But were there underlying comorbitities?

Obesity, diabetes, high blood pressure, etc...

Covid-19 is dangerous in the ability for many to be asymptomatic and others go on a three month Medical nightmare leading to their death.

If vaccines are released we still aren't sure it is over... However, I'm optimistic that 2021 will be much better though.

(07-26-2020 10:49 AM)XLance Wrote:  

(07-26-2020 10:33 AM)cuseroc Wrote:  

(07-26-2020 08:44 AM)TexanMark Wrote:  

(07-22-2020 09:37 PM)cuseroc Wrote:  

(07-22-2020 09:30 PM)green Wrote:  

https://twitter.com/niravb/status/1286063221087117312

infection not tantamount to death ...

THERE YOU GO AGAIN

True, but why lose 5000 or 10,000 folks when you dont have to?

This disease is brutal on the old and those with comorbitities. The sad point is many of them would have died this year without Covid-19.

Why it is insane to blame these 140K deaths on any politician. The real blame lies in China with their deceiving.

We have no way of knowing this at all. I went to my great uncles (by marriage) funeral in Florida back in late January. His baby sister came down with covid by the time she returned home to Georgia. She was full of life. She died last week at 78 after battling covid since the beginning of February. Its difficult for me to imagine that she would have died anyway this year. My cousin in Bradenton was telling me about 3 of her friends between the ages of 41-48 who died from covid in the last 6 weeks. Its difficult for me to think that they would have died anyway this year. She was tripping over the fact that its killing people so young. She's 46

Its correct to blame politicians for how they handle the covid outbreak, if they do things like encouraging folks not to wear masks or not to social distance or to make it a political statement to wear masks or not wear a mask. Especially when evidence is overwhelming that it works.. Its not correct to blame them for covid itself.

The wishy-washy suggestions from the scientists at the beginning of the outbreak created a lot of confusion.
When the leading expert can be quoted as saying "go ahead and go on a cruise" or "you don't need to wear a mask" only to reverse course a week or month later, nobody can be certain of being told the truth if there really is one.
1-the Chinese are responsible for creating and spreading the virus
2-politics in the US have hampered efforts and if it weren't an election year, we may have seen a greater level of cooperation among politicians.

Agreed

Putting our PPE supply chain under control of China was a huge culprit. Dems and Repubs both have blood on their hands. Never again but American's must be willing to pay more.

(07-26-2020 10:51 AM)TexanMark Wrote:  But were there underlying comorbitities?

Obesity, diabetes, high blood pressure, etc...

Covid-19 is dangerous in the ability for many to be asymptomatic and others go on a three month Medical nightmare leading to their death.

If vaccines are released we still aren't sure it is over... However, I'm optimistic that 2021 will be much better though.

I dont know if there were any underlying conditions. I know that underlying conditions increases the chances of dying from covid. But I know lots of people who have diabetes asthma, high blood pressure etc.... But I certainly dont think they are going to die this year. I am with you about hoping 2021 is a better year.

(07-26-2020 10:49 AM)XLance Wrote:  

(07-26-2020 10:33 AM)cuseroc Wrote:  

(07-26-2020 08:44 AM)TexanMark Wrote:  

(07-22-2020 09:37 PM)cuseroc Wrote:  

(07-22-2020 09:30 PM)green Wrote:  

https://twitter.com/niravb/status/1286063221087117312

infection not tantamount to death ...

THERE YOU GO AGAIN

True, but why lose 5000 or 10,000 folks when you dont have to?

This disease is brutal on the old and those with comorbitities. The sad point is many of them would have died this year without Covid-19.

Why it is insane to blame these 140K deaths on any politician. The real blame lies in China with their deceiving.

We have no way of knowing this at all. I went to my great uncles (by marriage) funeral in Florida back in late January. His baby sister came down with covid by the time she returned home to Georgia. She was full of life. She died last week at 78 after battling covid since the beginning of February. Its difficult for me to imagine that she would have died anyway this year. My cousin in Bradenton was telling me about 3 of her friends between the ages of 41-48 who died from covid in the last 6 weeks. Its difficult for me to think that they would have died anyway this year. She was tripping over the fact that its killing people so young. She's 46

Its correct to blame politicians for how they handle the covid outbreak, if they do things like encouraging folks not to wear masks or not to social distance or to make it a political statement to wear masks or not wear a mask. Especially when evidence is overwhelming that it works.. Its not correct to blame them for covid itself.

