(01-14-2021 02:13 PM)Stugray2 Wrote:  Chicago State is spinning the refusal to renew their contract as voluntary exit.

Nobody wants to have to schedule every sport as an Independent.

Don't think it's likely these Texas schools do much for Basketball. Their budgets are much smaller. But it is Texas and improves recruiting. If Basketball is really the aim they should target UT-Arlington.

SFA, Lamar, and SHSU have all had some success in basketball---but its not like they are adding VCU or Duke. That said, the #1 WAC team among the current membership in the NET ratings is Grand Canyon at #130. The second best WAC team in the NET ratings is Utah Valley at #225. The worst current WAC team is ranked #344. Thus, Abilene Christian, one of the incoming Southland teams, would be the highest ranked WAC team (#81). Sam Houston , #159 in the NET rankings, would be the third best team in the league. All the incoming Texas teams are better than the bottom of the WAC. So---yeah, there is reason to believe the league could improve its overall standing with respect to other D1 leagues.

(01-14-2021 02:41 PM)Bobcat2013 Wrote:  

(01-14-2021 02:38 PM)Realignment Wrote:  

(01-14-2021 02:13 PM)Stugray2 Wrote:  Chicago State is spinning the refusal to renew their contract as voluntary exit.

Nobody wants to have to schedule every sport as an Independent.

Don't think it's likely these Texas schools do much for Basketball. Their budgets are much smaller. But it is Texas and improves recruiting. If Basketball is really the aim they should target UT-Arlington.

If they can get UTA, that's a good grab. I'm sure they are more willing to join FCS football. But I don't see UTA leaving the Sun Belt Conference right now, but who knows. Depends what the goal is for their athletics. Does everyone still think West Texas A&M will join the WAC? As for the 4 non-basketball schools, I think they keep them for now but eventually will probably break off from them. Utah Valley would probably have a landing spot in the Summit League. The 3 private schools of Cal Baptist, Grand Canyon & Seattle may be left up in the air.

If UTA were to start football I don't understand why people think they wouldn't just stay in the SBC. Then they are guaranteed FBS access as long as they're in the SBC.

I think it would have to do with the cost of running an FBS program compared to an FCS program. But I agree. Globe Life Park (now that the Texas Rangers play at Globe Life Field) can be retro-fitted into a college football stadium like Turner Field was for Georgia State.

So who ends up being the 14th member? It sounds like they want them to be in the Southwest Division.

WTAMU
A&M CC/A&M Kingsville merger
UCA
Other

(01-14-2021 02:54 PM)Fighting Muskie Wrote:  So who ends up being the 14th member? It sounds like they want them to be in the Southwest Division.

WTAMU
A&M CC/A&M Kingsville merger
UCA
Other

I think West Texas A&M and Texas A&M Commerce will be the two top candidates. They both have football attendance in line with the other WAC newbies and above any of the remaining Southland members in Texas. Enrollments are comparable. WT has advantages in facilities, endowment, market (Amarillo MSA), and basketball prowess (32-1 and ranked third in D2 last season). Commerce has a big advantage in proximity to the other Texas members, and has finished higher in the Lone Star Conference football standings over the past several years. I don't know how their athletic budgets compare.

(01-14-2021 02:54 PM)Fighting Muskie Wrote:  So who ends up being the 14th member? It sounds like they want them to be in the Southwest Division.

WTAMU
A&M CC/A&M Kingsville merger
UCA
Other

UCA is joining the ASun. They’re 100% not joining the WAC.

(01-14-2021 02:46 PM)Attackcoog Wrote:  SFA, Lamar, and SHSU have all had some success in basketball---but its not like they are adding VCU or Duke. That said, the #1 WAC team among the current membership in the NET ratings is Grand Canyon at #130. The second best WAC team in the NET ratings is Utah Valley at #225. The worst current WAC team is ranked #344. Thus, Abilene Christian, one of the incoming Southland teams, would be the highest ranked WAC team (#81). Sam Houston , #159 in the NET rankings, would be the third best team in the league. All the incoming Texas teams are better than the bottom of the WAC. So---yeah, there is reason to believe the league could improve its overall standing with respect to other D1 leagues.

Losing Chicago State and New Mexico State playing a full schedule will go a long way. Tarleton State and Dixie State upgrading their schedules as they come into full Division I status will help... and then the SLC schools coming in not playing as many 300+ games by just shedding the rest of the Southland, also will help.

