(02-12-2021 02:36 PM)Cyniclone Wrote:  Howard has the best chance, followed by Norfolk State, North Carolina Central and Delaware State in no particular order. Is South Carolina State financially/academically stable now? I know there were questions not that terribly long ago. Morgan State is probably the weakest of the football schools. Coppin State and UMES might need a miracle if the MEAC dies.

So let's say Howard to the NEC, North Carolina Central, Norfolk State and possibly South Carolina State to the Big South, which now needs to fortify football with the ASUN sponsoring it. Morgan State, Coppin State, UMES probably have to accept D2 at that point. Delaware State for the sake of this discussion go down to 2 as well, though they'd stand a better chance at hanging on in the NEC.

At this point, you might be better off (presuming all principals agree) to reestablish the MEAC as a D2 conference and then redistribute the D2 HBCUs into three conferences: MEAC (Mid-Atlantic), CIAA (Carolinas) and SIAC (Southeast).

MEAC: Lincoln (Pa.)*, Morgan State*, Coppin State, Maryland-Eastern Shore, Bowie State*, Virginia State*, Virginia Union*, Elizabeth City State* (Delaware State)
CIAA: Shaw*, St. Augustine's*, Fayetteville State*, Winston-Salem State*, Johnson C. Smith*, Claffin, Benedict*, Allen (South Carolina State)
SIAC: Albany State*, Savannah State*, Clark-Atlanta*, Paine, Fort Valley State*, Morehouse*, Tuskgee*, Spring Hill, Miles*, Lane*, LeMoyne-Owen, Kentucky State*, Central State (Ohio)*
*-football

The SIAC is probably always going to have a big footprint; there's no obvious way to split it into two.

Assuming that of the remaining 8 MEAC schools, only Howard (NEC), NCCU (Big South), and NSU (Big South) manage to find other D1 homes, there will be 32 schools (plus 1 FB-only affiliate) among the MEAC schools dropping to D2, the CIAA and SIAC schools, and potential future D2 member Edward Waters. Here's how I might split them into 3 conferences:

CIAA (10 schools in NC and SC + 1 FB affiliate in NC)
FB (9+1): Allen, Chowan (FB only), Elizabeth City State, Fayetteville State, Johnson C. Smith, Livingstone, SC State, Shaw, St. Augustine's, Winston-Salem State
NFB (1): Claflin

MEAC (10 schools in DE, KY, MD, OH, PA, and VA)
FB (8): Bowie State, Central State, Delaware State, Kentucky State, Lincoln, Morgan State, Virginia State, Virginia Union
NFB (2): Coppin State, UMES

SIAC (12 schools in AL, FL, GA, SC, and TN)
FB (10): Albany State, Benedict, Clark Atlanta, Edward Waters, Fort Valley State, Lane, Miles, Morehouse, Savannah State, Tuskegee
NFB (2): LeMoyne-Owen, Spring Hill

So the demoted MEAC adds 4 schools from the CIAA (Bowie, Lincoln, VA St., VA Union) in exchange for SC St., and also adds 2 schools from the SIAC (Central St., KY St.). The remaining CIAA schools (now incl. SC St.) add 1 school from the SIAC (newcomer Allen). This leaves 11 schools in the SIAC, who are joined by Edward Waters.

(02-13-2021 04:43 PM)Nerdlinger Wrote:  

(02-12-2021 02:36 PM)Cyniclone Wrote:  Howard has the best chance, followed by Norfolk State, North Carolina Central and Delaware State in no particular order. Is South Carolina State financially/academically stable now? I know there were questions not that terribly long ago. Morgan State is probably the weakest of the football schools. Coppin State and UMES might need a miracle if the MEAC dies.

So let's say Howard to the NEC, North Carolina Central, Norfolk State and possibly South Carolina State to the Big South, which now needs to fortify football with the ASUN sponsoring it. Morgan State, Coppin State, UMES probably have to accept D2 at that point. Delaware State for the sake of this discussion go down to 2 as well, though they'd stand a better chance at hanging on in the NEC.

At this point, you might be better off (presuming all principals agree) to reestablish the MEAC as a D2 conference and then redistribute the D2 HBCUs into three conferences: MEAC (Mid-Atlantic), CIAA (Carolinas) and SIAC (Southeast).