The wishy-washy suggestions from the scientists at the beginning of the outbreak created a lot of confusion.
When the leading expert can be quoted as saying "go ahead and go on a cruise" or "you don't need to wear a mask" only to reverse course a week or month later, nobody can be certain of being told the truth if there really is one.
1-the Chinese are responsible for creating and spreading the virus
2-politics in the US have hampered efforts and if it weren't an election year, we may have seen a greater level of cooperation among politicians.

I mis-typed. It is correct to blame China for the virus. But not for the spread in the US. Politics can be blamed for whats going on in Florida, Texas Arizona etc..

I haven't seen any hard evidence that the Chinese actually created the virus - that seems like conspiracy theory stuff at this point.

There's plenty of evidence that they continued spreading it after they knew about it, however, so the Chinese are definitely culpable for that.

Agree too that politicians on both sides of the fence are responsible for policies which allowed items critical to national security (like PPE) production to be out-sourced.

combination of short-sighted decisions by U.S. leaders coupled with some deception on the part of China.

(07-26-2020 10:54 AM)TexanMark Wrote:  

(07-26-2020 10:49 AM)XLance Wrote:  

(07-26-2020 10:33 AM)cuseroc Wrote:  

(07-26-2020 08:44 AM)TexanMark Wrote:  

(07-22-2020 09:37 PM)cuseroc Wrote:  True, but why lose 5000 or 10,000 folks when you dont have to?

This disease is brutal on the old and those with comorbitities. The sad point is many of them would have died this year without Covid-19.

Why it is insane to blame these 140K deaths on any politician. The real blame lies in China with their deceiving.

We have no way of knowing this at all. I went to my great uncles (by marriage) funeral in Florida back in late January. His baby sister came down with covid by the time she returned home to Georgia. She was full of life. She died last week at 78 after battling covid since the beginning of February. Its difficult for me to imagine that she would have died anyway this year. My cousin in Bradenton was telling me about 3 of her friends between the ages of 41-48 who died from covid in the last 6 weeks. Its difficult for me to think that they would have died anyway this year. She was tripping over the fact that its killing people so young. She's 46

Its correct to blame politicians for how they handle the covid outbreak, if they do things like encouraging folks not to wear masks or not to social distance or to make it a political statement to wear masks or not wear a mask. Especially when evidence is overwhelming that it works.. Its not correct to blame them for covid itself.

The wishy-washy suggestions from the scientists at the beginning of the outbreak created a lot of confusion.
When the leading expert can be quoted as saying "go ahead and go on a cruise" or "you don't need to wear a mask" only to reverse course a week or month later, nobody can be certain of being told the truth if there really is one.
1-the Chinese are responsible for creating and spreading the virus
2-politics in the US have hampered efforts and if it weren't an election year, we may have seen a greater level of cooperation among politicians.

Agreed

Putting our PPE supply chain under control of China was a huge culprit. Dems and Repubs both have blood on their hands. Never again but American's must be willing to pay more.

China is maturing so fast as an industrialized nation, and their economy is growing so fast that in a decade or so, it may not be economically feasible to buy much of anything there. We will have to find some other emerging nation to do business with.

(07-26-2020 02:04 PM)cuseroc Wrote:  

(07-26-2020 10:54 AM)TexanMark Wrote:  

(07-26-2020 10:49 AM)XLance Wrote:  

(07-26-2020 10:33 AM)cuseroc Wrote:  

(07-26-2020 08:44 AM)TexanMark Wrote:  This disease is brutal on the old and those with comorbitities. The sad point is many of them would have died this year without Covid-19.

Why it is insane to blame these 140K deaths on any politician. The real blame lies in China with their deceiving.

We have no way of knowing this at all. I went to my great uncles (by marriage) funeral in Florida back in late January. His baby sister came down with covid by the time she returned home to Georgia. She was full of life. She died last week at 78 after battling covid since the beginning of February. Its difficult for me to imagine that she would have died anyway this year. My cousin in Bradenton was telling me about 3 of her friends between the ages of 41-48 who died from covid in the last 6 weeks. Its difficult for me to think that they would have died anyway this year. She was tripping over the fact that its killing people so young. She's 46

Its correct to blame politicians for how they handle the covid outbreak, if they do things like encouraging folks not to wear masks or not to social distance or to make it a political statement to wear masks or not wear a mask. Especially when evidence is overwhelming that it works.. Its not correct to blame them for covid itself.

