 2014. That being said, Rice is where they should be given their athletic budget.

Except their budget is larger than Tulsa and Tulane.

(07-20-2021 09:31 AM)DFW HOYA Wrote:  

(07-20-2021 08:32 AM)SMUstang Wrote:  Schools added to the AAC since 2011 include SMU, Houston, Memphis in 2013, Tulane, East Carolina, and Tulsa in 2014. That being said, Rice is where they should be given their athletic budget.

Except their budget is larger than Tulsa and Tulane.

I'm not going to argue, maybe the AAC was going for markets at that time. But why ECU?

*** SMUstang ***

(07-20-2021 10:08 AM)SMUstang Wrote:  

(07-20-2021 09:31 AM)DFW HOYA Wrote:  

(07-20-2021 08:32 AM)SMUstang Wrote:  Schools added to the AAC since 2011 include SMU, Houston, Memphis in 2013, Tulane, East Carolina, and Tulsa in 2014. That being said, Rice is where they should be given their athletic budget.

Except their budget is larger than Tulsa and Tulane.

I'm not going to argue, maybe the AAC was going for markets at that time. But why ECU?

If I recall, ECU was added first as a football-only affiliate, and then when the American under it's prior branding was raided again, it got an upgrade.

Perhaps they ran out of candidates that added the kinds of markets that they were looking for and were forced to look for schools that demonstrated an ability to get people to pay attention in the market they happened to be in.