MEAC: Lincoln (Pa.)*, Morgan State*, Coppin State, Maryland-Eastern Shore, Bowie State*, Virginia State*, Virginia Union*, Elizabeth City State* (Delaware State)
CIAA: Shaw*, St. Augustine's*, Fayetteville State*, Winston-Salem State*, Johnson C. Smith*, Claffin, Benedict*, Allen (South Carolina State)
SIAC: Albany State*, Savannah State*, Clark-Atlanta*, Paine, Fort Valley State*, Morehouse*, Tuskgee*, Spring Hill, Miles*, Lane*, LeMoyne-Owen, Kentucky State*, Central State (Ohio)*
*-football

The SIAC is probably always going to have a big footprint; there's no obvious way to split it into two.

Assuming that of the remaining 8 MEAC schools, only Howard (NEC), NCCU (Big South), and NSU (Big South) manage to find other D1 homes, there will be 33 schools among the MEAC schools dropping to D2, the CIAA and SIAC schools, and potential future D2 member Edward Waters. Here's how I might split them into 3 conferences:

CIAA (11 schools in NC and SC)
FB (9): Benedict, Elizabeth City State, Fayetteville State, Johnson C. Smith, Livingstone, SC State, Shaw, St. Augustine's, Winston-Salem State
NFB (2): Allen, Claflin

MEAC (10 schools in DE, KY, MD, OH, PA, and VA)
FB (8): Bowie State, Central State, Delaware State, Kentucky State, Lincoln, Morgan State, Virginia State, Virginia Union
NFB (2): Coppin State, UMES

SIAC (12 schools in AL, FL, GA, and TN)
FB (9): Albany State, Clark Atlanta, Edward Waters, Fort Valley State, Lane, Miles, Morehouse, Savannah State, Tuskegee
NFB (3): LeMoyne-Owen, Paine, Spring Hill

So the demoted MEAC adds 4 schools from the CIAA (Bowie, Lincoln, VA St., VA Union) in exchange for SC St., and also adds 2 schools from the SIAC (Central St., KY St.). The remaining CIAA schools (now incl. SC St.) add 2 schools from the SIAC (Allen and Benedict). This leaves 11 schools in the SIAC, who are joined by Edward Waters.

Thats a solid arrangement

I wonder if the Patriot League might consider adding the four MEAC remnants as affiliate members for baseball.

The PL only has the AQ minimum six itself; putting the MEAC 4 with Navy makes a nice South division with Army, HC, Bucknell, Lehigh, Lafayette in a North division.

(02-13-2021 04:43 PM)Nerdlinger Wrote:  

(02-12-2021 02:36 PM)Cyniclone Wrote:  Howard has the best chance, followed by Norfolk State, North Carolina Central and Delaware State in no particular order. Is South Carolina State financially/academically stable now? I know there were questions not that terribly long ago. Morgan State is probably the weakest of the football schools. Coppin State and UMES might need a miracle if the MEAC dies.

So let's say Howard to the NEC, North Carolina Central, Norfolk State and possibly South Carolina State to the Big South, which now needs to fortify football with the ASUN sponsoring it. Morgan State, Coppin State, UMES probably have to accept D2 at that point. Delaware State for the sake of this discussion go down to 2 as well, though they'd stand a better chance at hanging on in the NEC.

At this point, you might be better off (presuming all principals agree) to reestablish the MEAC as a D2 conference and then redistribute the D2 HBCUs into three conferences: MEAC (Mid-Atlantic), CIAA (Carolinas) and SIAC (Southeast).

MEAC: Lincoln (Pa.)*, Morgan State*, Coppin State, Maryland-Eastern Shore, Bowie State*, Virginia State*, Virginia Union*, Elizabeth City State* (Delaware State)
CIAA: Shaw*, St. Augustine's*, Fayetteville State*, Winston-Salem State*, Johnson C. Smith*, Claffin, Benedict*, Allen (South Carolina State)
SIAC: Albany State*, Savannah State*, Clark-Atlanta*, Paine, Fort Valley State*, Morehouse*, Tuskgee*, Spring Hill, Miles*, Lane*, LeMoyne-Owen, Kentucky State*, Central State (Ohio)*
*-football

The SIAC is probably always going to have a big footprint; there's no obvious way to split it into two.