The wishy-washy suggestions from the scientists at the beginning of the outbreak created a lot of confusion.
When the leading expert can be quoted as saying "go ahead and go on a cruise" or "you don't need to wear a mask" only to reverse course a week or month later, nobody can be certain of being told the truth if there really is one.
1-the Chinese are responsible for creating and spreading the virus
2-politics in the US have hampered efforts and if it weren't an election year, we may have seen a greater level of cooperation among politicians.

Agreed

Putting our PPE supply chain under control of China was a huge culprit. Dems and Repubs both have blood on their hands. Never again but American's must be willing to pay more.

China is maturing so fast as an industrialized nation, and their economy is growing so fast that in a decade or so, it may not be economically feasible to buy much of anything there. We will have to find some other emerging nation to do business with.

Or start making everything ourselves.
College is no longer the golden ticket to success.
If trade unions would function more like guilds in preparing workers for a career, workers income could easily match that of any college educated person, and restore the middle class.
We must be prepared to consume less and pay a little more to keep our money at home instead of financing world growth only to have it turned back on us.

(07-26-2020 08:50 AM)TexanMark Wrote:  

(07-26-2020 08:10 AM)CardinalJim Wrote:  The Kentucky State Fair is going on as scheduled. We can’t send our children to school but we can take them out for a corn dog and to risk their lives on rickety carnival rides. All because the Kentucky Fair board is all friends of the Governor.

NY shut theirs down... I'll miss it. Really improved over the last few years. However, NY's best and brightest aren't hanging out in the Midway.

That’s a smart move.
Unfortunately you won’t find Kentucky’s best or brightest in the Governor’s mansion.

(07-26-2020 03:14 PM)CardinalJim Wrote:  

(07-26-2020 08:50 AM)TexanMark Wrote:  

(07-26-2020 08:10 AM)CardinalJim Wrote:  The Kentucky State Fair is going on as scheduled. We can’t send our children to school but we can take them out for a corn dog and to risk their lives on rickety carnival rides. All because the Kentucky Fair board is all friends of the Governor.

NY shut theirs down... I'll miss it. Really improved over the last few years. However, NY's best and brightest aren't hanging out in the Midway.

That’s a smart move.
Unfortunately you won’t find Kentucky’s best or brightest in the Governor’s mansion.

(07-26-2020 02:24 PM)XLance Wrote:  

(07-26-2020 02:04 PM)cuseroc Wrote:  

(07-26-2020 10:54 AM)TexanMark Wrote:  

(07-26-2020 10:49 AM)XLance Wrote:  

(07-26-2020 10:33 AM)cuseroc Wrote:  We have no way of knowing this at all. I went to my great uncles (by marriage) funeral in Florida back in late January. His baby sister came down with covid by the time she returned home to Georgia. She was full of life. She died last week at 78 after battling covid since the beginning of February. Its difficult for me to imagine that she would have died anyway this year. My cousin in Bradenton was telling me about 3 of her friends between the ages of 41-48 who died from covid in the last 6 weeks. Its difficult for me to think that they would have died anyway this year. She was tripping over the fact that its killing people so young. She's 46

Its correct to blame politicians for how they handle the covid outbreak, if they do things like encouraging folks not to wear masks or not to social distance or to make it a political statement to wear masks or not wear a mask. Especially when evidence is overwhelming that it works.. Its not correct to blame them for covid itself.

The wishy-washy suggestions from the scientists at the beginning of the outbreak created a lot of confusion.
When the leading expert can be quoted as saying "go ahead and go on a cruise" or "you don't need to wear a mask" only to reverse course a week or month later, nobody can be certain of being told the truth if there really is one.
1-the Chinese are responsible for creating and spreading the virus
2-politics in the US have hampered efforts and if it weren't an election year, we may have seen a greater level of cooperation among politicians.

Agreed

Putting our PPE supply chain under control of China was a huge culprit. Dems and Repubs both have blood on their hands. Never again but American's must be willing to pay more.

China is maturing so fast as an industrialized nation, and their economy is growing so fast that in a decade or so, it may not be economically feasible to buy much of anything there. We will have to find some other emerging nation to do business with.