The league should easily be able to move up the pecking order by the changes, especially if some of the more successful programs hold their spots and are joined by others. Certainly more potential of that in this new WAC than where we're coming from.

Seattle University is an obvious geographic misfit in the new WAC. They would love to be in the WCC and fit geographically and religiously but they're probably don't belong athletically.

(01-14-2021 02:46 PM)Realignment Wrote:  

(01-14-2021 02:41 PM)Bobcat2013 Wrote:  

(01-14-2021 02:38 PM)Realignment Wrote:  

(01-14-2021 02:13 PM)Stugray2 Wrote:  Chicago State is spinning the refusal to renew their contract as voluntary exit.

Nobody wants to have to schedule every sport as an Independent.

Don't think it's likely these Texas schools do much for Basketball. Their budgets are much smaller. But it is Texas and improves recruiting. If Basketball is really the aim they should target UT-Arlington.

If they can get UTA, that's a good grab. I'm sure they are more willing to join FCS football. But I don't see UTA leaving the Sun Belt Conference right now, but who knows. Depends what the goal is for their athletics. Does everyone still think West Texas A&M will join the WAC? As for the 4 non-basketball schools, I think they keep them for now but eventually will probably break off from them. Utah Valley would probably have a landing spot in the Summit League. The 3 private schools of Cal Baptist, Grand Canyon & Seattle may be left up in the air.

If UTA were to start football I don't understand why people think they wouldn't just stay in the SBC. Then they are guaranteed FBS access as long as they're in the SBC.

I think it would have to do with the cost of running an FBS program compared to an FCS program. But I agree. Globe Life Park (now that the Texas Rangers play at Globe Life Field) can be retro-fitted into a college football stadium like Turner Field was for Georgia State.

I guess my point is that if you're going to increase your budget to account for FCS football then you might as well go all the way to FBS.

Looking at our 2020 football budget vs SHSUs since they're in our system and all the numbers are on the same budget sheet. SHSUs is about 4 million, ours is about 8. They make about 800k in revenue, we make about 3 million (it doesn't say anything about TV revenue so I'm not sure if that's taken into account). So when it all shakes out they spend about 3 million, we spend about 5.

Is it worth it to spend an extra 2 million for FBS? For us, I'd say so.

Dumb move by the Texas schools. The Southland Conference was a better fit for them.

Seattle U. is now the WAC sore thumb.

(01-14-2021 03:48 PM)quo vadis Wrote:  Dumb move by the Texas schools. The Southland Conference was a better fit for them.

Seattle U. is now the WAC sore thumb.

Weird move for sure. I am under the suspicion something else is going on. I think its a plan to separate from the WAC by the Texas 4. I don't think they wanted to be with the Louisiana schools or Central Arkansas and this was an easy way out. The non-Texas WAC schools (outside of New Mexico St) may have signed their death note, but we'll see.

(01-14-2021 04:12 PM)BePcr07 Wrote:  

(01-14-2021 03:48 PM)quo vadis Wrote:  Dumb move by the Texas schools. The Southland Conference was a better fit for them.

Seattle U. is now the WAC sore thumb.

Weird move for sure. I am under the suspicion something else is going on. I think its a plan to separate from the WAC by the Texas 4. I don't think they wanted to be with the Louisiana schools or Central Arkansas and this was an easy way out. The non-Texas WAC schools (outside of New Mexico St) may have signed their death note, but we'll see.

They will be fine. Very far from signing a death note. Central Arkansas wasn’t a problem, UIW and HBU were. The Texas 4 aren’t separating from the WAC anytime soon. No reason to even join if that was their plan.

Seattle U will be just fine, even if they stick out geographically. It’s 1900 miles from Seattle to Houston and 2600 miles from LA to Honolulu. Hawaii flies longer to play their Big West games than Seattle will for any WAC game.

(01-14-2021 03:48 PM)quo vadis Wrote:  Dumb move by the Texas schools. The Southland Conference was a better fit for them.

Seattle U. is now the WAC sore thumb.

While I disagree about the first point, Seattle really is WAY out there, now. Just like in every other sporting body.

