Speaking strictly of former BCS AQ / Power Conference members switching conferences, who actually remained competitive/at the top of their new conference?

Nebraska (Big XII to Big Ten) - For years they were a power in the Big 8 and later Big XII, but have not been really challenged for the conference much at all in the Big Ten.

West Virginia (Big East to Big XII) - During the 00s and early 10s WVU was a power in the Big East, always in the hunt for the conference title, in the Big 12.... not so much (though have had some decent years).

Mizzou (Big XII to SEC) - Mizzou was often in the hunt for the Big XII North division, and had success right out the gates after moving into the SEC but it was short lived, they are now average in the division they never should've geographically been in. Has this been a successful transition competitively for Mizzou?

Louisville (Big East to ACC) - Louisville like WVU was always a challenger in the Big East during their time there, did moving to the ACC and increased competition take them down a notch, or maybe something else?

Maryland (ACC to Big Ten) - Correct me if I'm wrong but Maryland wasn't all that competitive in the ACC and that didn't change much in the Big Ten.

Rutgers (Big East to Big Ten) - Rutgers had a solid run during the late 00s (maybe earlier, somebody else help me out here) but has been nothing but a doormat in the Big Ten. Successfully competitive in their new conference? Not even close.

Miami (Big East to ACC) - I think everyone knows the answer to this one. This is the biggest drop off of any team arguably in the modern era. That drop off started shortly after joining the ACC.

Pitt (Big East to ACC) - Another team I remember being quite competitive in the Big East. Yes I know Pitt has recently been in the ACC Championship Game and has some big wins, but is this competitive success or just a sign of how watered down the ACC has become?

Colorado (Big XII to Pac 12) - I am not sure what to think of this one. I know Colorado was successful during the 90s, but was that before or after the start of the Big XII? During the 00s I never thought too much of Colorado and in the Pac 12 I probably think of them even less. Is this coincidence? Are they competitive after switching conferences?

Texas A&M (Big XII to SEC) - A&M always seemed to be rather competitive in the Big XII and I'd argue this has translated fairly well to the SEC West (they are actually in their correct division unlike Mizzou).

Well, I hit most of them that moved from power conference to power conference. What say you? Do you agree, disagree? Some I'm overlooking?

Arkansas (SWC to SEC) - Someone help me out here as this was wayyyy before my time. Was Arkansas solid in the SWC/regularly challenging for the conference crown? I know in the SEC save for the Darren Mcfadden years Arkansas hasn't done a whole lot. Thoughts?

You could make a hell of a case that not a single one of those programs improved on the field after switching conferences and that all are further away from a national championship today than before.

(07-23-2020 03:50 PM)IWokeUpLikeThis Wrote:  You could make a hell of a case that not a single one of those programs improved on the field after switching conferences and that all are further away from a national championship today than before.

That's pretty much the case I am making. Makes me wonder what a potential conference move for Oklahoma or Texas would mean for them? Right now they run the show and are highly competitive in the Big XII. Would they maintain this as members of the SEC, Big Ten, or Pac-12 for example? Pac-12 is the only one where I think they might still contend year in and year out. There is certainly something to be said for regional conferences and history.

You forgot to mention that Missouri won the SEC East twice since moving.

(07-23-2020 03:58 PM)Fighting Muskie Wrote:  You forgot to mention that Missouri won the SEC East twice since moving.

"...and had success right out the gates after moving into the SEC but it was short lived..."

Based on the lack of response to the OP's glaring omission, I assume that none of our Virginia Tech diehards have checked this board today.

TCU and Virginia Tech found some success but haven't done much over the past few years.

(07-23-2020 04:20 PM)Wedge Wrote:  Based on the lack of response to the OP's glaring omission, I assume that none of our Virginia Tech diehards have checked this board today.

Yes, thank you! That was a glaring omission on my part. It was not intentional (I may have intentionally left off BC and Syracuse). Va Tech is definitely one they has wound up in mediocrity like most who have moved to the ACC sadly.