Or start making everything ourselves.
College is no longer the golden ticket to success.
If trade unions would function more like guilds in preparing workers for a career, workers income could easily match that of any college educated person, and restore the middle class.
We must be prepared to consume less and pay a little more to keep our money at home instead of financing world growth only to have it turned back on us.

This I totally agree with. The wealthiest and most powerful country in the history of the world should not have to depend on any other nation to manufacture medical items, PPE, pharmaceuticals etc... or any other items that are important to the well being of its citizens.

(07-26-2020 06:49 PM)cuseroc Wrote:  

(07-26-2020 02:24 PM)XLance Wrote:  

(07-26-2020 02:04 PM)cuseroc Wrote:  

(07-26-2020 10:54 AM)TexanMark Wrote:  

(07-26-2020 10:49 AM)XLance Wrote:  The wishy-washy suggestions from the scientists at the beginning of the outbreak created a lot of confusion.
When the leading expert can be quoted as saying "go ahead and go on a cruise" or "you don't need to wear a mask" only to reverse course a week or month later, nobody can be certain of being told the truth if there really is one.
1-the Chinese are responsible for creating and spreading the virus
2-politics in the US have hampered efforts and if it weren't an election year, we may have seen a greater level of cooperation among politicians.

Agreed

Putting our PPE supply chain under control of China was a huge culprit. Dems and Repubs both have blood on their hands. Never again but American's must be willing to pay more.

China is maturing so fast as an industrialized nation, and their economy is growing so fast that in a decade or so, it may not be economically feasible to buy much of anything there. We will have to find some other emerging nation to do business with.

Or start making everything ourselves.
College is no longer the golden ticket to success.
If trade unions would function more like guilds in preparing workers for a career, workers income could easily match that of any college educated person, and restore the middle class.
We must be prepared to consume less and pay a little more to keep our money at home instead of financing world growth only to have it turned back on us.

This I totally agree with. The wealthiest and most powerful country in the history of the world should not have to depend on any other nation to manufacture medical items, PPE, pharmaceuticals etc... or any other items that are important to the well being of its citizens.

The really stupid and inexcusable part is that we entrusted a former adversary (Korea/VietNam) with this important task and did so at a time when they were already threatening our allies in Japan and India. It is merely insane!

I think there is a guy in Moscow who once said "The Capitalists will sell us the rope with which we will hang them.”

When the profit of the corporation is more important than national interest or personal interest you get our current situation. In the long run, economics is not very different from physics and eventually you run against the limits of a closed system.


The saving grace is that China has Russia on one boarder and India on the other and a destabilized population pyramid that is rapidly aging their overall population. While they can **** with us, they can't bring us down and they have their own issues.


The real shame is the 40-50 million Americans living in emptying rural areas waiting for someone to come along and bring economic development. The bit into a Faustian bargain and anchored themselves to dying areas, losing the relative wealth of their nest egg late in life, trapping them in place. So many young, suburban/urban people do not comprehend why so many of these rural people are red assed mad. On top of that those trapped don't always articulate or fully understand the trap they are in.

I have people like this on both sides of the family, living in rural areas and waiting for the government to bring a new factory. They own the land their house is on so they think they have an asset rather than understanding what they have is an anchor. They "played by the rules" and got screwed. Over time they gravitate toward stupid conspiracy theory bull **** because it's better to feel like someone targeted you instead of you being screwed because you didn't understand the system.

(07-26-2020 08:51 PM)Statefan Wrote:  I think there is a guy in Moscow who once said "The Capitalists will sell us the rope with which we will hang them.”

When the profit of the corporation is more important than national interest or personal interest you get our current situation. In the long run, economics is not very different from physics and eventually you run against the limits of a closed system.


The saving grace is that China has Russia on one boarder and India on the other and a destabilized population pyramid that is rapidly aging their overall population. While they can **** with us, they can't bring us down and they have their own issues.


The real shame is the 40-50 million Americans living in emptying rural areas waiting for someone to come along and bring economic development. The bit into a Faustian bargain and anchored themselves to dying areas, losing the relative wealth of their nest egg late in life, trapping them in place. So many young, suburban/urban people do not comprehend why so many of these rural people are red assed mad. On top of that those trapped don't always articulate or fully understand the trap they are in.