Assuming that of the remaining 8 MEAC schools, only Howard (NEC), NCCU (Big South), and NSU (Big South) manage to find other D1 homes, there will be 33 schools among the MEAC schools dropping to D2, the CIAA and SIAC schools, and potential future D2 member Edward Waters. Here's how I might split them into 3 conferences:

CIAA (11 schools in NC and SC)
FB (9): Benedict, Elizabeth City State, Fayetteville State, Johnson C. Smith, Livingstone, SC State, Shaw, St. Augustine's, Winston-Salem State
NFB (2): Allen, Claflin

MEAC (10 schools in DE, KY, MD, OH, PA, and VA)
FB (8): Bowie State, Central State, Delaware State, Kentucky State, Lincoln, Morgan State, Virginia State, Virginia Union
NFB (2): Coppin State, UMES

SIAC (12 schools in AL, FL, GA, and TN)
FB (9): Albany State, Clark Atlanta, Edward Waters, Fort Valley State, Lane, Miles, Morehouse, Savannah State, Tuskegee
NFB (3): LeMoyne-Owen, Paine, Spring Hill

So the demoted MEAC adds 4 schools from the CIAA (Bowie, Lincoln, VA St., VA Union) in exchange for SC St., and also adds 2 schools from the SIAC (Central St., KY St.). The remaining CIAA schools (now incl. SC St.) add 2 schools from the SIAC (Allen and Benedict). This leaves 11 schools in the SIAC, who are joined by Edward Waters.

That'd certainly work. Didn't even occur to me to extend the new MEAC west to take in the Ohio and Kentucky schools, but it makes sense. I do think Elizabeth City State would want to be with the Virginia schools (they're only like 30 minutes from the Va. border and have always been in the CIAA North Division), but in the end they can always schedule Virginia State and/or Virginia Union in OOC.

Virginia Union has only 1099 students, only 504 men. It's smaller than Chicago State. Their entire budget is $4,321,343, which is less than half the average of the MEAC. Their entire endowment is a measly $29m. They cannot support D-I. They need to be three times larger in everything. It makes no sense for them.

Kentucky State is equally small with only 1052 undergrads, (only 468 men), and a budget of $3,984,782
Central State is a bit larger with 2029 students but a budget of only $4,194,542

For comparison:
Norfolk State has 4,133 students and a budget of $13,709,708
Delaware State has 3,582 (only 1196 are men, heavy female tilt) and a budget of $12,457,825
Morgan State has 5,829 students and an athletic budget of $14,156,767
NC Central has 5,237 undergrad students and an athletic budget of $14,511,739

Virginia State is more plausible with 3,862 full time undergrads (although only 1,640 are men) and a budget of $6,149,071. They would still need to double their budget, which would be about $4,000 per student to support athletics, but it's not that much different than current MEAC members. The other four schools would need to tax their students $7,000 (Central State) to $14,000 a year to support FCS programs at the MEAC level.

The only viable option for an add is Virginia State, as Winston Salem State (4,111 students, but only 1,167 are men -- heavy female tilt; and budget of $4,286,679) took themselves off the table because they realize they cannot afford to D-I, as they tried before. Chicago State looks worse than the first three D-II schools I looked at and they are farther away, do not have baseball or football, so no help on critical sports.

So any MEAC add from D-II beyond Virginia State is DOA, and so far no indication Virginia State is really interested.

Note, SC State is really marginal on resources with just 2.152 full time undergrads an a budget half the other MEAC at $7,778,657.

All data above from the schools official submissions to the department of Education:
https://ope.ed.gov/athletics

(02-13-2021 05:36 PM)Cyniclone Wrote:  

(02-13-2021 04:43 PM)Nerdlinger Wrote:  

(02-12-2021 02:36 PM)Cyniclone Wrote:  Howard has the best chance, followed by Norfolk State, North Carolina Central and Delaware State in no particular order. Is South Carolina State financially/academically stable now? I know there were questions not that terribly long ago. Morgan State is probably the weakest of the football schools. Coppin State and UMES might need a miracle if the MEAC dies.

So let's say Howard to the NEC, North Carolina Central, Norfolk State and possibly South Carolina State to the Big South, which now needs to fortify football with the ASUN sponsoring it. Morgan State, Coppin State, UMES probably have to accept D2 at that point. Delaware State for the sake of this discussion go down to 2 as well, though they'd stand a better chance at hanging on in the NEC.