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(07-23-2020 04:25 PM)EigenEagle Wrote:  TCU and Virginia Tech found some success but haven't done much over the past few years.

TCU is a success story... But not really from a power conference. I mean if you go all the way back to SWC but there was about 16-18 yrs there outside of the power conference structure. But yes, they are one of the successful moves in their current conference. I was trying to limit the discussion to those who moved directly from one power conference to another. I left Utah off for this same reason who also has seen some competitive success.

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Arkansas was once a Cotton Bowl challenger and the 1994 NCAA basketball champion. Now, crickets.

(07-23-2020 04:42 PM)DFW HOYA Wrote:  Arkansas was once a Cotton Bowl challenger and the 1994 NCAA basketball champion. Now, crickets.

The simple reality is that larger conferences are simply not as good for mid tier programs. It makes it that much harder to get over the hump because odds are higher that someone else is having a great year at the same time you are.

Sure they make more money for schools but 14 or 16 team conferences just aren’t that great for on field success

(07-23-2020 04:42 PM)DFW HOYA Wrote:  Arkansas was once a Cotton Bowl challenger and the 1994 NCAA basketball champion. Now, crickets.

Their baseball team is salty.

(07-23-2020 03:44 PM)Once a Knight... Wrote:  Speaking strictly of former BCS AQ / Power Conference members switching conferences, who actually remained competitive/at the top of their new conference?

Nebraska (Big XII to Big Ten) - For years they were a power in the Big 8 and later Big XII, but have not been really challenged for the conference much at all in the Big Ten.

West Virginia (Big East to Big XII) - During the 00s and early 10s WVU was a power in the Big East, always in the hunt for the conference title, in the Big 12.... not so much (though have had some decent years).

Mizzou (Big XII to SEC) - Mizzou was often in the hunt for the Big XII North division, and had success right out the gates after moving into the SEC but it was short lived, they are now average in the division they never should've geographically been in. Has this been a successful transition competitively for Mizzou?

Louisville (Big East to ACC) - Louisville like WVU was always a challenger in the Big East during their time there, did moving to the ACC and increased competition take them down a notch, or maybe something else?

Maryland (ACC to Big Ten) - Correct me if I'm wrong but Maryland wasn't all that competitive in the ACC and that didn't change much in the Big Ten.

Rutgers (Big East to Big Ten) - Rutgers had a solid run during the late 00s (maybe earlier, somebody else help me out here) but has been nothing but a doormat in the Big Ten. Successfully competitive in their new conference? Not even close.

Miami (Big East to ACC) - I think everyone knows the answer to this one. This is the biggest drop off of any team arguably in the modern era. That drop off started shortly after joining the ACC.

Pitt (Big East to ACC) - Another team I remember being quite competitive in the Big East. Yes I know Pitt has recently been in the ACC Championship Game and has some big wins, but is this competitive success or just a sign of how watered down the ACC has become?

Colorado (Big XII to Pac 12) - I am not sure what to think of this one. I know Colorado was successful during the 90s, but was that before or after the start of the Big XII? During the 00s I never thought too much of Colorado and in the Pac 12 I probably think of them even less. Is this coincidence? Are they competitive after switching conferences?

Texas A&M (Big XII to SEC) - A&M always seemed to be rather competitive in the Big XII and I'd argue this has translated fairly well to the SEC West (they are actually in their correct division unlike Mizzou).

Well, I hit most of them that moved from power conference to power conference. What say you? Do you agree, disagree? Some I'm overlooking?

Arkansas (SWC to SEC) - Someone help me out here as this was wayyyy before my time. Was Arkansas solid in the SWC/regularly challenging for the conference crown? I know in the SEC save for the Darren Mcfadden years Arkansas hasn't done a whole lot. Thoughts?

Arkansas was a national power in the SWC. They dropped more than anyone.
In the AP poll they were 3rd in the 60s, just behind Alabama and Texas. In the 70s they were 10th and in the 80s 20th. In the 90s 42nd.