I have people like this on both sides of the family, living in rural areas and waiting for the government to bring a new factory. They own the land their house is on so they think they have an asset rather than understanding what they have is an anchor. They "played by the rules" and got screwed. Over time they gravitate toward stupid conspiracy theory bull **** because it's better to feel like someone targeted you instead of you being screwed because you didn't understand the system.

In the times we are in right now, those rural people are in better position to survive than you are. And China has a credible nuclear threat. Logistics are against them, but you never know what a cornered dragon will do. And Statefan, the ones who are targeted are the ones in debt up to their eyeballs just to keep up with their neighbors in burbs, but make just enough from their white collar jobs to keep their nostrils above water as they live paycheck to paycheck.

There are always two sides to every coin and most times it just depends on which side you call. Those rural folks will be eating when the city folks aren't.

I have friends in both situations. Some of them do draw down six figures but spend their last nickel just keeping up appearances and one of them confessed to me he can't afford to retire until he is 75 because he had kids late in life. The ones that live in the sticks are mostly happy. They hunt and fish and farm and log and the highlight of their week is going to Church and listening to the gossip. Their big issue is having an affair when they get bored and by doing so in a small town everybody knows including the spouses and then a world of hurt comes down on them. But if they can avoid that they live quite well, and don't really worry about what you have or don't have in your urban environment.

What they are hurting from truly is lack of decent healthcare without driving to the city. The mortality in my old home town is now too frequent from 55 to 65 and most of that is lack of primary care physicians to spot problems on routine check ups that might have led to treatments that would have prevented early death. And that development is relatively recent, like the last 20 years.

But hey if you check into big city hospital the third shift nursing crew that doesn't speak English just might give you the wrong meds.

You pays your money and you take your chances.

(07-26-2020 10:51 AM)TexanMark Wrote:  But were there underlying comorbitities?

Obesity, diabetes, high blood pressure, etc...

Covid-19 is dangerous in the ability for many to be asymptomatic and others go on a three month Medical nightmare leading to their death.

If vaccines are released we still aren't sure it is over... However, I'm optimistic that 2021 will be much better though.

I hope 2021 is a better year but a vaccine has to be found, manufactured and distributed to people around the world. Also the vaccine could mutate again and the vaccine will be less effective.

(07-26-2020 12:26 PM)cuseroc Wrote:  

(07-26-2020 10:49 AM)XLance Wrote:  

(07-26-2020 10:33 AM)cuseroc Wrote:  

(07-26-2020 08:44 AM)TexanMark Wrote:  

(07-22-2020 09:37 PM)cuseroc Wrote:  True, but why lose 5000 or 10,000 folks when you dont have to?

This disease is brutal on the old and those with comorbitities. The sad point is many of them would have died this year without Covid-19.

Why it is insane to blame these 140K deaths on any politician. The real blame lies in China with their deceiving.

We have no way of knowing this at all. I went to my great uncles (by marriage) funeral in Florida back in late January. His baby sister came down with covid by the time she returned home to Georgia. She was full of life. She died last week at 78 after battling covid since the beginning of February. Its difficult for me to imagine that she would have died anyway this year. My cousin in Bradenton was telling me about 3 of her friends between the ages of 41-48 who died from covid in the last 6 weeks. Its difficult for me to think that they would have died anyway this year. She was tripping over the fact that its killing people so young. She's 46

Its correct to blame politicians for how they handle the covid outbreak, if they do things like encouraging folks not to wear masks or not to social distance or to make it a political statement to wear masks or not wear a mask. Especially when evidence is overwhelming that it works.. Its not correct to blame them for covid itself.

The wishy-washy suggestions from the scientists at the beginning of the outbreak created a lot of confusion.
When the leading expert can be quoted as saying "go ahead and go on a cruise" or "you don't need to wear a mask" only to reverse course a week or month later, nobody can be certain of being told the truth if there really is one.
1-the Chinese are responsible for creating and spreading the virus
2-politics in the US have hampered efforts and if it weren't an election year, we may have seen a greater level of cooperation among politicians.

I mis-typed. It is correct to blame China for the virus. But not for the spread in the US. Politics can be blamed for whats going on in Florida, Texas Arizona etc..

I doubt China created the virus based on the information i have read, but it probably did make the jump from animals to humans there. I think China probably could have warned the world earlier and taken steps to contain it earlier. It is crazy how this whole covid-19 became politicized because the virus does not care about politics. It just goes to show you how out of hand politics are. It is wrong for politicians to politicize this.