At this point, you might be better off (presuming all principals agree) to reestablish the MEAC as a D2 conference and then redistribute the D2 HBCUs into three conferences: MEAC (Mid-Atlantic), CIAA (Carolinas) and SIAC (Southeast).

MEAC: Lincoln (Pa.)*, Morgan State*, Coppin State, Maryland-Eastern Shore, Bowie State*, Virginia State*, Virginia Union*, Elizabeth City State* (Delaware State)
CIAA: Shaw*, St. Augustine's*, Fayetteville State*, Winston-Salem State*, Johnson C. Smith*, Claffin, Benedict*, Allen (South Carolina State)
SIAC: Albany State*, Savannah State*, Clark-Atlanta*, Paine, Fort Valley State*, Morehouse*, Tuskgee*, Spring Hill, Miles*, Lane*, LeMoyne-Owen, Kentucky State*, Central State (Ohio)*
*-football

The SIAC is probably always going to have a big footprint; there's no obvious way to split it into two.

Assuming that of the remaining 8 MEAC schools, only Howard (NEC), NCCU (Big South), and NSU (Big South) manage to find other D1 homes, there will be 33 schools among the MEAC schools dropping to D2, the CIAA and SIAC schools, and potential future D2 member Edward Waters. Here's how I might split them into 3 conferences:

CIAA (11 schools in NC and SC)
FB (9): Benedict, Elizabeth City State, Fayetteville State, Johnson C. Smith, Livingstone, SC State, Shaw, St. Augustine's, Winston-Salem State
NFB (2): Allen, Claflin

MEAC (10 schools in DE, KY, MD, OH, PA, and VA)
FB (8): Bowie State, Central State, Delaware State, Kentucky State, Lincoln, Morgan State, Virginia State, Virginia Union
NFB (2): Coppin State, UMES

SIAC (12 schools in AL, FL, GA, and TN)
FB (9): Albany State, Clark Atlanta, Edward Waters, Fort Valley State, Lane, Miles, Morehouse, Savannah State, Tuskegee
NFB (3): LeMoyne-Owen, Paine, Spring Hill

So the demoted MEAC adds 4 schools from the CIAA (Bowie, Lincoln, VA St., VA Union) in exchange for SC St., and also adds 2 schools from the SIAC (Central St., KY St.). The remaining CIAA schools (now incl. SC St.) add 2 schools from the SIAC (Allen and Benedict). This leaves 11 schools in the SIAC, who are joined by Edward Waters.

That'd certainly work. Didn't even occur to me to extend the new MEAC west to take in the Ohio and Kentucky schools, but it makes sense. I do think Elizabeth City State would want to be with the Virginia schools (they're only like 30 minutes from the Va. border and have always been in the CIAA North Division), but in the end they can always schedule Virginia State and/or Virginia Union in OOC.

You could have ECSU in the MEAC. I was just trying to keep schools in the same state in the same conference.

(02-13-2021 05:45 PM)Stugray2 Wrote:  Virginia Union has only 1099 students, only 504 men. It's smaller than Chicago State. Their entire budget is $4,321,343, which is less than half the average of the MEAC. Their entire endowment is a measly $29m. They cannot support D-I. They need to be three times larger in everything. It makes no sense for them.

Kentucky State is equally small with only 1052 undergrads, (only 468 men), and a budget of $3,984,782
Central State is a bit larger with 2029 students but a budget of only $4,194,542

For comparison:
Norfolk State has 4,133 students and a budget of $13,709,708
Delaware State has 3,582 (only 1196 are men, heavy female tilt) and a budget of $12,457,825
Morgan State has 5,829 students and an athletic budget of $14,156,767
NC Central has 5,237 undergrad students and an athletic budget of $14,511,739

Virginia State is more plausible with 3,862 full time undergrads (although only 1,640 are men) and a budget of $6,149,071. They would still need to double their budget, which would be about $4,000 per student to support athletics, but it's not that much different than current MEAC members. The other four schools would need to tax their students $7,000 (Central State) to $14,000 a year to support FCS programs at the MEAC level.

The only viable option for an add is Virginia State, as Winston Salem State (4,111 students, but only 1,167 are men -- heavy female tilt; and budget of $4,286,679) took themselves off the table because they realize they cannot afford to D-I, as they tried before. Chicago State looks worse than the first three D-II schools I looked at and they are farther away, do not have baseball or football, so no help on critical sports.