(07-23-2020 03:58 PM)Once a Knight... Wrote:  

(07-23-2020 03:50 PM)IWokeUpLikeThis Wrote:  You could make a hell of a case that not a single one of those programs improved on the field after switching conferences and that all are further away from a national championship today than before.

That's pretty much the case I am making. Makes me wonder what a potential conference move for Oklahoma or Texas would mean for them? Right now they run the show and are highly competitive in the Big XII. Would they maintain this as members of the SEC, Big Ten, or Pac-12 for example? Pac-12 is the only one where I think they might still contend year in and year out. There is certainly something to be said for regional conferences and history.

OU has won 5 conference championships in a row in the Big 12. Part of that is the relative strength of the OU program, and part of it is the relative weakness of the B12. There's no way we'd win 5 in a row in the SEC. I don't think we'd win 5 in a row in the B1G, either.

Texas will stay in the B12 as long as they can. They have most of what they want, including money. The only thing they're not doing right now is competing for national championships.

If the money is in the same ballpark, OU will stay in the B12. There is a lot to be said for regional rivals and the path of least resistance. But, if there's a $20M/year difference in income, as would be the case based on the new SEC media deal, OU will explore options, even if it means an average of one or two more losses per year on the football field.

My boss is a Missouri grad. He prefers the university be a member of the SEC more so than the Big 12 (though he hugely misses the basketball rivalry with Kansas). But his preference, hypothetically, is that Mizzou be a member of the Big Ten.

I feel (and I realize many folks disagree with me on this) that Missouri in the SEC actually makes some sense — geographically and culturally. As a Vanderbilt fan, I like having the Tigers in the SEC East Division in football.

ND is 64-26 in football since joining the ACC in 2013 and entering into a 5 game/year football scheduling agreement.

It has gone 24-8 against ACC teams since then.

It made the 4 team playoff in 2018.

ND basketball had two Elite 8 finishes and won an ACC Tournament Title since joining in 2013.

A&M has had Manziel and has been mediocre otherwise. I wouldn't exactly call them a success story, but then again, they weren't world beaters in the Big XII either. You have to go down to G5 to see anyone having success in their new conference. Houston, Western Kentucky, and Boise State have all done really well for themselves in their new conferences.

I do wonder how much of the lack of success on the part of a lot of P5 movers has been due to losing their old recruiting grounds and having a hard time establishing new ones. I know Nebraska losing Texas has hurt really bad, and they've basically lost western Iowa and are in the process of letting their home state get regularly raided. Pitt's move basketball-wise has cost them the ability to recruit NYC and Philly. West Virginia can't pull from Virginia, Pennsylvania, or Ohio since they're on such a geographic island.

(07-23-2020 04:38 PM)Once a Knight... Wrote:  

(07-23-2020 04:25 PM)EigenEagle Wrote:  TCU and Virginia Tech found some success but haven't done much over the past few years.

TCU is a success story... But not really from a power conference. I mean if you go all the way back to SWC but there was about 16-18 yrs there outside of the power conference structure. But yes, they are one of the successful moves in their current conference. I was trying to limit the discussion to those who moved directly from one power conference to another. I left Utah off for this same reason who also has seen some competitive success.

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TCU and Utah have seen success but VT has not. VT won the ACC 4 times and went to the championship game 2 other times. We've only won 10 games once in the last 8 years but never failed to go to a bowl. VT won 10 or more games every year for 8 straight years. What have Utah and TCU done to compete with that?

(07-23-2020 07:56 PM)bullet Wrote:  

(07-23-2020 03:44 PM)Once a Knight... Wrote:  Speaking strictly of former BCS AQ / Power Conference members switching conferences, who actually remained competitive/at the top of their new conference?

Nebraska (Big XII to Big Ten) - For years they were a power in the Big 8 and later Big XII, but have not been really challenged for the conference much at all in the Big Ten.

West Virginia (Big East to Big XII) - During the 00s and early 10s WVU was a power in the Big East, always in the hunt for the conference title, in the Big 12.... not so much (though have had some decent years).