(01-14-2021 02:46 PM)Realignment Wrote:  

(01-14-2021 02:41 PM)Bobcat2013 Wrote:  

(01-14-2021 02:38 PM)Realignment Wrote:  

(01-14-2021 02:13 PM)Stugray2 Wrote:  Chicago State is spinning the refusal to renew their contract as voluntary exit.

Nobody wants to have to schedule every sport as an Independent.

Don't think it's likely these Texas schools do much for Basketball. Their budgets are much smaller. But it is Texas and improves recruiting. If Basketball is really the aim they should target UT-Arlington.

If they can get UTA, that's a good grab. I'm sure they are more willing to join FCS football. But I don't see UTA leaving the Sun Belt Conference right now, but who knows. Depends what the goal is for their athletics. Does everyone still think West Texas A&M will join the WAC? As for the 4 non-basketball schools, I think they keep them for now but eventually will probably break off from them. Utah Valley would probably have a landing spot in the Summit League. The 3 private schools of Cal Baptist, Grand Canyon & Seattle may be left up in the air.

If UTA were to start football I don't understand why people think they wouldn't just stay in the SBC. Then they are guaranteed FBS access as long as they're in the SBC.

I think it would have to do with the cost of running an FBS program compared to an FCS program. But I agree. Globe Life Park (now that the Texas Rangers play at Globe Life Field) can be retro-fitted into a college football stadium like Turner Field was for Georgia State.

Globe Life Park has already been retrofitted for football. The Dallas Renegades of the XFL played there. Arlington ISD began using it this year for home high school games, and several rounds of high school state playoffs were played there this year. As I understand it, one side of the field has great sightlines, and the other does not. It would need some more work, but UTA could play there if they wanted to begin a program. The question is, do they want to compete with the Cowboys, TCU, SMU, North Texas, UT, A&M, OU, Tech, and everyone else for football attention?

One of the complaints about construction of the new ballpark in Arlington was that the old one (partially taxpayer funded) was a perfect ballpark (except for weather) but was already obsolete after only 25 years. Football has restored some usefulness to the facility, even if it is a clunky fit.

(01-14-2021 04:52 PM)maybeimhere Wrote:  

(01-14-2021 03:48 PM)quo vadis Wrote:  Dumb move by the Texas schools. The Southland Conference was a better fit for them.

Seattle U. is now the WAC sore thumb.

While I disagree about the first point, Seattle really is WAY out there, now. Just like in every other sporting body.

From a geography perspective, a Seattle for N. Arizona trade would make a ton of sense. But, I don't know much about the goals, needs, or desires of the Big Sky or WAC schools.

(01-14-2021 05:01 PM)YNot Wrote:  

(01-14-2021 04:52 PM)maybeimhere Wrote:  

(01-14-2021 03:48 PM)quo vadis Wrote:  Dumb move by the Texas schools. The Southland Conference was a better fit for them.

Seattle U. is now the WAC sore thumb.

While I disagree about the first point, Seattle really is WAY out there, now. Just like in every other sporting body.

From a geography perspective, a Seattle for N. Arizona trade would make a ton of sense. But, I don't know much about the goals, needs, or desires of the Big Sky or WAC schools.

Good idea.

No reason for NAU to play in a Montana-Idaho conference if they don't have to.

(01-13-2021 07:09 PM)Todor Wrote:  

(01-13-2021 02:30 PM)joeben69 Wrote:  

(01-13-2021 12:28 PM)solohawks Wrote:  

(01-13-2021 12:10 PM)Foreverandever Wrote:  

(01-13-2021 11:24 AM)solohawks Wrote:  There you go spouting logical realignment again

This is the scenario that I brought up in the other WAC thread.

This actually makes sense and is the primary goal in this, I think. There are plenty of in between scenarios that work for almost everyone as well. The move isn't earth shattering like the Big Ten taking Maryland or the ACC getting into the Big East. But it's a move that could be a major positive, but really ends up being a positive no matter how it all shakes out.

From where they are now it's really just trading Seattle for NAU (as long as the schools do not object) because it makes more sense for everyone. With nine football schools they have enough that a few might make it FBS. Really as long as three of them can it means they along with NMST could fairly easily maintain FBS status by scheduling each other and their FCS home game (probably against the WAC FCS left back) in November and doing 2-1s or buy games September and October as pay days. Toss in a home and home with an eastern independent and they could make some decent schedules.