(07-26-2020 06:49 PM)cuseroc Wrote:  

(07-26-2020 02:24 PM)XLance Wrote:  

(07-26-2020 02:04 PM)cuseroc Wrote:  

(07-26-2020 10:54 AM)TexanMark Wrote:  

(07-26-2020 10:49 AM)XLance Wrote:  The wishy-washy suggestions from the scientists at the beginning of the outbreak created a lot of confusion.
When the leading expert can be quoted as saying "go ahead and go on a cruise" or "you don't need to wear a mask" only to reverse course a week or month later, nobody can be certain of being told the truth if there really is one.
1-the Chinese are responsible for creating and spreading the virus
2-politics in the US have hampered efforts and if it weren't an election year, we may have seen a greater level of cooperation among politicians.

Agreed

Putting our PPE supply chain under control of China was a huge culprit. Dems and Repubs both have blood on their hands. Never again but American's must be willing to pay more.

China is maturing so fast as an industrialized nation, and their economy is growing so fast that in a decade or so, it may not be economically feasible to buy much of anything there. We will have to find some other emerging nation to do business with.

Or start making everything ourselves.
College is no longer the golden ticket to success.
If trade unions would function more like guilds in preparing workers for a career, workers income could easily match that of any college educated person, and restore the middle class.
We must be prepared to consume less and pay a little more to keep our money at home instead of financing world growth only to have it turned back on us.

This I totally agree with. The wealthiest and most powerful country in the history of the world should not have to depend on any other nation to manufacture medical items, PPE, pharmaceuticals etc... or any other items that are important to the well being of its citizens.

That was a strategic error to have supply chains for so many things in China and not just medical and pharmaceuticals. Even stuff like Aspartame (used for diet sodas) is in short supply (I know because i drink diet Sprite and diet 7up). This is crazy to be so dependant on China. It is one thing to be dependant on your friends and allies but I would be careful about how much you depend on China.

(07-26-2020 08:51 PM)Statefan Wrote:  I think there is a guy in Moscow who once said "The Capitalists will sell us the rope with which we will hang them.”

When the profit of the corporation is more important than national interest or personal interest you get our current situation. In the long run, economics is not very different from physics and eventually you run against the limits of a closed system.


The saving grace is that China has Russia on one boarder and India on the other and a destabilized population pyramid that is rapidly aging their overall population. While they can **** with us, they can't bring us down and they have their own issues.


The real shame is the 40-50 million Americans living in emptying rural areas waiting for someone to come along and bring economic development. The bit into a Faustian bargain and anchored themselves to dying areas, losing the relative wealth of their nest egg late in life, trapping them in place. So many young, suburban/urban people do not comprehend why so many of these rural people are red assed mad. On top of that those trapped don't always articulate or fully understand the trap they are in.

I have people like this on both sides of the family, living in rural areas and waiting for the government to bring a new factory. They own the land their house is on so they think they have an asset rather than understanding what they have is an anchor. They "played by the rules" and got screwed. Over time they gravitate toward stupid conspiracy theory bull **** because it's better to feel like someone targeted you instead of you being screwed because you didn't understand the system.

The world economy has changed over the years so jobs that used to be there in manufacturing have gone overseas to countries with cheaper labor. This is globalization with the internet and technology pushing this stuff. Many of these jobs require advanced university educations to do well. The farming jobs will not go away but many of the manufacturing jobs will not come back.

(07-26-2020 09:21 PM)JRsec Wrote:  

(07-26-2020 08:51 PM)Statefan Wrote:  I think there is a guy in Moscow who once said "The Capitalists will sell us the rope with which we will hang them.”

When the profit of the corporation is more important than national interest or personal interest you get our current situation. In the long run, economics is not very different from physics and eventually you run against the limits of a closed system.


The saving grace is that China has Russia on one boarder and India on the other and a destabilized population pyramid that is rapidly aging their overall population. While they can **** with us, they can't bring us down and they have their own issues.


The real shame is the 40-50 million Americans living in emptying rural areas waiting for someone to come along and bring economic development. The bit into a Faustian bargain and anchored themselves to dying areas, losing the relative wealth of their nest egg late in life, trapping them in place. So many young, suburban/urban people do not comprehend why so many of these rural people are red assed mad. On top of that those trapped don't always articulate or fully understand the trap they are in.