So any MEAC add from D-II beyond Virginia State is DOA, and so far no indication Virginia State is really interested.

Note, SC State is really marginal on resources with just 2.152 full time undergrads an a budget half the other MEAC at $7,778,657.

All data above from the schools official submissions to the department of Education:
https://ope.ed.gov/athletics

If you're responding to my proposed MEAC alignment, if you read the whole post, you'll see that the conference has been demoted to D2.

(02-13-2021 04:43 PM)Nerdlinger Wrote:  

(02-12-2021 02:36 PM)Cyniclone Wrote:  Howard has the best chance, followed by Norfolk State, North Carolina Central and Delaware State in no particular order. Is South Carolina State financially/academically stable now? I know there were questions not that terribly long ago. Morgan State is probably the weakest of the football schools. Coppin State and UMES might need a miracle if the MEAC dies.

So let's say Howard to the NEC, North Carolina Central, Norfolk State and possibly South Carolina State to the Big South, which now needs to fortify football with the ASUN sponsoring it. Morgan State, Coppin State, UMES probably have to accept D2 at that point. Delaware State for the sake of this discussion go down to 2 as well, though they'd stand a better chance at hanging on in the NEC.

At this point, you might be better off (presuming all principals agree) to reestablish the MEAC as a D2 conference and then redistribute the D2 HBCUs into three conferences: MEAC (Mid-Atlantic), CIAA (Carolinas) and SIAC (Southeast).

MEAC: Lincoln (Pa.)*, Morgan State*, Coppin State, Maryland-Eastern Shore, Bowie State*, Virginia State*, Virginia Union*, Elizabeth City State* (Delaware State)
CIAA: Shaw*, St. Augustine's*, Fayetteville State*, Winston-Salem State*, Johnson C. Smith*, Claffin, Benedict*, Allen* (South Carolina State)
SIAC: Albany State*, Savannah State*, Clark-Atlanta*, Paine, Fort Valley State*, Morehouse*, Tuskgee*, Spring Hill, Miles*, Lane*, LeMoyne-Owen, Kentucky State*, Central State (Ohio)*
*-football

The SIAC is probably always going to have a big footprint; there's no obvious way to split it into two.

Assuming that of the remaining 8 MEAC schools, only Howard (NEC), NCCU (Big South), and NSU (Big South) manage to find other D1 homes, there will be 33 schools among the MEAC schools dropping to D2, the CIAA and SIAC schools, and potential future D2 member Edward Waters. Here's how I might split them into 3 conferences:

CIAA (11 schools in NC and SC)
FB (10): Allen, Benedict, Elizabeth City State, Fayetteville State, Johnson C. Smith, Livingstone, SC State, Shaw, St. Augustine's, Winston-Salem State
NFB (1): Claflin

MEAC (10 schools in DE, KY, MD, OH, PA, and VA)
FB (8): Bowie State, Central State, Delaware State, Kentucky State, Lincoln, Morgan State, Virginia State, Virginia Union
NFB (2): Coppin State, UMES

SIAC (11 schools in AL, FL, GA, and TN)
FB (9): Albany State, Clark Atlanta, Edward Waters, Fort Valley State, Lane, Miles, Morehouse, Savannah State, Tuskegee
NFB (2): LeMoyne-Owen, Paine, Spring Hill

So the demoted MEAC adds 4 schools from the CIAA (Bowie, Lincoln, VA St., VA Union) in exchange for SC St., and also adds 2 schools from the SIAC (Central St., KY St.). The remaining CIAA schools (now incl. SC St.) add 2 schools from the SIAC (Allen and Benedict). This leaves 11 schools in the SIAC, who are joined by Edward Waters.

Two corrections to this; Allen has football and Paine is gone.

(02-13-2021 06:04 PM)Nerdlinger Wrote:  If you're responding to my proposed MEAC alignment, if you read the whole post, you'll see that the conference has been demoted to D2.

Howard, Norfolk State, Morgan State, Delaware State and NC Central all invest far too much in athletics to go down. Simply not happening. They are all D-I. Even SC State is not dropping down.

Would schools like Morgan St and Delaware St try to stick it out as independents if the rest of the conference drops down or joins another DI conference?

The scenario I see as possible is MEAC football continues, but the schools join other conferences for Basketball and Olympics

(02-13-2021 08:34 PM)Stugray2 Wrote:  The scenario I see as possible is MEAC football continues, but the schools join other conferences for Basketball and Olympics

How would that look?