Ive mentioned this scenario too. Seattle to Big Sky, Northern Arizona to WAC, and Northern Colorado to Summit/WAC football just makes a ton of sense and allows all 3 conferences to solidify their footprint.

if this scenario like stated above plays out...

- Chicago State out ===> (MEAC)
- Northern Arizona ===> WAC
- Seattle ===> BSC
- West Texas A&M ===> WAC
- Northern CO ===> Summit (non-football)/WAC (football)

...would it be a reversal/comeback or bsc karma of former bsc commissioner doug fullerton's attempt to destroy the wac football from back in 2012???...initially fcs level but potentially fbs in the future???

Fullerton was a bum. He did all he could to shoot his mouth off and hurt the WAC. SUU joining the WAC has to be pain point to him. And North Dakota leaving after a short time. He'll hit the roof if the WAC could get Northern Arizona and/or Weber. His goal of the Big Sky as the only game in town didn't pan out at all lol.

That rat bastard did manage to wrangle Idaho back to the BSC so at least one of his awful ideas came to fruition.

With SUU's departure, I'm glad to see the BSC will be at 10/12.

(01-14-2021 12:00 PM)dbackjon Wrote:  

(01-13-2021 07:09 PM)Todor Wrote:  

(01-13-2021 02:30 PM)joeben69 Wrote:  

(01-13-2021 12:28 PM)solohawks Wrote:  

(01-13-2021 12:10 PM)Foreverandever Wrote:  This is the scenario that I brought up in the other WAC thread.

This actually makes sense and is the primary goal in this, I think. There are plenty of in between scenarios that work for almost everyone as well. The move isn't earth shattering like the Big Ten taking Maryland or the ACC getting into the Big East. But it's a move that could be a major positive, but really ends up being a positive no matter how it all shakes out.

From where they are now it's really just trading Seattle for NAU (as long as the schools do not object) because it makes more sense for everyone. With nine football schools they have enough that a few might make it FBS. Really as long as three of them can it means they along with NMST could fairly easily maintain FBS status by scheduling each other and their FCS home game (probably against the WAC FCS left back) in November and doing 2-1s or buy games September and October as pay days. Toss in a home and home with an eastern independent and they could make some decent schedules.

Ive mentioned this scenario too. Seattle to Big Sky, Northern Arizona to WAC, and Northern Colorado to Summit/WAC football just makes a ton of sense and allows all 3 conferences to solidify their footprint.

if this scenario like stated above plays out...

- Chicago State out ===> (MEAC)
- Northern Arizona ===> WAC
- Seattle ===> BSC
- West Texas A&M ===> WAC
- Northern CO ===> Summit (non-football)/WAC (football)

...would it be a reversal/comeback or bsc karma of former bsc commissioner doug fullerton's attempt to destroy the wac football from back in 2012???...initially fcs level but potentially fbs in the future???

Fullerton was a bum. He did all he could to shoot his mouth off and hurt the WAC. SUU joining the WAC has to be pain point to him. And North Dakota leaving after a short time. He'll hit the roof if the WAC could get Northern Arizona and/or Weber. His goal of the Big Sky as the only game in town didn't pan out at all lol.

Eh, no one in the Big Sky cared in North Dakota left - it was a pain in the ass to get to.

And the northern members never wanted SUU to begin with. NAU was the one pushing for them to get in.

I still don't understand the SUU move - I guess they think that the WAC Football will be easier and cheaper.

UND was going to be a package deal with USD. Then USD got an 11th hour invite to the Summit and Foolerton looked like a total dumb ass for orchestrating the UND add as everyone in the conference had to fly to bumfuc nowhere to play D1 athletics. The UND/USD adds never made sense to anyone with a brain.

If the Big Sky take a school, they will grab Central Washington over Seattle U. They will grab Western Oregon and Southern Oregon before allowing Seattle U. in. If the west coast want a new none -football conference? They could revive the Great West with Seattle U., California Baptist and Grand Canyon and invite the large D2 schools to join from California and the GNAC. Seattle and Grand Canyon would be eligible right away for post season right away.

(01-14-2021 05:14 PM)SDHornet Wrote:  

(01-13-2021 07:09 PM)Todor Wrote:  

(01-13-2021 02:30 PM)joeben69 Wrote:  

(01-13-2021 12:28 PM)solohawks Wrote:  

(01-13-2021 12:10 PM)Foreverandever Wrote:  This is the scenario that I brought up in the other WAC thread.