I have people like this on both sides of the family, living in rural areas and waiting for the government to bring a new factory. They own the land their house is on so they think they have an asset rather than understanding what they have is an anchor. They "played by the rules" and got screwed. Over time they gravitate toward stupid conspiracy theory bull **** because it's better to feel like someone targeted you instead of you being screwed because you didn't understand the system.

In the times we are in right now, those rural people are in better position to survive than you are. And China has a credible nuclear threat. Logistics are against them, but you never know what a cornered dragon will do. And Statefan, the ones who are targeted are the ones in debt up to their eyeballs just to keep up with their neighbors in burbs, but make just enough from their white collar jobs to keep their nostrils above water as they live paycheck to paycheck.

There are always two sides to every coin and most times it just depends on which side you call. Those rural folks will be eating when the city folks aren't.

I have friends in both situations. Some of them do draw down six figures but spend their last nickel just keeping up appearances and one of them confessed to me he can't afford to retire until he is 75 because he had kids late in life. The ones that live in the sticks are mostly happy. They hunt and fish and farm and log and the highlight of their week is going to Church and listening to the gossip. Their big issue is having an affair when they get bored and by doing so in a small town everybody knows including the spouses and then a world of hurt comes down on them. But if they can avoid that they live quite well, and don't really worry about what you have or don't have in your urban environment.

What they are hurting from truly is lack of decent healthcare without driving to the city. The mortality in my old home town is now too frequent from 55 to 65 and most of that is lack of primary care physicians to spot problems on routine check ups that might have led to treatments that would have prevented early death. And that development is relatively recent, like the last 20 years.

But hey if you check into big city hospital the third shift nursing crew that doesn't speak English just might give you the wrong meds.

You pays your money and you take your chances.

Health Care is a problem that this country needs to fix. It is not right for people to work their whole lives and then have to go bankrupt because they get diagnosed with diabetes or cancer. I don't know why they can't bring in health care like in
Canada or the UK or Australia or Germany. Its not rocket science we should just copy what those countries do to have a good health care system. In case anyone was wondering I am not a left wing radical but actually a fiscal conservative. The US spends more on health care than any country in the world and its not even close.
It would be much cheaper to have a single payer health care system.

(07-27-2020 01:05 AM)tj_2009 Wrote:  

(07-26-2020 12:26 PM)cuseroc Wrote:  

(07-26-2020 10:49 AM)XLance Wrote:  

(07-26-2020 10:33 AM)cuseroc Wrote:  

(07-26-2020 08:44 AM)TexanMark Wrote:  This disease is brutal on the old and those with comorbitities. The sad point is many of them would have died this year without Covid-19.

Why it is insane to blame these 140K deaths on any politician. The real blame lies in China with their deceiving.

We have no way of knowing this at all. I went to my great uncles (by marriage) funeral in Florida back in late January. His baby sister came down with covid by the time she returned home to Georgia. She was full of life. She died last week at 78 after battling covid since the beginning of February. Its difficult for me to imagine that she would have died anyway this year. My cousin in Bradenton was telling me about 3 of her friends between the ages of 41-48 who died from covid in the last 6 weeks. Its difficult for me to think that they would have died anyway this year. She was tripping over the fact that its killing people so young. She's 46

Its correct to blame politicians for how they handle the covid outbreak, if they do things like encouraging folks not to wear masks or not to social distance or to make it a political statement to wear masks or not wear a mask. Especially when evidence is overwhelming that it works.. Its not correct to blame them for covid itself.

The wishy-washy suggestions from the scientists at the beginning of the outbreak created a lot of confusion.
When the leading expert can be quoted as saying "go ahead and go on a cruise" or "you don't need to wear a mask" only to reverse course a week or month later, nobody can be certain of being told the truth if there really is one.
1-the Chinese are responsible for creating and spreading the virus
2-politics in the US have hampered efforts and if it weren't an election year, we may have seen a greater level of cooperation among politicians.

I mis-typed. It is correct to blame China for the virus. But not for the spread in the US. Politics can be blamed for whats going on in Florida, Texas Arizona etc..