(02-13-2021 07:15 PM)AZcats Wrote:  

(02-13-2021 04:43 PM)Nerdlinger Wrote:  

(02-12-2021 02:36 PM)Cyniclone Wrote:  Howard has the best chance, followed by Norfolk State, North Carolina Central and Delaware State in no particular order. Is South Carolina State financially/academically stable now? I know there were questions not that terribly long ago. Morgan State is probably the weakest of the football schools. Coppin State and UMES might need a miracle if the MEAC dies.

So let's say Howard to the NEC, North Carolina Central, Norfolk State and possibly South Carolina State to the Big South, which now needs to fortify football with the ASUN sponsoring it. Morgan State, Coppin State, UMES probably have to accept D2 at that point. Delaware State for the sake of this discussion go down to 2 as well, though they'd stand a better chance at hanging on in the NEC.

At this point, you might be better off (presuming all principals agree) to reestablish the MEAC as a D2 conference and then redistribute the D2 HBCUs into three conferences: MEAC (Mid-Atlantic), CIAA (Carolinas) and SIAC (Southeast).

MEAC: Lincoln (Pa.)*, Morgan State*, Coppin State, Maryland-Eastern Shore, Bowie State*, Virginia State*, Virginia Union*, Elizabeth City State* (Delaware State)
CIAA: Shaw*, St. Augustine's*, Fayetteville State*, Winston-Salem State*, Johnson C. Smith*, Claffin, Benedict*, Allen* (South Carolina State)
SIAC: Albany State*, Savannah State*, Clark-Atlanta*, Paine, Fort Valley State*, Morehouse*, Tuskgee*, Spring Hill, Miles*, Lane*, LeMoyne-Owen, Kentucky State*, Central State (Ohio)*
*-football

The SIAC is probably always going to have a big footprint; there's no obvious way to split it into two.

Assuming that of the remaining 8 MEAC schools, only Howard (NEC), NCCU (Big South), and NSU (Big South) manage to find other D1 homes, there will be 33 schools among the MEAC schools dropping to D2, the CIAA and SIAC schools, and potential future D2 member Edward Waters. Here's how I might split them into 3 conferences:

CIAA (11 schools in NC and SC)
FB (10): Allen, Benedict, Elizabeth City State, Fayetteville State, Johnson C. Smith, Livingstone, SC State, Shaw, St. Augustine's, Winston-Salem State
NFB (1): Claflin

MEAC (10 schools in DE, KY, MD, OH, PA, and VA)
FB (8): Bowie State, Central State, Delaware State, Kentucky State, Lincoln, Morgan State, Virginia State, Virginia Union
NFB (2): Coppin State, UMES

SIAC (11 schools in AL, FL, GA, and TN)
FB (9): Albany State, Clark Atlanta, Edward Waters, Fort Valley State, Lane, Miles, Morehouse, Savannah State, Tuskegee
NFB (2): LeMoyne-Owen, Paine, Spring Hill

So the demoted MEAC adds 4 schools from the CIAA (Bowie, Lincoln, VA St., VA Union) in exchange for SC St., and also adds 2 schools from the SIAC (Central St., KY St.). The remaining CIAA schools (now incl. SC St.) add 2 schools from the SIAC (Allen and Benedict). This leaves 11 schools in the SIAC, who are joined by Edward Waters.

Two corrections to this; Allen has football and Paine is gone.

I’ve seen nothing on their site or the SIAC’s to indicate that Paine is gone

(02-14-2021 02:06 AM)Cyniclone Wrote:  I’ve seen nothing on their site or the SIAC’s to indicate that Paine is gone

Paine lost accreditation and is no longer an NCAA member.

(02-14-2021 02:17 AM)Inkblot Wrote:  

(02-14-2021 02:06 AM)Cyniclone Wrote:  I’ve seen nothing on their site or the SIAC’s to indicate that Paine is gone

Paine lost accreditation and is no longer an NCAA member.

The latest I’m seeing about their accreditation is that they got it again, albeit with a different group, the Transnational Association of Christian Colleges and Schools

https://www.wrdw.com/2020/10/28/paine-co...editation/

I’ll take your word on Paine not being an NCAA member anymore, but I’m struggling to find much about it online. The Paine website’s most recent update (which was in July to be fair) was the SIAC announcing that fall sports were suspended, and the SIAC site still has them in the members section, though it does appear that they’re no longer included among the institutions in the press release boilerplate.