This actually makes sense and is the primary goal in this, I think. There are plenty of in between scenarios that work for almost everyone as well. The move isn't earth shattering like the Big Ten taking Maryland or the ACC getting into the Big East. But it's a move that could be a major positive, but really ends up being a positive no matter how it all shakes out.

From where they are now it's really just trading Seattle for NAU (as long as the schools do not object) because it makes more sense for everyone. With nine football schools they have enough that a few might make it FBS. Really as long as three of them can it means they along with NMST could fairly easily maintain FBS status by scheduling each other and their FCS home game (probably against the WAC FCS left back) in November and doing 2-1s or buy games September and October as pay days. Toss in a home and home with an eastern independent and they could make some decent schedules.

Ive mentioned this scenario too. Seattle to Big Sky, Northern Arizona to WAC, and Northern Colorado to Summit/WAC football just makes a ton of sense and allows all 3 conferences to solidify their footprint.

if this scenario like stated above plays out...

- Chicago State out ===> (MEAC)
- Northern Arizona ===> WAC
- Seattle ===> BSC
- West Texas A&M ===> WAC
- Northern CO ===> Summit (non-football)/WAC (football)

...would it be a reversal/comeback or bsc karma of former bsc commissioner doug fullerton's attempt to destroy the wac football from back in 2012???...initially fcs level but potentially fbs in the future???

Fullerton was a bum. He did all he could to shoot his mouth off and hurt the WAC. SUU joining the WAC has to be pain point to him. And North Dakota leaving after a short time. He'll hit the roof if the WAC could get Northern Arizona and/or Weber. His goal of the Big Sky as the only game in town didn't pan out at all lol.

That rat bastard did manage to wrangle Idaho back to the BSC so at least one of his awful ideas came to fruition.

With SUU's departure, I'm glad to see the BSC will be at 10/12.

That is the good part - getting rid of the bloat

(01-14-2021 05:14 PM)SDHornet Wrote:  

(01-13-2021 07:09 PM)Todor Wrote:  

(01-13-2021 02:30 PM)joeben69 Wrote:  

(01-13-2021 12:28 PM)solohawks Wrote:  

(01-13-2021 12:10 PM)Foreverandever Wrote:  This is the scenario that I brought up in the other WAC thread.

This actually makes sense and is the primary goal in this, I think. There are plenty of in between scenarios that work for almost everyone as well. The move isn't earth shattering like the Big Ten taking Maryland or the ACC getting into the Big East. But it's a move that could be a major positive, but really ends up being a positive no matter how it all shakes out.

From where they are now it's really just trading Seattle for NAU (as long as the schools do not object) because it makes more sense for everyone. With nine football schools they have enough that a few might make it FBS. Really as long as three of them can it means they along with NMST could fairly easily maintain FBS status by scheduling each other and their FCS home game (probably against the WAC FCS left back) in November and doing 2-1s or buy games September and October as pay days. Toss in a home and home with an eastern independent and they could make some decent schedules.

Ive mentioned this scenario too. Seattle to Big Sky, Northern Arizona to WAC, and Northern Colorado to Summit/WAC football just makes a ton of sense and allows all 3 conferences to solidify their footprint.

if this scenario like stated above plays out...

- Chicago State out ===> (MEAC)
- Northern Arizona ===> WAC
- Seattle ===> BSC
- West Texas A&M ===> WAC
- Northern CO ===> Summit (non-football)/WAC (football)

...would it be a reversal/comeback or bsc karma of former bsc commissioner doug fullerton's attempt to destroy the wac football from back in 2012???...initially fcs level but potentially fbs in the future???

Fullerton was a bum. He did all he could to shoot his mouth off and hurt the WAC. SUU joining the WAC has to be pain point to him. And North Dakota leaving after a short time. He'll hit the roof if the WAC could get Northern Arizona and/or Weber. His goal of the Big Sky as the only game in town didn't pan out at all lol.

That rat bastard did manage to wrangle Idaho back to the BSC so at least one of his awful ideas came to fruition.

With SUU's departure, I'm glad to see the BSC will be at 10/12.

When WAC football collapsed, where else was Idaho going to go than the Big Sky? I don't think Fullerton gets any credit for that. Plus, how big an asset is Idaho anyway?