I doubt China created the virus based on the information i have read, but it probably did make the jump from animals to humans there. I think China probably could have warned the world earlier and taken steps to contain it earlier. It is crazy how this whole covid-19 became politicized because the virus does not care about politics. It just goes to show you how out of hand politics are. It is wrong for politicians to politicize this.

What cool-aid have you been drinking?
The "bat" that the virus supposedly jumped from in the wet market can not be found living within 1,000 miles of Whuhan. You want us to believe some Chinese farmer was trucking bat meat over 1,000 miles just to sell for pennies? Not to mention that the Chinese government has a lab to create biological weapons just a few blocks from that meat market in Whuhan where they (the Chinese Government) claim the virus came from.
The Chinese government allowed travel from Whuhan to other parts of the world but not to Beijing. They locked people in Whuhan in their homes without food and water to kill off the virus.
You had better wake up and realize what type of enemy you are dealing with.
Grab a book and check out what Stalin did to his own people.
It's why people are running through our streets trying to eradicate history, and our University indoctrinated population is too stupid to realize what is actually happening as their "leaders" and the media want to blame everything on politics.

(07-27-2020 01:24 AM)tj_2009 Wrote:  

(07-26-2020 09:21 PM)JRsec Wrote:  

(07-26-2020 08:51 PM)Statefan Wrote:  I think there is a guy in Moscow who once said "The Capitalists will sell us the rope with which we will hang them.”

When the profit of the corporation is more important than national interest or personal interest you get our current situation. In the long run, economics is not very different from physics and eventually you run against the limits of a closed system.


The saving grace is that China has Russia on one boarder and India on the other and a destabilized population pyramid that is rapidly aging their overall population. While they can **** with us, they can't bring us down and they have their own issues.


The real shame is the 40-50 million Americans living in emptying rural areas waiting for someone to come along and bring economic development. The bit into a Faustian bargain and anchored themselves to dying areas, losing the relative wealth of their nest egg late in life, trapping them in place. So many young, suburban/urban people do not comprehend why so many of these rural people are red assed mad. On top of that those trapped don't always articulate or fully understand the trap they are in.

I have people like this on both sides of the family, living in rural areas and waiting for the government to bring a new factory. They own the land their house is on so they think they have an asset rather than understanding what they have is an anchor. They "played by the rules" and got screwed. Over time they gravitate toward stupid conspiracy theory bull **** because it's better to feel like someone targeted you instead of you being screwed because you didn't understand the system.

In the times we are in right now, those rural people are in better position to survive than you are. And China has a credible nuclear threat. Logistics are against them, but you never know what a cornered dragon will do. And Statefan, the ones who are targeted are the ones in debt up to their eyeballs just to keep up with their neighbors in burbs, but make just enough from their white collar jobs to keep their nostrils above water as they live paycheck to paycheck.

There are always two sides to every coin and most times it just depends on which side you call. Those rural folks will be eating when the city folks aren't.

I have friends in both situations. Some of them do draw down six figures but spend their last nickel just keeping up appearances and one of them confessed to me he can't afford to retire until he is 75 because he had kids late in life. The ones that live in the sticks are mostly happy. They hunt and fish and farm and log and the highlight of their week is going to Church and listening to the gossip. Their big issue is having an affair when they get bored and by doing so in a small town everybody knows including the spouses and then a world of hurt comes down on them. But if they can avoid that they live quite well, and don't really worry about what you have or don't have in your urban environment.

What they are hurting from truly is lack of decent healthcare without driving to the city. The mortality in my old home town is now too frequent from 55 to 65 and most of that is lack of primary care physicians to spot problems on routine check ups that might have led to treatments that would have prevented early death. And that development is relatively recent, like the last 20 years.

But hey if you check into big city hospital the third shift nursing crew that doesn't speak English just might give you the wrong meds.

You pays your money and you take your chances.

Health Care is a problem that this country needs to fix. It is not right for people to work their whole lives and then have to go bankrupt because they get diagnosed with diabetes or cancer. I don't know why they can't bring in health care like in
Canada or the UK or Australia or Germany. Its not rocket science we should just copy what those countries do to have a good health care system. In case anyone was wondering I am not a left wing radical but actually a fiscal conservative. The US spends more on health care than any country in the world and its not even close.
It would be much cheaper to have a single payer health care system.

If you believe single payer will be cheaper, then you believe that pink unicorns will frolic across the country to implement it. Utter nonsense. I have a special needs kid and single payer is my greatest fear.