Mizzou (Big XII to SEC) - Mizzou was often in the hunt for the Big XII North division, and had success right out the gates after moving into the SEC but it was short lived, they are now average in the division they never should've geographically been in. Has this been a successful transition competitively for Mizzou?

Louisville (Big East to ACC) - Louisville like WVU was always a challenger in the Big East during their time there, did moving to the ACC and increased competition take them down a notch, or maybe something else?

Maryland (ACC to Big Ten) - Correct me if I'm wrong but Maryland wasn't all that competitive in the ACC and that didn't change much in the Big Ten.

Rutgers (Big East to Big Ten) - Rutgers had a solid run during the late 00s (maybe earlier, somebody else help me out here) but has been nothing but a doormat in the Big Ten. Successfully competitive in their new conference? Not even close.

Miami (Big East to ACC) - I think everyone knows the answer to this one. This is the biggest drop off of any team arguably in the modern era. That drop off started shortly after joining the ACC.

Pitt (Big East to ACC) - Another team I remember being quite competitive in the Big East. Yes I know Pitt has recently been in the ACC Championship Game and has some big wins, but is this competitive success or just a sign of how watered down the ACC has become?

Colorado (Big XII to Pac 12) - I am not sure what to think of this one. I know Colorado was successful during the 90s, but was that before or after the start of the Big XII? During the 00s I never thought too much of Colorado and in the Pac 12 I probably think of them even less. Is this coincidence? Are they competitive after switching conferences?

Texas A&M (Big XII to SEC) - A&M always seemed to be rather competitive in the Big XII and I'd argue this has translated fairly well to the SEC West (they are actually in their correct division unlike Mizzou).

Well, I hit most of them that moved from power conference to power conference. What say you? Do you agree, disagree? Some I'm overlooking?

Arkansas (SWC to SEC) - Someone help me out here as this was wayyyy before my time. Was Arkansas solid in the SWC/regularly challenging for the conference crown? I know in the SEC save for the Darren Mcfadden years Arkansas hasn't done a whole lot. Thoughts?

Arkansas was a national power in the SWC. They dropped more than anyone.
In the AP poll they were 3rd in the 60s, just behind Alabama and Texas. In the 70s they were 10th and in the 80s 20th. In the 90s 42nd.

That just means their trajectory downward was accelerating when they left the SWC. Desegregation everywhere helped in that regard. While many schools in the South didn't desegregate football until the early 70's Arkansas did in 1966-7.

They played predominantly white only teams prior to that. After ~1972 black athletes were being accepted everywhere. Arkansas being a small population state without large metro areas was affected negatively by that much more than schools in states with cities like DFW, Atlanta, Birmingham, New Orleans, Houston, etc.

Prior to that many of the black athletes from the South exceled elsewhere.

From the 60's the Hogs fell 17 slots in the polls while in the SWC and then another 12 in the SEC during the 90's. The demographic that hurt them was the move away from rural white athletes in the South to urban black athletes. That move didn't favor Arkansas.

(07-23-2020 09:38 PM)Mav Wrote:  A&M has had Manziel and has been mediocre otherwise. I wouldn't exactly call them a success story, but then again, they weren't world beaters in the Big XII either. You have to go down to G5 to see anyone having success in their new conference. Houston, Western Kentucky, and Boise State have all done really well for themselves in their new conferences.

I do wonder how much of the lack of success on the part of a lot of P5 movers has been due to losing their old recruiting grounds and having a hard time establishing new ones. I know Nebraska losing Texas has hurt really bad, and they've basically lost western Iowa and are in the process of letting their home state get regularly raided. Pitt's move basketball-wise has cost them the ability to recruit NYC and Philly. West Virginia can't pull from Virginia, Pennsylvania, or Ohio since they're on such a geographic island.

What hurt Nebraska was not losing Texas as much as games being broadcasted for a majority of schools nationally or on cable. They used to kill it with players in CA, CO, TX, FL.

I do think Frost will get them to be a competitive team in a couple seasons, but their time of dominance it once had in the 80's and 90's is truly over.