Ultimately of course any restructuring of D2 HBCU conferences, which probably wouldn’t happen this way anyhow, isn’t affected by the presence or absence of a college the size of a small high school.

(02-14-2021 10:44 AM)Cyniclone Wrote:  

(02-14-2021 02:17 AM)Inkblot Wrote:  

(02-14-2021 02:06 AM)Cyniclone Wrote:  I’ve seen nothing on their site or the SIAC’s to indicate that Paine is gone

Paine lost accreditation and is no longer an NCAA member.

The latest I’m seeing about their accreditation is that they got it again, albeit with a different group, the Transnational Association of Christian Colleges and Schools

https://www.wrdw.com/2020/10/28/paine-co...editation/

I’ll take your word on Paine not being an NCAA member anymore, but I’m struggling to find much about it online. The Paine website’s most recent update (which was in July to be fair) was the SIAC announcing that fall sports were suspended, and the SIAC site still has them in the members section, though it does appear that they’re no longer included among the institutions in the press release boilerplate.

Ultimately of course any restructuring of D2 HBCU conferences, which probably wouldn’t happen this way anyhow, isn’t affected by the presence or absence of a college the size of a small high school.

The SIAC has been terrible on providing info on Paine. The "MEMBER INSTITUTIONS" page on the SIAC site is in need of updating. Look at the row of logos under the menu at the top of the page; Allen was added and Paine was removed. Paine does have accreditation but it is not by an agency that is approved by the NCAA.

REPORT OF THE NCAA DIVISION II MEMBERSHIP COMMITTEE - JULY 8-9, 2020 (Page No. 2)

Quote:4. Paine College Division II membership status. Staff provided an update that Paine College forfeited its active member status in Division II on May 29, 2020, due to a loss of regional accreditation by the Southern Association of Colleges and Schools Commission on Colleges [see NCAA Division II Constitution 3.3.5.2 (Removal of Accreditation)].

Also when you go to this site: NCAA Directory, Paine has been removed.

(02-13-2021 07:15 PM)AZcats Wrote:  Two corrections to this; Allen has football and Paine is gone.

Good points! I modified my proposal to account for these changes and also to place ECSU in the MEAC.

(02-14-2021 01:17 PM)Nerdlinger Wrote:  

(02-13-2021 07:15 PM)AZcats Wrote:  Two corrections to this; Allen has football and Paine is gone.

Good points! I modified my proposal to account for these changes and also to place ECSU in the MEAC.

I would have left ECSU where they are due to the distance to Central State. And due to the structure of the D2 football season it's best to have an even number of football teams because with an odd number someone is going to have an open date every week that can get extremely difficult to fill after week four. But here's another wrench to keep things messy, former CIAA full member Chowan is now a CIAA football affiliate (at least until Conference Carolinas is able to sponsor football).

(02-14-2021 03:26 PM)AZcats Wrote:  

(02-14-2021 01:17 PM)Nerdlinger Wrote:  

(02-13-2021 07:15 PM)AZcats Wrote:  Two corrections to this; Allen has football and Paine is gone.

Good points! I modified my proposal to account for these changes and also to place ECSU in the MEAC.

I would have left ECSU where they are due to the distance to Central State. And due to the structure of the D2 football season it's best to have an even number of football teams because with an odd number someone is going to have an open date every week that can get extremely difficult to fill after week four. But here's another wrench to keep things messy, former CIAA full member Chowan is now a CIAA football affiliate (at least until Conference Carolinas is able to sponsor football).

OK, I moved ECSU back to the CIAA and Benedict back to the SIAC. Chowan stays in the CIAA as a FB affiliate, leaving all 3 conferences with even numbers in FB and MBB.

There may be capacity within the CIAA and SIAC to handle the absorption of any MEAC schools that have to drop to D2. For 2021-22, it looks like the CIAA has 12 full members, 1 of which is non-FB, as well as 1 FB-only affiliate. So 12 FB and 12 MBB. And the SIAC has 14 full members, 2 of which are non-FB. So they're set with even FB and MBB numbers too. However, if both conferences are willing to expand to 16 full members, they could take on up to 6 MEAC schools between them.